More loner men than women? More male gamers, card players, hobbyists than women?

November 1, 2012

I'm not familiar with the gamer culture OP discussed, but lots of activities are self-selected by gender. If you go to a sports bar, you'll be surrounded by men; if you go to the mall, you'll be surrounded by women.

But the nerd culture ISN'T dominated by men, at least not anymore. Seriously, check out my pictures! Lots and lots of ladies all around.

November 2, 2012

It's also a confirmation bias. If you THINK women don't play video games/anime, you are more likely to ignore the women you do see and discount them/ignore them/forget them.

I've also noticed that a lot of nerdy guys complain about women not being into nerdy things, WHILE sitting next to/inbetween nerdy girls. What they really mean is no hot women are into nerdy things, but neglect to mention the "hot" word out loud.

Whenever I've gone to cons or Magic tournaments, I've seen tons and tons of women. Quite a few of the nerdy guys I know are married and bring their wives. Sometimes I even feel a little sad, because a tiny part of me way back in high school got into some nerdy things because supposedly it was a sausage fest, only to discover that was not true.

Trust me its not confirmation bias. Especially when the hardcore gamers and anime lovers cant seem to find many women who share their interests. Its hardly confirmation bias when you look at conventions or tournaments and see how men greatly, and I mean greatly, outnumber the women.

November 2, 2012

My non-scientific experience has been that women tend to do more social things that involve other women and men tend to solo or have smaller group hobbies, with infrequent conventions.

November 2, 2012

Kaylan, no offense to your thread, I think it's a great one, but it amuses me when people use the 'you barely see any attractive girls playing games/doing nerdy stuff, ergo there aren't any girls who like playing games/doing nerdy stuff' line. Like, wha? Since when was being attractive a prerequisite for being recognized as a gamer? Honest to god, if we were to narrow down the 'male gamers' to ONLY those who are very attractive (as male gamers so often do to their female counterparts), you'd probably be left with only a handful.

So, let's break the issues down into two here.

1) Why there are fewer female gamers than male. I do think that this is undisputed fact in most cultures. I think it's a mixture of social conventions and upbringing - guys look at you reaaaallly weirdly during your formative years if you prove yourself to be a geek, and during formative years many young women place a lot of emphasis on to fitting in. Fortunately geek culture is becoming more open and less of a social-pariah thing, which encourages many previously unheard-of groups to participate - young women, housewives, and even retired folk with time on their hands. So the number of women involved has been rising.

It also depends on the particular activity. Cosplay attracts a lot of women - the ratio of women/men there is something like 40/60 at the very least. Because it aligns with what those women already innately love - dress-up and costumes and acting. Also there is not much hard competititveness in cosplay, and I think many people, but especially women, as they are more emotionally sensitive, tend to shy away from competition that involves a lot angst and bitching. Sometimes, on the worst days, I feel like leaving competitive gaming altogether because why invite that sort of drama into your life?

Anyone who has ever played competitive team stuff such as end-game WoW raiding, DotA (or its tributaries HoN and LoL), CS, etc, will know what I mean. It depends on your team and your opponents, but in the course of it emotions will run high, people will yell at each other, people get frustrated because they're losing. I notice guys can yell at their friends in a game and then when it's done they'll have forgotten entirely EVERYthing that was ever said and they'll be all buddy-buddy again. Well, I can't do that.

2) Why there are even fewer attractive women in gaming

Well... laws of statistics mostly. Women in gaming are rare, and attractive women are fairly rare, so put the two together and you get a unicorn. Well, not really, as Felicia Day, Hafu, ChocoBlanka, and TossGirl will demonstrate, they do exist. That being said, I think the ratio of attractive to unattractive women in gaming is really the same as that of men. You will find that the men complaining about there being no attractive women in gaming don't always look themselves in the mirror very much.

Also, I know many of you won't believe me, but some types of attractiveness in women require a lot of TIME. Time to find the right clothes, time to style and straighten/curl your hair, time to put on makeup, time to shave your entire body... time. Most adults in full-time jobs don't have that much time to spread around, so if a woman were to spend time on an extensive beauty regime, she is unlikely to have the time to immerse herself in nerdy stuff. Not to mention that the women who are INTERESTED in doing all that, and thus look more attractive, are usually more interested in going out and being social than nerding out. Same goes to bodybuilder guys - I've never met a bodybuilder who was also a huge nerd, though I'm sure they exist.

So there you go, from a girl who's been in Magic, cosplays, WoW, DotA, SC2, Diablo, and quite a bit of other stuff.

November 2, 2012

From what I see, the men who are into the geekier stuff want a girl who is into that stuff as well.

Girls who are into geeky things, don't care if the guy they are dating is into geek culture or not. They rather have a guy who is conventionally attractive in terms of looks, interests and personality.

I don't know what your sample size is, but based on my own observations, I disagree. And I think I know the reason for the discrepancy.

I used to be part of a WoW guild that was very active in BC and LK - out of the 25~ of us, 5 of us were female, the other 20 male. Of the 5 of us women, three of us had bfs in the same guild, the other 2 had bfs who were gamers, but not in the guild. Of the 20 men, 3 WERE the bfs, the others were overwhelmingly not single - more than 70% of them had gfs who were not gamers.

If you think about it, there is a logical explanation - the majority of male attention a normal-looking gamer girl is going to get will be from other gamers. Gaming is a dating strength and a niche for her. Naturally, many will accept this niche instead of ruling it out, especially if there are suitable men within the niche. On the other hand, I'm sorry, but gaming is not a dating strength for men. The very rule of numbers precludes it from being so. So what do the men do? They diversify.

Not all male geeks are alike, you see. Some genuinely have interests other than gaming. Some of them met their gfs at basketball, tennis, martial arts, work, mission trips, church, classes. Basically, they have gfs because gaming is not the end-all be-all of their lives. This doesn't mean that they aren't 'real gamers' or whatever nonsense that the bitter 'hardcore'-ers level at them. It means that they know how to live a balanced life.

Let's take, for example, another group of guys that I spent my college years going to cybercafes into the wee hours of the morning with, everyday. An overwhelming 90% of them were single. It isn't difficult to imagine why. Our lives were: get up, attend classes, meet rightaway after class and head to the cybercafes, have dinner and supper nearby, come home at 2am, rinse and repeat. Where did they think they'd be meeting girls? To make things worse, they were the sort of guys who were more interested in 'hot girls' than 'gamer girls'. Their dream was of finding a 'hot gamer girl' who would somehow miraculously turn up there and be attracted to a guy who spent 8 hours a day in a cybercafe. Nope.. don't think so.

Edited November 2, 2012 by Elswyth

November 2, 2012

Apparently I need to stop posting in threads like this because my experiences are completely out of the ordinary.

I must live in a bizzaro world where the geeky girls only want to date non-geeky guys, if those girls want to date at all and most of the time, they rather be single.

November 2, 2012

I think my point is that you must consider if you are one of those who allows gaming to be the be-all and end-all of your hobbies. When was the last time you tried a new hobby?

November 2, 2012

I would be completely happy getting a GF that likes to dance (salsa or ballroom) or a geeky gamer/anime girl.

And I have spent years looking in what seems to be the best places to find them and I've had absolutely zero luck.

Where the hell does one actually find girls that like those things who'd want to date me?!

November 2, 2012

I think you turned down a few requests for group dancing because the girl who asked you had a husband? You should have accepted, because others in the group might have been single.

Gamer girls, I'll tell you straight up, you are going to be at a disadvantage there. Guys in gaming are like girls in a convent school.

Anime, as V says, you should participate in cosplay. And by participate I don't mean just showing up at cosplays and watching and asking girls out. Plenty of guys do that, and it isn't terribly attractive. I mean really taking part in it, being part of the community and dressing up yourself, being involved in organizing and planning events and managing the booths.

November 2, 2012

Kaylan, no offense to your thread, I think it's a great one, but it amuses me when people use the 'you barely see any attractive girls playing games/doing nerdy stuff, ergo there aren't any girls who like playing games/doing nerdy stuff' line. Like, wha? Since when was being attractive a prerequisite for being recognized as a gamer? Honest to god, if we were to narrow down the 'male gamers' to ONLY those who are very attractive (as male gamers so often do to their female counterparts), you'd probably be left with only a handful.

So, let's break the issues down into two here.

1) Why there are fewer female gamers than male. I do think that this is undisputed fact in most cultures. I think it's a mixture of social conventions and upbringing - guys look at you reaaaallly weirdly during your formative years if you prove yourself to be a geek, and during formative years many young women place a lot of emphasis on to fitting in. Fortunately geek culture is becoming more open and less of a social-pariah thing, which encourages many previously unheard-of groups to participate - young women, housewives, and even retired folk with time on their hands. So the number of women involved has been rising.

It also depends on the particular activity. Cosplay attracts a lot of women - the ratio of women/men there is something like 40/60 at the very least. Because it aligns with what those women already innately love - dress-up and costumes and acting. Also there is not much hard competititveness in cosplay, and I think many people, but especially women, as they are more emotionally sensitive, tend to shy away from competition that involves a lot angst and bitching. Sometimes, on the worst days, I feel like leaving competitive gaming altogether because why invite that sort of drama into your life?

Anyone who has ever played competitive team stuff such as end-game WoW raiding, DotA (or its tributaries HoN and LoL), CS, etc, will know what I mean. It depends on your team and your opponents, but in the course of it emotions will run high, people will yell at each other, people get frustrated because they're losing. I notice guys can yell at their friends in a game and then when it's done they'll have forgotten entirely EVERYthing that was ever said and they'll be all buddy-buddy again. Well, I can't do that.

2) Why there are even fewer attractive women in gaming

Well... laws of statistics mostly. Women in gaming are rare, and attractive women are fairly rare, so put the two together and you get a unicorn. Well, not really, as Felicia Day, Hafu, ChocoBlanka, and TossGirl will demonstrate, they do exist. That being said, I think the ratio of attractive to unattractive women in gaming is really the same as that of men. You will find that the men complaining about there being no attractive women in gaming don't always look themselves in the mirror very much.

Also, I know many of you won't believe me, but some types of attractiveness in women require a lot of TIME. Time to find the right clothes, time to style and straighten/curl your hair, time to put on makeup, time to shave your entire body... time. Most adults in full-time jobs don't have that much time to spread around, so if a woman were to spend time on an extensive beauty regime, she is unlikely to have the time to immerse herself in nerdy stuff. Not to mention that the women who are INTERESTED in doing all that, and thus look more attractive, are usually more interested in going out and being social than nerding out. Same goes to bodybuilder guys - I've never met a bodybuilder who was also a huge nerd, though I'm sure they exist.

So there you go, from a girl who's been in Magic, cosplays, WoW, DotA, SC2, Diablo, and quite a bit of other stuff.

I don't say this often enough, E, but I do wish we lived in the same country. I'd love to play Magic with you some time.

Oh and how do you like my Cosplay "Raven" costume? I'm not sure I ever posted picture of it until now.

November 2, 2012

I think you turned down a few requests for group dancing because the girl who asked you had a husband? You should have accepted, because others in the group might have been single.

Gamer girls, I'll tell you straight up, you are going to be at a disadvantage there. Guys in gaming are like girls in a convent school.

Anime, as V says, you should participate in cosplay. And by participate I don't mean just showing up at cosplays and watching and asking girls out. Plenty of guys do that, and it isn't terribly attractive. I mean really taking part in it, being part of the community and dressing up yourself, being involved in organizing and planning events and managing the booths.

agreed. Did ya see my pictures Somedude? My friend (dressed as Tuxedo Mask from Sailor Moon) reminds me of you, at least physically. And see how much attention he's getting? He gets TONS when he's dressed up as Zuko from Avatar: Last Airbender.

This last weekend I ran into him out at our college bar. He was with a bachelorette party, all of em dressed Steampunk-y. They told him he couldn't come unless he dressed up too. So, he threw on a corset, a blonde wig, and was the most popular thing at the bars that night. Lots of girls wanted their picture taken with him... of course, he's already got a cute girlfriend in Japan who adores him, so he just played it cool and had a good time.

That's how you do it. I could tell you SO many stories of guys who got tons of attention just for cosplaying. Did you not see my pictures of Captain America? Without much exaggeration, the guy could have had ANY single girl at that Con because his costume was so spot-on and he was so charming. (Take him out of the costume and I didn't recognize him!)

Try. Just try. Who could you try cosplaying as?

November 2, 2012

I don't say this often enough, E, but I do wish we lived in the same country. I'd love to play Magic with you some time.

Aww, me too! I've missed gaming with other girls. Though you would probably own me in Magic.

Oh and how do you like my Cosplay "Raven" costume? I'm not sure I ever posted picture of it until now.

Can't see it. You gotta add me to contacts, though I thought you already did the last time I viewed your pics?

agreed. Did ya see my pictures Somedude? My friend (dressed as Tuxedo Mask from Sailor Moon) reminds me of you, at least physically. And see how much attention he's getting? He gets TONS when he's dressed up as Zuko from Avatar: Last Airbender.

This last weekend I ran into him out at our college bar. He was with a bachelorette party, all of em dressed Steampunk-y. They told him he couldn't come unless he dressed up too. So, he threw on a corset, a blonde wig, and was the most popular thing at the bars that night. Lots of girls wanted their picture taken with him... of course, he's already got a cute girlfriend in Japan who adores him, so he just played it cool and had a good time.

That's how you do it. I could tell you SO many stories of guys who got tons of attention just for cosplaying. Did you not see my pictures of Captain America? Without much exaggeration, the guy could have had ANY single girl at that Con because his costume was so spot-on and he was so charming. (Take him out of the costume and I didn't recognize him!)

Try. Just try. Who could you try cosplaying as?

Yeah, lots of the guys and girls from my old cosplay group paired up with one another. Cosplaying takes a lot of effort and social interaction, though.

November 2, 2012

Can't see it. You gotta add me to contacts

I can't see it either V.

November 2, 2012

Anyone seen the Seth Green

Geeks and Gamer Girls Spoof of Katie Perry's song? LOL

November 2, 2012

Or, if you watch

That they might not game as much as they want.

November 2, 2012

Also, if nerdy guys got into cosplaying just a little bit, they'd suddenly find themselves surrounded by girls. I've never understood why more guys don't embrace cosplaying for that alone...

Exhibit A
B
And C

I still think you looked great in that costume. Lovely hair style too.

November 2, 2012

I can't see it either V.

If you click on my "Exhibit B" picture, I'm the shorter girl on the right.

Edit: This is a better shot. I didn't sew the leotard, but I am darn proud of that cloak. Worked on that for two weeks straight... six feet of velvet and satin. That thing is warm; I used it to blanket 3 other people during a chilly panel.

Edited November 2, 2012 by verhrzn

November 2, 2012

I think you turned down a few requests for group dancing because the girl who asked you had a husband? You should have accepted, because others in the group might have been single.

1. It was not a group dance. Just me and her.

2. We both realized it was a mistake for us to go and canceled the plans.

3. Nobody requested to go dancing with me. She's the one (and only woman so far) who expressed an interest in going out dancing with me, and I invited her not knowing that she was married.

Gamer girls, I'll tell you straight up, you are going to be at a disadvantage there. Guys in gaming are like girls in a convent school.

I've never heard the expression "girls in a convent school" before.

Anime, as V says, you should participate in cosplay. And by participate I don't mean just showing up at cosplays and watching and asking girls out. Plenty of guys do that, and it isn't terribly attractive. I mean really taking part in it, being part of the community and dressing up yourself, being involved in organizing and planning events and managing the booths.

agreed. Did ya see my pictures Somedude? My friend (dressed as Tuxedo Mask from Sailor Moon) reminds me of you, at least physically. And see how much attention he's getting? He gets TONS when he's dressed up as Zuko from Avatar: Last Airbender.

This last weekend I ran into him out at our college bar. He was with a bachelorette party, all of em dressed Steampunk-y. They told him he couldn't come unless he dressed up too. So, he threw on a corset, a blonde wig, and was the most popular thing at the bars that night. Lots of girls wanted their picture taken with him... of course, he's already got a cute girlfriend in Japan who adores him, so he just played it cool and had a good time.

That's how you do it. I could tell you SO many stories of guys who got tons of attention just for cosplaying. Did you not see my pictures of Captain America? Without much exaggeration, the guy could have had ANY single girl at that Con because his costume was so spot-on and he was so charming. (Take him out of the costume and I didn't recognize him!)

Try. Just try. Who could you try cosplaying as?

Trouble is, I don't know anybody who cosplays nor do I know anything about cosplaying itself or making costumes.

I think it would be fun to try and put together a costume and go out with people. Right now, I wouldn't even know how to start.

November 2, 2012

VERY cool, V! I admire the cosplayers who make their own costumes by hand instead of paying tailors to do it... such dedication. Your costume is awesome, and you look great. The hairstyle seems to really suit you, too!

November 2, 2012

VERY cool, V! I admire the cosplayers who make their own costumes by hand instead of paying tailors to do it... such dedication. Your costume is awesome, and you look great. The hairstyle seems to really suit you, too!

Well, the tailor made my leotard because I was/am still too much of a beginner to work with tightly-fitted spandex, but I was determined to make the rest.... so cloak, belt, and gloves are all me!

I'm hoping to dress up like the character from Assassin's Creed next year; I think if I start sewing in February I can pull it off.

@Somedude

Well hit up some cons and you'll find plenty of cosplayers. None of us know anything when starting out; I've spent years toying with it, and I am still very much an amateur. (Never tried molds or weapons.)

Who is a character that you love to embody?

November 2, 2012

If you click on my "Exhibit B" picture, I'm the shorter girl on the right.

Edit: This is a better shot. I didn't sew the leotard, but I am darn proud of that cloak. Worked on that for two weeks straight... six feet of velvet and satin. That thing is warm; I used it to blanket 3 other people during a chilly panel.

You're so cute and gorgeous V. Wow!

November 3, 2012

I must live in a bizzaro world where the geeky girls only want to date non-geeky guys, if those girls want to date at all and most of the time, they rather be single.

I am female and I consider myself to be kinda geeky. I would much rather spend the afternoon playing video games then shopping or dancing or anything esle you may think of as a normal "female" activity.

I would also never be able to date a guy who didn't at least somewhat like geeky things. I would probably be incredibly bored trying to find something to talk about and do.

November 3, 2012

If you click on my "Exhibit B" picture, I'm the shorter girl on the right.

Edit: This is a better shot. I didn't sew the leotard, but I am darn proud of that cloak. Worked on that for two weeks straight... six feet of velvet and satin. That thing is warm; I used it to blanket 3 other people during a chilly panel.

With all the complaints Ive heard from you regarding men and dating, its definitely not your looks keeping you from finding the guy you want. I know several guys who would want to date you.

I know Id kick it to you if I saw you in a bar.

November 3, 2012

Yet another Exhibit

November 3, 2012

Some consider liking anime to be "nerdy", but honestly unless you're gaming and watching anime, reading comics constantly, I wouldn't consider it as such. I like reading manga and watching anime to a certain extent and I'm female, but I have other interests outside of that. My husband is a casual gamer, he used to be more into comics, games and anime when I first met him, but work and school take priority now. Nothing wrong with having a casual hobby. I just cannot stand the notorious anime and gamer fans with BO. Yikes!

I also used to be a loner in school...and that's just because I'm shy and introverted. *shrugs*

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