Fitz Posted July 31, 2012 Posted July 31, 2012 It also has the added bonus right now where if it is real I know we will be together. Knowing that we could be together if I was not competing with time and the stages in life we are both at is ok with me. If he is lying to me still I did dodge the bullet because we are at different stages in live. That doesnt mean our love was or wasnt real and thats my truth. thats what i got from closure. So let me guess: he's older than you? 10 years? 20? ps -I'd argue that fundamentally you aren't competing with time and life stages so much as you are competing against his wife. I suspect that if his wife (and kids) died in a plane crash that you'd be together immediately -as morbid as that may sound. pps I agree: if it is real -then you will find a way to be together. But I also believe that real love doesn't hide in the shadows. And real love won't make you a coward. So based on what you've told us, I believe your MM can only be one of two things: either a liar or a coward. And so I don't see much of a future between the two of you until he undergoes a change in his character. That being said, I do hope that you find happiness and find someone who isn't afraid to openly love you -with no strings attached. And I do thank you for sharing your story.
Author ChynaDoll Posted July 31, 2012 Author Posted July 31, 2012 So let me guess: he's older than you? 10 years? 20? We are less than 2 years apart. ps -I'd argue that fundamentally you aren't competing with time and life stages so much as you are competing against his wife. I suspect that if his wife (and kids) died in a plane crash that you'd be together immediately -as morbid as that may sound. I understand your point. This point can be argued many ways. I say right now we are in different stages in life. He's married, I'm still traumatized from my previous relationships so I dodged the bullet. I know he loves me and loving me does not automatically make him stop loving his wife. I could also argue that his wife is competing with me and she is not enough to keep him from doing this. Although I am not ready if she put him out today i would still be with him and give it a shot because we already have started. A new love that can give me everything i deserve without him going through a major life change FOR me is out there, but I am not ready and will channel the love energy created between he and I to improve my life for myself and my children. Knowing the love was real is simply helping me cope. pps I agree: if it is real -then you will find a way to be together. But I also believe that real love doesn't hide in the shadows. I agree which is why I felt the way I did when he told her. It would of meant alot more if he told her willingly and not by me pulling the if you dont tell her I very well may if I need to card. And real love won't make you a coward. I felt like real love gave him courage to come clean. Even for him to come clean is a big step. I never thought the day would come where he would basically tell on himself. What I saw as audacity I see as courage inspired by our love. It is also clear he has some cowardly ways and major flaws for this affair to ever occur, AS DO I. I'm focusing on me. I'm not expecting his love for me and possibly for his family to be enough to REVERSE those flaws. We will see how his marriage turns out. I am still glad I dodged the bullet on that one because I'm really not ready and credit OUR love as some type of awesome force. It could also just be that he is a true coward and he knew it was his best shot to keep her and his family. Either way I do respect the allegiance he has to his wife and kids who are innocent and do not deserve for him to turn his back on them whether he found the love of his life in me or if he found something he REALLY REALLY likes or if he found his soul mate. I know what he and I had was real. I also know he did tell her because he informed me last night she is giving him hell because she wants to speak with me. However he asked me to cover for him which tells me he is truly a coward and he wants me to be more of a woman with him. I believe everything i still do about our love, and was hoping he used that energy for good not evil by coming clean but I also know it is true he has not learned his lesson as much as everything that is on the line and he still isnt 100% honest. I will find happiness with or without him and will be happy either way... thats what closure did for me.
Author ChynaDoll Posted July 31, 2012 Author Posted July 31, 2012 You're basing the real love on the knowledge that he actually told his wife, though aren't you? Since you have no knowledge of that other than what he said, how can you be sure it's true? His W supposedly wants to speak with you, so I reckon the way to find out is to talk to her and speak the truth without covering for the mm. Then see if you're still feelin the love. Maybe that's what you're afraid of? Finding out that things weren't the way you thought? You seem to be grasping at straws. Like getting over a fear of horses by convincing yourself that they are really unicorns without wings. Whatever works for you. I agree with you to a certain extent. I know he's told her. I can bet $ she and I will speak in the future. I'm certainly not afraid of what I'm feeling. I've already accepted the fact that he may still be a sham. Whether he is or he is not is irrevelant unless we spend a life together which I have accepted is VERY VERY unlikely. I dont know why him and his W are fighting so hard for a marriage where both parties are clear WHO we wants. I dont care. If he wants to spend his life paying his wife back for his betrayal instead of being truly happy with me that is his loss in my opinion. I'm not basing my future and happiness on the fate of their marriage. I am on the right track to healing myself and will be happy regardless.
Author ChynaDoll Posted July 31, 2012 Author Posted July 31, 2012 (edited) Chyna, the more you post the less I believe he told her, especially the latest above. He asked you to cover for him............why ask you to cover if he is so damn honest? To me, that says they had a d day and he lied his ass off. Think..........chyna, why ask you to cover if he was truthful, that makes no sense at all. Even your own posts have many contradictions, he didn't lie, maybe he lied, he told her the truth, maybe he didn't, etc. For you, everything seems to be wrapped up in your need to believe that he did love you, all these posts and how you mention it so many times. I'm worried about you, so many posts and what seems to be a highly unusual need to convince yourself he loved you. Are you going to be alright if you find out he lied to you, lied to her? Are you going to fall apart if you find things aren't the way you think they are? I KNOW things are not the way I think they are and I am coping right now or overplaying the 'love' part. I realized that when the romeo/juliet thing was mentioned. I dont know how that story turned out but i know it is a fairy tale and my mind was far from it. I know he loved me. Thats good enough. Even if he never loved me, it won't break me. I've been through too much to let that happen but anything is possible when a person is already beat up and weak. It is my responsibility to see myself through this and discover why i put myself here. That is my lesson and truth. I am also confident at this point that whatever happens is what will happen and as long as I stop messing up and crossing boundaries i should have never crossed I will be safe. He can continue messing up or not. If he gets it together good, if he does not oh well. I will be ok regardless as long as Chyna stops messing up. I acknowledge I do not have all the answers and facts about his 'other' or should i say 'real' life and whether she knows or not. I DONT CARE! (not yelling at any of you just stating with confidence it is insignificant to my plan.) My truth will evolve as time goes on and things evolve. I'm not putting my on $$ this mm, he doesnt deserve me to since he did not choose me. him and his W and whether she knows who she is married to and if he will take the actions he needs to be truly happy is not critical to my future and self discovery / improvement. I know that. I may sound like a lunatic but I also know that he truly loves me, showed me that during closure. I could of said what I needed to without being so lengthy but part of the reason I am ok right now is that I letting how I feel out, to him, to my friends, to my family, to LS and the world because I cant do this alone. I can go on for days on what I think of my mm and why he is doing / did this. The fact of the matter is our love or his fear moved him to confess to his W. He is going to have to pay for the rest of his life for his betrayal if he / she chooses to stay. He makes it seem like his W runs him and he has no backbone to tell her no. Alot of men think if they tell their kids mom no it is telling their kid NO. I recently learned before dday he has a problem telling me no. I've realized I have a problem asking for what I want so him and I clicked. I know i dont have proof proof. I only have my gut that I've already started listening to. Whatever my gut tells me, I ASK THE RIGHT QUESTIONS to confirm and it has been working for me so far. Usually i tell my gut to sshhhh and I BELIEVE WHAT I WANT TO so i can do what i want. Based on the toll i can see the stress he is under taking on his body and the way he looked after he said he told her, i know he told her. He said he's been telling her everything. My gut did not trust his words so I started asking questions. Did you tell her this, did you tell her that, and he would give me natural responses you would get from a woman in her state that he is not clever enough to devise on his own. Then i asked him did you tell her about xyz , and he said 'i dont even know if i have it'. I started to explain how he would know then I realized what he accidentally told me he as he is still sleeping with his wife. smh @ his unsuspecting wife. I will tell all. He knows I will tell all, and has been being as honest as he is capable of being. I do think it is huge that this serial cheater basically told on himself I am the 3rd affair she knows of. I am the 4th. I understand he is not perfect, and although he is still messing up I have already decided not to worry about him and his W cuz I am moving on. Lets see if by the time i'm ready for Mr. Right he will still fit the bill. I already know the way he is now needs some work, as do I so we shouldnt be together right now anyway. I've also raised my standards since he and I were together so for us to work he has to do some work on himself at the bare minimum which is no longer an acceptable standard for me, I would have to be the only woman in the picture. I'm not going to settle for anything less than what I deserve and that gives me confidence and relief when I analyze this situation. (If what I think in my OP is true, thats cool too lol) I'm good either way because my happiness is independent of this situation. Edited July 31, 2012 by ChynaDoll
nofool4u Posted July 31, 2012 Posted July 31, 2012 I now know my flawed thinking, excuse making and ignorace enabled me to cross a boundry that led me to THIS. Our affair lasted exactly 7 months. I dont know off hand the signifcance of the number 7, but I know that number has a special meaning just like I know the bond we created during our affair has a special meaning in my life. I've always known mainly b/c of you guys that I could never replace his wife and he will never leave her to be with me which was not my goal. My initial goal was fun and based on selfishness. I decided to NOT quit while I was ahead becase I was having so much fun. I didnt care who got hurt as long as it wasnt me. I'm hurting and suffering now due to my actions and I've accepted that. What I've gotten out of this affair and the impact it has had on my life has made this experience almot indescribeable but I'm going to try. This post is helping me to document and gather my thoughts. It is helping me to vent, and has the added benefit of feedback from people that have walked in my shoes. The words of Miss Bee and others on here that real love is tangible and not hidden and that love is as love does is it is the action that speaks loudest. Actions do not lie. This LS advice has been resonating in my mind every single day for months and I've used it to play my cards. The affairs Dday was on Friday (2 days ago). Today was MY dday. His family went out of town for the entire month of july. We both had seperate lives still and could not spend every minute together but we spent every minute together we possibly could without him having to go home because he loved me. The time he was able to spend with me without any limitations except him having to check in in the evenings for a few hours on weekdays, spoiled me and changed me. He came home to me. He came home from work and was waiting for me in my bed everyday. He was able to help me out with my kids. He did everything he could and was able to to show me love. Him being able to do for me with almost no limitations showed me exactly what I was missing, deserve, and entitled to. He showed me what it was like to be #1. I already knew what it was like to NOT be the other woman and be with a man that didnt have to lie to be with me, but I never knew what it was like to be treated as a queen. I knew I only got a taste of what it is like to be treated as a queen because this is still a secret affair. That taste I am calling OUR love. This entire experience has been shaped by our love so which has renewed my commitment to myself to be a better woman and stop messing up. I was jaded and could only remember being abused, beat, cheated on, taken advantage of, abandoned and used. I hade a wall up. He broke my wall, i fell in love with him, and experienced REAL LOVE. Lots of pain, but lots of love. He insisted on breaking that wall possibly to stroke his ego but I still believe it is our love that stroked his ego and that is what I am focusing on to get through this break up. Our love was a good thing, its a good thing and has caused us to be true to ourselves. The affair was wrong in SO many ways but our love was bigger than the lies and deception and it showed. This love gave us both what may seem to you all like audacity I see as courage created by the bond and chemistry we have had since day 1. I experienced a love that gave me the courage to demand what I want, and stop lying to myself. I am now looking at our love as the catalyst that gave me the strength to demand more for myself. This is huge for me. I used to be a very passive person. He was a liar. Our love gave him the strength to tell her he was in love with me and that he is not in love with her, has been lying to her and has been living a double life. Not because he wanted to leave her but because he wanted to do the right thing. He didnt want her to have to hear it from me. I told him I will do it myself so that the truth can be out and I can move on. I was going to tell her because I did not want her to find out 3 years from now and I get dragged back into this after I've moved on. I didnt think he truly loved me since he was choosing her. I didnt think he truly loved her because I was in the picture and the BS in me wanted her to know. I also knew he could cut me off and potentially not have any consequences if he didnt tell her and I felt like his audacity needed to be checked and since I couldnt do it I would expose him and force him to answer to his wife. I felt taken advantage of and that he had to answer to his wife if he wasnt going to answer to me since it will be a lie anyway. This is what OUR love caused me to do, I was passionate about it, and I fought for it. I fought for what I wanted and did not submit to his plan hoping he will change his mind. He told his W two days ago. I started confessing to everyone I have been lying to that my BF is married and I have been lying. The love he showed me in July and over the past 7 months taught me I can love again. It taught me to demand what I want. It taught me that men sometimes have to be told what to do and its ok, but there has to be a balance. It taught me that I have SERIOUS issues, boundry problems, a tendency to avoid confrontation, and am that I need not allow any man no matter how in love I am with him to hurt me. He may hurt me unintentionally because men are from venus, but once he is made aware if it is REAL love he will stop and it is my responsibility to not be passive speak my mind. The love and pain i experienced taught me to demand what I want and not leave things to chance and overcompensate with hope. This is common sense for many situations, but not when it comes to love for me. Once I begin a sexual relationship with a man, my judgemet gets clouded. Sex for me releases endorphins that bonds me that person and it starts after the FIRST time for me. I am a very emotional person. I give all of myself to a man whether he deserves it or not just based on my own delusions, excuses and HOPE. I turn crumbs into loaves because I dont know if I am worthy of loaves perhaps? This may be common sense to many of you but not for me and our love has made me want to be better and find out why. I did not think it was possible for me to experience this breakthrough without sharing what i shared with my mm. When July started to come to an end, and it was time for him to leave for an even shorter amount of time he was gone for initially to drop them off, I started having a hard time. The lies were getting out of hand. The reality of seeing the "home" he has made clear from the beginnig he was not AT ALL interested in disrupting or breaking to be with me made me realize our selfishness and greed had taken over. I could see him RESUMING to consider my feelings less and tend to his responsibilities at the house more because its almost time to pick up the family. One week before its time for his departure, it popped into my head to end the affair when he goes back to his family because it will hurt ALMOST as much anyway. I knew I would need to find a reason besides the obvious to end the affair and this should be it. We knew we couldnt handle NC. We cried and cried up until his departure together as we were trying to hold onto our last days. i poured my soul out to him selfishly and secretly hoping he would choose me. He didnt choose me in the end but he chose to protect our love and my love for him and come clean and stop hurting me by keeping me a secret. I normally have a wall up, and do not let anybody see in. I started to get very angry and jealous, but he held his ground and made it clear in many other ways he will NEVER leave his wife. I thought he loved her more than me and I let him know every chance I got. I started to resent him for breaking my wall of defense if he had no intentions on leaving his wife. His lies started to repulse me. My lies to my family and friends as I pranced him around like my BF started to repulse me. My disregard for his wife and their newborn started to bother me. The pain our love has caused I do not regret because it brought out the best in us in the end. Nothing besides losing a loved one hurt more than this. Our love had that type of energy. Our love is so strong, this is how bad it hurts when you try to break it. I experienced a love so powerful it gave us both the strength to come clean. It was so strong it made him face losing his life as he knows it. It has made me look into the mirror long and hard all day for the past two weeks and commit to stopping dating right now until I face every issue that has caused me to fall in love with a mm. Our love was THAT strong and is life changing to me. I tried to break up with him via text, he chose to come to my house this morning in the wake of this Dday, tell his wife he was coming to my house for closure. He gave me the truth in person and we both got closure. He finally admitted what he felt for me was the same I felt for him. That what we experienced was like no other. That he wasnt really happy in his marriage but he cannot be happy in life if he doesnt give his marriage and family a fair shot by coming clean. We showed eachother our raw emotions today during our closure session. We hugged, talked, cried and sobbed for three hours and gave each other the strength to walk away from a situation that breeds confusion and deceit. I can tell by his emotions, actions, our discussion today and in my gut that he TRULY loves me. He fought for me by coming to see me to get closure and to give closure. He knew his W was timing him but did not leave me until we were able to close properly. I even offered to continue the affair on slightly different terms and worry about breaking up later. (I know was a moment of weakness but he was strong for me.) He declined saying "no more lies". This was the first time I did not feel rejected. He didnt tell me nor did i hear "no i dont want to be with you" which is what I was hearing before. I heard I am not going to lie to be with you. I know if he wasnt married he will be with me. I know that if his wife leaves him we are going to be together. I know that I am not ready for Mr. Right, I am committed to get answers from myself. This experience (the good and bad) that has our love written all over will make me be a better woman. It has set a new standard for both him and I and we will not settle for anything less than what we shared. After our closure session today I see OUR love not as something that I am losing. I see it as a life changing energy that brought out the best and worst in us and that we will both use as motivation to live our lives to the fullest and not settle. He left me with a vision and standard of how I want my love life to be (the good parts not the bad). I see our love as a tangible energy that has renewed each of us in its own way and as a now constant driving force that will help us to strive for true happiness. I dont see myself at a loss. I dont see our love destroyed or passed over. I see it as a powerful energy force that has made us be true to ourselves and ofcourse each other. Our love came first today, it gave me closure, and is now a standard of what we will strive for in our 'real' lives. There were lies, there was deception and alot of wrong doing. We both recognize we have and will ALWAYS carry a love that is greater than that type of situation. That is my new standard and is symbolized by "our love". Our love which is now my standard will motivate me to be a better woman and be prepare myself for Mr. Right when he shows up. I have converted my experience to a commitment to change, self awareness and improvement. We are both going to do some fixing in our lives because of "our love". I know there is the possibility that he may not have told his wife anything about me and this may be a tactic to avoid me having to tell her. I believe in my soul he told her in order to protect her from hearing it from me instead. I know he told her to give himself the best shot at saving his marriage AND because he wants both the women in his life to know the truth. I am so proud of him for having the courage. I am giving our love experience the credit for giving him to the courage to be honest. The truth is he is in love with me, but he still loves her and has legal and moral ties to her. I'm proud of myself for being so positive and self aware. This is MY truth. What I am taking away from this is that our love brought out our best and worst and will continue to bring out our best and a commitment for us both to change our lying deceitful ways. It is not impossible for our love to be even greater than this affair and for us to be together one day. It is possible for him to fall in love again with his wife and for them to not get a D and I'm finally ok with that after two weeks of grieving him not choosing me. Now I am happy that he chose me and I chose him, we experienced this together and we will both always carry this love. That love we carry I know in my soul and it will live on and inspire us whether we r together or apart. He left me with the most priceless, wonderful gift he could of ever left me with: closure. What happened to the idea that you just wanted to have fun with him for a while, and only wanted him as a friends with benefits? Oh, and he didn't tell his wife jack. He told you he did so you wouldn't have a reason to contact her and rat him out. 1
nofool4u Posted July 31, 2012 Posted July 31, 2012 So your MM told you that he had a planned "Dday" and claims he told his that he was in love with you? AND you told him you were going to out your affair to his wife? This guy didn't say a word to his wife about you. He's only telling you he had a Dday because you pose a threat to his real life. And based on your initial post in this thread (which comes off as very delusional), he KNEW you were going to be (or eventually be) a threat. That "Dday" he told you about never happened - he was merely doing damage control with you so you don't rat him out to his wife and get even further obsessed with him. He wasn't doing anything to "protect your love." He's only protecting HIMSELF from having a real Dday. His wife knows nothing about you. Lets not forget from her first thread, she didn't care that she was hurting the wife. She just wanted to have no strings fun for as long as it would last. That being the case why would she really care if the wife knew the truth? What is it about, mainly, women, that love the ride, but once it starts coming to and end, only THEN they think the wife deserves to know the truth?? 1
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