Author saralynn Posted August 8, 2004 Author Posted August 8, 2004 i cannot stand arguing especially over a message board. you know i AM depressed, i am angry and i am hurt still from the things he said about me. it is showing in my moods and actions and that is why he noticed. in a day or so if i show the same actions he will start snapping at me once again. he was in a good mood today and is relaxed and happy because it is a sunday and he can take it easy i guess. on a normal given day this/that is not his normal behavior. he is pretty intune to a lot of my moods and i to his as well but that does not constitue a nice guy in my books. he does have several of the signs posted above for emotional abuse, several! at that i had a few as well but i think mine stem from some insecurities instead and he has signs of depression as well and refuses to see anyone about it because one day he has a better day then the day before. he is moody and irratable and wakes up tired every morning and has his coffee and goes to work and then he is in high gear all day and if i talk to him i am likely to get "what do you need" or "is there anything else" or some business sounding crap from him and i remind him of who i am and to chill and he does then. then he comes home and is as sweet as pie and the things that he said from the day are vanished from his mind and he wonders why i am still carrying around an attitude. so maybe i should not be so sensitive and not take what he said about me in a fit of anger as something he really means though if he came up again and he had one of his bad days it would all be thrown at me again, i know as this is how it happens. i'm tired of it though. he comes across as this really nice guy, real professional, real personable, very well liked, and puts on his business mask and people think he is the greatest guy around. he listens attentively to his clients all day and comes home and hides in the paper then the t.v. because he is spent on others. oh well that is another whole different can of worms and i've said enough already. i am just feeling very down and unhappy but i love him very much and thinking of leaving is very painful, my head will leave but my heart just wont follow which makes for one miserable and unhappy person.
moimeme Posted August 8, 2004 Posted August 8, 2004 First of all, don't worry about Samson and me. We tussle constantly; it's sport. I know for a fact he loves me madly ( Samson) i am angry and i am hurt still from the things he said about me. it is showing in my moods and actions This is a normal human reaction when someone does not communicate other than to complain and berate. As RR (winking back) said, it can lead to depression, but your primary problem is not depression. Sit him down when he's in a good mood and tell him that you feel you two need to change the way you communicate because what's going on is killing your love (which it will if it hasn't already). Then, PLEASE, use the link I provided to try to negotiate the household stuff or else ask him to see a counsellor with you. This relationship is fast on its way downhill and you are not going to fix it, nor should you, by learning to endure. And Samson, dearie, I know you have something against partners learning to communicate with each other, but trust me on this, that is the key to sorting these two out. She can get treatment for depression, but until the underlying cause - living with someone who is not a true 'partner' to her - is repaired, she'll just get depressed all over again. You fix problems by working on the root cause, not by trying to heal the symptoms. The root cause here is that they don't communicate effectively.
RowanRavyn Posted August 8, 2004 Posted August 8, 2004 Sweetie, My ex was the nicest guy you could ever meet. UNTIL we were behind closed doors. Nothing I did was up to his standards. I am a good housekeeper, but NOTHING was right. Even if I did it to his detailed instructions. When he noticed that I got in a quiet mood, then he would suddenly be all sweet and kind. I suppose it was mission accomplished. He had proven his point and I was quiet and in my place. It started off with simply that I did not mop the floor the way he liked (nevermind that I had made lots of money as a professional domestic). Watch sleeping with the enemy, you will get an idea of what it was like. It wasn't let me show you a tip, it was demeaning. From there it was pictures being an inch off center. In the beginning he was Mr. Charming. It went down hill from there. You deserve the same respect as his clients. You really do. If you really are feeling depressed then maybe you should ask Moimeme for some of those links. The thing you need to ask yourself is if the way you feel is the way you want to feel for a life time. Best wishes.
Author saralynn Posted August 8, 2004 Author Posted August 8, 2004 i do not want to feel this way for a life time! and neither does he though. he is not happy either because he says i have too much free time on my hands and this house should be spotless because of it and dinner on the table. neither are done though to his liking. sometimes i think it is the house. it is dark and dingy even though we've painted every single room a different bright color it always just has a dirty look to it even right after i clean it! it is sad that we are both miserable like this at times but not all the time but this time i am draggin it out too long, i am sure that is what he would think. i know we need to communicate, we need to learn how to because he thinks that what he said in that email that he was communicating with me and that i cannot take it as that. i told him it was a personal attack on my character and totally negative, and this was all communicated through the email he originally sent to me. my depression i am sure is situationally and i sit here and think as i read all this stuff that if i just did what he wanted then we will be okay! it is not too much what he asks for, a clean house, dinner, to come home read the paper, watch some t.v. go to dinner now and then, etc...but it is the way he puts it to me that makes me not want to do it anyways. how can i want to do these things when i do them anyways but not to his likings, but if i try harder to keep the house cleaner and make dinner even a few times a week then he would be happier, no? yes? only one way to tell right? honestly i do not think it would put an end to the problems as i am sure there are others that he has to bitch at me about..sometimes i get jealous and he knows it with his contacts with other women via work, i get jealous when i hear him laughing with other women on the phone, jealous because it is not me he is laughing me, so that is an issue too and of course my lack of work hours though i pull my own weight with things around here, he still thinks i have too much htime and it should be spend productively like helping him i guess.
Samson Posted August 8, 2004 Posted August 8, 2004 If you really are feeling depressed then maybe you should ask Moimeme for some of those links. ----RowanR You see, Moi, I'm not the only one that loves you! XOXOXO, Samson
RowanRavyn Posted August 8, 2004 Posted August 8, 2004 Compromise is a wonderful thing. Offer to do joint counseling. If that doesn't work, then bale. The fact that you are on a board asking if it is emotional abuse says that something in your is NOT OK with what's happening. Its not healthy for either of you. While compromise is a wonderful thing, settling for something is not. to you Sammy boi. to you. ::Grins:: While you are adorable........ depression isn't. It can be a serious thing, especially when you keep excusing the issue that is causing it.
Samson Posted August 8, 2004 Posted August 8, 2004 RowanR, dear: I have no doubt that depression is a serious issue. I think saralynn needs to be checked out. I'm not sure what you think. On the one hand you say "Effective communication is the key, this has nothing to do with depression," in agreement with sweet Moi (who characteristically has ignored every positive behavior about the husband that saralynn has posted), but on the other hand you recommend "If you really are feeling depressed then maybe you should ask Moimeme for some of those links." I am guessing that by "this" having nothing to do with depression you do not mean saralynn's feeling but you mean her ability to effectively communicate. However, if this is true, then I must disagree (however, not in an abusive way ). Depression, Anger, Rage, all prevent effective communication.
RowanRavyn Posted August 8, 2004 Posted August 8, 2004 My latter statement was based on saralynn's own words that she "IS" depressed. As saralynn educated me on her feelings, I changed my mind. I am a woman. I am prone to doing it.
Samson Posted August 8, 2004 Posted August 8, 2004 See Moimeme........................................................................................................................... My guess is that you're also female!
Author saralynn Posted August 8, 2004 Author Posted August 8, 2004 i was/am still trying to decipher the difference between verbal and emotional. i am leaning more towards that what he does is verbal because it is his words that are hurtful and almost hateful and filled with a ton of anger. i cannot stand him being mad at me even if i feel it is my own fault. maybe an apology would be nice from him. i sent him an email and asked him why he thinks i should not feel hurt from what he said about me. i am sure it is going to breed another arguement as to him it is all said and done and if i bring it up again then i am draggin it on or wanting to be in some drama or something dumb he will say that is what i am trying to do. the depression i feel is mainly situationally. i do not know if it is from anything else besides this arguing about the house and the other things i mentioned in my last post. either way i just wish i could feel better about us and between us. we went grocery shopping a while ago and i felt better when we were doing that then he had to go to do some work today so i am glad now he is gone. we watch t.v. in separate rooms on sundays because he wants to read the paper and watch sports junk and i play on the computer or watch it in the living room, either way at times it seems we live separate lives in the same house and i do not like that. i liked when we use to cuddle on the couch and watch t.v. together. gone are those days i guess. he bitched at me for parking my car too close to his space so he could not back in the way he wanted to and that made me feel sad all over again, seems i cant do nuttin right at times, my poor ego is dying inside. yet i feel it is my own fault for not doing, not complying, not submitted, not being what he wants which is a beaver and wally cleaver family i guess.
Samson Posted August 8, 2004 Posted August 8, 2004 that made me feel sad all over again, seems i cant do nuttin right at times, my poor ego is dying inside. OK, I'm just going to say this one more time, very gently, and politely............................................................................................................................................................................(taking deep, cleansing breath)....................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................... only you are responsible for how you feel. Get help to feel better, Samson Bye.
moimeme Posted August 8, 2004 Posted August 8, 2004 he says i have too much free time on my hands and this house should be spotless because of it and dinner on the table. Oh he does, does he? And he was crowned King of All the Planet, was he? You see, the fact that he thinks he has a right to tell you how things 'should' be is a bad sign. This is what abusers do. They think they 'should' get everything they want exactly the way they want it. No requests, no 'please', no negotiation. Just orders and criticism. he bitched at me for parking my car too close to his space so he could not back in the way he wanted to You see how it goes? Everything is your fault. With my abusive guy, my purse was wrong, the blankets weren't right, I turned left instead of right (never mind that left got us there sooner), my slacks were wrong, the pots were not good enough (the very expensive ones, mind you), etc. etc. etc. I drove well and he liked my looks but that was it. Everything else, he found fault with. The thing is with these guys - they are angry anyway and they think they are angry because of something - so the something, which can never be them, has to be you. But the anger is inside them - caused by rotten childhoods or some other problem - however you are the brunt of it. And that, absolutely, is abuse because you are being blamed for not living up to what somebody else tells you to do. You say the place is not a pigsty but it's never good enough for him. A reasonable man would not insist it be done to 'his' standards like some dictator, but would negotiate with you. So what you need to do is get him to counselling with you or start gathering up the resources you'll need to leave because this guy will destroy your self-esteem and if you think you are depressed now (and I agree that it is situational depression), it's nothing compared to how you will be if you continue to live with this bossman for much longer.
RowanRavyn Posted August 8, 2004 Posted August 8, 2004 ::applaudes Moimeme:: Amen! Wow two amens on a sunday. I haven't done that since I left four years ago. Also, I want to point out to you saralynn that you are obviously a resourceful woman. You started your own business! YAY YOU! Now take that resourcefulness and find a better life for yourself! You are worth it. To a point I agree with Samson. You are responsible for how you feel, so move out, move on and feel better about yourself!
Samson Posted August 8, 2004 Posted August 8, 2004 Sarahlynn says: i am moody and sullen and he notices and asks me if i still love him and still want to be with him. if i talk to him i am likely to get "what do you need" or "is there anything else" or some business sounding crap from him he works hard and comes home and wants dinner and the house cleaned and i am just not into that. Yeah Moimeme and RowanR, the guy's a real "bossman." Obviously terribly abusive. Sarahlynn couldn't possibly benefit from psychoanalysis for depression!
moimeme Posted August 8, 2004 Posted August 8, 2004 Samson We've been around this block before. You ignore all the idiocy of the man, look at the woman's remarks about how she REACTS when he's an idiot, and then say the fault's with her. And every time you do it, you demonstrate your bias in believing the woman is always to blame.
Samson Posted August 8, 2004 Posted August 8, 2004 Yes, we have, and I'll continue to be cognizant that the other spouse has a side of the story to tell, intentionally or not, through the words of the poster. Recoginise your own bias. You'll be better for it.
moimeme Posted August 9, 2004 Posted August 9, 2004 Oh cripes anyway. The REASON she is "moody and sullen" is that he has come home and criticized her. She can't retort back or she gets shxt from him. So she is upset. Then he says 'what's wrong' in all feigned innocence even though what's wrong is that he's just given her hell again. And that, my dear, is a DUH type no-brainer. The bit you quoted came in post 17 after MANY posts about how he tells her off all the time. Guess you missed all of those, eh?
Samson Posted August 9, 2004 Posted August 9, 2004 I suppose many have succomed to your insistance that all ignore the truth, and focus your laser beam onto the minutae. Just for you, because I love you, I'll go back to my post #8: when i clean the house and i know it is very clean and he says how nice it looks then i feel that he thinks i did it because he has made his point and i did it out of obedeince to him. OK, so the problem is not that you don't know what to do, or that he doesn't respond positively when you do clean this way......................The problem is: how you feel about what he thinks. It is not NECCESSARILY THIS GUYS FAULT THAT SHE"S HAVING FEELINGS ABOUT WHAT SHE THINKS HE THINKS, MOIMEME. It is called projecting. Look it up.
moimeme Posted August 9, 2004 Posted August 9, 2004 If he didn't order her around in the first place, she wouldn't feel manipulated. When you're being manipulated, your gut knows it. So he tells her off and criticizes her constantly but hands out a few crumbs when she 'behaves'. Big whoop. Send this guy's name in for 'husband of the year'.
Samson Posted August 9, 2004 Posted August 9, 2004 Your lack of objectivity become more astonishing with every post, Moimeme It is as is even sarahlynn never had a kind word for her husband, or never acceptes any responsibility causing the house to be in disarray? While you're looking up "projecting," why not also discover some self preventatives for it. I'm sure it will help you as well as sarahlynn.
moimeme Posted August 9, 2004 Posted August 9, 2004 Because, of course, she's the only person who creates the mess
Author saralynn Posted August 9, 2004 Author Posted August 9, 2004 okay i know there are two sides to every thing but i did say that the house is not that messy, only to him it is but not to me, so what makes him think i should clean it so spotless when i already see it as clean and no one has ever come to our house and thought it was dirty, maybe sometimes messy but who's isn't at times right? he is no saint and you portray that he is by what i said but i do not see what i said as him being a saint of any type. i admit he has good points, i am sure he thinks i do, though when he blows his stack the last thing i feel from him is love or anything good warm and fuzzy. instead i feel ashamed for what he says i am, for what he thinks of me, i feel ashamed and i do not even know why! maybe he has said those things and somewhere i have come to belive them and when he throwns them at me again i feel ashamed thinking they must be true. either way, my only reason was to try to determine emotional abuse versus verbal abuse, but maybe it is just anger abuse if there is such a thing. this post has gone on way to long and i've read each post from everybody and i feel sad samson that you think because there are two sides that his side is better or more accurate then mine as that is how it sounds that you are thinking. moimeme, thank you so much for pleading my case but it is senseless to continue when someone has already drawn a conclusion and does not budge. i know i live with it every day! lol, so i am use to it.
moimeme Posted August 9, 2004 Posted August 9, 2004 moimeme, thank you so much for pleading my case but it is senseless to continue when someone has already drawn a conclusion and does not budge. i know i live with it every day! lol, so i am use to it. You are exactly correct, saralynne, and I am a fool for trying to talk sense to people who won't hear. Please do help yourself. Talk to him and, if he won't get counselling, then get yourself out of there. There's no point in living with some goof who thinks you 'eat bonbons and watch TV all day'. Wait. I've heard that line before. Wonder where? Maybe here: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/showthread.php?postid=147163#post147163
ladyangel Posted August 9, 2004 Posted August 9, 2004 Saralynn - I mean you no harm by saying this, but it is my honest opinion. It seems that you already had your mind made up before you posted here and just wanted someone to confirm what you already believe...that your boyfriend is abusive. Honestly, from what I've read, I haven't yet reached the conclusion that it is abuse. I do agree that there is not good communication between the two of you. There are a few things you have said that indicate to me that what we have here is most likely a difference of opinion. so last night he told me that i am right behind my niece that i have so much free time that the house should be clean and dinner on the table! i told him i am not june cleaver and this is the 2000's and that that those types of women do not exist anymore and if he can find one like that then he should just go for it then. It sounds like you don't have a hard time standing up to him. i am just not domesticated at all! i can walk right by dirty dishes and think notihng of them whereas he has to pick them up. This makes it sound like he has a point when it comes to the house being dirty. ...keep it fairly tidy in my own mind but to him it is never clean herein lies the problems. we have been raised so differently that to him and to me clean are like opposites. Like I said, difference of opinion. i wish i could shake this rebellious little brat out of me, then maybe, just maybe, i could do these things for the right reasons and we could get along. Actually, it almost sounds like you KNOW what the problem is.
RowanRavyn Posted August 9, 2004 Posted August 9, 2004 While I am willing to concede that there is a huge difference in opinions going on in saralynn's home. I also believe that staying there is doing nothing but hurting her and causing damage to her self-esteem that she is going to have a hard time overcoming. It sounds to me if she isn't quoting him in her opinions of herself. saralynn, I hope that you can get past the rubbish, judgment and difference of opinions and get help for yourself and move on. I can assure you that you are much stronger than you think you are. Maybe you did come here for validation, maybe you did need to hear that it was abuse, so what?! Nothing wrong with that at all. If the jerk has decided that the house is your domain, then he needs to leave it to you. If he doesn't like it, then he can get off his duff, and help you with it.
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