Author RedRobin Posted August 28, 2012 Author Posted August 28, 2012 Very noble (not being sarcastic) and understandable but.... It means you are learning to interact with a new group you don't know how to get a measure of easily. I know that dating 'middle class' men works for me and sometimes they are in 'lowly' occupations or have working class hobbies but they were still brought up in a certain way. I think it is very hard to tune into another strata. Perhaps you need to refine what you are looking for in a different way. Makes sense? This post makes more sense than just about any post on here... You are right... I'm having a VERY difficult time tuning into another strata.
Author RedRobin Posted August 28, 2012 Author Posted August 28, 2012 As I read through your last post, I asked myself "why bother?'. Don't then. Your input is not helpful. You can meet people in many kinds of ways. Either way, OLD, meet up groups, strangers in the park or coffee house, or acquaintances through a mutual friend, all run the probability of meeting someone who isnt right for you. Youve had bad luck all around, so why limit yourself to one avenue of acquiring dates? I've tried all of those. What isn't changing is most men's need to press for sex early on and the world of 'multi-dating'. Those are the two biggest reasons I choose not to continue getting to know a man. I say keep your dating pool expanded and just have fun. Dating these days is not 'fun'. Getting to know people is and can be. Again, stop going into situations waiting for someone to screw up. Just enjoy things in the moment. Not every guy wants sex right away...and if a guy does come on to you, simply let him know its not time. Its not the biggest deal in the world. People have sex drives, and a desire for sex isnt a reason to throw someone out of your life. Well, if he wants sex from a near stranger, we aren't compatible. Real easy. Let him plow his wares elsewhere and oblige some other woman to use her vagina as a relationship roulette wheel. World is full of those. Simple say its too soon, and go from there. Plenty of guys will have no issue with that. Hopefully you can find these guys. Obviously not. Wow...how mature of you to lash out at me for being honest with you. Your attitude is your biggest problem and you sit and try to defend such bitterness and defensiveness. You dont think good men can sense this despite whatever little facade you put up? I mean really...F me? I've read your posts. Some women are for f*cking and 'fun'... other women are for relationships. Do you tell them this before or after you f them?? If you tell them before, then great. If you tell them after.. Then yea... F-you. I get the impression you tell them after. Could be wrong though. Maybe not 'you' personally... but 'you' as in the collective encompassing the range of most male behavior these days. And I usually know whether a girl has potential as a gf or not very quickly. And I will not hook up with them unless we are both on the same page in what we want. Ok, good. Sounds like you don't have sex with women without telling them your intentions... Most guys don't you know. Not every guy is going to rush into things with women he doesnt see himself with. Hence the 'walls'. They serve a purpose. And I dont speak for my "brethren". Every guy is different in how he does things. But Im not rare in how I do things myself. I do know that walls are unattractive and a defensive, uptight, and insecure attitude like yours would definitely keep you out of the potential gf bin. And get mad all you want, thats honesty. I'm not mad at all. If they decide not to date me, then great. If they treat me as something to f*ck and for 'fun'... yes, we DO have a problem. But I also have a problem with men who have a habit of f*cking for fun... so if they find me uptight and not interested in knowing them... then all is well. We are both open to spending our time elsewhere. And as I said. After a certain age, the pool is smaller. And heck, sometimes guys are getting out of relationships and are sick of them. They may figure they are older and want to enjoy being single again. Gotta be some diamonds in the rough out there though. *shrug* Not interested in sifting through the garbage. If youre fine with making no progress, then so am I. Great.... and we also can define what constitutes 'progress' too... Progress to me is not opening myself up to bad men, commitment-phobes, or ones who f*ck for fun... If that means never dating and spending my life romantically 'alone' so be it. Those men can wreak havoc and do damage to other women...
Emilia Posted August 28, 2012 Posted August 28, 2012 I'm having a VERY difficult time tuning into another strata. I sympathise. I'm happy with the area I live in (though could do with a quieter road) but would not date the men there. It's very central and it's getting 'gentrified' (a terrible word I know) but I would have sweet little nothing in common with most people there if I socialised with them so I don't. Never go to my local pub
Ninjainpajamas Posted August 28, 2012 Posted August 28, 2012 I tried to keep up with the thread but I'm emotionally exhausted by it I think It would be extremely interesting however to have the perspective of the men who have/are dating RR though...I wonder what it would look like from their side. I think there's more to this but RR can only give her perspective and how she feels and what she thinks...I think most people are feeling like there's something awry or missing from this picture...it doesn't feel complete. So trying to feel in the gaps so to speak seems futile. 1
Lonely Ronin Posted August 28, 2012 Posted August 28, 2012 I tried to keep up with the thread but I'm emotionally exhausted by it I second this. If that means never dating and spending my life romantically 'alone' so be it. Those men can wreak havoc and do damage to other women... Red, Based on what I know of you, I'm pretty sure you don't want to end up alone. You have had ***** luck with men recently, and that had made you jaded about the entire concept of dating.You can't change these guys, or anyone else for that matter, the only person you can change is you. Please hear me out, because I'm not saying you are doing anything wrong. What I'm suggesting is that you site down and try and figure out what all these guys have in common. Once you know that you have changed you, you will then be prepared with a tool to weed them out, and save yourself grief. The only other point I want to make, is IMO you are being to nice. Pretty much every woman I know would have lit sexy talks ear on fire, if he said that kind of stuff to them over the phone. As Swayze said "be nice until it's time to not be nice". I think that phone call was a time to not be nice.
thatone Posted August 28, 2012 Posted August 28, 2012 This post makes more sense than just about any post on here... You are right... I'm having a VERY difficult time tuning into another strata. i can sympathize with that. from my perspective, women from higher class families tend to be entitled and high maintenance. do not want. on the other hand women who have gained success on their own struggle in relationships for obvious reasons. their hormones tell them to be polite and submissive but their rational mind doesn't really want to, so they wind up coming across as indecisive, confused, etc. so what have i done? pick from middle class women until i find one i deem worthy of 'trading up'. call it what you like, it works for me. from your perspective i don't know that you would ever find a man who is lesser than you in professional success who is comfortable with you, it's not the nature of most men to be that way. the only couple i know who has done this did it as a sort of 'bargain' in their college years (wife was going to medical school and husband supported her until then, now that she's a doctor she repays the favor). of course not all of these are absolute truths but they describe most of the population, imo, so from a standpoint of maximizing your odds, it's worth considering.
Author RedRobin Posted August 28, 2012 Author Posted August 28, 2012 What I don't understand is that you aren't able to find any man that is willing to go about it in that way. How is it possible that there is no man in your area that is willing to give that a try? Can you explain what you think the reason is for this? I've attempted to explain a few, but if I knew the answer to that question, I would have fixed it by now. I'm tired of thinking about it, TBH. Right now, I feel the need to just not bother. Takes too much out of me.
Author RedRobin Posted August 28, 2012 Author Posted August 28, 2012 I tried to keep up with the thread but I'm emotionally exhausted by it I think It would be extremely interesting however to have the perspective of the men who have/are dating RR though...I wonder what it would look like from their side. I think there's more to this but RR can only give her perspective and how she feels and what she thinks...I think most people are feeling like there's something awry or missing from this picture...it doesn't feel complete. So trying to feel in the gaps so to speak seems futile. Well, we already have one, don't we? I'm sure alot of them would be pleading their case for: 1) having noble intentions... 2) That I'm too rigid in terms of not accepting multi-dating 3) That I have trust issues 4) That I should just 'go with the flow'. I'll only accept one out of four of those as anything I even care to continue to work on. I'm sure you could say which it is. #3, of course. The rest I consider little more than BS handwaving... The ones I managed to keep in touch with in some way ended up with exactly the women I predicted they would... or situations I imagined they prefer. People may not like my reactions... They can criticize how I go about things... but I'm rarely wrong in my assessments. Even my closest friends give me credit for my intuition. ... I will say this, Ninja... You are as bad as anyone at ridiculing women who (foolishly) go in head first trying to trust men... and warning them about all the baaaad things men do to try and suck women in and use them. You (as in you in the global sense, not you personally) can't wag your fingers at me or women building walls and simultaneously ridicule women when they attempt to pull them down.
Author RedRobin Posted August 28, 2012 Author Posted August 28, 2012 The only other point I want to make, is IMO you are being too nice. Pretty much every woman I know would have lit sexy talks ear on fire, if he said that kind of stuff to them over the phone. As Swayze said "be nice until it's time to not be nice". I think that phone call was a time to not be nice. Perhaps. The people I admire the most, though, tend to be able to say what they need to say without diminishing or harming the other person in any way. They have an air of cheerful firmness most of the time... the 'worst' you will ever get from them is complete silence once you have worn out your welcome. They aren't even passive-aggressive about it. They just manage to be honest without hurting anyone or letting anyone cross boundaries. It's amazing to watch. Anyway, this is not a skill I demonstrate very often here on LS... ha ha... I could stand to practice it more here, for sure. But it is one I'm working very hard to develop IRL. I still do consider my ability to shush him away honestly and respectfully as a major 'victory' in my efforts to communicate effectively. It was very hard on me to manage my fear/anger in the moment.. But I suspect it will get easier as time goes by.
Author RedRobin Posted August 28, 2012 Author Posted August 28, 2012 Anything further from Mr. Sexy? Thank you for asking. No. The conversation we had on my front doorstep seemed to be effective.
Author RedRobin Posted August 29, 2012 Author Posted August 29, 2012 (edited) Have you considered therapy to address this? Note that in some cases therapy renders a higher percentage of success if the therapy is done with a partner. For example, for Borderline Personality Disorder the success rate of treatment is 7% when the patient goes into therapy by herself/himself, but it has a 75% success rate if the patient goes into therapy with a partner. Well, I feel my basic trust 'issues' are mostly situational and experiential... not something that can be fixed with therapy. It comes from being out of my element and not understanding how to adapt in a new environment... But I'm figuring that out. I have some very good friends who are helping me learn the ropes and navigate this new territory. The fact that I'm able to find, build, and maintain friendships and work relationships with both genders and close ties with family means (to me) that any trust issues I have aren't pathological... I honestly feel that with dating these days, the traditional 'safety' nets have been removed... and with the added emotional burden being predominantly on women to size men up quicker than most people make a car purchase... ...and alot of men refusing to invest in anything. They just try to push their way through like Mr. Sexy Talk with force or lies... or rely on women's naivete to get what they want... I really am struggling to see how it is worth the risk or effort anymore. Edited August 29, 2012 by RedRobin
Author RedRobin Posted August 29, 2012 Author Posted August 29, 2012 I do have an update on this situation... I happened to see our mutual acquaintance at Starbucks this morning and pulled him aside on his way out. I briefly told him that I've told Mr. Sexy Talk many times that I'm not interested in pursuing anything romantic with him... and that he has persisted to try to contact me and come to my home uninvited... and that it was making me very uncomfortable. Also told him that I hadn't notified authorities yet, but was prepared to do that if he didn't stop. For some reason, my friend didn't look surprised... Turns out that Mr. Sexy Talk got into legal trouble recently with the neighbor of our acquaintance... refused to pay him back for $700 on a real-estate transaction... after which the neighbor sued him. MST (Mr. Sexy Talk) pissed off a few people around here, looks like... I don't have to worry about our mutual acquaintance setting MST up with any more single ladies, looks like.
Lonely Ronin Posted August 29, 2012 Posted August 29, 2012 If your friend didn't look surprised, then why did he set you up with that guy? I was thinking the same thing. I would have been like wtf why did you set me up with the weirdo?
Author RedRobin Posted August 29, 2012 Author Posted August 29, 2012 (edited) If your friend didn't look surprised, then why did he set you up with that guy? I was thinking the same thing. I would have been like wtf why did you set me up with the weirdo? The issue with Mr. Sexy Talk has been developing for months... Probably starting around the beginning of the summer... I could go back to look at my prior text messages from him... but before this week, the last I heard from him was at least a month ago, probably longer.... So, the 'news' about MST was hitting our mutual acquaintance about the same time it hit me a few months ago. So it is very good I sat on my hands the first time and didn't say anything. It gave MST's reputation time to circulate all on it's own... ... the good news is that I have a big, end of summer BBQ bash to attend for a local running group I'm involved with this Thursday. Hopefully the weather will turn out nice. Will be a great distraction from this junk. The bad news is that I left the key in my motorcycle last night and drained the battery it was a gorgeous day today... Would really have loved to go for a ride... but I'm stuck at home watching the needle on the battery charger... Ah well... things COULD be worse. Edited August 29, 2012 by RedRobin
Author RedRobin Posted September 1, 2012 Author Posted September 1, 2012 The issue with Mr. Sexy Talk has been developing for months... Probably starting around the beginning of the summer... I could go back to look at my prior text messages from him... but before this week, the last I heard from him was at least a month ago, probably longer.... So, the 'news' about MST was hitting our mutual acquaintance about the same time it hit me a few months ago. So it is very good I sat on my hands the first time and didn't say anything. It gave MST's reputation time to circulate all on it's own... ... the good news is that I have a big, end of summer BBQ bash to attend for a local running group I'm involved with this Thursday. Hopefully the weather will turn out nice. Will be a great distraction from this junk. The bad news is that I left the key in my motorcycle last night and drained the battery it was a gorgeous day today... Would really have loved to go for a ride... but I'm stuck at home watching the needle on the battery charger... Ah well... things COULD be worse. ... and a few hours after I posted the above... I learned that one of my best female friends... and also the wife of one of my very good male friends and biking buddies... Just suffered a stroke. We don't know what the outcome will be. For what it is worth... she is also a woman who is in the public eye and one of my mentors. When her husband (my friend) called me, I was sworn to secrecy about what actually happened... So this is just one more thing he has to manage on top of everything else. My friend is used to it... but still. It only underscores to me the importance of having a tight circle of people you can trust...
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