Taking it slow?

[oldschool1]

Hi everyone. I recently met a man online, and we clicked immediately (very unusual for me to feel so strongly right off the bat). Even on the phone I could tell that I was going to like him. He's very intellectual, and we have great conversations. We've been out 4 times (very, very long dates) in a short amount of time, and the chemistry is great. I would say that he has pursued me quite intensively, but we have actually only kissed (beginning on date 1). He's extremely gentlemanly.

 

Now, both of us just came out of longer relationships. He recently got in over his head with a LDR and moved this woman out of her state and into his house to break up with her 6 months later (that was 2 months ago). Now he says he is looking for the end game relationship (for marriage and kids). Tonight we went to his house and started kissing on his bed. He then said that he really wanted to take it slow (sexually) because he knew that could confuse/complicate things. He also mentioned that I was beautiful and that he was attracted to me so that he was really trying to keep his head straight. So, he said I was very welcome to spend the night and that he had a tshirt/shorts for me (because he thought he'd get too excited if I were half naked next to him). He said that because he was looking for the endgame relationship, he really wanted to go slowly as we had been going---that it was great to "fool around" and kiss. Apparently, it was strange for him even to be kissing someone new but has mentioned more than once that he is certain he made the right decision in ending his last relationship and got over it quickly (since he already knew for awhile that it wasn't working). He also said something about being the type of man who is very loyal or monogamous when he's committed to a relationship.

 

So, I didn't know what this meant exactly, but I said that taking it slow seemed like a good idea. I did offer up that I was surprised that I liked him so much. He didn't really say anything back (which worried me) but was being very affectionate and kissy. I did decide to go home pretty late in the night.

 

I am not sure whether he was trying to say that he ISN'T going to want a relationship or that he just wants to build it slowly and make sure it's built on the right foundation. Part of me applauds this maturity, but the other part of me isn't sure whether this is a brush off.

 

I should also say that I am looking for marriage at this point (I'm 36 and divorced and he's already 47).

 

Any advice on this? Is this just his way of telling me he's not that into me? I don't think it is, but I don't know. Thank you so much.

[Emilia]

That's pretty worriesome that he met a woman on the internet and moved her - long distance - into his place and within 6 months, basically dumped her. Who does this?

 

Not necessarily. Long distance relationships are tricky, in my opinion you only get to know a person well when you have more time to spend together. Moving in was too soon but clearly they didn't get on as well as they thought they would. It happens.

[january2011]

That's pretty worriesome that he met a woman on the internet and moved her - long distance - into his place and within 6 months, basically dumped her.

 

I agree with Just_A-Poster, particularly because he (the guy) also told you that, "he already knew for awhile that it wasn't working." How long was that "while"? The entire six months they were living together? A lot longer than that? And what was the nature of their relationship before they moved in together? Length? How often had they visited each other before deciding to move in together?

 

And he only broke up with her two months ago. I'm not sure that he's ready to date anyone. He's had a lot of relationship upheaval in such a short time.

 

I'd also suggest that you may be rushing things too, particularly marriage, as you mention that you also just came out of a long relationship (your last relationship = marriage? --> divorce?).

 

Perhaps taking it slow might not be a bad thing for both of you. However, I think that you need to address your questions to him. Ask him to clarify what he means by "taking it slow" and if he means just sex or being in a relationship. Then work out if the pace and your timetables align.

[oldschool1]

Thank you for your helpful comments.

 

I don't think he met his ex online; she was from his hometown, and they dated 6 months before he moved her out. I got out of my own marriage 3 years ago and had dated someone 2.5 years. He said that he did a lot of the grieving already (before they had broken up) and that it was a hard time (he also had some other health things happen then that he is just getting over now). My breakup was my own choice, and I also didn't look back. I was with a man who was unavailable emotionally, and he wasn't going to be a great husband/father. I should also say that this new man is a very accomplished person and knows how to talk about his feelings---big talker in general (which is a new one for me).

 

The Viagra comment was hilarious---I don't think it's that though. The make-out sessions with him have been incredible. Amazingly passionate. He just said that sex can confuse him and throw off his calibration. He also mentioned that when he commits to a relationship, he's all in. He really wants to get into a permanent, serious relationship and have kids, so I sort of feel like he is auditioning me (and perhaps others) for this role. We have been going on formal dates (very long ones) with lots of great discussions, dinners, long walks, etc... He's done everything right and is incredibly gentlemanly.

 

I am also seeing someone else (about to have date #4) who is saying a similar thing about wanting to take it slow. But this second guy (who has 3 children and is not my top choice) also explained that he is really excited to see me, hadn't expected to feel like this, sees potential, etc... Guy #1 has called/emailed/texted me regularly and all (and said a few things about "thinking about me", etc...) but hasn't clearly indicated that he sees potential for a relationship with ME.

 

So, i have only kissed both of these people, but I am not a fan of multidating (especially when real feelings are involved). Guy #1 is definitely someone I want to get to know more; I've never actually felt this way before.

Obviously, taking it slow (both sex-wise and relationship-wise) is the right thing to do here, and I'm going to continue to do that. Perhaps last night was the "two week talk"---where you have to iterate that you're not in a full-blown relationship yet (and then you often end up in that place anyway). I don't usually broach exclusivity until sex has happened anyway (which is usually more of an 8th date thing). Also, I haven't dated around much (guy #1 knows this) and tend to be in relationships. So, maybe he is concerned about me too. I came out of my last relationship even more recently that he did (but mine didn't cause as much upheaval, since I didn't live with the guy).

 

Should I try not to contact Guy #1 too much? I don't want to seem too overeager (though he's the one who has initiated everything thus far).

[RedRobin]

How long were his past relationship(s)? Has he ever been married? What was his experience like while in a relationship?

 

I'm suspect of the guys who reach 47 and all of a sudden say they are looking for the 'end game'...

 

Is that the words he actually used? 'End Game'?? Sounds kinda yucky to me.

 

Why would you believe he is looking for marriage/kids? Has he demonstrated any desire to be around kids, spend time with them, or learn about them?

 

If he really cared about having kids... and hadn't had any by that time, I'd imagine he'd be like the favorite uncle... or the guy volunteering at Boy's Club/Girls Club and mentoring kids... or actively dating women with kids he can help parent...

 

Any close calls on the marriage thing? Engagements? Very LTR's??

 

If not, then I call BS... probably on the whole charade... just another guy telling you what (he thinks) you want to hear...

 

Going slow is a good idea.... gives you a chance to ask these questions.

 

Won't comment on the multi-dating... You opened the thread asking about Guy #1 so that is where I'll focus my responses.

Edited September 3, 2012 by RedRobin

[carhill]

Canary: Says 'he wants to take it slow' after already having you on the bed in his house after only four dates, and apparently moving to kiss you on the first date, and successfully.

 

Canary: Cohabiting in a sufficiently serious state post-LDR, then summarily evicting his cohabitant and stating he 'got over it quickly' as he had 'known for awhile it wasn't working'.

 

Canary: 47yo looking for family and children as 'end game' after apparently having none of his own (unclear on that). This would match up poorly with wanting to 'take it slow', as such a mindset, if authentic, would put him well into his 50's before reasonably achieving fatherhood through a new pregnancy after courtship, engagement and marriage. Minor canary, but I'm around his age, love kids and understand the realities, with regards to 'taking it slow'

 

Observing the totality, I'll submit he is smooth and convincing and likely quite easy on the eyes. This type of 'disclosure' needs lubricating to succeed and it sounds like he has it.

 

Since he desires to take it slow, confine your dates to public places for now. I'm sure he'll enjoy the pleasure of your beauty and company. Definitely stay out of his bedroom and don't invite him into yours. Continue to entertain other potentials. After a couple months of dating, I'm sure the canaries will either be alive or dead, indicating next steps. After all, it's 'taking it slow'. Good luck.

Edited September 3, 2012 by carhill

[RedRobin]

also agree with the above that his actions aren't in line with 'going slow'...

 

... and agree with recommendations to keep yourself out of situations where he's, um, obliged or encouraged to push your limits... and you are obliged or encouraged to drop your limits prior to getting questions answered.

[oldschool1]

Wow, your responses are all interesting.

 

I don't know too much about this guy's dating history, but I do know that he wanted it to work with his last girlfriend but felt that jumping into it (especially the sex part) might have clouded his judgment. I know he has had serious relationships in the past, but I can't speculate as to why he didn't marry them. Clearly, he's thinking kids now, and yes--he is the doting Godfather/Uncle type. He's also made it clear that he's into my looks, but I think he's more about the connection (emotional, intellectual, etc...). His behavior actually confirms that, because he hasn't been trying to get into my pants (but is definitely wanting to be affectionate and passionate through lighter making out). He even said we could go into the living room if I was uncomfortable with the bedroom scenario.

 

So, we have taken it slow sexually (though he declared a spark from day one--when he did kiss me), but we have been going out a lot in the short time we've known each other. He had to go away for 9 days the morning after meeting me the first time but called me and contacted me quite a lot while he was gone and set something up the second he got back into town.

 

He did not use the term "endgame". I think it was "final relationship" or something like that. It doesn't sound at all like he's using me in any way (because he's AGAINST having sex right now), as he's been the perfect gentleman and very consistent. But, I am wondering if this taking it slow thing implies a lack of interest and an interest in dating other women (and NOT having sex with them...). I just don't want to get hurt, as I really think he and I could be perfect for each other---in a permanent way.

[RedRobin]

Something doesn't add up here. First off... I don't know any women who use the term 'end game'... Men? Plenty.

 

Second... you know he's a doting godfather 'type'... but no knowledge of his relationship history. Hmm.. How would you know that exactly?? About being a doting godfather??

 

Also, the emphasis on age difference in the OP. Lots of guys interested in keeping this older guy/younger woman dynamic alive in any way they can. Especially trying to influence women of that age to give them a shot for whatever reason.

 

Sorry... jumping out of this thread... Could be wrong, but I detect the slight smell of excrement from the male gender of the Bovinae subspecies is present...

Edited September 3, 2012 by RedRobin

[LeoNguyen]

Hey OldSchool,

 

It's scary to open yourself like this because you don't want to get hurt again.

 

But we all know that at some point, we have to take that chance (because it's worth it and it's the only way a relationship has any chance of working).

 

The question is...

 

Is this man worth it?

 

He's either way too smooth that you can't see anything behind the smoke-screen or he's just being completely honest (which is uncommon). But I've also heard from men in their 40s- 60s confessing that they sometimes prefer to hold back the sex because they want to take things slowly.

 

So the one thing going for him is that he hasn't pushed for sex yet.

 

He knows how much you like him. If he wanted to have sex with you, it would have happened already (unless Just_A_Poster is right about the Viagra situation).

 

My guess is that even if everyone tells you to stay away from him, you probably still want to see where this will lead to if you just gave it a try.

 

As of right now, we don't know for sure what his intentions are.

 

So your best bet is to hold back on the sex until he asks you to be his girlfriend. You can still do foreplay and everything else, just not intercourse.

 

If he's truly honest about taking things slowly and not letting sex cloud his judgement, he's not going to bitch about you "holding back sex" later on.

 

If he pushes for it and doesn't want you to be his girlfriend, then you have your answer.

 

And please, whatever do you do, don't move in with him until he asks you to marry him.

[oldschool1]

Thank you, Leo,

 

Yes, you're absolutely right. Actually, he hasn't even tried to do anything more than basic kissing (no nudity, etc...), but he's made it clear that he's very into that stuff! He just called me already to see how I was and asked me out for tomorrow. So, it would seem that we're not moving slowly in that regard (we've been doing every other day since he came back to town a week ago). I don't think he's smooth at all, and he's certainly not slimy. We're both intellectual types (I am finishing my doctorate and teach at university), and it's interesting that he seems particularly interested in my brain/character as opposed to my body (but he's into that too). More than anything, we've been having wonderful conversations, and he asks me what I think and feel and loves to hear me theorize. We just talk for hours and take long walks. It's pretty great!

 

Redrobin, I don't entirely understand your posts, but I do appreciate your input. In the 30 or so hours we've spent together, we haven't quite managed to discuss every single relationship in our lives. We have certainly talked about that stuff a fair amount though. The guy is clearly into getting married and having kids; that's why he got serious with this last woman, that's why he wrote it on his profile, and everything he's said and done suggests that. He is always talking about people's kids and has sent me a bunch of pics of them. Lots of gushing about kids! I think that because his career didn't get off the ground until about 10 or 12 years ago, he is probably a little slower than some other men. By the way, people who live where I live have kids OLD. I'm 36--that isn't exactly criminally young for kids either! Whether he is truly ready to get into a serious relationship right now is another question. And I'm the one who just got out of a 2.5 year relationship a month ago, so there's reason for me to take it slowly too.

[tori0001]

I had to add a comment about men moving a woman in from another state. A man I was dating last summer, it was short term anyway. While dating me he started talking to this girl on FB. She lived in SC. He was 44, and she was 19. He stopped talking to me and moved her from SC to NY, without even meeting her. Only talking on line, and dumped her after 5 months. It think it happens more then you think.

[oldschool1]

Uh, this guy KNEW the woman who moved in with him, and she was of childbearing age (prob mid-thirties like moi)--not underage. I'm pretty sure she was NOT a mailorder bride. She was from his hometown (where he goes regularly and is active in the community there), and I doubt they met online. When you have a long distance relationship, you either have to go for it or cut bait. He obviously went for it, and it didn't go well. Look, we all make mistakes, and this guy feels that that year long relationship screwed up his calibration (which is why he wants to wait on sex so that we don't get confused). Perhaps he's impossible to live with or has some horrible mental illness, but the good news is I live 15 minutes away from him; I would spend enough time with him to know his issues. I do think he's being honest, and he hasn't overdone anything to the point of seeming inauthentic. For instance, he doesn't OVERcompliment me (though he does compliment me), and he's not promising things he can't deliver...

 

My own issue is that I often get seriously involved with men I am not really in love with (which is debatably worse than this guy's former behavior). I tend to jump into relationships myself, so it's probably good to take a second and figure it out. I am starting to think I want kids, so I really want a great all-around partner. I've never felt so into someone from the beginning as I do with this guy. He's not perfect, but I am very much drawn to him. I couldn't tell whether he wanted me to spend the night or whether he just didn't want to throw me out so late at night (he's the type to insist upon calling him once I get home...), but I didn't feel ready to spend the night yet. For some reason, spending the night is a big deal for me, but I didn't mention that yet. He picked me up from my place the other night as well, and he seemed comfortable there and with my dog.

 

So there you have it. Thanks for letting me think out loud. It IS scary when you like someone, but of course you have to have faith. I think that taking it slow for this guy is still moving pretty fast (just not sexually), and we're spending enough time with each other to figure it all out in a reasonable amount of time. My last boyfriend also moved slowly sexually, but we weren't seeing each other so much. It was barely more than once a week, and he wanted to become exclusive after maybe 8 dates---when we started having sex. It took 6 months for him to call me his girlfriend and EONS longer to become more integrated. I don't think this new guy would do that. And I do think that if this new guy figured out that he DIDN'T see me as a potential life partner, he'd let me know pretty damn fast. The stakes are high these days...

[FitChick]

What's his birthdate? It sounds like he has Venus in Virgo, in which case that is just the way he is with no ulterior motives.

[oldschool1]

Thanks, Fit Chick. It happens to be 4/17, and mine is 3/9. I am not very knowledgeable about astrology, so it's always fun to hear about it! Yes, we went out again tonight (5th date): out for dinner, took a nice walk with my dog, and then he went home (early day tomorrow for him). Whereas our other dates have been super duper long and intense, this was just a nice evening with great discussion (as always). Something significant had gone down at my work today, and he discussed it with me for a very long time. He's a great listener and has a lot of insight into human motives, etc... I really am smitten with him, and it's not all sexual for me either here. Usually I ONLY care about sex, and with this guy it's the whole package. He said he'd call me tomorrow, and I'm sure he will. Can I just say that it's so refreshing that this guy actually makes honest-to-goodness phone calls? My last boyfriend (also in his 40s) ONLY texted, and he certainly wasn't big on communication. This guy clearly is, and it's a very positive sign.

 

We seem to be doing an every-other-day thing, which seems like a lot for someone I've only known 2 weeks. But, I love it! Despite all of this, he's still keeping his feelings about me under wraps. I would say that he is being somewhat cautious (with the sex stuff and potential professions of love...), but at least he is showing clear and consistent interest. He definitely compliments me---but not too much. I suppose he is either trying to restrain himself since we're so new or isn't sure what he thinks yet.

 

I have shown consistent interest myself but am not overdoing it. It just seems like he wants to get to know me, and I am trying not to overthink it. Do you all think it's too early to cook a meal for him? Maybe it is...