Daisy926 Posted October 9, 2012 Posted October 9, 2012 OK I am in an emotional affair that started online. We have met once - just for lunch nothing happened. I know the thoughts of grass is greener on the other side and all the other terrible things that can come of this. This is more of a friendship. Basically my marriage has had issues over the last few years and way before we were married. I have had my doubts about this but except for once in a while talking to friends have just pushed it aside. We started talking lots while I was on business trips and for months it was non stop. He was the friend I needed, I can't explain how wonderful it feels. He has helped me through a lot. I started going to counselling based on discussions with him. He wanted me to help mend my marriage. It was never about us being together. I am pretty sure my marriage is over (my therapist agrees my love is gone) The guy and I still talk not as much. It was important for me to know he was not the decision that pushed me to breaking up but helped me confont my happiness. He has distanced himself. Says he needs to work on him. I understand this as he has said look at it from his perspective - he can give and give and I cannot, I understand it hurts. He has told me of his feelings but also that he cannot and will not express them as it will hurt us both to pursue now. We also live somewhat far although he lives where I am from and can see moving back one day. He is more into saying but even forget my marriage look how far we are, I on the other hand like to believe love can work. His main issue is not wanting to feel like he is in a relationship with me and that is what happens. I understand that and try not to talk about us or wanting too much of his time. I know in just reading this the responses are move on, leave him alone and I understand that. He is backing away more and more and I guess it just hurts. We still talk lots but I guess I understand he does not want to openly express his feelings often and I understand that too but at the same time it is nice to know I am not just having feelings for an "idea". I don't know my question really, I guess it is just for those that have ever talked with a married person do you hold back to keep from hurting. I would like to believe we can stay friends and whatever happens happens but I think about him way to much. I know if he didnt care he wouldn't waste his time. I guess I just feel for over a year we talked non stop now he is backing away a little, is this normal. I am working up the strength to leave my marriage (that is another thread) and has nothing to do with this guy. I have felt this prior and know I need alone time after the breakup before I look to someone else. I guess my main fear is I finally got the courage to leave but am worried that if I do not see a future with this guy I will just stay unhappy in marriage. Not that I would leave for him the idea that I can connect with someone else.
Hawaii50 Posted October 9, 2012 Posted October 9, 2012 Leave you marriage fine, but don't use this guy's heart as your crutch. He's seems smitten and is trying to be practical...
veryhappy Posted October 9, 2012 Posted October 9, 2012 It is very common for women to have exit affairs; they're done with the marriage, but need the extra help out. If a divorce is what you wanted, and you can do that, go ahead and get a divorce. 1
Author Daisy926 Posted October 9, 2012 Author Posted October 9, 2012 (edited) I am not trying to use his heart AT ALL. That is why I am posting here. I know it sounds crazy but I truley feel I am falling in love with this other man. Our conversations are very deep like a best friend. I know how this can usually turn out and sure you can judge but I am the most loyal person who would never hurt anyone intentionally. I guess the part that hurts is not knowing his feelings 100%. Sure he has said but doesn't like if I go on about mine. He says we are beating a dead horse right now and I know it is hard for him to express as he doesn't want to get hurt.. I guess I need that reassurance - which I know is selfish. I want to have a heart to heart but I am scared of pushing him away. I feel he is intentionally trying to maybe get over me or something and it hurts. I also understand what talking for over a year can do to him. I am just so lost with what to do and feel I am having a breakdown with all I am feeling lately. I am not looking for him to help me out, That is guilt neither of us would want. I just want to be able to get to know him better right now not looking for more. We have talked about it - he doesn't know the single me nor do I know him in that light. Edited October 9, 2012 by Daisy926 added
sad puppy Posted October 9, 2012 Posted October 9, 2012 Just sounds like you're not ready to divorce until you have the other locked into a relationship with you. Why are you afraid to be alone or on your own, even for a short period of time? Maybe you should explore that with your therapist. Did the other guy start backing off after you met? I ask because from what you write, it doesn't sound like he's making arrangements to be with you or take your relationship to a deeper level. Maybe he was just the catalyst to get you thinking seriously about divorce. 2
Author Daisy926 Posted October 9, 2012 Author Posted October 9, 2012 No he didn't back off after we met. We met almost a year ago. It is recent and he has had some changes in his life as far as job, etc. so I knew we would talk less just my insecurities I think. I understand what you mean by me putting in 50% to my marriage. I have given 150% for almost 18 years of this relationship (4 years of marriage) My husband is completely emotionless, we lack any form of communicating. You can see my other thread to explain but I do not feel I am taking away from the marriage. Sure talking to the other guy does not help and I am not trying to make excuses but I am not talking to him about things I wouldn't talk about with husband or instead of.... my husband and I never have and I tried. I can barely keep my husband on the phone for 5 minutes when I travel so I am not taking away from what is there - it's not there anyway. I agree with what you say about my happiness. I have been trying to focus on me but being home and depressed makes it hard. I am not trying to leave one for another although it does sound like that I understand. I guess I just don't want to have feelings that cannot be returned. Its hard to explain. I think I need to take this EA for what it is a nice friendship and work on my marriage by either ending it or not and just live my life with whatever happens happens. One of my issues is I worry about things to much. I can't control the future and even if he told me he loves me today who says that would be the same 6 months or a year from now anyway. I just need to stop focusing so much energy on him.
Tenacity Posted October 9, 2012 Posted October 9, 2012 Do you realize that you are at least 50% responsible for the crappy marriage? I wonder what your H thinks about your contributions to the marriage. How on EARTH can you possibly know this from one post? You think that for every marriage that fails, each spouse is always equally at fault? I was married to a narcissistic, alcoholic man who abused me physically and mentally for almost 2 decades. And I am 50% responsible for my crappy marriage? OMG... I am SO tired of these posts from people who profess to have all the answers, and offer lectures on completely off-topic subjects they know nothing about! OP, you need to do things in the proper order. He is likely pulling away because he doesn't want to get hurt. First step... get out of the M, and leave this man alone. Clearly this man cares for you... if he is still available when you are, that is the time for a real relationship. Good luck to you. 2
BetrayedH Posted October 9, 2012 Posted October 9, 2012 He wisely does not want to invest more of his emotional capital on a woman that is unavailable. You're a married woman. The healthy thing for him to do is to let your marriage alone at least until such time as you are divorced and probably for a good year after, or he runs the risk of just being either your exit affair or your soft-landing rebound. Be kind and let the guy go until you are officially divorced. As for your marriage (and this is just my $.02), your husband likely has no clue that he should be in competition for your marriage. MANY people begin to take marriage for granted because, well, we're never supposed to be in competition for our wife. I made (perhaps) similar mistakes to your H. We had been together for like 16 years, married for 10, two small kids, two professional jobs, and so forth. Lots of "life" stuff got in the way of keeping a passionate emotional connection. We even took separate days off so we only had three days a week to worry about day care. This meant we had NO days off together and if you weren't working, you always had the kids. Life wasn't remotely exciting. I have to admit that I just kinda stayed in neutral. I figured that with all this going on, that these weren't going to be our best years and our relationship took a back seat to several more years of a kid-centric universe. I certainly didn't mean to neglect my wife or marriage; I loved her to death but I felt very secure in us. When my wife sat me down to tell me that she thought we might need to separate, that she needed some time to think about it, and that it was probably too late to save the marriage, I was completely shell-shocked. She could say that she had tried to talk to me (what she later called "softball attempts") but I truly never got the message. Men are freakin' dense. You can't switch to 2% milk and think we somehow got the message that we need to lose weight. We need to be hit over the head with a sledgehammer. I won't judge your decision to quit your marriage as I haven't read your other thread (maybe he is a complete asshat). But I can tell you that when I found out how much my marriage was in jeopardy, I changed EVERYTHING that she had every considered to be a problem. I felt awful that I had somehow made my wife so unhappy that she was considering separation. I got the message and prayed that it wasn't too late. I watched my diet (lost a lot of weight), began exercising twice a day, tried my damnedest to quit smoking, opened up to her in an emotional sense, did much more to help out around the home (although I was never a slacker in that regard), agreed to marriage counseling, and so forth. It was shocking for her. But after about 3 weeks of this (and not really understanding how the hell we were at a point of separation), I discovered that she had been in an affair for a year. We did our utmost to reconcile and she eventually told me how stupid she felt (her word) for having an affair when all she really had to do was really sit me down and say how unhappy she was. Perhaps you are past a point of no return but to have engaged in an affair rather than fixing your marriage or leaving it, you've been horribly unfair to your husband. My gut says he deserves for you to have one straight up honest conversation about how close he is to losing this marriage so he has a real chance to reinvest in you and his marriage. There is no way for him to compete with the mental fantasy you've been engaging with over the last year. This other man just needs to put his best self forward via text on a screen and your lonely heart fills in all the rest of the blanks with sunshine, sunflowers, unicorns and rainbows. There are no shared responsibilities, no kids, no debts, no dirty underwear - just the fantasy of a better life. Your husband has NO CHANCE of competing with that, especially when he has no idea that he is in competition for his wife. In comparison to your fantasy, he is a total loser. This is pretty unfair. And although you have tried to mentally prevent it from happening, there is a real amount of "rewriting your marital history" that is done to help your mind justify behaviors that are probably completely contrary to your own belief system. "Now that I think about it, I haven't been happy for years. I'm not sure I was ever in love with my husband." This is, of course, nonsense. The reality is that your husband is a real person that has actually been there with you for 18 years (and has probably put up with a lot of your bull**** over that time, too). You have had good and bad times with him. Don't try to compare that with the fantasy you've created in your head. There's about a 3% success rate for relationships that begin as affairs. Sound like something worth throwing 18 years away for? Please consider getting completely honest with your husband about what you have been doing and give him the chance to make his own informed decision about how to proceed with his life. That has been denied him for the last year while he has unknowingly had another man in the middle of his marriage. Contrary to what you might think, I suspect you might see a man that desperately fights for you and your marriage (which is probably what you really wanted all long). Good luck. 6
Author Daisy926 Posted October 9, 2012 Author Posted October 9, 2012 Thanks everyone especially BetrayedH. I agree with almost all you have said and I understand what you mean. To clear things up OM is not married or even dating (hasn't had many relationships) I know it is an EA but not in the sense of a traditional affair. In all honesty it is a good friendship that I know is unhealthy. The reason I say I agree with most of what you said is I have had these feelings way before OM (OM really just got me thinking of myself and therapy). Since my H and I have been together for so long I feel I lost myself. I am not blaming him but when people say what made you fall in love in the first place I can't answer that. I was a kid everyone said he was wrong but I justified it all in my head. I am at a point now where I just realize the core values I want in a relationship are not, never have nor will ever be there. We are too different people. I do agree that I need to be completely honest about my thoughts of leaving. I try - we never communicate so it is talking to a wall. He refuses to go to therapy and says if I want to leave go he can't stop me. He says he cares and I agree to a point he does but deep down I feel it is only because I have provided for us all these years. I will make effort. I have reached out to many friends/family that know us over the years and it seems everyone saw this coming one day so I am not completely crazy. The therapist says I will not leave for guilt. I am not sure why I won't leave and being with the OM right away would never be an option for me. I care about this person and I know I would never get into anything unless/until it was the right time. Again I am not trying to justify my friendship - it is just nice to have that person you can communicate with deeply. It is not something I am replacing my H with - we never had that.
Author Daisy926 Posted October 9, 2012 Author Posted October 9, 2012 Unless he is the biggest manipulator ever. We have each others facebooks, I have mailed things to his home, when we can't talk it is me - meaning I can call, text or email whenever I want. He lives with his brothers who I hear all the time in the back, everything said seems true, very open about anything. Trust me I know about lies on the internet and I am not saying that I know him 100% but I have met him, we have shared pictures, cams, talked hours on end... There is zero indication that anything he has told me is untrue. Believe me I am always thinking the way you are but that would be the last thing I suspect. I have not gotten physical nor would I ever while married but we have met - this is not just someone I have never seen. Just saw your edit - true but our friendship started as just that - talking about relationships, etc. I do not know this but at the same time he has done nothing to steer me away from marriage. If anything he wanted to help me at first. I believe he is one of the good guys, sure I can be wrong but I do know a lot of the bad ones so not sure how to prove it
Author Daisy926 Posted October 9, 2012 Author Posted October 9, 2012 Yes - I don't want to get too personal on here but in the family home, parents passed. Eventually they will split it. My point was he is not a married man with kids. I do believe what he has told me about his past relationships - never a reason to lie and really doesn't change the fact that I am the married one.
todreaminblue Posted October 9, 2012 Posted October 9, 2012 Your husband does deserve to know the truth.You should talk to him you are conflicted.Marriages do develop into firm friendship and keeping the spark in intimate relations takes effort and persistence when you become apathetic or leave it to stagnate that spark will go.....you can get it back if you are willing to make the effort.You need to work on your conflicted heart.Your husband needs to know the truth to have a chance to say his piece.....i wish you hope...only you know what this marriage is really worth to you and yoru heart.....for better or worse.....for you at the moment is the worse bit.....that can be worked on....good luck..deb 1
BetrayedH Posted October 9, 2012 Posted October 9, 2012 Daisy, I took the time to read some of your older posts. You have been pretty consistent about the talking to the wall thing. I think you need to do exactly what my wife did. Sit him down. Tell him you are serious about divorce if things do not change. Have specific requirements for him in order to remain married (weekly marriage counseling, 15 hours a week of togetherness time without any children, TV, movies - it's just for the two of you to build imtimacy, x number of job application submitted per month, and so forth). Be clear and determined about what are dealbreakers for you. As much as I hate infidelity, it's not the only way to break your vows. You're coming up on a year's worth of posting here. My gut says it is time to tell your H to step up or he should expect divorce papers. If he doesn't, you know how the rest of your life is going to be in this marriage and staying means consent to it. In the meantime, break off this EA you're having and quit calling it a friendship. If you are having personal and intimate conversations about your life, marriage and future with someone of the opposite sex behind your husband's back, you're in an EA. That role is reserved for your husband. And if he doesn't want the role, you divorce before engaging anyone else. Calling it an inappropriate friendship is nothing short of denial. Break off this EA completely for the sake of the sOM, yourself, and out of respect for your marriage vows/husband. If you end up divorcing, try to give yourself some time to heal (a year is what is typically recommended) before leaning on someone else so that they're not just being used as a soft landing. You can do this and if you do it right, you will be proud of the way you handled yourself and you will heal more quickly on your way to your second life. But rest assured, what you are going through stops when you say it stops. Take charge of your life. Best of luck to you.
Author Daisy926 Posted October 14, 2012 Author Posted October 14, 2012 Thanks Betrayed. I am trying to talk with husband now. He keeps asking if I still love him. It is more than just that - I need to work on how to explain what is wrong. I finally got the nerve up to talk to my mother and let her know what is going on. That was a big help and I feel stronger. Thanks again I really appreciate your post. I so not want to intentionally hurt my husband. I just feel we are different people. I can't imagine not caring for him but I can't take care of him forever.
GLDheart Posted October 14, 2012 Posted October 14, 2012 Daisy, I respect you coming here with this. I'm glad you are trying to talk to him. I hope he surprises you with just how much he can step up to the plate... If not, his loss.
BetrayedH Posted October 14, 2012 Posted October 14, 2012 Thanks Betrayed. I am trying to talk with husband now. He keeps asking if I still love him. It is more than just that - I need to work on how to explain what is wrong. I finally got the nerve up to talk to my mother and let her know what is going on. That was a big help and I feel stronger. Thanks again I really appreciate your post. I so not want to intentionally hurt my husband. I just feel we are different people. I can't imagine not caring for him but I can't take care of him forever. From your standpoint, I think it is yes that you love him but you cannot stay if certain things don't change. And then get specific. Sounds like you've had difficulty in that regard. Imagine then how much harder it is for him to read your mind. I'm glad you have a confidante now that can help you provide some clarity. Perhaps an IC can also help you know what you really need. This is the part that is on you. After that, it's in him to make permanent changes. I agree that you cannot care for him like a parent forever. He may never have the same drive that you do (he's not the same person as you so you always end up compromising for a spouse) but if it continues to be extreme enough to keep building resentment in you, then I agree to GLDHeart that it's your Hs loss. Pls keep posting as you can find some objective opinions here. Mom and even your counselor are biased in your favor and sometimes we all need to hear messages that aren't our favorite. This EA is a big distraction for you and I would love to hear you end it for all three people involved so you can focus on reconciliation or separation/divorce with your H. I'm glad to hear that you want to do right by him and that's very tough to do when you're focused on getting your needs met elsewhere. I think you would agree that this EA is a huge distraction from cleaning up what you have going on at home. Affairs don't solve anything (except for a very short term and for you only) and you pay far too much of a long term price for that short term external validation (and others pay a heavy price as well). By the way, sorry for the delayed reply. Been out of town for a few days (at a wedding of all places).
Author Daisy926 Posted October 16, 2012 Author Posted October 16, 2012 He won't go to counselling. I just posted in separation and divorce if anyone cares to ready - not sure how to link it... Lot happened and I am so lost - can use all the help I can get. The EA I am def cutting off - I really do want to stress it is not as deep as people think. My issues with H have been there so many years prior. The EA helped me see I can have conversations and guided me to therapy. Thanks I have IC tomorrow and it should be big - so much has happened
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