Free spirit with conservative

[denise_xo]

Just checking in before we take off in a bit.

 

Ninja, I think you have a rather cynical and bleak point of view. Do you ever give a positive forecast for any relationship? I don't think I've seen it on this forum. It seems to always be gloom and doom with you. Correct me if I'm wrong. I'm reading your comments, but some of them are just way off.

 

Will I be sad if it doesn't work out? Sure. That's natural. Will I be heart-broken? I don't think so. Yes, I have feelings for him and would like things to work out. But I'm paying attention to what's going on and considering all the time how I feel about it. If it's not right, I'll end it and move on, with some lessons learned.

 

I've talked to my counselor very openly about everything that has happened. This is a woman who never encourages me to settle for less than what is good for me. She always advocates standing up for my needs and wants and making sure they're met. And in the past, when I've found myself in a go-nowhere situation with a guy, she was decisive and very clear in giving advice on why disengaging was a healthy move, and exactly how I could do it in a healthy way.

 

I've basically spent the last few sessions trying to convince her of why I should dump him. She said the choice is ultimately mine, of course, but she's found holes in all my arguments and made a strong case for not dumping him.

 

He came over last night, and with the decision made that we will continue, the stress and tension were obviously lifted from us both. He was affectionate, expressive, attentive, sweet.

 

I've given him every opportunity to leave the situation without any flack from me. If he didn't want to continue, why would he keep coming back? Why would he be working to convince me to give it a chance to grow and improve? If he were so resistant and not invested, don't you think he would have taken any of the dozen or more opportunities I've given him to walk out the door?

 

I think it all boils down to what the essentials are in the package you want.

 

In a post upthread, you recounted how you told him that your 'over active brain' (or something along those lines, can't remember the exact wording) 'comes with the package'. I think you just also need to take that attitude towards him. I think it's great that you are communicating your needs and being open about them, but I don't think you can assume that this will result in him being as emotionally affectionate and romantic as you would like him to be. I think you just need to take that as a basic premise and then figure out whether you can live with it, and whether you can live with it in a way where you don't feel that you give more than you get. In that respect, pinpoint exactly what it is that you have done to meet him halfway, which you don't (or didn't) feel that he has reciprocated.

 

You could also consider whether your need for that kind of repeated confirmation would change in the long run. Now in the first stage of the relationship, you've had a lot 'does he really like me' questions and I think that is normal. However, I would say that as a relationship progresses, while it still takes a lot of work and maintenance to be healthy, I don't think it necessarily needs the same kind of confirmations as in the early phases. That's just my personal opinion applied to my life and you might feel differently about it. But now, after X years, I don't really need to hear my partner say x, y, z to me on a daily basis, because I know that he cares about me and he shows it through a range of actions.

[Ruby Slippers]

But that doesn't really make sense in the context of a long distance relationship, does it? I mean, if he just wanted sex, he could find that locally (in his new location). Would presumably be much easier.

Agreed. This guy has no problem getting women and sex. No matter what his issues are, he's never going to have a problem with that. He just walks in the room and women are magnetized to him wherever we go.

 

I even asked him the other day why he doesn't just get a new girlfriend in the new city. He looked hurt, and said, "Because I want you."

 

I also said maybe he just wants me to go on this trip so he has some company in the new place and doesn't have to go alone. He said one of his best friends told him he was going to be in Chicago right before he left town and asked if he could go with him, before he even asked me to go. And he said no, I want to take Ruby with me. He said if he just wanted some company, he would have taken his friend.

 

He certainly isn't perfect, but he isn't anywhere close to what some people here are making him out to be.

[Ruby Slippers]

I'm home, and the weekend was wonderful. It wasn't without some sadness and tension here and there, but beyond that, we had a blast. Several times, he mentioned coming back to see me next weekend and started planning the time frame out.

 

But I'm going to take Imajerk's advice and stop examining events in this thread for a while. Nature will run its course now, and I'm excited to see what unfolds ahead, with or without this man in my life.

 

I think all the signs are good. No guarantees, of course, but I'm maintaining a winner's attitude and feeling good about whatever comes next in my life.

 

I really appreciate all the good advice here so far. It has been a huge help!!

[Eternal Sunshine]

Ruby, my advice would be to write here as little as possible. It will just keep you more confused, more suspicious, more "going through everything with a fine tooth comb".

 

It's not healthy for you or the relationship. Trust your own instincts and just enjoy it, for however long it lasts

[Emilia]

Agreed. This guy has no problem getting women and sex. No matter what his issues are, he's never going to have a problem with that. He just walks in the room and women are magnetized to him wherever we go.

 

I even asked him the other day why he doesn't just get a new girlfriend in the new city. He looked hurt, and said, "Because I want you."

 

I also said maybe he just wants me to go on this trip so he has some company in the new place and doesn't have to go alone. He said one of his best friends told him he was going to be in Chicago right before he left town and asked if he could go with him, before he even asked me to go. And he said no, I want to take Ruby with me. He said if he just wanted some company, he would have taken his friend.

 

He certainly isn't perfect, but he isn't anywhere close to what some people here are making him out to be.

 

It is difficult for a guy to find a decent short or even medium term relationship, clearly he isn't into a bar scene or anything like that and I'm sure he likes you. It's just that he isn't making the effort to turn you into a long term proper relationship. His wanting to spend time with you isn't significant proof that he wants you to be something serious, you only met about 3 months ago after all. Of course he is keen.

 

I don't know how wealthy he is or how much debt he has, etc. but from your posts I wasn't getting the impression that he was doing all to stay around in your city. He seemed to be pretty ready to move somewhere that's 6 hours away. Yes I know the economy is difficult and that he has liabilities, he is a successful businessman etc but I also know what men are capable of when they want a woman. They move continents and start over.

 

I hope I'm wrong but I don't think so. I think he has accepted that this relationship has run its course and he isn't fighting for it, he is just sticking around as long as he can. Ironically, if he was into it that much more, he would struggle seeing you knowing it will be an LDR soon and he would have his emotional doubts over it. He is content how things are because he doesn't want anything more.

 

Like I said I hope I'm wrong but he isn't really working for this in my opinion.

[Chocolat]

Ruby, if you're going to stick with it, then give it your all. Yes, your heart could be broken, but there's no such thing as a half-way love affair.

 

Personally, this sounds like an awful lot of work just for sex. Not saying you aren't a goddess in bed and all that, but there's too much angst here for a guy who only wants to score. So I'm assuming he has feelings on the line. As you do.

 

Enjoy it - there are some benefits to a LDR (like hot, hot, sex!).

[Babolat]

If he were so resistant and not invested, don't you think he would have taken any of the dozen or more opportunities I've given him to walk out the door?

 

I am him. I have tried to end it two times with my gf. The next day I miss her and then minimize the major red flag with us; one where she states she wants to change, she has changed over the past 10 years, will continue to change, though she will not change for me and I should not wait for her to change. I agree with her.

 

I think I am hanging in there for:

 

- companionship - we get along very well

- I do have strong feelings for her. This weekend she fell asleep next to me on the couch and I was staring at her thinking how beautiful she is. Next day we were at the coffee shop and I found myself just gazing at her. When I can lift the veil if you will, there is something wonderful there.

- sex, yes the sex is great

- I am attracted to her care free free spirit. All of my friends and family think she is great, think we are great and think she is good for me

- I stopped counseling recently (felt like a broken record after a while) though while I was in counseling my counselor thought she was good for me too

- I have issues I want to work on and she is helping me (without her knowing it).

- I guess I am waiting for the change to occur, which I know is foolish and I also know I will eventually get fed up and leave if I am not seeing signs of change

Edited September 24, 2012 by Babolat

[Ruby Slippers]

I'm going to respond to the latest questioning posts, and then no more. Like I said, I don't think that any more questioning at this point is helpful for me or the situation. Nature will run its course. I'm standing up for myself and what I want, making sure I get it.

 

Incidentally, I just got word today that I got this amazing house, and I'll be moving in on the 1st. This is going to be the nicest place I've ever lived by far, and I chose it because I need a very nice home office where I can meet with my clients. My boyfriend is the one who found this place for me. He took me to look at another house, and then recommended we just walk around my desired neighborhood and look for rental signs. That's how we found this one, and I had this strong feeling that this was the right place from the moment I saw it. I wouldn't have found it without him, and it is everything I was looking for and then some.

 

We have this funny way of anticipating each other's problems and needs, and easily coming up with ways to solve and meet them. I'm talking about mostly big practical stuff here. At several different points this weekend, he gave me a huge grin, said, "You're very smart," and thanked me for doing something similar for him in the new city - something he most likely would not have done on his own, but which came easily to me.

 

In his new town, we came across this really nice but affordable car that he had said before is the perfect car for my personality. And it really is. I asked him early on, because he's very into cars and ideally I'll get a car in the next year or two. It's gorgeous and practical, just a great value in a car. I've never thought a car was beautiful before, but this one is. We've watched videos on this car, and he's told me all about the engineering and so on. Once I got home last night and he called me, we were replaying the weekend. He said, "You need to test drive that car." I said it was too intimidating with the overbearing salespeople, and I can't afford to buy a car yet and don't want to be harassed by them in the meantime. But I did agree that it could be good motivation to work hard for the things I want and need. He said he'll take me to test drive it, he'll deal with the salesmen, and we'll just make up a phone number. I said it was very flattering that he chose such a beautiful, sporty, fun, high-quality car to fit me, and he said again that it's the perfect fit for me and my personality. In person, we were both in awe about how gorgeous and well-made it is. I have never had this reaction to a car in my life. haha

 

It's just that he isn't making the effort to turn you into a long term proper relationship. His wanting to spend time with you isn't significant proof that he wants you to be something serious, you only met about 3 months ago after all.

He said some interesting things this weekend. We both went to college in Texas, my home state, and he says he loves Texas and wants to settle down there eventually. He asked me if I would have moved with him if he got a job in Texas. He also kept asking me questions about houses as we were looking around the new town, what kind of house I want to settle down in. He told me it sounds like he and my dad think a lot alike. At one point, I was saying something about if things don't work out with us, and he stopped me and said, "I don't want to talk about that possibility. We're together. So let's be together." He agreed with me that we were both being kind of lazy and cynical when we first got together (and had sex right away), but we can acknowledge that fact and do better now.

 

He also told me that in his family and among friends, people know he's very discriminating and always ask him to help them pick the best option of several - from minor things to major. Even as a kid, he was the one to pick the fruit in the market. At restaurants, I usually let him order (and I have never let a man order for me), because somehow, he always knows what the best dishes are going to be. He considers numerous factors and will sometimes brainstorm about his decision and analyze all the factors out loud. He has this uncanny ability to make the top choice. He kept squeezing my thigh, hugging me, taking my hand, and saying things like, "I'll take THIS mango", "this is the one I want", (and cute variations of that), giving me a big grin.

 

Also, at a couple of points in the weekend, he said to me, "You look so happy", and "I love making you happy." And when I went into my quiet, distant mode a couple of times, he kept working on me until I was smiling again, and said, "I can't stand to see you sad."

 

I was also commenting on how nicely he dresses, and he said he has always been known as a dapper guy, and friends will ask him to help them when they need to get new clothes. He has a lot more money to spend on clothes than I do, and I'm only really beginning to invest in my wardrobe. I started with the business wardrobe, and now I'm working on stepping up the personal wardrobe. I told him that if he sees any particular clothing or anything that he really thinks would suit me, let me know and I'll get it. He said, "OK. But if I do, I'll just get it for you." He's already done this, in fact. He got me these amazing designer sandals for my birthday in July, and I wore them all summer long. They're the nicest pair of shoes I've ever worn, and they suited me perfectly.

 

At the same time, he told me that meeting me has made him realize he's gotten too materialistic and entrenched in the rat race. He clearly has this strong curiosity about bohemian/hippie/revolutionary philosophy and lifestyle, and he gets to play around with that with me. I told him I think it's great that he doesn't have to worry about things like paying for a root canal as I did a year ago, and he's worked very hard and it's good he's being rewarded for that. I've also said that I think it's perfectly fine to take care of all your material needs and be comfortable, as long as you are giving back in some way. If you're well off, you're very lucky, and I think it's the duty of well-to-do people to give back time or money to the society that has provided a framework for their success. He agrees with that, and says that's what he's drifted from.

 

I don't know how wealthy he is or how much debt he has, etc. but from your posts I wasn't getting the impression that he was doing all to stay around in your city. He seemed to be pretty ready to move somewhere that's 6 hours away. Yes I know the economy is difficult and that he has liabilities, he is a successful businessman etc but I also know what men are capable of when they want a woman. They move continents and start over.

His reasons are completely valid. It's a huge promotion for him and a natural next step in his career. I've talked to all my friends, my mom, my counselor about his reasoning, and every single one of them said they agree he is making the right move at this time. I'm not going to get into the details of why, but I understand and don't take that personally. Given the circumstances, he would have accepted that job and moved even if he were married with kids. Making a good living and dominating in his career has been the top goal he's been working toward since college. And he's doing it very well. He has explained to me that that's because he wants to provide for himself and his family without any problem. Though his path is different from mine, I really respect how strong and focused he's been, and I would never want to stand in the way of that. If he had passed up this opportunity to stay in one place with a girl he'd only been dating for 2 1/2 months - well, he would be a totally different guy, and not the guy I respect and admire so much.

 

Several times, he's told me about a friend of his who works in New York during the week and drives home to his family about 5 hours away every weekend. He said they've been doing this for years, and it works for them. I told him that something like this would not work for me long-term, and this weekend he said he's going to keep looking in Chicago, and aim to stay in the other city no longer than 6 months. He said he can't make any guarantees about that, but that's what he's thinking right now.

 

I hope I'm wrong but I don't think so. I think he has accepted that this relationship has run its course and he isn't fighting for it, he is just sticking around as long as he can.

That doesn't seem to be the case at all. If it were, he would have said his good-byes and blew out of here. But he has been consistent in saying he wants us to stay together. I've tried to bail on that at least a dozen times, and every time, he's asked me to stay with him and get through this transition, because things will get better. He's already made a tentative plan for visiting me next weekend, and he reminded me that we've planned visits for the next month on our calendars. Anytime I try to wiggle around on that, he says, "But we made a plan. Let's stick to the plan."

 

Ironically, if he was into it that much more, he would struggle seeing you knowing it will be an LDR soon and he would have his emotional doubts over it.

He has struggled, at a few different times. During one of them, he said he didn't really anticipate what a big deal this was going to be for us until it was right in front of him. Remember, he's never had a serious relationship, and certainly not a long-distance one. Once we were in the new city, he expressed similar thoughts a few times.

 

Ruby, if you're going to stick with it, then give it your all. Yes, your heart could be broken, but there's no such thing as a half-way love affair.

 

Personally, this sounds like an awful lot of work just for sex. Not saying you aren't a goddess in bed and all that, but there's too much angst here for a guy who only wants to score. So I'm assuming he has feelings on the line. As you do.

 

Enjoy it - there are some benefits to a LDR (like hot, hot, sex!).

I agree. This is a ridiculous amount of work for just sex. And yeah, I'm good, but nobody is THAT good.

 

I think he has some feelings, sure, but even more than that, I think he sees what a good match we are and how much we're helping each other grow. And it's not just in some touchy-feely way. Like I said, we both offer smart, practical advice and tangible support that rounds out the other person. I wouldn't have found this gorgeous house in my perfect neighborhood without his help. I already know that this is going to have a profoundly positive effect on my company's bottom line, which is my major life goal right now. It's also just going to be a pleasure for me to live there. I am so excited. I know he has a few similar examples of ways I've helped him. Several times over the weekend, he said "you're wonderful", "you're amazing", "you're very smart", "I never would have thought about this, and you saved me so much trouble", "you think of everything", etc.

 

- I guess I am waiting for the change to occur, which I know is foolish and I also know I will eventually get fed up and leave if I am not seeing signs of change

I think denise had a really smart post above about being clear with myself about what I really need here. Though I like emotionally expressiveness and romance, I am flexible in how I get that. This guy only expressed himself verbally and emotionally a handful of times over the weekend. But when he did, it was sincere. And what did he do several dozen times? He took charge of practical situations, provided for my comfort and happiness, took care of things so I didn't have to worry, cemented plans for future visits, texted and called me several times during my journey back home, stayed up till midnight before his first day at the new job talking to me, told me he will call me tonight to talk about his first day.

 

God, I've written a book.

 

No more questioning in this thread, though. It's not useful at this point.

 

Back to work, so I can afford this beautiful house and keep up the good momentum

[Ruby Slippers]

Just a little update: things are better than ever, and I feel very happy and blessed

 

We've visited every weekend since he moved, and he's now coming to me more often - because we agree it's more fun and we both like this city more than his new one. He's also been great about getting out of the office a little early on Friday, and even though I said I totally understand and it wouldn't bother me, he's refused to take any work calls over the weekend that would interrupt our time together. He's also tried to take Friday off and come here a day early, though that hasn't happened yet. He's the boss, and he's only been there for a short time, so they want him at all the meetings, events, and so on. But he has flatly refused to work on the weekends, told the people at work about me and his frequent travel to Chicago, and defended our weekend time together - which is awesome.

 

He's opening up on absolutely everything, and it's all clicking into place - emotionally, practically, sexually. It really does just keep getting better. When I recently admitted that I'm sometimes a bit insecure because he's so amazing and has so many options, he said, "I don't want to be with anyone else. You're the best person I know."

 

Things were so good this weekend that I just felt like I was dreaming. We were both grinning and laughing like fools all weekend long. He seems like this hero dream guy, and sometimes it's hard to believe this is really happening. But it is.

 

The same thing is happening with my business. Demand for my company's services is huge right now, and we can't keep up, so we're hiring and expanding. I just moved into this amazing new house, and I need new furniture and trimmings to make the home office really nice. He's been helping me with all of the practical demands of this, driving me all over town to pick stuff up, taking me shopping for stylish winter clothes, discussing all the new demands and how to handle them. I could do all this without him - but he sure does make it easier. Being with him pushes me to BRING IT, and I just keep surprising myself with how well I'm doing.

[serial muse]

Just a little update: things are better than ever, and I feel very happy and blessed

 

We've visited every weekend since he moved, and he's now coming to me more often - because we agree it's more fun and we both like this city more than his new one. He's also been great about getting out of the office a little early on Friday, and even though I said I totally understand and it wouldn't bother me, he's refused to take any work calls over the weekend that would interrupt our time together. He's also tried to take Friday off and come here a day early, though that hasn't happened yet. He's the boss, and he's only been there for a short time, so they want him at all the meetings, events, and so on. But he has flatly refused to work on the weekends, told the people at work about me and his frequent travel to Chicago, and defended our weekend time together - which is awesome.

 

He's opening up on absolutely everything, and it's all clicking into place - emotionally, practically, sexually. It really does just keep getting better. When I recently admitted that I'm sometimes a bit insecure because he's so amazing and has so many options, he said, "I don't want to be with anyone else. You're the best person I know."

 

Things were so good this weekend that I just felt like I was dreaming. We were both grinning and laughing like fools all weekend long. He seems like this hero dream guy, and sometimes it's hard to believe this is really happening. But it is.

 

The same thing is happening with my business. Demand for my company's services is huge right now, and we can't keep up, so we're hiring and expanding. I just moved into this amazing new house, and I need new furniture and trimmings to make the home office really nice. He's been helping me with all of the practical demands of this, driving me all over town to pick stuff up, taking me shopping for stylish winter clothes, discussing all the new demands and how to handle them. I could do all this without him - but he sure does make it easier. Being with him pushes me to BRING IT, and I just keep surprising myself with how well I'm doing.

 

So happy to hear!

[Chocolat]

Awesome!

 

This brought a huge smile to my face. So happy for you, Ruby!