How can our sexual intimacy be special and unique?

[Quiet Storm]

Hey Quiet Storm, I really love what you said! He's told this to me in so many ways! Even his parents give me so much love and attention. I should be more busy with believing everything he says to me. We once shared a cab ride to another city for 2 hours in the dawn. we sat with our hands locked together. he said it was a kind of moment he never had. Thank you so much!

 

It sounds like you have a great guy! Best wishes on your life together.

 

My husband had casual encounters before me and we have been together 21 years. We still have a fun and satisfying sex life, and he hasn't cheated yet. So I don't agree that casual sex (unless it involves dishonesty or cheating) will lead to infidelity.

[i-wish-i-didnt-wish]

@ Red Robin: I was very similar to you prior to meeting my Man. I strongly advocated sex with your life partner only! and I still do but only for myself! it is because I fell in love with someone who has had a different life and views regarding sex, I came to know it from the very beginning and yet fell deeper and deeper in love each day. I did go through a hell lot of things to get over his past and m still in the process of getting completely rid of insecurities, but I am glad I chose to do this instead of dumping him for his past. And No, no matter how many questions I had, I could never bring myself to ask him hard questions. I instead CONFESSED my feelings and he took care of me. He said its a part of his life that he was drawn to temptations because he lost in love, he regrets it, he had no motivation to stop him from yielding to it but had he a choice to go back, he would rather have me as his only girlfriend, his first and last kiss and everything. but now we have no choice but to accept it and put it behind us. I am so fortunate to have him rather than a virgin because his failed experiences taught him how hard it is to find true love. and that's what matters. When a guy pours his heart out to you, you dont need to ask hard questions!! And after reading all the replies, I feel like a fool to have felt insecure in the first place! 'This guy, owing to his past, would never cheat because he learnt it the hard way that its not easy to find what we have and we cannot afford to loose it for anything! Although I was staunch about sex and attached it with values, I realised I never set "Virginity" as a criteria, I had dreams of a man who truly loves me and i got that! We both changed and learnt for each other! Hope you find your inspiration too!

[KungFuJoe]

@ Red Robin: I was very similar to you prior to meeting my Man. I strongly advocated sex with your life partner only! and I still do but only for myself! it is because I fell in love with someone who has had a different life and views regarding sex, I came to know it from the very beginning and yet fell deeper and deeper in love each day. I did go through a hell lot of things to get over his past and m still in the process of getting completely rid of insecurities, but I am glad I chose to do this instead of dumping him for his past. And No, no matter how many questions I had, I could never bring myself to ask him hard questions. I instead CONFESSED my feelings and he took care of me. He said its a part of his life that he was drawn to temptations because he lost in love, he regrets it, he had no motivation to stop him from yielding to it but had he a choice to go back, he would rather have me as his only girlfriend, his first and last kiss and everything. but now we have no choice but to accept it and put it behind us. I am so fortunate to have him rather than a virgin because his failed experiences taught him how hard it is to find true love. and that's what matters. When a guy pours his heart out to you, you dont need to ask hard questions!! And after reading all the replies, I feel like a fool to have felt insecure in the first place! 'This guy, owing to his past, would never cheat because he learnt it the hard way that its not easy to find what we have and we cannot afford to loose it for anything! Although I was staunch about sex and attached it with values, I realised I never set "Virginity" as a criteria, I had dreams of a man who truly loves me and i got that! We both changed and learnt for each other! Hope you find your inspiration too!

 

Very good post and as long as you maintain this positive outlook you will find unconditional happiness.

[i-wish-i-didnt-wish]

@ KungFuJoe, Thanks a lot! :-)! it all helped a lot!

[i-wish-i-didnt-wish]

@ Quiet Storm: Thanks a lot!! Its all because of you guys who took the time out to read and post sincerely!

[kaylan]

You're prepared to argue that there is no relationship whatsoever between promiscuity and ability to remain faithful?? None?

 

Then you should have no problems making a commitment or having a relationship with a woman who 'gets around'...

Remaining faithful has to do with morals and loyalty. I could be the sluttiest of the slutty sluts while Im single if I really wanted to...but it wouldnt mean Id be more apt to cheat on someone Im committed to and whom I love. Im very VERY against cheating. Its such a harsh betrayal, and the pain it causes hurts deeply....so my ability to enjoy my single life (within reason) does not impair my ability to commit to a woman.

 

I have no issue committing to a girl whos done all of the things I have. Im not a goody good boy, nor am I a man whore. Id say I fall in between and am a rather average guy in terms of sexual experiences. Id like the same in a gal. Im sure I could tell you some things about my past that would make you never date me...but Im sure if a girl told me the same things, I would not judge her harshly over it.

 

No, they have not always had the same values. Her OP did not indicate that. I suggested she asked hard questions.

 

She came back and said she had.

 

Not sure why you need to keep beating this dead horse.

The fact that they have had a good relationship for this long and that its leading to marriage indicates they share the same values. Thats my point.

[RedRobin]

@ Red Robin: I was very similar to you prior to meeting my Man. I strongly advocated sex with your life partner only! and I still do but only for myself! it is because I fell in love with someone who has had a different life and views regarding sex, I came to know it from the very beginning and yet fell deeper and deeper in love each day. I did go through a hell lot of things to get over his past and m still in the process of getting completely rid of insecurities, but I am glad I chose to do this instead of dumping him for his past. And No, no matter how many questions I had, I could never bring myself to ask him hard questions. I instead CONFESSED my feelings and he took care of me. He said its a part of his life that he was drawn to temptations because he lost in love, he regrets it, he had no motivation to stop him from yielding to it but had he a choice to go back, he would rather have me as his only girlfriend, his first and last kiss and everything. but now we have no choice but to accept it and put it behind us. I am so fortunate to have him rather than a virgin because his failed experiences taught him how hard it is to find true love. and that's what matters. When a guy pours his heart out to you, you dont need to ask hard questions!! And after reading all the replies, I feel like a fool to have felt insecure in the first place! 'This guy, owing to his past, would never cheat because he learnt it the hard way that its not easy to find what we have and we cannot afford to loose it for anything! Although I was staunch about sex and attached it with values, I realised I never set "Virginity" as a criteria, I had dreams of a man who truly loves me and i got that! We both changed and learnt for each other! Hope you find your inspiration too!

 

Thank you for sharing...

 

My life experience and observations are different than yours, and apparently, lots of other posters here... I've worked around men my entire life... 100's of them. I see and hear the things they talk about when their wives/girlfriends aren't around.

 

I DO believe in the power of redemption.... but I'm rather sick to death of hearing about stories from men (mostly) who f around for whatever reason.... then manage to find someone who has been more careful to take him in and 'forgive' him.

 

You said he "had no motivation to stop him from yielding to it"... Remember those words. Because there will be a point in your life where your love may be in jeapardy... and he will need some motivation to stop him. From what I can tell, he hasn't suffered any consequences at all. He got to play around... and when the time was right, he gets someone who hasn't done what he's done to settle down with. Seems like a pretty good deal for HIM.

 

...I strongly disagree with what you said in bold.... It is a mistake many women make every day. They get sucked in by the emotion and don't ask the hard questions.

 

I'd suggest you ask him what his motivation will be to stop him from yielding to it in the future.

 

... or take another poster's advice and attend pre-maritial counseling. They are professionals and better than anyone here at helping you sort these things out.

 

Or not. It is your life and if you believe that he is worth taking a risk on, then that is your choice.

Edited September 1, 2012 by RedRobin

[RedRobin]

]Remaining faithful has to do with morals and loyalty. I could be the sluttiest of the slutty sluts while Im single if I really wanted to...but it wouldnt mean Id be more apt to cheat on someone Im committed to and whom I love.

 

Actually, yes it does. Because someday your love will be tested... and you will need more than the motivation not to hurt another person to keep you from cheating.

 

... and if jumping into bed with another person is as easy as jumping into a pair of old slippers.... your boundaries just aren't at high as those who don't or haven't.

[xxoo]

Thank you for sharing...

 

My life experience and observations are different than yours, and apparently, lots of other posters here... I've worked around men my entire life... 100's of them. I see and hear the things they talk about when their wives/girlfriends aren't around.

 

Wives and girlfriends work around men, too. Not all of them, of course, but most of us. I've heard the worst, too, and did even before I married---but it doesn't shake my confidence in the one man I married.

 

I DO believe in the power of redemption.... but I'm rather sick to death of hearing about stories from men (mostly) who f around for whatever reason.... then manage to find someone who has been more careful to take him in and 'forgive' him.

 

If it happened before we met, and it harmed none, what is there to "forgive"? Understand and accept, yes, but forgive?

 

My H had more experience than me, including some casual sex. He was young at time time. It never occurred to me to disapprove of a young man sowing wild oats, and collecting sexual experience, before falling in love.

 

You said he "had no motivation to stop him from yielding to it"... Remember those words. Because there will be a point in your life where your love may be in jeapardy... and he will need some motivation to stop him. From what I can tell, he hasn't suffered any consequences at all. He got to play around... and when the time was right, he gets someone who hasn't done what he's done to settle down with. Seems like a pretty good deal for HIM.

 

The life they build together can serve as motivation to stop him should their love suffer at times. I honestly don't know how this part will play out for them, but it hasn't been an issue for us in 20+ years together, or my parents in 45+ years (and my dad admits to being "wild" before marriage). A man can be capable of commitment and fidelity in a loving relationship and sex without emotion in a casual relationship (as can a woman).

 

Of course she should be careful, and sure--ask the hard questions! Our courtship was full of long evenings, laying together, talking for hours, and wanting to know everything about each other, hard questions naturally included.

 

Hard questions should be part of every courtship, I believe, regardless of sexual history. Two virgins should also ask hard questions, because virginity (or low sexual history) does not necessarily mean a person will be faithful 20 years down the road when the blush of first love wears off. A person who has "been around", and knows a good relationship from average or poor, may be more able to meaningfully commit.

 

They each got a person they deeply love to settle down with. Seems like a pretty good deal for BOTH

 

Why do you feel he needs consequences?

[Mme. Chaucer]

I still don't understand why one would feel that a person needed "redemption" from having casual sexual liaisons in their life.

 

I DO understand that there are people who want to find virgins or others with a lower or similar "number" to their own for partners, and that IMO is just another preference. If it's important to you, you do owe it to yourself to abide by it.

 

But attribute all these negative traits to people because they happen to have the capacity to enjoy sex separate from love and / or commitment … IMO is just wrong.

 

Personally, I am not one who can separate the two, but I don't think that makes me morally superior to, and therefore, entitled to sit in judgement of, those who can.

 

I find that attitude offensive, and even ignorant.

 

One person's morals, values and attitudes regarding sex are not appropriately spread all over everyone else. Live according to them. Pair up with someone else who feels the same way, but leave the rest of humanity to express their sexuality as we see fit.

 

It's just "slut shaming," which is revolting, with gender reversal.

[Mme. Chaucer]

Here is a Wikipedia definition of "slut-shaming," which I think is taking place on this thread with regards to the OP's fiance, about whose ethical and moral fibre we have heard not a single complaint:

 

Slut-shaming is the act of making someone, usually a woman, feel guilty or inferior for having strong sexual desires, having "too many" sex partners, or acting or dressing in a way that is deemed excessively sexual, often by calling them a "slut" or other derogatory terms, sometimes just by implying that a person's sexual "standards" are "too low" (i.e. that they are too sexually available).[1] Slut-shaming is based on the idea that there is something wrong with being sexually promiscuous. Slut-shaming can occur privately or publicly, between people in all types of relationships.

 

I think it's sick.

 

Those who think it's righteous to behave this way, google RooshV and find our what kind of company you're in. Just because it's happening to a man on this thread instead of women, it's just as nasty.

[xxoo]

One person's morals, values and attitudes regarding sex are not appropriately spread all over everyone else. Live according to them. Pair up with someone else who feels the same way, but leave the rest of humanity to express their sexuality as we see fit.

 

I agree.

 

The OP came here for help with her insecurities, not a problem with her bf's past. From what she's shared about him, I would not be concerned about his past, given his actions in this relationship. He sounds like a man who is honest, self aware, and fully appreciates the relationship he and the OP share. I'd take that over a less aware man with lower numbers any day.

[irin]

the only advice i would give is to put-off the wedding, give it more time, and see if you feel better about it, not just this moments because you got advise from strangers, that made you happy. wait till come you to peace with whole thing. howd you feel if one day you ended sitting in the same rooms as some girl hes been with. like someone said PMC, is a very good idea to deal with this issue.

 

ive actually read alot about RT, and read in some cases it creeps back upon you, after 20 years, i read a post about a man who divorced his wife for this very issue after 20 years of M. you need to know that you/he cant change the past.

[kaylan]

Actually, yes it does. Because someday your love will be tested... and you will need more than the motivation not to hurt another person to keep you from cheating.

How do you know what motivation I or others need? I couldnt hurt someone by cheating, plus I wouldnt ever want it done to me. I take commitment seriously...mine as well as someone elses...thats also why I dont flirt with girls once they mention a bf or husband, and its also why I find it a deal breaker if a girl has cheated or helped someone to cheat in the past.

 

My motivation is about whats right and wrong. What more do I need?

... and if jumping into bed with another person is as easy as jumping into a pair of old slippers.... your boundaries just aren't at high as those who don't or haven't.

Bullcrap. Cheating or not cheating has NOTHING to do with whether or not I have casual sex with people I know while I am single. Again, its not like slipping on a pair of slippers because I dont hook up indiscriminately.

 

Please go.

[sally4sara]

Remaining faithful has to do with morals and loyalty. I could be the sluttiest of the slutty sluts while Im single if I really wanted to...but it wouldnt mean Id be more apt to cheat on someone Im committed to and whom I love. Im very VERY against cheating. Its such a harsh betrayal, and the pain it causes hurts deeply....so my ability to enjoy my single life (within reason) does not impair my ability to commit to a woman.

 

I have no issue committing to a girl whos done all of the things I have. Im not a goody good boy, nor am I a man whore. Id say I fall in between and am a rather average guy in terms of sexual experiences. Id like the same in a gal. Im sure I could tell you some things about my past that would make you never date me...but Im sure if a girl told me the same things, I would not judge her harshly over it.

 

 

The fact that they have had a good relationship for this long and that its leading to marriage indicates they share the same values. Thats my point.

 

But but but! It means you shared your body with others indiscriminately and not just with a photo either! I'm sorry dude, I don't judge the OP's BF for his past because if he was honest in his dealings he is likely an honest person full stop. But if you can't deal with someone having nude photographs without calling them trashy and bad relationship material, you might want to check your advice to the OP and caution her about what she is getting herself into per your own stated standards instead of suggesting that a virgin and this guy have clear shared values. He has actually shared his body and not just the image of his body after all.

 

Effin hypocrites.

[Emilia]

Hadn't thought of that... excellent advice... Some pre-marital counseling (PMC) is great at unearthing areas that need resolving before marriage.

 

Good luck OP!

 

Counselling before marriage. What has the world come to.

[Emilia]

It's a risk one takes unless the person has demonstrated otherwise... and consistently.

 

Hence the discussion about values and goals. It is a risk mitigation strategy. Nothing more.

 

No it's fear and the desire for control. Those two make anyone healthy with confidence and self esteem run. Dealing with someone's insecurities from day one is not most people's idea of a fulfilling relationship.

[kaylan]

But but but! It means you shared your body with others indiscriminately and not just with a photo either! I'm sorry dude, I don't judge the OP's BF for his past because if he was honest in his dealings he is likely an honest person full stop. But if you can't deal with someone having nude photographs without calling them trashy and bad relationship material, you might want to check your advice to the OP and caution her about what she is getting herself into per your own stated standards instead of suggesting that a virgin and this guy have clear shared values. He has actually shared his body and not just the image of his body after all.

 

Effin hypocrites.

What are you talking about?

 

Can a persons values not change? The fact that they are together and soon to be married means that they are a match and go together well. Whats so hard for you to understand?

 

And you obviously missed my point. Again..whats cheating have to do with whether someone has sewn wild oats or not? And please dont be stupid and act like sharing nude photographs with the general public is the same as having some fun when you are single. Ive had a couple of flings myself with women I know, and I hope youre not telling me its the equivalent of sending pictures of my dik to strangers? In either case though, it wouldnt make someone apt to cheat. We are talking about cheating...not whether I feel naked photos or casual sex is bad or not.

 

The point is the OP has a history with this guy, things are going good, and his past doesnt seem to be the most horrible thing ever. If he had sent naked photos of himself to several women or had some floating around on websites, Id still tell her to enjoy the good relationship they seem to have. This isnt a thread about how trashy or slutty casual sex can be depending on the degree to which it is done. Again, I was making an argument about whether past flings would be an easy way to peg someone as a potential cheater.

 

Dont call someone a hypocrite when you show an inability to understand the logic and points presented.

Edited September 3, 2012 by kaylan

[i-wish-i-didnt-wish]

@ Red Robin: May be what you have seen or heard is not different than what i do, but the biggest difference is the person I am talking about. He was great enough to change my views, lovable enough to make me realize a lot of things. And talking about motivation in future, it is the same motivation that changed him from an average single guy to a committed man. And in THIS relationship he has done enough to let me know what he is and what he feels for me. He has every quality I ever dreamt of in a life partner, I hold a very special place in his life, because out of both of us, HE knows how rare and difficult it is to find true love. I might have still slipped into skepticism, but he has always had the faith, as he got this the hard way. All I had to do is fall in love with the first guy and marry him. So, its a good deal for ME. Also, whether or not a person is a virgin or with less numbers, has no direct bearing on their worth as a life partner. Its the person''s CONSCIENCE that matters. There are a lot more values other than sexual, and its a folly to ignore the LONG of good qualities for a mistake that lives ONLY in the past and cannot be changed! AND THE MOST IMPORTANT THING: I never asked ANYONE here if I should Marry him or not, Or if he Has a good character or NOT! I asked help to get over MY insecurities! NOTHING ELSE!

[sally4sara]

What are you talking about? Can a person's values not change?

 

You know darn well what I'm talking about. I don't agree with Red Robin here because I look only to how honest a person conducts themselves.

But to suggest one act in someone's single past that doesn't include casual sex means a person is likely an untrustworthy relationship partner, then its blind or willfully ignorant to suggest many acts in someone's single past that did involve casual sex wouldn't factor into a person's level of trustworthiness. That is what you're doing here.

 

Can a person's values not change? It would seem you feel it only possible for men and with more wiggle room to spare for consideration.

[xxoo]

I might have still slipped into skepticism, but he has always had the faith, as he got this the hard way. All I had to do is fall in love with the first guy and marry him. So, its a good deal for ME.

 

I can relate to that. I marred my first boyfriend, my first love. He'd had other serious girlfriends, and had felt that he was in love before (although he knew early in our relationship that this was different).

 

Of the two of us, I was the one to get a little restless, and take the relationship a little for granted, around year 5. He already knew that there was nothing better out there. I foolishly imagined that every relationship was this easy and wonderful, and wondered "what fun have I missed?"

 

Thankfully, I got over it (we talked about it), and didn't do anything stupid! I've learned enough through 2nd hand knowledge, and don't need the 1st hand knowledge of a bad relationship, tyvm. I am now deeply grateful for

what we have, and what pain I've avoided through failed relationships and dating messiness.

[kaylan]

You know darn well what I'm talking about. I don't agree with Red Robin here because I look only to how honest a person conducts themselves.

 

But to suggest one act in someone's single past that doesn't include casual sex means a person is likely an untrustworthy relationship partner, then its blind or willfully ignorant to suggest many acts in someone's single past that did involve casual sex wouldn't factor into a person's level of trustworthiness. That is what you're doing here.

What?

 

Ok first off, you need better memory and you need to quote my past posts. Because you are far off the mark. I have never said someones non sexual past makes them untrustworthy. If you are referring to that naked photo thread, I didnt say anything remotely close to the fact that photos means someone would cheat. I even said in that thread that Ive taken some risque photos myself (half naked). So get your stuff straight.

 

Secondly, again I say this...casual sex is not indicative of someones ability to cheat or not! MANY kinds of people cheat. Ive known conservative people and loose people to cheat...so someone having casual fun in the past is not indicative of their loyalty. Their behavior in committed relationships is indicative of their loyalty and honesty.

 

You finally understand? No willful ignorance or blindness here sister. I dont think risky photos or a few casual flings means someone would be more apt to cheat. All I ever said in that other thread is that taking naked photos isnt a good look for someone and can be off putting. The same way sleeping around with too many people can be offputting. But I never said either meant the person would cheat.

Can a person's values not change? It would seem you feel it only possible for men and with more wiggle room to spare for consideration.

What the hell is some of you ladies problem on this forum. Stop fixating on the posts you want to fixate on...and stop misremembering what I actually say.

 

People who actually pay good attention to what I post know I dont give men more wiggle room then women. You are yet just another example of a poster trying to discredit my opinion by accusing me of gender bias. Ive heard the same thing from both men and women on this site about how I supposedly favor either men or women in my responses. Whats that mean if Ive had both men and women try that? Its means Im even handed, like Ive always said.

 

Please indicate where Ive said a woman could never change her values? Either way...this thread isnt about OPs fiance's value! Yet some were trying to judge him for having a past they didnt like even though her and him get along great. If OP was a guy asking about a female fiance, Id give the same advice. If they are freaking happy and have 2 years+ going strong, why the hell wouldnt I say that people can change? Im not here to place doubts in someones mind when their relationship seems strong and fine.

 

Please go.

Edited September 3, 2012 by kaylan

[i-wish-i-didnt-wish]

Hey XXOO, I went through the exact same thing and have come to understand how lucky I am!

[i-wish-i-didnt-wish]

Thank you! Kaylan, thanks a lot!

[pteromom]

People who have lots of casual sex like thinking they can turn that habit off (and their reasons for pursuing it) whenever they like.

 

They can't. It doesn't make sense to think they can... at least not easily. And even when they do, they will probably always struggle with the desire to slip back into their former lifestyle.

 

Wrong. I had a TON of casual sex when I was single. I've been married for 11 years, and even being quite unhappy in my marriage, I have never cheated.

 

I've never struggled with a desire to cheat either.