friendship to EA to PA... what next?

[stevieg]

Hey,

 

This is only my second thread here, please see my first one from 9 months ago for some background as the two are related.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/marriage-life-partnerships/308054-unhappy-relationship-but-dont-understand-why-possible-ea

 

Things have kinda got out of control... I really don't know what to do next. My plan did not work, I got closer and closer to my co-worker to the point when I had made the decision in my own head to tell her as it was killing me inside. Before I had a chance though, she made the first move when we were way at a conference. I could not believe it, after all these years what I had desired had come true. We went over the threshold into PA and have been doing so for 6 months.

 

It is clear to me now that this is far more than just lust. We are both completely in love with each other, it turns out she has always had feelings for me as I have here sinceshw meeting all those years ago. We have discussed leaving our partners and she is ok with my domestic situation (i have kids, she does not and doesn't want her own bit would be fine with mine during weekends and vacations).

 

Clearly the affect on my marriage has been significant. Although WF doesn't know, the complete lack of intimacy is evident, for the first time ever I couldn't perform in bed with her some weeks ago.

 

My problem is with leaving her. The kids would be fine, better to have two happy homes in my opinion, but its my wife I worry for. I don't think she would ever recover and I don't think I can do it to her. I feel weak for not being able to come clean and deal with this situation but it cannot stay as is, the stress and guilt is killing me.

 

I guess the question is, should I follow my own heart and happiness or should I be content with trying to make someone else happy for the rest of my life. Kinda one of life's fundamental questions ain't it?

[woinlove]

You can't give anyone a happy life, they need to do that themselves, although you can add or detract from their happiness. Staying with your W, from how you describe your feelings, seems likely to give both of you a subpar M and, consequently, to detract from her happiness. From what you write, I would suggest divorce, since you think your own future happiness lies with the OW.

 

In that case, I would advice you doing your best to treat your W with respect, giving her honesty, as you work through the divorce. Unless they are very young, counselling for the children is usually a good idea to help them adapt. And I'd advice counselling for you too, to help you deal with inevitable stresses in any long-term relationship better, as choosing to have an A is typically more about the individual making that choice than about who their current spouse is. If you don't want to be repeating the same behavior 10 years from now, counselling will help.

 

You have not treated your family well, but you can change that, be more honest, and have a respectful divorce, being as kind as possible under the circumstances.

[TaraMaiden]

Yup, basically, what she said.

 

And don't stay with a spouse out of pity.

That's the worst kind of affection - particularly with no sex.....

[woinlove]

 

And don't stay with a spouse out of pity.

That's the worst kind of affection - particularly with no sex.....

 

Yes, this too. Your W is probably blaming herself for you not being able to have sex with her. Your actions will have already eroded her self-confidence. Don't prolong the cruelty.

[carhill]

The next obvious step is to end your respective current relationships, as appropriate, then proceed to solidify your union exclusively.

 

IMO, no need to worry about your wife. Women are resilient. She'll be fine, especially with clarity about the nature of your relationship and the next steps you're taking, presuming that is to end your marriage and be with your current affair partner.

 

Good luck.

[stillafool]

Definitely tell her the truth about what is going on with you ASAP. It would be cruel of you not to tell her you are in love with someone else. At least that would explain why you can't perform with her. It will hurt her, no doubt about that, but she will heal and be free to move on and find a love of her own. Don't delay, do it today! Keeping her in the dark about this situation is the most awful thing you can do to her.

[GLDheart]

How is living a lie good for your wife?

 

Everyday that you perpetuate this cruelty adds to the inevitable realization of betrayel and resulting pain that she is going to go through.

 

You've made your choice. It is not your wife. Rip the band-aid off and get it over with.

[Spark1111]

Yes. Please tell your wife the truth so she too can find a man who loves and cherishes her.

 

He then can move into your family home after the divorce and help raise your children on the weekends and vacations you do not have them....the ones where you are finding true love with your co-worker; the one who doesn't want children of her own.

 

Good luck to you.

[TaraMaiden]

Yes. Please tell your wife the truth so she too can find a man who loves and cherishes her.

 

He then can move into your family home after the divorce and help raise your children on the weekends and vacations you do not have them....the ones where you are finding true love with your co-worker; the one who doesn't want children of her own.

 

Good luck to you.

 

There's no need for that.

You and anyone else who has experienced divorce know full well that this isn't necessarily the case, and that children know who their real parents are no matter who raises them, or with whom they live...

 

When my ex- and I divorced, my youngest was obviously a little shaken and upset, and confided in a good school-friend of hers whose parents were also divorced and both with new partners....

"It's great!" she said, "Really, it's not as bad as you think - you get double birthdays, double Christmas, double Easter... and often two homes, and two holidays - sure, it's upsetting - but more because they think it's worse than you do! Cheer up, your mum and dad are still your mum and dad!"

 

and I swear, she was absolutely fine after that.....

[Spark1111]

PS: You have already DONE IT TO HER...by having a secret affair with your co-worker.

 

No need to protect her now. The damage has already been done by you when you made that choice.

 

Certainly, if you could not/would not consider her feelings then, while taking step after step to fall in love, do not condescend to protect her NOW.

 

That's just so wrong on so many levels.

 

Unless, (sigh) that is the excuse you are telling yourself now because you really want both, or you are not 100% sure you want your OW forever.

 

Commit and decide.

[standtall]

Steve..your at the point now to be truthful to the wife.

[Spark1111]

There's no need for that.

You and anyone else who has experienced divorce know full well that this isn't necessarily the case, and that children know who their real parents are no matter who raises them, or with whom they live...

 

When my ex- and I divorced, my youngest was obviously a little shaken and upset, and confided in a good school-friend of hers whose parents were also divorced and both with new partners....

"It's great!" she said, "Really, it's not as bad as you think - you get double birthdays, double Christmas, double Easter... and often two homes, and two holidays - sure, it's upsetting - but more because they think it's worse than you do! Cheer up, your mum and dad are still your mum and dad!"

 

and I swear, she was absolutely fine after that.....

 

Were you in the middle of an affair TM? Was the affair found out or disclosed?

 

Don't you believe there is a difference in leaving a relationship that is not working as opposed to leaving a relationship because you have found someone new?

 

I do. Doesn't mean it cannot still be amicable....but the situation is different and potentially much more volatile when one of the partners is in the throes of a "new love."

[TaraMaiden]

Were you in the middle of an affair TM?

 

Yes, but not I.....

 

Was the affair found out or disclosed?

Disclosed

 

Don't you believe there is a difference in leaving a relationship that is not working as opposed to leaving a relationship because you have found someone new?

No.

As in Law, the reason is irrelevant. The fact it's done with, is more sobering. To children.

 

I do. Doesn't mean it cannot still be amicable....but the situation is different and potentially much more volatile when one of the partners is in the throes of a "new love."

That depends on many things:

The emotional maturity of all involved, and their ability to conduct themselves with dignity and discuss things in a constructive way.

[Furious]

Hey,

 

This is only my second thread here, please see my first one from 9 months ago for some background as the two are related.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/marriage-life-partnerships/308054-unhappy-relationship-but-dont-understand-why-possible-ea

 

Things have kinda got out of control... I really don't know what to do next. My plan did not work, I got closer and closer to my co-worker to the point when I had made the decision in my own head to tell her as it was killing me inside. Before I had a chance though, she made the first move when we were way at a conference. I could not believe it, after all these years what I had desired had come true. We went over the threshold into PA and have been doing so

for 6 months.

 

It is clear to me now that this is far more than just lust. We are both completely in love with each other, it turns out she has always had feelings for me as I have here sinceshw meeting all those years ago. We have discussed leaving our partners and she is ok with my domestic situation (i have kids, she does not and doesn't want her own bit would be fine with mine during weekends and vacations).

 

Clearly the affect on my marriage has been significant. Although WF doesn't know, the complete lack of intimacy is evident, for the first time ever I

couldn't perform in bed with her some weeks ago.

 

My problem is with leaving her. The kids would be fine, better to have two happy homes in my opinion, but its my wife I worry for. I don't think she would ever recover and I don't think I can do it to her. I feel weak for not

being able to come clean and deal with this situation but it cannot stay as is, the stress and guilt is killing me.

 

I guess the question is, should I follow my own heart and happiness or should I be content with trying to make someone else happy for the rest of my life. Kinda one of life's fundamental questions ain't it?

 

 

 

You left your wife a long time ago but she didn't know this...and you gave her a false reality.

 

You fed the affair and starved the marriage. Instead of being honest with your wife in the last year you denied her the truth and the right she deserved to make her own choices. You did not give her or your family a fair chance and you lied day in day out.

 

Lies build walls and the truth tears them down.

 

Give your wife the truth because as much as that hurts the lies hurt even more.

[woinlove]

Were you in the middle of an affair TM? Was the affair found out or disclosed?

 

Don't you believe there is a difference in leaving a relationship that is not working as opposed to leaving a relationship because you have found someone new?

 

I do. Doesn't mean it cannot still be amicable....but the situation is different and potentially much more volatile when one of the partners is in the throes of a "new love."

 

I imagine it is very different and potentially more volatile. I think this is where the honesty, clarity, respect that many have been advocating will make a difference. Here we have a husband and father who has been planning a new parenting arrangement for his and his W's children with another woman completely unknown to his W, while he continues living with her and trying to have sex with her - even his penis is telling him, wake up, this is completely crazy! This is a situation crying out for a change, right now.

 

I think it will be worse if he tries to divorce while lying, the W suspects but doesn't know, probably finds out for sure sometime later, meanwhile she is trying to co-parent with a man who didn't even respect her enough to give her clarity, didn't allow her to process things as they really are and heal. Co-parenting under that situation could be damaged for many years. If he starts treating her with respect now, she could adapt to reality, and hopefully they will work out a healthy co-parenting arrangement.

[2long]

I guess the question is, should I follow my own heart and happiness or should I be content with trying to make someone else happy for the rest of my life. Kinda one of life's fundamental questions ain't it?

 

IMNSHO, you should focus your energies and efforts on finding out what love really is, because what you're doing is NOT it.

 

I've used this quote from M. Scott Peck's book "The Road Less Traveled" a number of times, but I think it applies here.

 

Of all the misconceptions about love the most powerful and pervasive is the belief that "falling in love" is love or at least one of the manifestations of love. It is a potent misconception, because falling in love is subjectively experienced in a very powerful fashion as an experience of love.

 

Love is not a feeling. Many, many people possessing a feeling of love and even acting in response to that feeling act in all manner of unloving and destructive ways. It is not only possible but necessary for a loving person to avoid acting on feelings of love. I may meet a woman who strongly attracts me, whom I feel like loving, but because it would be destructive to my marriage to have an affair, I will say vocally or in the silence of my heart, "I feel like loving you, but I am not going to". My feelings of love may be unbounded, but my capacity to be loving is limited. I therefore must choose the person on whom to focus my capacity to love, toward whom to direct my will to love.

 

True love is not a feeling by which we are overwhelmed. It is a committed, thoughtful decision. Genuine love implies commitment and the exercise of wisdom. When we are concerned for someone's spiritual growth, we know that a lack of commitment is likely to be harmful and that commitment to that person is probably necessary for us to manifest our concern effectively.

 

Genuine love is volitional rather than emotional. The person who truly loves does so because of a decision to love. This person has made a commitment to be loving whether or not the loving feeling is present. If it is, so much the better; but if it isn't, the commitment to love, the will to love, still stands and is still exercised.

 

The common tendency to confuse love with feelings of love allows people all manner of self-deception. It is clear that there may be a self-serving quality in this tendency to confuse love with the feeling of love; it is easy and not at all unpleasant to find evidence of love in one's feelings. It may be difficult and painful to search for evidence of love in one's actions.

 

What are your values? What do the promises you made 2 be faithful 2 your W mean 2 you now? Where does "integrity" fit in your world view?

 

-ol' 2long

[TaraMaiden]

Apologies, 2long - but that just makes me want to stick 2 fingers down my throat....

[2long]

Apologies, 2long - but that just makes me want to stick 2 fingers down my throat....

 

...but "follow your heart" doesn't??

 

-ol' 2long

[TaraMaiden]

Sentimentality belongs to Hollywood.

the fact is, he's cheated on his wife, he's no longer in love with her, his marriage is a sham and he wants out.

That's basically the bottom line.

It happens.

time, and time, and time, and time again.

At least he's realised this - more cheaters than not, would rather prolong the affair in secret, maintain a wife AND a mistress, and carry on with the double-life subterfuge for as long as they can feasibly sustain it.

At least this guy - after having sampled the GIGS - knows that it's what he'd rather have.

He's making a choice.

[2long]

I think it very much remains 2 be seen what "choices" he's made or will make.

 

I would predict that he'll keep on keeping on cheating and lying 2 his W as long as he possibly can. Sure, he'll express remorse and whine here, but he'll never make the choice 2 make a positive change until and unless his W finds out about the affair and effectively pisses in his cheerios by making her own informed choices.

 

-ol' 2long

[jwi71]

Hey,

 

This is only my second thread here, please see my first one from 9 months ago for some background as the two are related.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/marriage-life-partnerships/308054-unhappy-relationship-but-dont-understand-why-possible-ea

 

Things have kinda got out of control... I really don't know what to do next. My plan did not work, I got closer and closer to my co-worker to the point when I had made the decision in my own head to tell her as it was killing me inside. Before I had a chance though, she made the first move when we were way at a conference. I could not believe it, after all these years what I had desired had come true. We went over the threshold into PA and have been doing so for 6 months.

 

It is clear to me now that this is far more than just lust. We are both completely in love with each other, it turns out she has always had feelings for me as I have here sinceshw meeting all those years ago. We have discussed leaving our partners and she is ok with my domestic situation (i have kids, she does not and doesn't want her own bit would be fine with mine during weekends and vacations).

 

Clearly the affect on my marriage has been significant. Although WF doesn't know, the complete lack of intimacy is evident, for the first time ever I couldn't perform in bed with her some weeks ago.

 

My problem is with leaving her. The kids would be fine, better to have two happy homes in my opinion, but its my wife I worry for. I don't think she would ever recover and I don't think I can do it to her. I feel weak for not being able to come clean and deal with this situation but it cannot stay as is, the stress and guilt is killing me.

 

I guess the question is, should I follow my own heart and happiness or should I be content with trying to make someone else happy for the rest of my life. Kinda one of life's fundamental questions ain't it?

 

Arrogant much there OP?

 

I mean, you and only you give your W reason to live, to function and be happy?

And, because you and only you "prop her up in life" leaving would just cripple her. Seriously, she'd be an inconsolable mess of a woman with no hope of ever tasting the sweet nectar of happiness and love.

 

You are so nobly stuck - your own selfish desires of happiness or the sacrificial nobility of helping this dreg of a woman know, fleetingly, the happiness of life you give her - at the expense of your own true happiness.

 

Shakespeare's got nothing on you bro.

 

Here's a reality check.

 

She will be hurt no doubt.

Crushed even.

 

And then she'll recover with the help of her friends and family. They'll form a protective cocoon around her for the sole purpose of helping her through.

 

And she'll make it.

 

And then she'll be ready to live life again - hopefully she'll find a man who will treat her better. I'm sure she will.

 

And she'll be happy.

 

Hopefully you will be too.

[Ninja'sHusband]

Sentimentality belongs to Hollywood.

the fact is, he's cheated on his wife, he's no longer in love with her, his marriage is a sham and he wants out.

That's basically the bottom line.

It happens.

time, and time, and time, and time again.

At least he's realised this - more cheaters than not, would rather prolong the affair in secret, maintain a wife AND a mistress, and carry on with the double-life subterfuge for as long as they can feasibly sustain it.

At least this guy - after having sampled the GIGS - knows that it's what he'd rather have.

He's making a choice.

Relationships can be worked on. People can adjust their viewpoint and look to the positive side of life. Vows can be kept, families preserved. I was really inspired by reading Dr. Harley's books on rebuilding love. If you have dedication to each other, your kids, and your family, you will work things out with the other parent of your children to your best ability.

 

Honestly I really despise the notion that people think it's ok to just throw away their vows and family for the next fleeting fantasy they have (GIGS = grass is greener on the other side?) I love a lot of people in my life, I could probably fall in love with any number of women I know...but I picked one to be with and was faithful to her for 18 years and counting until we are officially divorced and enough time has passed(about a year) for it to be ok to introduce somone new to my daughter.

[chalkfarm]

Arrogant much there OP?

 

I mean, you and only you give your W reason to live, to function and be happy?

And, because you and only you "prop her up in life" leaving would just cripple her. Seriously, she'd be an inconsolable mess of a woman with no hope of ever tasting the sweet nectar of happiness and love.

 

You are so nobly stuck - your own selfish desires of happiness or the sacrificial nobility of helping this dreg of a woman know, fleetingly, the happiness of life you give her - at the expense of your own true happiness.

 

Shakespeare's got nothing on you bro.

 

Here's a reality check.

 

She will be hurt no doubt.

Crushed even.

 

And then she'll recover with the help of her friends and family. They'll form a protective cocoon around her for the sole purpose of helping her through.

 

And she'll make it.

 

And then she'll be ready to live life again - hopefully she'll find a man who will treat her better. I'm sure she will.

 

And she'll be happy.

 

Hopefully you will be too.

 

Off topic post here, but I simply swoon when one references Shakespeare! Well done!

[Furious]

Your wife will be fine.

But you already know this.

 

Now that your OW is expecting you to make a move, you're making excuses because you know you really don't want to be with OW full time and make it "real."

 

You're what's called a cake eater OP and this scenerio is not unique. Your story (and your reasons why you ultimately "can't" leave) have been told a million times over.

 

You'll never leave. If you do "leave," you'll flip flop between the two of them and eventually claim to have to "go back for the kids," but try to keep to keep the OW hooked for as long as possible portraying yourself as a martyr.

 

You know you can't keep up the fantasy if you take it to real life. THAT is why you "can't" leave.

 

 

I agree with Alice

 

Reality is creeping in and it's threatening the affair bubble.

 

Divorce ain't pretty.

There will be child support, perhaps alimony.

Then there's the issue of his new woman and how the kids respond to her.

Also, the thought of his wife moving on and not only surviving but thriving.

No guarantee the OW will really leave her husband and then the pain of giving up everything for nothing If it doesn't work out.

[BetrayedH]

Your question seems to be to stay in your M and be unhappy or leave it to make yourself happy.

 

Considering how you seemed to give no energy in your post to how you want to restore your marriage and are making plans to be with the OW permanently, I can see why so many support you divorcing her.

 

Personally, I have to agree with Ducksoup who is spot-on about your affair being a fantasy land. Affair sex is powerful stuff. No real life to interfere. Just someone with whom you have no real commitment other than to explore sexual boundaries. No arguments, no dishes, no kids. It's exciting, fresh, and new. You show them your best side and they laugh at all of your jokes. Meanwhile, your wife has heard all of your jokes and is sick of your lame ass college stories. She sucks doesn't she? Too bad she doesn't even know she's in a competition for her husband. Poor girl probably wears an old nightgown to bed, trusting that her husband. She probably trusts you would be faithful and let her guard down. Long story short, right now she can't possibly compete.

 

I also agree with NinjasHusband that you made vows and you should stick to them. Period. Have some honor and integrity. Restore your marriage. Give you and your wife the chance that your marriage deserves. Anyone can piss away their marriage for some new flame. I don't have much faith that you're going to have the courage and character to do the right thing but I counsel you to do it anyway.

 

Either way, by my count everyone here thinks you should come clean with your wife. She should get a vote on what to do with the rest of her life. You're stealing her life from her and she only has one. Knock it off.