WASRPA Posted November 18, 2012 Posted November 18, 2012 Just to let you guys know I wrote a lot here since this issue has been a continuous issue for years and I felt giving details was the best idea to give you an idea where I have been. If you don't have the patience or attention span to read several paragraphs please leave now, if you can bear through it I would be grateful. The title says it all. I didn't go out on my first date until a month before I turned 24, I am still a virgin and dating has been a continual failure for me since that first date. The whole dating scene in all it's forums is something that has caused me great distress, pain and suffering since 24. I am at a point in my life where I feel like I am running out of time to get it right but at the same time I also know the negative feelings/experiences isn't something that can go on forever as it's wearing me out and those negative feelings are starting to spill over into the other aspects of my life. Right now I am even considering extreme options like just giving up on dating, putting it behind me until my 30's and looking into a mail order bride when I move out/get on better financial footing. I can't stress enough how much I don't want to do that but I lost so much faith in women and my own abilities that I am considering this to be my only option and I know I deserve better than dying alone because women don't see anything in me or because I lack the skills to be successful in dating. Coming here also was a last resort but to be honest I never met another man like myself that has had similar issues so late into life (Age 26) and I really can't find another source of information in my own life to solve my issue. Worse than not being successful with women I am openly criticized by people who are successful at dating. I can't tell you how many times I heard people telling me how they lost their virginity at 12, had their first 3-Way by 20 and was married with kids by my age. Some even imply that I am some sort of "In the closet" homosexual which is not the case. I laugh it off but below the surface it's like rubbing salt in wounds. Seeing these people who are nothing special make dating look so effortless makes me feel like some kind of freak. Even some of my good friends are like "I can't believe you're a virgin". The reason I didn't start dating until 24 was lack of confidence, I was extremely overweight from the age of 13 until around the age of 23. Taking a lot of **** from people in school and the dirty looks or being ignored by girls kept me out of dating for all those years. To make it worse I moved out of the city into Pennsylvania when I turned 20, I love it up here but the negative to moving here was it ended my social life. The area is tight knit and due to that the people here are very "clique'ish". In the 6 years I have been here I managed to make one friend, who is in a committed relationship. Everyone else I know up here I consider more of an acquaintance. Thankfully I managed to stay good friends with 1-2 people back in the city, one of them comes up here during summer on weekends. Overall I don't get out like I used to back when I lived in the city so beyond my job and online dating I don't get many opportunities to meet single women. My friend in the city was great for getting me out and about, if I still lived in the city I probably wouldn't be here now but I just hate the city so much so I can't see myself moving back ever. Getting back to the present, I have been working on my issues over the past 2 years with dating. I know my lack of confidence hurt me in the beginning. I remember only until recently I would avoid eye contact with all women in my age group and doing whatever it took to get out of the same room as them. Part of it was due to my lack of experience dealing with women, fear, embarrassment and to be honest part of me is still angry/bitter about the treatment I got over the past 10 years. Over these past two years I went out of my way to talk with girls and women I run into where I work. Most of them remember me and always talk to me now when I run into them. So at least I overcame that issue with just talking to women casually. I was able to work past some of these issues but I don't have the experience in talking with women that most 26 year old males who have been dating for 10+ years, plus deep down I am still bitter about past/present experiences in dealing with women. I keep those feelings buried and they usually don't show until after a failed attempt at asking a girl out. I put some serious thought into my issues, I feel my fatal flaws (Just my opinion, I admit I can be totally wrong) is my lack of experience and physical appearance. I think all those years of avoiding dating while other guys jumped into it really damaged me beyond repair, I highly doubt a women in her 20's will be interested in a guy in his 20's that has less experience with women than a 15 year old. The second issue I feel is my physical appearance. I spent years thinking about why women shoot me down before getting to know me and this is the only conclusion I can come to. I don't think I am ugly, I am no Danny DeVito by any long shot however I am no Brad Pitt either, I am somewhere in the middle of those two extremes. I lost a lot of weight, over 100 pounds and even though I lost all that weight I still do have a little stomach left over. In short I am not ripped with a 6 pack. Recently too I even get the feeling that I am not tall enough, something that never concerned me until this past year. Trying with online dating since July I can't tell you how many profiles I ran across where women demanded tall men, so many said unless you're 6'2" don't bother contacting. I am 5'10" which I always felt was an average height for a man and I can't do anything about that. However even with these issues in mind I don't see this stopping other men of similar appearance. My friend who is excellent with women weighs 20 pounds more than me, still has bad acne and has a slightly bigger stomach than I have. However he has 2 inches on me in height. I have seen this a lot but again I feel my lack of experience goes in hand with my average appearance which turns women off. Now that I have discussed my issues I will discuss the issues I have seen with women, if I am right or wrong is up for debate as I have been making my observations from the sidelines and rarely in the middle of it. First, I think the women in my age group are really in denial. In real life and online I have seen an endless amount of women pine for a sweet and caring guy. Guess what I have been told all my life? How sweet and intelligent I am. Not by just my parents but everyone that knows me, even the people who crack jokes about my dysfunctions with women. Not only that I also have the advantage of driving a new and really nice car, not being in debt, having a job, having good personal hygiene, not being an alcoholic, not being on drugs, not being covered in tattoo's/piercings and not growing a messy/unkempt beard. I live at home still but I don't need anyone to wipe my ass like some of the guys out there. However women seem to fall head over heels for these kinds of men. Seeing this I feel women really want self-centered, train wrecks of men. I even saw it personally with that girl I took out 2 years ago. She is a very attractive and sweet Korean girl who was finishing her BA in business management at the time. I met her through work with the help/encouragement of someone at work (A few people through work tried helping me out in similar fashion). I took her out, spent 3 hours with her then took her home. Great girl but she had baggage, like a string of guys beating the **** out of her and used her for sex. Since I tried to form a relationship with her and didn't try to get into her pants on the first date she made excuses when I tried to get a second date. For three weeks this went on before I just gave up, her lack of honesty with me really pissed me off since I thought she was awesome. Another issue I have found with women is how they showed interest in me at first then just lose interest, even before she gets to know me. Almost like they have a short attention span or they're "playing the field" behind my back. A few months after this Korean girl I started talking with this attractive Italian girl from where I work. I talked to her for 10 minutes and I got her phone number without even asking. We were supposed to hang out and when the day came I called asking where she wanted to be picked up, no answer. I tried for two weeks with no response. After that I gave up, never heard from her or saw her again. Then my last experience with a "near date" was with a girl that someone from work twisted my wrist into talking too. Very attractive girl too but something didn't seem right with her. I started talking to her and learned she was 17, still in high school. I admit this one I ended on my own since I didn't feel it was ethical to date someone so much younger than me. I tried to get a second chance with her a year later when she turned 18 but she made excuses. She told me months ago that she was moving away in a few months. Guess what? She is still here, another one who lied instead of just telling me the truth. Since this last girl I have been hard pressed to find another single girl. I still talk to girls around here but they make sure whenever we get into an extended conversation to mention their long term relationship with a boyfriend. Last girl I tried to ask out had to be one of the nastiest piece of works I ever met. Another very attractive Italian girl, we had a lot in common then she started to mention my car how awesome it was. So I invited her out to hang out then she goes on to mention how she is in engaged to a recovering crack head. So I say ok and walk away. I still talk to her and learned that she is stringing along in her words about 50 men, she was joking to this other girl which one should I ask for lunch today? See where my bitterness and anger stems from, things like this..... After these experiences I just tried sitting it out like some people advised, they mentioned a lot of people find someone unexpectedly during these times. I tried this for a year with no results. During this time I kept my eyes open for opportunities but I just came across women that chose to ignore me, going as far as not even making eye contact. The other issue I noticed with certain women is this body language they throw out, almost like they're hostile. You can see it in their eyes, how they talk and their general body language. Once someone took me to meet this girl thinking we might hit it off. Second he introduced me she looked at me like I killed someone she cared for. I just said "hey" and stood back while he talked with her. I have been very sensitive to body language my whole life and use it to gauge a person when they're very introverted and quiet. I would say an easy 1/3 of the women I met in my life just came off as unfriendly for no apparent reason. The last thing that I tried a few months ago was online dating, since all my attempts in person were with women at work I felt this might expose me to better quality women plus friends of mine gotten a few dates out of it. I have to date messaged 150 women over two websites in the past 4-5 months and talked only briefly to 4-5 women. The rest either didn't bother to view my profile or did but didn't respond, not even a no thanks. Oh and during this time not one women messaged me on her own. Of these 4-5 women I talked with they showed interest briefly, we would shoot messages back and forth for upwards of a week then without warning they would lose interest. This was my last option, I keep trying at it but after spending countless hours trying it's wearing thin on my patience and the experience is just leaving me bitter. So that's where I am, I am lost and tried everything I can think of. Sitting on my hands didn't work, approaching women in person hasn't work and online dating is turning out to be a big waste of time. So where am I right, where am I wrong and what can I do to correct this situation? My friend from the city has offered me help for the past few years and he means well but I have turned it down so far because I know it will turn into a quest just to get me laid. I really don't want to risk getting an STD from some bar skank just to said I got laid, I rather try for a relationship where sex isn't something I have to worry about until I know the person better. However I am out of my own options so I might have to risk it. So lets see what you guys have to say.
ScreamingTrees Posted January 3, 2013 Posted January 3, 2013 No one here is likely to be of any real help. I'm going to use my new catchphrase, and ask you if you'd consider getting counseling? Maybe the person can help you see yourself in a positive light, figure out what the real issue is, maybe help you find a dating/social coach or someone who can assess what the real issue is?
todreaminblue Posted January 3, 2013 Posted January 3, 2013 (edited) No one here is likely to be of any real help. I'm going to use my new catchphrase, and ask you if you'd consider getting counseling? Maybe the person can help you see yourself in a positive light, figure out what the real issue is, maybe help you find a dating/social coach or someone who can assess what the real issue is? hey screaming trees, bit of background on me,i am a woman up until six years ago has never been out fo a relationship, dont really have an extensive dating history i pretty much have gone out with who i have wanted to go out with...dated a bit in my teens, all of which i could have taken further, i also used to get paid to date men...im not proud of that and would never go back to it...it was necessary at the time and the circumstances are long so i wont get into it...... i am not going to give you a stock standard response, i am hiding out from dating at the moment its changed a lot since i dated and I do understand why you find it hard the position you are in with not having much dating experience actually makes you more likely to have a serious one on one relationship with a woman.Men who are serial daters have commitment issues, or they are not looking serious relationships,the smoother a man is on a date with me the more i figure out he is a serial dater so as far as doing something right, its pretty obvious you are not out to multiple date you get attracted to one person and you pursue that woman or girl, there's your something right...theres a few things that have put me off men when i have dated, 1.desperation in a man, is one its not hard to spot it, its when it doesnt matter i am the one sitting opposite them and its pretty obvious that they are desperate, because they let me do all the talking, they are scared to open up and say something wrong so they just do not say anything I CAN build on and be passionate about, they agree with everything i say, they order the same food,instead of concentrating on getting to know me they are planning the next date while we are on one.I could say some thing really outrageous or what i considerto be off putting, definitely something they should say "what did you just say that was whack you know " instead they laugh or they agree.....and in my head im going whhhhhatttttt you are kidding....... 2. inexperience....now not so much but i know it is a turn off for most women if a guy is inexperienced with me ill just try to make him feel at ease its natural for me,but honestly a date shouldnt be about having to do this it also tends to point to the number one date killer..desperation.... your inexperience is probably giving you an anxious demeanor ....I dated this guy once he had not had many dates it was a professional date hetol d em he used to get anxiety just speaking to girls, i asked him why he didnt have any trouble speaking to me he said to met hat i was different and he didnt know why....his main issue he struggled was that he was a virgin and the reason why he was a virgin is because he had a physical issue,not one that was noticeable dressed, hard to deal with yes but possible, he was scared to get intimate,and it showed,becausew hen he spoke about it he got anxious....i will tell you what i told him,inexperience is bettert han beinga smarmy suave smoothe talking gimp who has had a million datesthe, only thingis you cant be scared going into a date you have to be willing to try, every body was a virgin, everybody starts out inexperienced you have to take the knocks on teh ch in and keep working out , no one is a perfect date,not one can deliver perfection, if it is that way , it is too good to be true,possible serial dater, youhave to relax or your date wont...... keep the first date short....dont drag it out, dont be wrapped up in spending too much time on the first date, its an ice breaker, its important you keep it light and fun, a whisper of a date and possibility of a mystery of a second date, dont share you whole life story and lack of dating prowess,it s not a needed thing to discuss, on a first date, the dating prowess doesnt need to be discussed, if you go into the date with an open mind and passion for life in general it will go well,if she is talking non stop about her ex,her life and you cant get a word in edgewise dont sit there wrapped pleased she is monoplozing the conversation or feel that the world revolves around what she has to say, its actually rude,, give an offhand smile,butt in, say hey i have really enjoyed our conversation, hate to cut you short but I need leave unfortunately can we catch up another time, are you free on this day i have this place i would love to take you(do not tell her where) if she asks say its a surprise......smile look her straight n the eye dont you dare look down......and hopefully you get that second date where you get to do some talking.....never put up with rudeness from a date,makes you a door mat.....i think your anxiety about your inexperience and the fact you let the girls do all the talking is harming your prospects....deb. Edited January 3, 2013 by todreaminblue
ScreamingTrees Posted January 3, 2013 Posted January 3, 2013 Are you talking to me, or the guy who started this thread? I'm not even close to 26, and I can't say I'm that anxious around girls anymore, I just don't approach them or try to get a number. The few girls I have HAD approach were a success and they didn't feel I came off as inexperienced or desperate considering we'd spent months together as "friends", in fact, I actually wasn't into them at first and only realized later on that I was into them. I resisted their physical advances because I wasn't sure what I wanted, and eventually that backfired. I would've just PMed you since this isn't actually my thread and I do have a question about a recent situation that I'm not sure how to approach, but my PMing is disabled because one of our residential 40 year old virgins is a big baby who wants constant advice/internet attention as long as it doesn't actually help that person or "hurt thewr pwecious feewings"... So I'll have to wait.
todreaminblue Posted January 3, 2013 Posted January 3, 2013 Are you talking to me, or the guy who started this thread? I'm not even close to 26, and I can't say I'm that anxious around girls anymore, I just don't approach them or try to get a number. The few girls I have HAD approach were a success and they didn't feel I came off as inexperienced or desperate considering we'd spent months together as "friends", in fact, I actually wasn't into them at first and only realized later on that I was into them. I resisted their physical advances because I wasn't sure what I wanted, and eventually that backfired. I would've just PMed you since this isn't actually my thread and I do have a question about a recent situation that I'm not sure how to approach, but my PMing is disabled because one of our residential 40 year old virgins is a big baby who wants constant advice/internet attention as long as it doesn't actually help that person or "hurt thewr pwecious feewings"... So I'll have to wait. lol sorry my computer is really slow and i scanned the side of the post as it was retardedly going down ......and your name was one i spotted may be while flicking through other posts..dont know weird...about to do a restart on my puter....i was getting paranoid about the pm thing, as i tried to pms someone yesterday thought maybe i was blocked from pming people be cause i have a mental illness and i go a bit fruity on here when i am ill, or people were blocking me...i dont pm anyone though havent for a long time.....i like to ask first or be asked...... more likely to pm if someone asks me too.....so thanks for sharing that pm info.......and yes.....it was to the op.....i was posting too....sorrrrrrrrrrrrreeeeeeeeeeeeeee op ....lol.......hugs to ya trees...restart coming up....deb
OregonFriendzoned Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 You need to focus on getting yourself confident first man. Take your thoughts away from dating completely, and put all your attention on you. You said you lost 100 lbs, that's an amazing accomplishment! But if you aren't happy with the way you look, then make it a goal for yourself to do 20 sit-ups in the morning after you get up, then 20 pushups and start running. Nothing gets you feeling better about yourself than a good workout. Eventually you will see the results which will make you feel better about yourself and boost your confidence. Do that and start thinking of yourself in a more positive way. Stop looking at yourself as who you used to be and start looking at yourself as who you WANT to be, then start moving towards that. Women love confidence in a guy. Not fake, cocky confidence. True self esteem that a woman can look at the guy and know that he is cool with being him. Women want that because it 1. shows them that this guy can take care of himself and therefore can take care of her, 2. if a guy has low self esteem then he is going to always be wondering if he's doing something wrong if the girl is in a bad mood or something, which will lead him to ask annoying questions like "are you mad?" or "did I do something wrong?" and 3. women just get all hot n' bothered when they see a guy who likes himself. You say you have trouble talking to women... Yes talking to a cute girl can be intimidating. But what you have to do is just keep thinking of things to talk about with her. Ask her about her interests and see if you share any. If you don't then maybe it's best not to pursue her! If she shuts you down because she isn't interested in talking to you then tell her she's rude and isn't worth your time. Then when you find a cool girl who wants to talk, just keep it going. Ask her about her family, or her pets. Find things out about them so you can build off of that and CONNECT with her. But DO NOT fill the silence with empty babble. Sounds to me like you're already on your way there, putting yourself out there and trying. But when you're messaging these girls, what are you saying to them if you don't mind me asking? Because if you've messaged 150 ladies and only 5 have responded then I'm really curious as to what you're saying that's turning them away. So... like I said. Focus on you first, THEN dating after you get yourself to a point where you can look at yourself in the mirror and honestly say to yourself... "I am the balls and any women who gets me should consider herself lucky." Oh, and get the idea of a mail order bride out of your head. Even considering that option will kill your confidence because at that point you're giving up on yourself. Plus just the thought of buying a wife is ****ing creepy.
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