Were You Disappointed By Reality?

October 4, 2012

A few years back there was a post made here by a young 18-21 year old woman talking about how her breasts sagged and how it made her feel in relations to expectations from men. Alot of the young guys responded and gave her advice from telling her to work out harder, lose weight and even get implants. Basically, if a woman doesn't fit into the projected ideal, she should fix herself until she is the projected ideal. Alot of the young men seemed stunned that a woman that age could have breasts that sagged to begin with and where very critical of her.

While there are many pretty regular women in the world, media disproportionatly increases expectations with a combination of a high percentage of naturally attractive people showcased through a heavily moderated controlled environment that helps to create the illusion. Meaning surgery, make-up, styling, lighting... the likes of all that.

I don't partically take confort when guys say things like, "it's just fantasy". It being fantasy doesn't mean that's not what someone wants on some level. Of course, there are varying levels of desire and wants but when it comes to the ideal version of the female form, it's pretty clear what men expect and and want women to be is a heavy pressure.

There is a lot of pressure regarding your body as a woman. People will advise you not to buy into the hype. But I see a lot of men that buy into the hype everyday when it comes to depictions of women. How are you suppose to have relationships with men when you work hard not to buy the hype but you know they do when they are looking at things like porn or Maxim? I don't really know the answer. I do know that saying "it's just fantasy" doesn't fix the problem.

October 4, 2012

90+ percent of women arent flawless. If men are only sleeping with flawless women here then 90 percent of men are sleeping with 10 precent of women. Dont you all just love my LS logic?

V, these men are full of crap. There is no way they have only slept with porn star looking women, not the type that is in our head anyway.

That's not what they're saying - I personally like 'real' women's bodies, as I have said before on a now infamous thread . And I think articles like the one V posted don't really give those of us who aren't expecting flawless women enough credit.

I reiterate - I've never been 'disappointed' .

October 4, 2012

I was around women my entire life so of course I knew all did not look like porn stars. Women just like men are a very diverse group of people.

I have actually become pleasently surprised that as my past becomes more and more distant I realize women are not the monsters I was exposed to growing up.

To some people no matter what they will see the worst in the opposite sex. They will probably look at a man who died trying to protect a woman and say that he was just trying to get laid in the afterlife.

October 4, 2012

I've never seen a woman naked in real-life well except for the time when I was little I saw my parents naked in their bedroom, but yeah anyway if it ever comes to the situation where I'm about to have sex with a woman the only thing that could probably disappoint me besides the "woman" being a man (that would be beyond just disappointing) would be perhaps some serious deformities.

Besides with the way women dress today its not hard to imagine how they'd look naked its not like I'm in Iran and all the women are wearing Burkas (the hijab can look pretty good though) so I have no idea what to expect.

October 4, 2012

That's not what they're saying - I personally like 'real' women's bodies, as I have said before on a now infamous thread

Oh yeah … aren't you guys cautioned against speaking about your reactions to women's bodies? By the very poster who now wants you to talk about your reactions to women's bodies?

October 4, 2012

Oh yeah … aren't you guys cautioned against speaking about your reactions to women's bodies? By the very poster who now wants you to talk about your reactions to women's bodies?

Even yesterday in a thread she said you should tell a women right away you think shes hot or will be stuck in the friend zone,its all so very confusing on here sometimes:laugh:

October 4, 2012

The OP probably isn't aware of the breadth of modern porn variety. I'm guessing the "girls in porn" she's talking about are the stereotypical, Jenna Jameson, fake-titted blondes ??

Cause if that's who you mean, then no, I've actually been relieved by every girl I've seen naked not looking like that.

In the type of porn I've always watched ("amateur" varieties like that made by BangBros, etc), I come across as many I'm not attracted to as I am. And 95% of the time they look like some fine-ass chick you might run into out in any major city. Cause as someone pointed out - they are just ****ing people...

I like beautiful and/or cute-faced women who aren't too chunky or too thin, ideally with a plump booty and maybe some luscious breasts. Be mad about that but don't get into some classic, outdated complaint that "men only like thin, barbie-lookin' girls with big tits because that's what society and porn have conditioned them to"

October 4, 2012

I'm still reeling from the concept, often used as a bludgeon here on LoveShack by a handful of women posters, that it's horrible if men like to look at pretty, beautiful, sexy, or cute girls / women.

Hasn't this always been this way?

My dad had "Playboy" ...

October 4, 2012

That's an over simplification of what is being said Mme.

Some women feel certain pressure and implications are being made about feminnity and women's bodies through the visual mediums men like. This can cause certain issues with women that are trying to figure out themselves in connection with men and how it all fits together. I don't want to be in a relationship with a man that things "fantasy" is better. I also don't really understand why we expect women not to buy into the hype of these platforms but it's okay when men buy into them and enjoy them. If you want to berate some of us for that, you can. And you probably will, speaking from past experiences with you. But it doesn't really help the discussion.

I also think Playboy created unrealistic expectations. Unfortunetly, Playboy seems "tame" compared to what is available today.

Are men wrong to like pretty women? No. Are women wrong to feel pressured about expectations about what their bodies should be? No.

October 5, 2012

But … that's not really true. SOME men do that. Evidently, the men you and v both choose. Not ALL men.

I am SO SICK of those of you (there are only about 5 women, including you & v, and about 500 men) who feel perfectly okay about denigrating an entire gender full of our fellow human beings based upon your own … sickness (sorry, but that's the only way I can express it).

If you all have bad experiences with the opposite sex, NO WONDER. I can only imagine the walk in the park it must be to date you, v, and your male counterparts here like greznog, doc gobbles, woggle, somedude, leasureworld dude, etc. The horror.

I continue to be confused how me thinking men are shallow and want to have sex with attractive women is somehow denigrating an entire gender, when lots and lots of men say it themselves. I am not claiming men would cheat on their sexy wives, or dump their beautiful girlfriends.... just that they are with those women in the first place because guys are kind of "shallow."

And shallow, by my estimate, is not necessarily loaded with negative stereotypes. It just means men are visual and require physical beauty to be attracted to someone. Why is this such a hostile attitude to have??

October 5, 2012

Even yesterday in a thread she said you should tell a women right away you think shes hot or will be stuck in the friend zone,its all so very confusing on here sometimes:laugh:

Did ANY of you idiots criticizing me actually read my remarks in any of those threads you're claiming?

I said, over and over, that you are more than welcome to tal about a woman's body, when she has expressed consent to do so. So, when you're on a date, or when she asks, etc. It is when you talk about it without prompting or in crude ways that I took issue with.

And you SHOULDN'T call a woman hot right away, but you SHOULD ask her out on a date and tell her out right that you find her attractive. Hot <-> attractive. Not the same words.

If you guys are going to attack me, at least remember what I said accurately.

October 5, 2012

AS RogerWallace said, I think it's a common misconception that men like these over-sized, mutated looking things some porn stars call breast, with a half-ton of make-up on their face and air-brushed to hell, wearing 5 inch heels, and as dumb as you can get them.

That's not what men are watching these days at all, nor is it the kind of women that men are into these days either. Look at the women who are popular right now amongst men, or even young guys more like, they're not always curvacious and robust, a lot them are just skinny, average bodied, pretty/cute faced women...why? because men like women they could imagine themselves realistically being with...does that make sense now.

It's like day-dreaming about owning a jet, most of us are never going to have one nor do we waste our time fantasizing or even really want one...it's a fantasy, celebrities and women in porn that live in a mans mind for all but about 15 seconds. Otherwise a man could care less what a celebrity or about who the girl is in a porn movie, especially to ever even think about comparing her to his own GF (how the F is that a fantasy?, that's just weird)...and matter of fact the girl they're looking at probably looks a lot more average than you'd probably think, other than being somewhat in shape or even just plain not fat...It's not a real stretch here, like some women think.

The fact that porn and celeb women being a factor is more to do with a woman's insecurity and own self-esteem than it ever will be about how a man actually thinks and feels...women don't listen, they create their own theories and perspectives because guys are ogling over some hot mamasita for 5 seconds they think we actually care or think about that girl 5 seconds later...it's pretty rare If we do, however personally I don't ever understand men with porn stashes or obsessions with certain celebrities, the only porn I've ever had/saw was not purchased by me, and the internet is full of free websites/porn, you just find one half decent one and you're basically good.

October 5, 2012

Oh great, women calling men shallow. Like you all aren't shallow:

Do you even know what we're talking about on this thread?

I applaud you for dabbling into different territory than your usual race / ethnicity obsession, but you are supposed to be talking about what the rest of us are here.

Just a tip.

October 5, 2012

I continue to be confused how me thinking men are shallow and want to have sex with attractive women is somehow denigrating an entire gender, when lots and lots of men say it themselves. I am not claiming men would cheat on their sexy wives, or dump their beautiful girlfriends.... just that they are with those women in the first place because guys are kind of "shallow."

And shallow, by my estimate, is not necessarily loaded with negative stereotypes. It just means men are visual and require physical beauty to be attracted to someone. Why is this such a hostile attitude to have??

You contradict yourself when you say dont talk about a womens looks right away then yesterday say let a women know you think shes hot or youll be friend zoned which one is it?

As far as shallow both men and women are equally as shallow and visual stop ths its just men bs

October 5, 2012

Should be asking V about her relationship with her father, or between her father and mother.... no poop.

My mother constantly complains about her looks (small boobs, fat stomach, no hips, flat butt, overweight, bad hair, bad skin) and my father never compliments her. My mother says herself that she pursued my father, otherwise he probably wouldn't have given her the time of day. That help?

October 5, 2012

You tell me

http://i48.tinypic.com/5wz892.jpg

http://i48.tinypic.com/4fy3vp.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/264mj4x.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/2hgrzfd.jpg

will post pics of more girls I have been with in real life later on, they really don't care

Even so, I wouldn't advise doing that IF I were you.

October 5, 2012

Did ANY of you idiots criticizing me actually read my remarks in any of those threads you're claiming?

I said, over and over, that you are more than welcome to tal about a woman's body, when she has expressed consent to do so. So, when you're on a date, or when she asks, etc. It is when you talk about it without prompting or in crude ways that I took issue with.

And you SHOULDN'T call a woman hot right away, but you SHOULD ask her out on a date and tell her out right that you find her attractive. Hot <-> attractive. Not the same words.

If you guys are going to attack me, at least remember what I said accurately.

V, I'm not going to take the time to go back and find it, but I am quite sure you said that men ON THE INTERNET talking about what they find sexy and hot is hurtful to women and that men should not do it.

October 5, 2012

V, I'm not going to take the time to go back and find it, but I am quite sure you said that men ON THE INTERNET talking about what they find sexy and hot is hurtful to women and that men should not do it.

They should not do it unprovoked and in crude terms. I've said over and over that the comments should be appropriate to the setting. Since I am directly asking, then comments relating to women's bodies is appropriate. Make sense now?

October 5, 2012

They should not do it unprovoked and in crude terms. I've said over and over that the comments should be appropriate to the setting. Since I am directly asking, then comments relating to women's bodies is appropriate. Make sense now?

I must tell you that you really have a rude and condescending way of putting things.

What doesn't "make sense" in this conversation is how and why YOU have deemed yourself to be the arbiter of when and why it's appropriate for men to remark about women's physical attributes and what they think / feel about them in a conversation.

Why wasn't the thread about women's bodies "appropriate"? I think some guy started that because HE wanted to talk about women's bodies.

Now that YOU want to talk about women's bodies, it's fine, but if it's a guy, it's "unprovoked" and not appropriate?

That makes no sense.

But just like the rest of the agenda-pushers around here, most of whom are male women-haters, you will say anything to try to twist stuff around to "prove" the point you want to make.

If you get to post crap like this and it's "appropriate," then random guys waxing poetic about fine asses and boobs and hot nubile wenches is also appropriate.

If you don't want women to be objectified, then stop buying into the objectification of women with such unrestrained gusto.

There are plenty of us out here who aren't doing so. Do you like to be aligned with the sumdudes and doc gobbles of the Internet??

October 5, 2012

I must tell you that you really have a rude and condescending way of putting things.

What doesn't "make sense" in this conversation is how and why YOU have deemed yourself to be the arbiter of when and why it's appropriate for men to remark about women's physical attributes and what they think / feel about them in a conversation.

Why wasn't the thread about women's bodies "appropriate"? I think some guy started that because HE wanted to talk about women's bodies.

Now that YOU want to talk about women's bodies, it's fine, but if it's a guy, it's "unprovoked" and not appropriate?

That makes no sense.

Pot, kettle, as far as rudeness goes. I have by no means made myself the arbiter. I am merely sharing an opinion, which I believe is what this forum is all about. I am allowed to have opinions, right? I am allowed to state them, forcefully, even.

I am also allowed subtly in my opinions. I feel it's wrong to use crude terminology to talk about female bodies, or talk about individual female bodies when those individuals themselves have not consented to do so. I have no issue with discussing female bodies in an abstract (read: general) or respectful sense. It bothers me when men make comments about specific women's bodies, or when they make crude comments about women's bodies in general.

I am allowed to be bothered, and I am allowed to express it, neither of which means I am passing a law to force everyone to behave as I see fit. I may judge you if I see you making crude remarks about women's bodies, but so does everyone.... I was being judged in that thread for NOT liking men to make crude comments about female bodies.

But just like the rest of the agenda-pushers around here, most of whom are male women-haters, you will say anything to try to twist stuff around to "prove" the point you want to make.

If you get to post crap like this and it's "appropriate," then random guys waxing poetic about fine asses and boobs and hot nubile wenches is also appropriate.

If you don't want women to be objectified, then stop buying into the objectification of women with such unrestrained gusto.

There are plenty of us out here who aren't doing so. Do you like to be aligned with the sumdudes and doc gobbles of the Internet??

Let me get this straight: you think it's perfectly fine for men to objectify women. And when I spoke out about it, you threw down my opinion, and said it was totally okay for men to objectify women. So when I then decided to ask further about objectification of women's bodies, you are now yelling at me.

Can I ever satisfy you? More importantly, why do you come after me with such vitriol? No one is making you read this thread; no one is forcing you to engage with me. I did not even make this thread about myself, and yet somehow, yet again, it's turned into "Let's all psychoanalyze and bash V!"

How is that for twisting?

October 5, 2012

Your turn V, post a photo. let's see what we're dealing with.

Why? What does that have to do with anything? How did this thread turn into being about me?

October 5, 2012

... Um, well, if a guy is only with me cause he can't do better? Are you saying I should be pleased when a guy dates me only out of desperation, when he's disappointed by my body? Would you be happy in that kind of relationship??

But she obviously didn't say that in the example. I'm glad someone else noticed this about you, but then again I'm sure everyone has..

October 5, 2012

I'm still reeling from the concept, often used as a bludgeon here on LoveShack by a handful of women posters, that it's horrible if men like to look at pretty, beautiful, sexy, or cute girls / women.

Hasn't this always been this way?

My dad had "Playboy" ...

It's only really bothered me when it's expressed in specific ways, towards me or others (in ways that made us uncomfortable).

My dad jokes about things, but he isn't into the dirty magazines or strip clubs. He said he once attended a business lunch at a strip club, and that the girl in front of them didn't look like she liked her job at all - it made him feel sad.

I've always admitted that a part of my problem with men has been my own insecurities, or problems that have been there since certain men were a part of my childhood. Sometimes I wish that my mother had never divorced my father, because I had confidence in myself before that. It isn't just with men - it's my whole life - but the less healthy men generally make a beeline for me, just like strangers who supposedly need money (I had a woman call out to me just the other night, asking for a little money). I had my heart broken by one, and my own insecurities were what had this guy in my life for so long in the first place: I remember initially feeling free, when he decided we needed a break in whatever our relationship was (the whole situation ended up just being weird, but at first, I thought he was a good guy).

My Dad compliments my mothers' looks regularly, and admits that one of the first things that attracted him was her legs. She talks about his great legs and cute butt. I wouldn't mind hearing this stuff from someone I was involved with (about my own body), but it's completely different from the guys who harass you on the street, and know that they aren't making you feel good. I smiled when a guy blew a kiss at me in July, before worrying that maybe I suddenly looked tarty (I'd been the recipient of a wolf whistle a couple of hours before that).

October 5, 2012

AS RogerWallace said, I think it's a common misconception that men like these over-sized, mutated looking things some porn stars call breast, with a half-ton of make-up on their face and air-brushed to hell, wearing 5 inch heels, and as dumb as you can get them.

That's not what men are watching these days at all, nor is it the kind of women that men are into these days either. Look at the women who are popular right now amongst men, or even young guys more like, they're not always curvacious and robust, a lot them are just skinny, average bodied, pretty/cute faced women...why? because men like women they could imagine themselves realistically being with...does that make sense now.

It's like day-dreaming about owning a jet, most of us are never going to have one nor do we waste our time fantasizing or even really want one...it's a fantasy, celebrities and women in porn that live in a mans mind for all but about 15 seconds. Otherwise a man could care less what a celebrity or about who the girl is in a porn movie, especially to ever even think about comparing her to his own GF (how the F is that a fantasy?, that's just weird)...and matter of fact the girl they're looking at probably looks a lot more average than you'd probably think, other than being somewhat in shape or even just plain not fat...It's not a real stretch here, like some women think.

The fact that porn and celeb women being a factor is more to do with a woman's insecurity and own self-esteem than it ever will be about how a man actually thinks and feels...women don't listen, they create their own theories and perspectives because guys are ogling over some hot mamasita for 5 seconds they think we actually care or think about that girl 5 seconds later..

What women are popular right now? All of the women that are "popular" right now are beautiful! Kim Kradashian, Sophia Vergara , etc etc...Women that have the aid and time to spend working out and getting botox and who knows what else they get to present the image of their "natural" beauty.

Ninja, do you think it is a positive re-enforcement to say things like, "It's like day dreaming about owning a Jet...."? I don't get these kind of examples that often get used when guys try to explain or help women understand and in the process hopefully make a woman feel better but then compare fantasy women to these larger than life wonderful things and average women to well..just being average women. Do you really think women see these examples as positives? "Hey Hunny, you aren't the awesome cool Jet I totally fantasize about wanting but you do okay because hey, you're here to wash my socks and stuff." How is comparing other women to Jets in all their larger than life amenities a good thing for the one actual woman by a guy's side that is basically getting compared to spam?

And it's not just that it lives in his mind for 15 seconds. Men repeatidly and continually use porn. To higher levels then they ever have before in history. Lets not downplay how much men are using porn and how often other women are taking up those "15 seconds". So many different women online for men to choose from and men, even with female parters, are choosing them. And then women are being casterated about how they are just insecure and that their feelings are worthless because guys like you write off how some women can feel or degrade how they feel because you think it's all about insecurity. Or you feel that their insecurity isn't somewhat warrented because that's what *you* decided. Well no offense but you guys have no clue how much pressure there is on wome nto look and be a certain way and when you see your guy looking at those things in other women and comparing these women to big rich expensive Jets and you basically to what might as well be spam, it doesn't solve a thing for us. It just makes us reinforce what we already believed.

I am getting tired of hearing guys compare porn and women in porn to Jets and justifying how men interact with these larger then life examples of feminiity but demand women remain unaffected by them and if they don't, that we are simply just "insecure". That's not fair Ninja. That's not fair to write off some women's perspective because they live everyday with seeing how guys deal with porn and celeb culture and all the hot women around that men do infact titilate themselves whether they are in relationships or not. We don't live in a time when porn was a Playboy in the mail once a month. So any insecurities and fears a woman might have are well jsutified by seeing how men today engage with porn and have let it dominate their lives in ways that their fathers didn't let it dominate theirs.

.it's pretty rare If we do, however personally I don't ever understand me with porn stashes or obsessions with certain celebrities, the only porn I've ever had/saw was not purchased by me, and the internet is full of free websites/porn, you just find one half decent one and you're basically good.

What's the difference? Either way both men are still looking at porn. One stashing it on his computer and one not are still looking at porn. The one stashing it and the one not stashing it aren't that much different.

October 5, 2012

Who the hell compares real naked women to porn or models?

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