Change Yourself To Be Attractive?

[Jamesblame]

Let's say you as a person are fundamentally unattractive. There is nothing bad about you per say, you just have an unattractive package... Speaking for myself, my personality is annoying to the great majority of people. I am too intense, I am too analytic, I am too loud and talkative and annoying. There is nothing fundamentally BAD about me; I am not mean, or greedy, or cruel, or selfish, etc. I am just unattractive, or have a strange mental make-up.

 

Should you change your entire personality to be more attractive? Should you change who you fundamentally are as a person to have a chance at a relationship? Goes back to the idea that if you're ugly, should you get plastic surgery?

 

If it's the difference between changing absolutely everything about you, or being single forever, which would you choose?

 

 

There's being you and being YOU.

 

You should never change your morals, values, or beliefs in the hopes of attracting another person. You just can't keep up the charade, and you'll be miserable the entire time.

 

Now you should, regardless of relationship status, ALWAYS try your best to be at your best.

 

Live and act out your values

Groom yourself

Know your fashion style and spend the extra time maintaining it.

 

IT's not about changing yourself, it's about perfecting yourself. Not for another person, but for you.

 

If you are a social person then you'll never be happy if you aren't exercisizing your social behaviors. Same thing for extroverts.

 

At the end of the day, love and pamper yourself. You won't attract everyone, but you'll be happier and you WILL attract a partner who likes what you like.

[ThaWholigan]

How about "I think I'm a <fun/nice/smart/funny> person, but nobody else agrees with me." What is it then? When everyone agrees you are not an attractive person, but no one can agree on what exactly makes you unattractive (for some it's being physically unattractive, some say you're annoying, some say you're intimidating, some say you're not intimidating ENOUGH), how can you change then except to develop an entirely new personality? And if you can, should you?

 

1) It's lack of self-awareness.

 

2) People will have varying reasons why they themselves aren't attracted to you, but there are probably unconscious reasons that they themselves are unaware of and use superficial excuses to cover that up. It's an energy thing IMO, but I won't attempt to explain it to you because you will probably think it's BS. Let's just say that I have felt uncomfortable around certain girls because of the energy that they seem to give off, and it in turn indicates that they don't really have a high opinion of themselves or possibly of other people, or possibly something else equally negative, and that negative energy is quite off putting. Like I say though, I doubt you will put much stock in that.........

 

You have to identify all those things in your personality and see if you can pinpoint a way to reverse that energy. It can be done, even if you think it can't. You don't have to develop a completely new personality - that is simply putting on a disguise. What you have to do is find a new expression of that personality, supplement that personality with new traits that you can possibly cultivate and actually have a big of positive self-belief.

[ThaWholigan]

And yes I currently have a boyfriend who everybody on this forum is promising is going to leave me.

 

 

See, when you say stupid sh*t like this, it's hard to take you seriously or to engage with you without getting irritated. I think this is probably what your friends are alluding to, sadly.

 

Nobody on this forum is "promising" that your boyfriend will leave you, and nobody is wishing that on you either. That you keep giving these little snide implications that people on this forum "hate" you or want you gone or something equally sinister is very insulting to many of us who actually do care what happens to you and are actually really trying to help you out and ensure that you are happier and able to have a fulfilling relationship with your SO and yourself.

[verhrzn]

1) It's lack of self-awareness.

 

2) People will have varying reasons why they themselves aren't attracted to you, but there are probably unconscious reasons that they themselves are unaware of and use superficial excuses to cover that up. It's an energy thing IMO, but I won't attempt to explain it to you because you will probably think it's BS. Let's just say that I have felt uncomfortable around certain girls because of the energy that they seem to give off, and it in turn indicates that they don't really have a high opinion of themselves or possibly of other people, or possibly something else equally negative, and that negative energy is quite off putting. Like I say though, I doubt you will put much stock in that.........

 

You have to identify all those things in your personality and see if you can pinpoint a way to reverse that energy. It can be done, even if you think it can't. You don't have to develop a completely new personality - that is simply putting on a disguise. What you have to do is find a new expression of that personality, supplement that personality with new traits that you can possibly cultivate and actually have a big of positive self-belief.

 

And exactly how do you cultivate being annoying or intimidating or whatever??

 

The basic premise of this question is: what do you do when you are fundamentally incompatible/unattractive? Saying "well there are positive things" ignores the fundamental premise of that question. There ARE some people who just all around suck in the eyes of others, and I consider myself one of them. So, do you transplant an entirely new personality, or just accept being unloveable?

 

Am I right in thinking you are saying you shouldn't adopt a new personality because it's a disguise?

[oaks]

... Wow, that was a super helpful response, not even clarifying what the heck you mean. Thanks!

 

This is the second thread in the last few days along similar lines... a bit 'woe is me i'm forever single', when you're actually in a relationship, and I think I asked a similar question in that one that I don't recall seeing an answer to (but I'm not going to search for it)... and I asked a question a little higher up this forum... I'll repeat it (if I've remembered it correctly): How's your dating going?

 

The thing I can't figure out (and if you've explained it then I'm afraid it failed to sink in) is why, when you're in a relationship, are you making posts like this? This is the thing you should be changing, but not because it'll stop you from being forever single (because, incase you hadn't noticed, you're not single) but because it's self-destructive.

 

Anyway, what I meant by my super helpful response is that you have somewhat selective hearing yourself. You get given plenty of advice, yet you jump on the smallest bits and ignore whole chunks of it that support your self-pity.

 

And, since you're asking if the hypothetical someone who is forever single (which isn't you, remember!) should change everything about them... I'd advice that person to seek professional help because in my armchair-expert experience (which is what you asked for, this being the Internet and all) that's what that person needs.

[verhrzn]

 

See, when you say stupid sh*t like this, it's hard to take you seriously or to engage with you without getting irritated. I think this is probably what your friends are alluding to, sadly.

 

Nobody on this forum is "promising" that your boyfriend will leave you, and nobody is wishing that on you either. That you keep giving these little snide implications that people on this forum "hate" you or want you gone or something equally sinister is very insulting to many of us who actually do care what happens to you and are actually really trying to help you out and ensure that you are happier and able to have a fulfilling relationship with your SO and yourself.

 

... It's not a weird aside, if you look at my last thread most of the responses (especially towards the end) are telling me he's going to leave, that I am fundamentally f*cked up, that I'm a train wreck, that I'm not cut out for a relationship, etc.

 

It's right there, in clear writing. People come into my threads just to mock me (Oaks, for example.) So, how is it an implication when it's quite clearly spelled out??

[verhrzn]

This is the second thread in the last few days along similar lines... a bit 'woe is me i'm forever single', when you're actually in a relationship, and I think I asked a similar question in that one that I don't recall seeing an answer to (but I'm not going to search for it)... and I asked a question a little higher up this forum... I'll repeat it (if I've remembered it correctly): How's your dating going?

 

The thing I can't figure out (and if you've explained it then I'm afraid it failed to sink in) is why, when you're in a relationship, are you making posts like this? This is the thing you should be changing, but not because it'll stop you from being forever single (because, incase you hadn't noticed, you're not single) but because it's self-destructive.

 

Anyway, what I meant by my super helpful response is that you have somewhat selective hearing yourself. You get given plenty of advice, yet you jump on the smallest bits and ignore whole chunks of it that support your self-pity.

 

And, since you're asking if the hypothetical someone who is forever single (which isn't you, remember!) should change everything about them... I'd advice that person to seek professional help because in my armchair-expert experience (which is what you asked for, this being the Internet and all) that's what that person needs.

 

I AM forever single if the person cheats/leaves me... which is what everyone in this forum predicts. I tried to get around the "cheating" issue in my last thread and got absolutely ripped apart, so I guess I just to accept that part.

 

I make posts like this because my relationship is obviously doomed. And any way I try to figure out how to stop it, people just reinforce that it's doomed and that I suck. So, okay, fine, let's just accept that and move on.

 

The fact that my current guy is also an ex reinforces my idea that I can't find anyone to date me.... I had to resort to re-dating, towards dipping back into my past, because I don't appeal to any new guys.

 

I also start these threads because I am curious and this is the stuff I think about. So sue me.

[verhrzn]

You're so exhausting to deal with.

 

You've had 4 boyfriends before your current one, even more bed partners. You've dated quite a few guys via internet dating.

 

And you currently have a boyfriend.

 

Yet you think that:

 

- You are ugly

- That you can't get a boyfriend

- That there is nothing positive or likeable about you

 

You have very negative mind patterns.

 

In one of your lasts thread you were contemplating on suggesting to your boyfriend TO SLEEP WITH ANOTHER WOMAN.

 

And why?

 

Because you think you're not good enough.

 

Or because all of those other boyfriends SLEPT WITH ANOTHER WOMAN.

 

Does no one pay attention to the details? Yeah, I had boyfriends.... who disliked me, were dating me out of desperation, and ultimately cheated on me/left me for someone else.

 

And these were guys I pursued. I have been pursued, exactly once, in my entire life. So one guy out of THOUSANDS I have met decided I was attractive enough to pursue. Oh, and he is the current boyfriend.... except we only got back together because yet again, I pursued him.

 

That is not negative thought patterns. That is seeing evidence, and drawing conclusions. What conclusions would YOU draw from these experiences except that my past bfs weren't into me, that guys don't find me attractive, and that I'm really NOT good enough??

[oaks]

It's right there, in clear writing. People come into my threads just to mock me (Oaks, for example.)

 

Not just. I also point out the apparent contradiction in some of what you write, and ask you questions that I think would help towards a better understanding, and there's even some advice in there from time to time. But you have selective hearing, as you may have heard me say before.

[verhrzn]

You start these threads to get your fears confirmed by us, to get enabled by us.

 

Yet every time we tell you the opposite of what you think about yourself.

 

From our perspective, after so many threads of the same pattern, it gets old, repetitive and our efforts feel futile.

 

As an experiment, I once told you to get plastic surgery, to get your looks fixed. Even though I didn't agree with it, but I wanted to see how you reacted.

 

It was the only time you agreed with me.

 

So you don;t want to hear my honest opinion, you want me to enable you, to tell you that you are ugly, that you need plastic surgery, that there is nothing positive and likeable about you, that you aren't good enough.

 

If I tell you the truth, you resist.

 

If I lie to you and enable you, there is no resistance from you.

 

Again, if my assessment about myself isn't correct, then you explain my experiences.

 

Why I never get hit on. Why I am invisible around guys no matter where I am or what I'm wearing. Why I never get messaged online. Why I've always had to pursue guys. Why guys aren't attracted to me. Why I always get cheated on.

 

How does your opinion of me fit within those real life experiences?

[ThaWholigan]

... It's not a weird aside, if you look at my last thread most of the responses (especially towards the end) are telling me he's going to leave, that I am fundamentally f*cked up, that I'm a train wreck, that I'm not cut out for a relationship, etc.

 

It's right there, in clear writing. People come into my threads just to mock me (Oaks, for example.) So, how is it an implication when it's quite clearly spelled out??

You do it to yourself to be honest. And anything people say is misconstrued as an attack on you. You attack yourself way more than we do.

 

I should really put you on ignore to be honest - all we're doing is trying to help you and you constantly pull things like this, and not even ATTEMPT to understand and grasp the advice we're giving you. It's like when Somedude used to almost require a play-by-play flirting manual otherwise he couldn't work with the gems he would get given. And if people are coming into your threads to "mock" you, it's because your threads always go the same way, and it's usually because you don't listen, or attempt to understand.

 

And exactly how do you cultivate being annoying or intimidating or whatever??

 

The basic premise of this question is: what do you do when you are fundamentally incompatible/unattractive? Saying "well there are positive things" ignores the fundamental premise of that question. There ARE some people who just all around suck in the eyes of others, and I consider myself one of them. So, do you transplant an entirely new personality, or just accept being unloveable?

 

Am I right in thinking you are saying you shouldn't adopt a new personality because it's a disguise?

 

I can't answer the first question because it's not realistic. Nobody is that unlovable. You seem to have a completely lack of understanding about expression and how to change that. If you are annoying, learn how to not be annoying. Pinpoint exactly what it is about you that is annoying. Maybe it's because you think everyone hates you, maybe that's annoying. Maybe it's because you have to turn everything into an attack or an argument when there is none. That's annoying. Learn to curb that and change that.

 

You have to learn to understand things that may not fit into your logic. Sometimes, you have to embrace the illogical.

[jobaba]

Sometimes I question if OP is a real person or a really slick, smart troll.

 

Her experiences don't 'add up', and the brick wall act would get old for a normal person soon enough.

 

I used to think SD was a troll as well in the beginning, but he has since displayed some vulnerability and opened up a bit.

[verhrzn]

First of all, you can't apply the wrongdoings of past boyfriends onto your current boyfriend. That wouldn't be fair.

 

He told you: "I wouldn't sleep with another woman. I am committed to you."

 

Then what do you do?

 

You post a thread on LS where you consider to suggest to him that he should sleep with another woman.

 

You want a loyal, committed and exclusive relationship?

 

Then stop sabotaging and start acting like you want it.

 

I want a relationship in which I don't get cheated on. That is my ultimate desire, so I want to safe-guard against cheating. That was my attempt to safe-guard against cheating.

 

Again, what conclusions would YOU draw from my past experiences?

 

Pretend I'm a brand new poster who came to the board and said," I had to pursue all of my bfs, and they all cheated on me. Guys never flirt with me, and tell me directly I'm ugly. What does that mean?"

 

The resounding answer would: "Your bfs weren't into you, and you're ugly."

 

I find it bizarre that this simple logic escapes people in my threads.

 

Sometimes I question if OP is a real person or a really slick, smart troll.

 

Her experiences don't 'add up', and the brick wall act would get old for a normal person soon enough.

 

I used to think SD was a troll as well in the beginning, but he has since displayed some vulnerability and opened up a bit.

 

How the heck do my experiences not add up?? How many people do I have to show my dating profile to before people believe me??

 

Again: how much/what kind of evidence do I have to present before people just BELIEVE me?!

[Lonely Ronin]

Just because the Internet thinks something doesn't make it true. Real life trumps the Internet, and in real life, I never get approached, never get hit on, never get flirted with.

 

As others have said before, you're not ugly, but your not dread gorgeous either. Imo, you're a 5 or 5.5 (average) physically speaking, so your personality is going to play a much larger role in your dating life. If the personality you display to the world IRL is anything like the one you show here, that's why you're not getting approached/hit on/flirted with.

 

some personality traits that I see in you that will lead to you not getting hit on are:

 

1. You seem to approach life in general with a lot of melancholy

2. You come off as very pessimistic about almost everything

3. You come off as very combative

 

Imo, these are 3 things an astute person can pick up on from across the room from merely observing you for a while.

 

People just have this knee-jerk reaction to "negativity"...

Yea they do, have you ever considered how your general negativity effects your dating life?

 

For example have you considered the reason you have had such bad relationships in the past, is because you are attracting that type of guy? You chased them, but them excepting your pursuit is still a form of attraction. Basically you present them with a situation where all they had to do was accept your personality and you would sleep with/ dated them until something better came along.

 

 

 

I have a purposely vague question for you, what type of guy do you want?

[verhrzn]

As others have said before, you're not ugly, but your not dread gorgeous either. Imo, you're a 5 or 5.5 (average) physically speaking, so your personality is going to play a much larger role in your dating life. If the personality you display to the world IRL is anything like the one you show here, that's why you're not getting approached/hit on/flirted with.

 

some personality traits that I see in you that will lead to you not getting hit on are:

 

1. You seem to approach life in general with a lot of melancholy

2. You come off as very pessimistic about almost everything

3. You come off as very combative

 

Imo, these are 3 things an astute person can pick up on from across the room from merely observing you for a while.

 

YES, exactly. Who I am naturally, and what my personality is, is fundamentally unattractive, as you've laid out. SO, do I change my entire personality?

 

Yea they do, have you ever considered how your general negativity effects your dating life?

 

For example have you considered the reason you have had such bad relationships in the past, is because you are attracting that type of guy? You chased them, but them excepting your pursuit is still a form of attraction. Basically you present them with a situation where all they had to do was accept your personality and you would sleep with/ dated them until something better came along.

 

I have a purposely vague question for you, what type of guy do you want?

 

Chicken or the egg. My dating life was miserable before I was negative. My negativity was born FROM my dating life, not the other way around. My problems with guys started long before I became negative as a result of it.

 

I've already said I want a guy with common interests, who is intellectual and analytical.

[oaks]

I AM forever single if the person cheats/leaves me... which is what everyone in this forum predicts. I tried to get around the "cheating" issue in my last thread and got absolutely ripped apart, so I guess I just to accept that part.

 

Is it always night because at the end of each day the sun sets?

 

Since you're in a relationship NOW, I suggest that you make hay while the sun shines.

 

 

(as for "everyone predicts"... I don't think I've thrown my hat into the ring yet.)

 

I make posts like this because my relationship is obviously doomed. And any way I try to figure out how to stop it, people just reinforce that it's doomed and that I suck. So, okay, fine, let's just accept that and move on.

 

But you don't accept it... you'd like it to be something other than doomed. At least, I think you would. That's great news. (yes, really. No, I'm not being sarcastic).

 

How does your boyfriend think things are going? Do you have "us" talks, or is it too early for that? (sorry, I can't remember how long you've been dating him... and I missed the post where you explained before that he's an ex.)

 

Anyway, you're in a relationship now. (I may have mentioned this already, but it deserves emphasis.) So, relax a little and please try to enjoy it!

 

What can you do to not have things screw up this time? Well, that's one of the things. (Although, if you're taking all your frustration out on us so that you're calm and mellow and relaxed around your bf then that's a great idea, too!)

 

[oaks]

The resounding answer would: "Your bfs weren't into you, and you're ugly."

 

And (since we've been here) someone would say "what do you look like?" and then after a while you'd be brave enough to post some photos and links to others, and then we'd say "oh. We were expecting to see an ugly person. Where's the ugly chick?"

 

Then we'd probably have some silly argument with you about negativity.

 

 

But, since this thread is about change... are you prepared to make changes? What would you change? What help would you employ to get there? (This isn't the first thread about you that has discussed things you might change, so I'm sure you've considered some of the ideas before.)

[oaks]

SO, do I change my entire personality?

 

Do you want to?

 

Would you like to?

 

Are you prepared to put in the effort?

[verhrzn]

No.

 

The answer I would give is that I suspect that you seek out men with weak character.

 

Statistically 50% of all men cheat. Multiple studies have shown that.

 

Either you've been having a string of bad luck or you pursue men with weak character.

 

After all, it is you who does the pursuing, so it's your people picker that is guiding you. That they cheat is not your fault, but you did seek out the men that ended up cheating on you. So your assessment/analysis of them went wrong somewhere, which could indicate that you have to work on your people picker.

 

My people picker is pretty much "guys who would date me and have similar interests." That is really the main criteria. That means only men with weak characters would date me. So what does that say?

 

In regards to your last thread, I think people really meant that with your self esteem issues, the way you view yourself, beat yourself up + giving your boyfriend carte blanche to have sex with other women because you don't feel adequate enough in certain areas that eventually the relationship was doomed and could possibly crumble. Open relationships are a very different dynamic then a regular relationship.

 

For the last freaking time, it is NOT how I view myself, it is how I view myself in the context of other people. I am NOT beating myself up... I am simply relaying what I hear about myself. Again, if everybody thinks you're dumb, and you think you're smart, YOU'RE the delusional one. I am just choosing not to be delusional.

 

But, since this thread is about change... are you prepared to make changes? What would you change? What help would you employ to get there? (This isn't the first thread about you that has discussed things you might change, so I'm sure you've considered some of the ideas before.)

 

If it requires changing my entire personality, no. Because, alone, by myself, I actually LIKE who I am. It is only when I am around other people that I become self-hating, because no one else seems to like me.

 

Which goes back to my question. Is it worth it to change your entire personality for people to like you? What would you do if no one liked you; just accept it, or change everything?

 

I would, however, change my looks in a heart beat.

[oaks]

If it requires changing my entire personality, no. Because, alone, by myself, I actually LIKE who I am. It is only when I am around other people that I become self-hating, because no one else seems to like me.

 

Ok. Now that I know this (that you like who you are) I'd say that if I was in your shoes I wouldn't want to change me.

 

But now I'm wondering why you're asking us if you should change... when you like yourself.

 

Which goes back to my question. Is it worth it to change your entire personality for people to like you? What would you do if no one liked you; just accept it, or change everything?

 

I would, however, change my looks in a heart beat.

 

If changing your entire personality, when you like yourself, means losing yourself then no, it would not be worth it. Perhaps "entire" is a little extreme, and there might be some bits (the bits you like?) that you could keep.

 

As for changing your looks... fair enough! I'll ask (again, although it's been some months since I've asked you) : how's the cosmetic surgery savings fund going?

 

What I mean by that, in case it isn't clear, is that if you want to change how you look then you can. (just not "in a heart beat", of course)

 

(No, I'm not saying that you should change your appearance... and I say that because I imagine in your most negative moments you might come back here and tell me that I was saying that you should. But, you can. If you want to. But you have to want to.)

[verhrzn]

Ok. Now that I know this (that you like who you are) I'd say that if I was in your shoes I wouldn't want to change me.

 

But now I'm wondering why you're asking us if you should change... when you like yourself.

 

Because nobody ELSE likes me. So I am just curious what other people would do in my situation.... change something you like to become popular? Accept being alone? I mean, is it really any good if I like myself, when no one else does? If the very best I get socially is people "tolerating" me?

 

 

As for changing your looks... fair enough! I'll ask (again, although it's been some months since I've asked you) : how's the cosmetic surgery savings fund going?

 

What I mean by that, in case it isn't clear, is that if you want to change how you look then you can. (just not "in a heart beat", of course)

 

(No, I'm not saying that you should change your appearance... and I say that because I imagine in your most negative moments you might come back here and tell me that I was saying that you should. But, you can. If you want to. But you have to want to.)

 

Eh the saving funds is non-existent, because I can barely pay all of the necessary things paycheck-to-paycheck. Maybe if I won the lottery. I DID think of starting up one of those Kick Starter funds for surgery... people donating to beautify the world and all. I imagine I'd pay for one procedure from the proceeds of LS posters alone!

[verhrzn]

That you have to start setting standards, instead of taking a grab from the bottom of the barrel.

 

You're looking for a life partner, someone that is loyal and committed, someone you can grow old with.

 

That person needs to be of a certain standard.

 

Why?

 

Because not everyone is loyal, committed, honest or kind.

 

So you need to analyze before you get involved. You need to analyze whether they're relationship material.

 

If you say that you pick whomever will simply date you, then you're not setting any standards. And that can get you burned.

 

But what is the good of them being relationship material if they won't date me?? I think that's a pretty darn important standard. What good is it if Guy A is loyal and committed and all that if he won't commit to ME?

 

And again, these guys go on to commit just fine to other girls. They make fantastic boyfriends... to other women. That suggests it must be something about ME, and not just that I'm picking jerks. They are only jerks to ME.

[oaks]

Because nobody ELSE likes me. So I am just curious what other people would do in my situation.... change something you like to become popular? Accept being alone? I mean, is it really any good if I like myself, when no one else does? If the very best I get socially is people "tolerating" me?

 

If you like yourself then what's so bad about being alone?

 

Eh the saving funds is non-existent, because I can barely pay all of the necessary things paycheck-to-paycheck don't want it enough.

 

Fixed that for you. No, seriously.

[xxoo]

V, there is a difference between changing who you are, and changing how you interact with people.

 

It seems to me like you are a cool person who struggles with social skills. Social skills can be learned. Having good or poor social skills doesn't fundamentally change who you are as a person. It is more the filter through which people experience you.

[verhrzn]

If you like yourself then what's so bad about being alone?

 

Because I want a family and a husband to raise kids with, and I want a dog and a house and the typical "standard life" that other people have.

 

Fixed that for you. No, seriously.

 

Yeah, that's right, poor people don't get the medical care they need because they just don't WANT it enough.

 

Tell ya what, I'll lay out my entire financial spreadsheet, and YOU can tell me what to cut out. Food? Rent? The student loans that cost about 30% of my monthly paycheck? The 10% that goes towards my medical deducible, that I can't even use? Or the $100 that goes towards my car/apartment insurance, except oh, I can't use that unless it reaches the deducible of $500! Gee, how WONDERFUL that even in the case of an apartment fire, I STILL have to pay the first $500 of damages out of pocket. That's just swell.