Lonely Ronin Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 Although - at 44 years old, after years of being married and watching my friends and seeing which ones are happy and in love still, and which ones are miserable and lonely, I wonder how much truth there is to the whole "marriage is work" thing. It seems to me that the ones who are happiest - the ones who are still in love with each other after 10, 15, 20, 30 years together, are the ones who have an easy-going friendship and who are on the same page as far as affection, sex, individualism vs. couple, finances, etc. Doesn't mean there is a right or wrong way to be in any of these areas - just that the happiest marriages seem to be between those who don't need much "work" to keep it happy. My parent's have been married for 35 years, and both my grandparents where married for over 50 before being widowed. A good example of "work" is my dad. He has a very stressful job. When stuff goes wrong at work people end up in the ER or the morgue. When he has a bad day, he needs to be left alone, for a few hours when he gets home. This goes against my moms personality(nurse), but she knows it's what he needs. Basically the work part is accepting stuff that you don't like. I've seen this is my family as well as several other very loving relationships.
Lonely Ronin Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 Based on that list, I just can't see woman having to work "very hard" to get a guy like that. What you don't see, and what i think a lot of guys on ls don't see, is the guy she was after knew what he was worth. Just because she is superior to him in a lot of categories (imo), doesn't mean he would take whatever she would give him. In other words he had standards she had to meet. The best advise I ever got from a friend, was that "Most men drastically underestimate what they are worth".
grkBoy Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 Why do men need to be some confident alpha robot personality to be worth to date, while women on the other hand who are not socially retarded are good to go for most men. If you want a confident guy be confident yourself..... Which MOST women are not. Here's why...most men are just happy to get attention from a woman. Some men only "require" that the woman is hot looking. Women have their laundry lists. Men don't. Some men don't because they feel guilty in doing that...believing it makes them shallow. Many others just don't care to think of it. NOW...imagine if men suddenly had laundry lists...and held to them. Of course, you have to still be one of the more "desirable" men to get the women killing themselves to fulfill your "list". Men can reject women...but the problem is too many don't. 1
kaylan Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 My lack of experience has no relevance to what you quoted. I'm not giving advice or anything like that.Im applying what I said to both you and 49k. Both of your opinions would hold more weight if you two actually had more experience with women. And that is your personal experience. You are picky in who you want to be in a serious relationship with. Has it occurred to you that you may be pickier than most men?Sucks for most men I guess, if more cannot be picky. Thats the problem with the dating game anyways. Dudes arent picky, put women on a pedestal, chase them around while having no self respect, but then want to blame girls for be picky. Id be even more picky if my female dating pool behaved like some guys do. And why should a woman work to prove herself to a guy when many, many decent guys would take her as she is? Thats up to the girl to find out. Girls who have wanted me know exactly why they should work to prove themselves to me. Id say Im a rather dashing fellow lol. But it works both ways, I do work for girls who seem super cool.
Pyro Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 And why should a woman work to prove herself to a guy when many, many decent guys would take her as she is? this is where your inexperience shows. No normal guy would take a woman 'as she is'. She could end up being a complete psycho or even worse. Normal guys who are looking for a catch will go on dates and get to know her before they 'take her'
Mme. Chaucer Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 The more insecure a woman, the more confident a mate she requires. Not in my experience. I don't think that insecure people can handle confident people; they tend to stick together. Also, I don't think that truly confident men like doormat women; that works better for insecure men who want to feel "better" than somebody. 1
Mme. Chaucer Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 Why do men need confident personality but women not. Why do women need breasts and vaginas when men don't? Whaddya mean? Men have a basic need and entitlement to be provided with all the breasts and vaginas they can handle. Or shake a stick at. Or in.
Mme. Chaucer Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 Originally Posted by somedude81 And why should a woman work to prove herself to a guy when many, many decent guys would take her as she is? Unless she is average weight or higher, or has less than a C cup bra size, that is. Right? Then she probably has a lot to prove. 1
Pyro Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 Not in my experience. I don't think that insecure people can handle confident people; they tend to stick together. Also, I don't think that truly confident men like doormat women; that works better for insecure men who want to feel "better" than somebody. Doormat females are as exciting as doormat men are to women. 3
Untouchable_Fire Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 this is where your inexperience shows. No normal guy would take a woman 'as she is'. She could end up being a complete psycho or even worse. Normal guys who are looking for a catch will go on dates and get to know her before they 'take her' I take women as they are. I don't try to change them. I think most men just don't require high levels of confidence from the women they date. We do truly value loyalty... but there is no test for it and no way to verify it. So it becomes a moot point. How do you quickly test loyalty in a woman?
Pyro Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 I take women as they are. I don't try to change them. I think most men just don't require high levels of confidence from the women they date. We do truly value loyalty... but there is no test for it and no way to verify it. So it becomes a moot point. How do you quickly test loyalty in a woman? I don't change them either but I am going to make sure that she is right for me before I take her as she is. You can't quickly test that. As time goes on I make sure that her actions and words match up. What does loyalty have to do with confidence?
fortyninethousand322 Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 Im applying what I said to both you and 49k. Both of your opinions would hold more weight if you two actually had more experience with women. Oh yes, the old "you don't know anything because you're a virgin" dig. How lovely. Same could be said to you or anyone else you know: your opinion would hold more weight if you were ever inexperienced with women. You haven't, so you have only one perspective to come from.
kaylan Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 ^Its not just virginity. You guys havent dated AT ALL. Thats the issue here. How can you know what women want, and talk about what men and women do in dating, if youve never dated yourself? And um...the last part you said was dumb. Everyone begins from an inexperienced perspective and then they learn as they go. I used to be inexperienced, but Im not anymore...and Im telling you, you dont know much about sex and dating until youve experienced it. I know that I, and many other people, didnt know crap about anything until we got out there and dated.
fortyninethousand322 Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) ^Its not just virginity. You guys havent dated AT ALL. Thats the issue here. How can you know what women want, and talk about what men and women do in dating, if youve never dated yourself? And um...the last part you said was dumb. Everyone begins from an inexperienced perspective and then they learn as they go. I used to be inexperienced, but Im not anymore...and Im telling you, you dont know much about sex and dating until youve experienced it. I know that I, and many other people, didnt know crap about anything until we got out there and dated. Kaylan, you've taken this innocuous comment of mine: It's the man's job to be confident. It's always been this way and always will be this way. If you don't like it, well, that's just too bad I guess. And decided to construe it to mean that I'm claiming to be an expert on dating. Talk about dumb comments... Edited August 24, 2012 by fortyninethousand322
Disenchantedly Yours Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 Women look at men as the superiors the leaders the authotarian so to speak..they want to look "up" to their man not down or equal.. HUGE Misconception. It is not that women look up to men as "superiors". WTF. This would mean she thought he was better then her, I can tell you that isn't the case. I am disturbed that you even said that.
Mme. Chaucer Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 I don't change them either but I am going to make sure that she is right for me before I take her as she is. I'm sure when you met the right one, you were happy to "take her as she is." The differences here is that the person who posted that phrase initially in this thread meant, I believe, that all a woman has to do is have that chromosome configuration and its concurrent secondary sexual characteristics and she'll be A-Okay for "men." Maybe for a few.
somedude81 Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 ^Its not just virginity. You guys havent dated AT ALL. Thats the issue here. How can you know what women want, and talk about what men and women do in dating, if youve never dated yourself? And where in this thread have I talked about what women want, or what men and women do in dating? The only thing I have said is that women don't have to work that hard to get a decent guy. And yes, I have enough life experience to make that claim. Getting back to the point of this thread. A woman having confidence, is not a requirement that many men have.
Pyro Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 I'm sure when you met the right one, you were happy to "take her as she is." The differences here is that the person who posted that phrase initially in this thread meant, I believe, that all a woman has to do is have that chromosome configuration and its concurrent secondary sexual characteristics and she'll be A-Okay for "men." Maybe for a few. After I 'met' her and got to know her. I was responding to that definition of 'take her as she is'
kaylan Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) Kaylan, you've taken this innocuous comment of mine: And decided to construe it to mean that I'm claiming to be an expert on dating. Talk about dumb comments... That comment is just icing on the cake from the behavior you two usually display. Everyone can see that. Like I said on the first page...both men and women like confident mates.And where in this thread have I talked about what women want, or what men and women do in dating? The only thing I have said is that women don't have to work that hard to get a decent guy. The bolded is a claim about how men and women behave in dating. How can you not see that?You just made my point. And yes, I have enough life experience to make that claim.Oh right...because youre a decent guy, and because women havent picked you it must mean they dont have to work hard to get good men in general? Getting back to the point of this thread. A woman having confidence, is not a requirement that many men have.I think it is. Guys just dont outright say it. Ask a buncha guys if they want to date a clingy or insecure girl who lacks confidence. Doubt many will say yes. Edited August 24, 2012 by kaylan
fortyninethousand322 Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 That comment is just icing on the cake from the behavior you two usually display. Everyone can see that. "Behavior". I've been nothing but respectful and honest on here. Perhaps a bit too self effacing at times but no one (aside from you) has ever complained. Perhaps I should only hang out in the part of the forum meant for "inexperienced" people.
Mme. Chaucer Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 After I 'met' her and got to know her. I was responding to that definition of 'take her as she is' That's what I'm saying, dude!
Lonely Ronin Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 Perhaps I should only hang out in the part of the forum meant for "inexperienced" people. Na, you just need to realize that your opinion comes of as bias and incorrect to those with more experience than you.
fortyninethousand322 Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 Na, you just need to realize that your opinion comes of as bias and incorrect to those with more experience than you. I've never disputed this. Everyone's opinion is biased and colored by their experiences or non-experiences.
Pyro Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 That's what I'm saying, dude! Thought so. Just wanted to make sure.
somedude81 Posted August 24, 2012 Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) That comment is just icing on the cake from the behavior you two usually display. Can you stop talking as if 49k and I were one person. The bolded is a claim about how men and women behave in dating. How can you not see that?I'm talking about actions, not behaviors. Oh right...because youre a decent guy, and because women havent picked you it must mean they dont have to work hard to get good men in general?How is me having trouble with women, at all related to women working hard or not to get good men in general? You're really stretching there kaylan. I think it is. Guys just dont outright say it. Ask a buncha guys if they want to date a clingy or insecure girl who lacks confidence. Doubt many will say yes. A lack of confidence does not equal clingy. Confidence basically is, a belief in one's ability to succeed. Somebody who lacks confidence will need reassurance or encouragement. I'm not seeing how that's a dealbreaker for women. I don't see how a girl being insecure is a bad thing. If it is, why are there hundreds of songs out there song by men, telling women that they're beautiful and that they are amazing just the way they are? Edit: I just saw a thread about insecurity in women. Well that's the word the guy used, but it seems like she had a lack of trust. Edited August 24, 2012 by somedude81
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