Eternal Sunshine Posted November 20, 2012 Posted November 20, 2012 That's two of you now interested. No pressure Pyro. Enjoy the read. What author? Ordered. Pyro, if the book sucks I will be asking for my money back from YOU
MrCastle Posted November 20, 2012 Posted November 20, 2012 I think a lot of success in dating comes from confidence in past experiences. As a man, gets more success with women, he learns more about what works and what doesn't work. Also, feeling happy about success creates confidence that women are attracted to. Its not necessary the "PUA tactics" that attract women. It is the guy's newfound success breeds success confidence. Successfully dating one women makes a guy happy, and women "want what other women have." Since you are able to land one girl and satisfy her, other girls will feel like they are missing out. You are no longer seen as a "desperate lonely loser" but a "socially successful sexual stud" In many ways, women encourage men to resort to "PUA Player Personalities" because women are turning down the "awkward losers" for the "Alpha Men" - If the "losers" were getting girls, then they wouldn't have to resort to mimicking the behavior of the Alpha Males. This this and moar this!! Women want to turn guys away from PUA material, guys who could stand to use some improvement. But why? They don't date the guy who needs it anyway. That's why he's turning to PUA in the first place! 1
GirlontheLam Posted November 20, 2012 Posted November 20, 2012 I always thought they were BS antics as well...but are they really BS...? Would an entire industry be built around BS (like organic food )...? I am beginning to have my doubts as to whether I was wrong about PUA...perhaps the BS isn't as BS as I thought...I mean, why would it "work" if it was fluff...? I guess I'm more curious than anything else...or desperate... You don't need to find that many suckers to have a successful industry in the US.
runner Posted November 20, 2012 Posted November 20, 2012 you can help yourself be more attractive by learning more about how that dynamic works in a way that also compliments your own natural personality, all without becoming another sleazy pick up artist (as if the world really needs another one ). in other words, don't fall into the trap of simply mimicking what works for some other PUA because you'll most likely come off as a bit disingenuous or, worse yet, pretentious. quality women will see right through it. take your time evolving into the guy who simply "gets it" because it will take some time. live and learn, and be patient when you fail. but most of all, always be genuine and congruent with who you really are. learn and try something new, for sure; but don't get too absorbed in the material. 1
Pyro Posted November 20, 2012 Posted November 20, 2012 Ordered. Pyro, if the book sucks I will be asking for my money back from YOU I will gladly pay it, but I will only do it in person. That means that I will need from you two round trip tickets to Australia. 1
Author USMCHokie Posted November 20, 2012 Author Posted November 20, 2012 Read through the first few chapters of The Game, and so far it's been relatively entertaining. I hear so much about how "sleazy" and deceitful PUA is, but what exactly about it is so deceitful? Isn't the method simply a way to become more attractive to a woman who wouldn't otherwise be attracted to you? What's so wrong about it...why does society portray it in such a negative light...?
Emilia Posted November 20, 2012 Posted November 20, 2012 But I think I'd be fine with trying to attract the lower IQ women...because I learned in my last relationship that recently ended that I will never be happy in any relationship until I get this out of my system and rid myself of the race issue...so I am fine with an indefinite string of meaningless and casual relationships, for lack of a better term. I am not ready or willing for any kind of the real thing in the near future...so I'm not looking for the sharpest tool in the shed...or someone to bring home to the parents... Just being honest... I definitely got something out of casual relationships with men - but I was smart or careful enough to pick those that I thought were quite cool. ie I liked them as people. When I was travelling around for the best part of 3 years, it's the only way I dated - makes sense of course when you are not in the same spot for long. However, quality matters BECAUSE you can't get the validation/confidence you need otherwise. You care about what some women think, probably not everyone of them though. So it's not the matter of going through 20 girls ina row regardless of quality. Just a warning.
Author USMCHokie Posted November 20, 2012 Author Posted November 20, 2012 I definitely got something out of casual relationships with men - but I was smart or careful enough to pick those that I thought were quite cool. ie I liked them as people. When I was travelling around for the best part of 3 years, it's the only way I dated - makes sense of course when you are not in the same spot for long. However, quality matters BECAUSE you can't get the validation/confidence you need otherwise. You care about what some women think, probably not everyone of them though. So it's not the matter of going through 20 girls ina row regardless of quality. Just a warning. I see two approaches here...start with high quality and fail, gradually lowering my quality threshold until I stop failing, thus establishing my benchmark...or starting with low quality and succeeding, gradually increasing quality until I stop succeeding... The latter method is how humans learn things fundamentally...you don't throw a 10 year kid in a calculus class and wait for him to fail before teaching him basic arithmetic...
Emilia Posted November 20, 2012 Posted November 20, 2012 (edited) I see two approaches here...start with high quality and fail, gradually lowering my quality threshold until I stop failing, thus establishing my benchmark...or starting with low quality and succeeding, gradually increasing quality until I stop succeeding... The latter method is how humans learn things fundamentally...you don't throw a 10 year kid in a calculus class and wait for him to fail before teaching him basic arithmetic... I always aim higher than I can reasonably conquer, I find I get better that way. This is why I train with men a lot of the time. Sure it's more painful but it gets me good faster. EDIT: also those that you underestimate can get you in the wrong mindset in my opinion. Rejection is always possible too, if you get rejected by someone you don't view as being on your level, that must be the ultimate gutting experience. Edited November 20, 2012 by Emilia 1
ascendotum Posted November 20, 2012 Posted November 20, 2012 I see two approaches here...start with high quality and fail, gradually lowering my quality threshold until I stop failing, thus establishing my benchmark...or starting with low quality and succeeding, gradually increasing quality until I stop succeeding... Well, if you are going to try out your new craft starting with ES when you hit Oz, I guess its option A. But she'll know this, so you are going to have to operate on a totally cloaked level. Wholigan might know of some Inception inspired technique. 1
Eddie Edirol Posted November 20, 2012 Posted November 20, 2012 (edited) Read through the first few chapters of The Game, and so far it's been relatively entertaining. I hear so much about how "sleazy" and deceitful PUA is, but what exactly about it is so deceitful? Isn't the method simply a way to become more attractive to a woman who wouldn't otherwise be attracted to you? What's so wrong about it...why does society portray it in such a negative light...? Society (women) portray it in a negative light because women never seem to understand that many men grow up hopelessly clueless about how women really work, and wind up dateless with no help. Women always have some friend to help them along, most guys dont get that luxury. But people think the deceitful part of the PUA is tricking a pretty woman into sleeping with you for a one night stand. The PUA stuff I read never encourages lying to make yourself look like more than you are, and to not lead a woman on in a way that makes her think you intended on seeing her again. But of course guys will lie if it will get them laid, and women HATE the methods because they all fell for it at one time. And according to this board, some of them fall for it time and time again. Ive read many PUA stuff, and the main object of it is to ultimately learn how to get past the barriers of really really beautiful women. (Of course I wonder how much of it is bull to sell books) Really beautiful women get anything they want, and men falling all over them constantly trying to get their attention. PUA is meant to show you what it takes to get through their social conditioning. They have had so many men bullshytting them to their faces for so long, it takes alot to get through that if you yourself arent catching their eye. Women or men that dont get alot of attention until its annoying would never understand this. Depending on the level of attractiveness of the woman, theres different degrees of severity that you would have to apply the PUA tactics to them. What I learned is that you have to read the woman to figure out how thick to lay it on. You wouldnt use all the stuff on women that dont get hit on alot. The stuff works for the most part. I learned you can still be you, you dont have to lie about anything, you just have to be interesting in many ways. That includes personality and looks. From what I read, the stuff lets you know what degree to use on what women. Pretty Young girls in clubs get 100%. Older women that arent as picky anymore get 5%. PUA doesnt encourage negging women on points that would effect their self esteem (weight, features, etc). Teasing is safer than negging, but then again, I havent tried the stuff on really really beautiful women yet. I might have to reread the stuff just to try it and see what happens. BTW I think you should start low and work your way up. It will take a while before you can really work the stuff before you'd want to try it out on the 10's. If you start out high and work your way down, you might want to try to go high again once you get used to it. Edited November 20, 2012 by Eddie Edirol 6
TheBigQuestion Posted November 20, 2012 Posted November 20, 2012 ^ Excellent, well-reasoned post. However, don't be surprised if a chorus of mouth-breathers chimes in to inform you that you are wrong, that PUA is inherently evil and deceitful, that you or any other man who has ever used it is desperate and/or pathetic and/or creepy, that PUA can only be used to further predatory motivations, that all PUA is the same, and so forth. It's only a matter of time.
Eddie Edirol Posted November 21, 2012 Posted November 21, 2012 ^ Excellent, well-reasoned post. However, don't be surprised if a chorus of mouth-breathers chimes in to inform you that you are wrong, that PUA is inherently evil and deceitful, that you or any other man who has ever used it is desperate and/or pathetic and/or creepy, that PUA can only be used to further predatory motivations, that all PUA is the same, and so forth. It's only a matter of time. Its was practically the last 7 pages. It happens every time PUA gets brought up. Even if I was to say I never used PUA to deceive or get one night stands, they'd never believe me.
Imported Posted November 21, 2012 Posted November 21, 2012 Its was practically the last 7 pages. It happens every time PUA gets brought up. Even if I was to say I never used PUA to deceive or get one night stands, they'd never believe me. I don't think women realize that for the most part, their interaction with a guy trying to get with them is just reactive to what the guy does.
dasein Posted November 21, 2012 Posted November 21, 2012 What's so wrong about it...why does society portray it in such a negative light...? Some very loud, vocal women, not society, resent PUA, despite knowing less than nothing about it, because it threatens their innate control of the sexual selection process. They will never admit this of course. Keep reading The Game, the full picture emerges past the halfway point of the book. Will be interested to hear your assessment after you complete it.
Eternal Sunshine Posted November 21, 2012 Posted November 21, 2012 Some very loud, vocal women, not society, resent PUA, despite knowing less than nothing about it, because it threatens their innate control of the sexual selection process. They will never admit this of course. Keep reading The Game, the full picture emerges past the halfway point of the book. Will be interested to hear your assessment after you complete it. Ha! I have read The Game and every PUA book that followed. I have also read PUA forums regularly but never posted. The mentality of those men and how they view women is just I won't go further because my mum always tells me: if you got nothing nice to say.... 1
ThaWholigan Posted November 21, 2012 Posted November 21, 2012 Ha! I have read The Game and every PUA book that followed. I have also read PUA forums regularly but never posted. The mentality of those men and how they view women is just I won't go further because my mum always tells me: if you got nothing nice to say.... NAMES!!! 1
dasein Posted November 21, 2012 Posted November 21, 2012 Ha! I have read The Game and every PUA book that followed. I have also read PUA forums regularly but never posted. Then you of all people must know that the message of "The Game" is an overall balanced and positive one? As for what other stuff you read, I'm with wholigan, what specifically? And as far as forums go, those are mostly 15-18 y.o. kids trying to posture as guys that age often do, at least the ones I've read are. Those "HB8.5 I got to blow me after running shiftback takeaway wingwang 9 set" are Walter Mitty Jrs., not PUAs.
ThaWholigan Posted November 21, 2012 Posted November 21, 2012 Then you of all people must know that the message of "The Game" is an overall balanced and positive one? As for what other stuff you read, I'm with wholigan, what specifically? And as far as forums go, those are mostly 15-18 y.o. kids trying to posture as guys that age often do, at least the ones I've read are. Those "HB8.5 I got to blow me after running shiftback takeaway wingwang 9 set" are Walter Mitty Jrs., not PUAs. The irony of The Game is Strauss ending up with his missus by being an "AFC" because "game" didn't work on her. 1
TheBigQuestion Posted November 21, 2012 Posted November 21, 2012 Ha! I have read The Game and every PUA book that followed. I have also read PUA forums regularly but never posted. The mentality of those men and how they view women is just I won't go further because my mum always tells me: if you got nothing nice to say.... This is a fair assessment, so long as you can make the distinction between the full-on, classic PUA that dresses up like a clown to get noticed and men who simply take advice from some more up-to-date materials. Either way, the message of The Game by Neil Strauss was that being a PUA within the particular systems of which they were proponents was largely a terrible idea in the long run. Their system stopped working, egos destroyed friendships, people had mental breakdowns, and the protagonist gets into a long-term relationship with the one woman he found that he simply could not "game." The book is an expose on the movement. It isn't really a PUA book at all.
dasein Posted November 21, 2012 Posted November 21, 2012 Damn, guys he's still reading the book. Spoilers! I bet you two went around yelling "Dumbledore dies!" in the Barnes & Noble back in the day.
Anela Posted November 21, 2012 Posted November 21, 2012 Ha! I have read The Game and every PUA book that followed. I have also read PUA forums regularly but never posted. The mentality of those men and how they view women is just I won't go further because my mum always tells me: if you got nothing nice to say.... I've read a couple of the forums, too. Four years ago, I clicked on a link, without realizing what I was visiting (it was in a thread on recommended sites, that people had found to be helpful). I was seeing red when I saw the way they were talking about women.
Author USMCHokie Posted November 21, 2012 Author Posted November 21, 2012 Then you of all people must know that the message of "The Game" is an overall balanced and positive one? As for what other stuff you read, I'm with wholigan, what specifically? And as far as forums go, those are mostly 15-18 y.o. kids trying to posture as guys that age often do, at least the ones I've read are. Those "HB8.5 I got to blow me after running shiftback takeaway wingwang 9 set" are Walter Mitty Jrs., not PUAs. I'm about 20% through the book, and I don't know if I can take this stuff seriously...I mean, he goes on about how he has to go out with his satchel of sargin' gear...magic tricks and notebooks...? Seriously...? I can just see it now...girl offers her number...I reach into my fanny pack and pull out my handy dandy notebook and a crayon to jot it down... Still entertaining nonetheless...will write more after work tonight...
dasein Posted November 21, 2012 Posted November 21, 2012 Keep reading, the true message of the book doesn't unfold until well past 50%. It gets a bit repetitive and less interesting in that part too, plow through. 1
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