nofool4u Posted July 16, 2012 Posted July 16, 2012 I'm sorry I am not strong enough but I want this man. Why? There is nothing about him that is appealing. He is a cheater and a liar. It must be good looks or a huge member is all I can think of.
Author rosieisblue Posted July 16, 2012 Author Posted July 16, 2012 Why? There is nothing about him that is appealing. He is a cheater and a liar. It must be good looks or a huge member is all I can think of. He is very good looking, sex is good, he treats me like a queen and he is charming as anything. But now all this other stuff.
Author rosieisblue Posted July 16, 2012 Author Posted July 16, 2012 Yes he does need you. If you're out of the picture, then his wife wins. He will do WHATEVER it takes to keep you because he needs to save face with everyone, but especially his wife. You don't realize it yet, but he's looking to marry you as soon as possible to really stick the knife in his wife's back. That's one of the reasons why he's so desperate to get his kids to like you. But he doesn't care what his wife thinks, he's made that very clear to her and to everyone. She doesn't care what he thinks, either. They're very much done so she's not important to him anymore. I don't think we'll get married right away, although we have talked about a future togethr, living together.
Author rosieisblue Posted July 16, 2012 Author Posted July 16, 2012 Oh Rosie - yes he does. Why do you say that? He can't stand her. Can't even talk to her or be in the same room with her. They communicate only by email and sometimes text.
nofool4u Posted July 16, 2012 Posted July 16, 2012 That's what it keeps coming back to: them thinking I broke up the family. I had a part but it was a much bigger thing than me, namely a broken marriage hobbling along for a long time. Thats always the excuse isn't it? "a broken marriage". A broken marriage, too many times, is one spouse getting bored with married life, the trials of raising a family, and simply like the thrill of bedding down someone new. He doesn't have those responsibilities with you, not to mention the newness is thrilling to him. Don't expect a 7 year itch not to happen in your situation too. That being said, don't fool yourself into thinking it was simply "a broken marriage". I think more times than not its one spouse getting bored.
IfWishesWereHorses Posted July 16, 2012 Posted July 16, 2012 He can't stand her because she knows who he is! Idealize, devalue and discard! That's how they operate! It never changes, it's what you are signing up for and what everyone is warning you about. It's very rare around here that everyone gives the same advice, so take that for what it's worth. Rosie, didn't this man have inappropriate relationships with his wife's friends? You think that was about the friends? No! It was about power and control and devaluing his wife! 1
nofool4u Posted July 16, 2012 Posted July 16, 2012 He is very good looking, sex is good, he treats me like a queen and he is charming as anything. Well of course. How else is he going to get a woman in bed? Question is, do you think this charming and treating you like a queen is going to last once you are the same old person he has been with for a while? So it is the looks and the sex. Why have women lowered their standards to accept someone who is a cheater and liar as long as they look good and the sex is good?
snowflakes88 Posted July 16, 2012 Posted July 16, 2012 He absolutely cares what his wife thinks. If he didn't, she wouldn't have the power to make him angry. He'd be totally indifferent - that's the mark of someone who doesn't care. Again, he didn't leave her, no matter how much you want to believe he was "on his way out." She booted him out, and I guarantee you he doesn't like it. 2
Artie Lang Posted July 16, 2012 Posted July 16, 2012 of course he's gonna want to snatch you up right away. he gets to flaunt a new young wife. you're wasting your young life on a 40-year-old man.....what a shame. then you mention his past affairs. i guess you're ok being just another conquest, huh. 1
MissBee Posted July 16, 2012 Posted July 16, 2012 (edited) He is very good looking, sex is good, he treats me like a queen and he is charming as anything. But now all this other stuff. Wow... Sorry rosie but none of what you like about him is of substance. I was reading a study they did on the longevity of relationships and basically the couples, who when asked what they liked about their partner listed looks and sex off the cuff in the top 5 things, did not last long at all, as their relationship was built on shallow premises. While the couples that lasted listed important qualities that are about the person's character and personality even. Everytime you talk about MM and your relationship all you talk about is how much fun you guys have, how you need a fun hour with the kids, how you play games and work out...in your defense of what is so great about him, not one single thing is about his character, the first two are his looks and sex and the rest are other things that are as equally unimportant. Any creep can be charming..psychopaths are charming. So what? I'm not trying to be mean or rude...but your MM as everyone else notices seems very immature and his relationship with you seems to be one perfect for some old immature guy in a midlife crisis. You don't seem to demand much and instead of having to be a responsible, adult, who builds a relationship on solid stuff...he just gets to have a gf who mostly cares that he is sexy, likes sex and is fun. But aside from that, what do you two really have? I think given the kids and other drama, plus the fact that it doesn't seem like this relationship is built on substance...in a year or two you won't have to worry about any of this at all. I may be wrong, but for now, I suggest you give it at least a year, leave the kids out of it and see how the relationship has progressed by this time next year. I doubt you and MM will be happily in a solid relationship 5 years from now frankly...but for now, you are smitten with him, so enjoy it and see how it progresses after a year at least. Edited July 16, 2012 by MissBee 3
Emme Posted July 16, 2012 Posted July 16, 2012 Rosie you are an adult. That means you are in control over your life. No one else can be held responsible but you. At this stage in the relationship you are not the number one priority. The children are. In their eyes you have the cooties. They don't want to be around you at all. It's normal. Let them experience the emotions. You are too invested in something that at this point is none of your concern. The marriage is at an end and both parents have to do what's necessary to make the transition easier for them. Don't make this about you or your MM. They may never want to meet you and that is their choice. What should be your concern is this relationship you are invested in and how it's going to work. Let him and his soon to be ex handle what will happen with the kids. 2
beachbabe82 Posted July 16, 2012 Posted July 16, 2012 Oh Rosie girl, You are so in love you don't see what everyone here sees. He used his kid! He ambushed his kid! What kind of father does that? Why can't you 2 stop being in contact 24/7 when he is with his kids? Are you both so needy that those kids can't have 1-1 time with the dad. That's sick! The best things for those kiddos is the mom to take them and move far away. They need a real dad I their life and I hope she meets a guy who will be an awesome step dad to those kids. You can't wait a year and keep wanting to shove yourself at those kids. Don't you get how selfish that is? Do you expect those kids to care about you when they can't even spend time with him wiout YOU always texting or calling?'!! Leave them alone. I hope there mom can protect them from you and him. You think those kids NEED to know you are sleeping with their dad??? Geesh. I'm so glad Billy is a real man who does all he can to protect his kids. Very different from the Married man you are 'in love' with. FYI - love isn't needing nor smothering. 1
ac11442 Posted July 16, 2012 Posted July 16, 2012 Rosie, Please correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't his son threaten to kill your kids and call you a bad name? If you are not the one then please accept my apologies and ignore my comments below: You really should be running, yes running in the opposite direction. His kid is disturbed and he has serious parenting issues if he can't control his kids. Aren't you worried about YOUR kids? These types of threats should not be taken lightly. If he has done some of the things you say he has done, I would not underestimate he capability of doing whatever is necessary to keep YOU out of the picture. His parents have already instilled in him that there are no consequences for his actions. If you are still determined to stay then you need to accept EVERYTHING and I mean EVERYTHING he brings to the table and that includes his kids, and his kids disdain for you. They may OR may not get over this, you have to accept this. If your MM really loved you he wouldn't put this type of requirement on the relationship. Nope, that was me. And we are 40 days into no contact. I never wanted my xMM to leave his wife and be with me, I was perfectly content with the affair. Sad but true, I have my own issues. But yes, the issues with his son were horrible and yes, I did worry every time we were found out that his son would show up at my doorstep. I conveyed this to xMM several times and he took a very passive stance (people who have multiple affairs with only excuses as to why they 'can't' leave their marriage are innately spineless, we know this). I think that is why I have managed to stick to NC this time. He told me his w told the kids about finding out about me...again. I asked about how his son reacted and he said he was pissed. I figured. When I asked if it was mentioned to come to my home he said yes, his son had brought it up several times. I told him he needed to step up, be a man, be a FATHER, and put his foot down period end of story. He said he would talk to the boy and 'see if it will do any good'. That really hacked me off. Especially since I know part of the reason he won't do it is because if he forbids it that will mean he's protecting me which will put him in a bad light with his marriage and his kids. So if he can care that little for me, be willing to literally put me and, even worse, my children in harms way, be that worried about himself and his state of affairs (pardon the pun) then he never cared enough about me for me to pine over him. Phew! Glad I got that out. I am glad to see that someone else thinks that behavior is just as nuts as I do, on the part of the kid AND his parents. I apologize to those reading this thread, it has nothing to do with the topic, I just wanted to address this since it was brought up. 1
jade4071 Posted July 17, 2012 Posted July 17, 2012 Talking about meeting the MM's kids early on in the OP.... Rosie....I'm in my 40's and my parents divorced when I was very young, 3 or so. As I found out many years later, my parents both cheated on one another and ended up divorced. Your MM's kids are obviously older than I was at the time of divorce but I can remember meeting very, very few of my dad's girlfriends during my childhood. My dad has since passed away but never remarried after divorcing my mom. I met and knew a GF of his that he was with for 8 years and another woman he dated after that relationship ended. My mom is on her 4th husband and dated others in between those marriages. My dad also dated quite a bit. FWIW, I 125% preferred my dad's approach to introducing me to his SO's. Definitely not right away and only with serious relationships, not women he just dated. My mom, who I lived with primarily, introduced me to people far too soon and it impacted me in the sense that I now have little respect for my mom. Of course, there are other issues that go along with that but aren't necessary to post here. I don't see any reason why it's necessary to rush into meeting your MM's kids. If you are intent on staying with him, take it slow. It may or may not improve things as it pertains to his kids not wanting to meet you right now. However, rushing into meeting them will only make things worse, IMHO. My mom pushing me into meeting her boyfriends/dates/whatevers only made me resent her behavior, and subsequently the person she was dating, even more. She and I are not that close and partly due to her choices in that regard. **Also, FWIW, I never liked my mom's third husband and they were together for almost 20 years, the longest relationship she was ever in. My dislike of him didn't make things easy for them while I was still at home but it certainly didn't stop them. It's doable, dealing with a kid who can't stand you, but not likely very enjoyable. 2
Got it Posted July 17, 2012 Posted July 17, 2012 Oh Rosie. . . I understand, I have had similar struggles. I am not going to comment on him, you know him better than us, but the WORST thing to do is rush it with the kids especially since there has been one meeting that didn't go well (and asking his child to lie was a very bad idea). In the scheme of things, if you guys have the rest of your lives together, a year is a blink of the eye. Honey, listen to your gut and follow it.
StripeyShirt Posted July 17, 2012 Posted July 17, 2012 Rosie, my partner and I have been together for three years, and he had separated from his marriage just prior to us meeting. He was married for a long time and had two teenaged daughters. One of the daughters was okay with me, but now no longer speaks to me once my partner and I and my kids moved in together. Once we saw how much the children were struggling with our situation - mine and his - we stopped living together and reassessed everything. We are still together, but not living together and he has focussed on trying to rebuild a relationship with his girls. The eldest hates me with every fibre of her being - just because I am not her mum and have ended any chance of her parents getting back together - and the youngest barely tolerates me. My partner and I are loving partners together on this. What he needs is time to strengthen his relationship with his daughters. Would he love me to have a relationship with them? - sure. But that is not our decision. Its theirs. And it will probably will never happen. So the next step is working how we work that one out. I dont know what shape that will take. Neither of us do, but we have all the time in the world to figure it out. But you know what? I love him enough to give him that space. And he loves me enough to give me and my kids space. We are strong enough to be patient and wait until either his kids can cope, or we can cope with the guilt if we decide to take our relationship further. (My kids are fine now, they are younger and we probably moved too fast for them. Plus, my ex-husband is supportive of my relationship with my partner, so my kids are well adjusted). If you are both in such a rush to sort this out and make it okay, then it says to me that you are insecure about the future of your relationship. And let me tell you - when my partner is with his kids, I never ever ever ever text or call or even email. And every time I give him space and room and love to be a father to his kids, he has more respect and love for me than the day before. 8
jade4071 Posted July 17, 2012 Posted July 17, 2012 Witnessing a divorce, cheating/deceit, OWs and OMs is tolerable at age 3 because at that age you cannot reason. What impact did all of this had on you as an adult? My post to Rosie was mostly regarding the impact of meeting a parent's significant other in a general sense and how my experiences in that regard impacted me, not necessarily as it pertains to cheating, etc. However, as I mentioned before, my mom is on her 4th marriage. All of her prior marriages ended in divorce and every last one of them due to adultery on both sides. For example, my mom's third husband left her for his HS sweetheart after 20 years of marriage. Earlier in the same marriage my mom cheated on him with someone she met on a trip thousands of miles away. My mom moved a lot when I was growing up and when I was 8yo we moved into a house next door to a family with two teen daughters. Within a year my mom was not only sleeping with the husband but he had also moved into my mom's house, right next door. He and his wife eventually divorced and while he and my mom never married, they were together a few years and it was a terrible situation. My mom didn't leave him because he was abusive to me, didn't leave him because he was abusive to animals, didn't leave him because his younger daughter was a horrible bully who needed a crap load of help, or because he was basically a sociopath.....she left him because she met a new guy, per the usual for her. The above is just one example. As a result of my childhood, I had enormous issues with trust and emotional intimacy. My first husband is dying due to health issues related to severe alcohol abuse. I've been happily remarried for 17 years to someone who does not have issues with addiction and who is trustworthy. So no, I don't recall my parents' divorce but the saga since has definitely had an impact. Sorry for the T/J.....back to Rosie's post.....
MissBee Posted July 17, 2012 Posted July 17, 2012 (edited) Rosie, my partner and I have been together for three years, and he had separated from his marriage just prior to us meeting. He was married for a long time and had two teenaged daughters. One of the daughters was okay with me, but now no longer speaks to me once my partner and I and my kids moved in together. Once we saw how much the children were struggling with our situation - mine and his - we stopped living together and reassessed everything. We are still together, but not living together and he has focussed on trying to rebuild a relationship with his girls. The eldest hates me with every fibre of her being - just because I am not her mum and have ended any chance of her parents getting back together - and the youngest barely tolerates me. My partner and I are loving partners together on this. What he needs is time to strengthen his relationship with his daughters. Would he love me to have a relationship with them? - sure. But that is not our decision. Its theirs. And it will probably will never happen. So the next step is working how we work that one out. I dont know what shape that will take. Neither of us do, but we have all the time in the world to figure it out. But you know what? I love him enough to give him that space. And he loves me enough to give me and my kids space. We are strong enough to be patient and wait until either his kids can cope, or we can cope with the guilt if we decide to take our relationship further. (My kids are fine now, they are younger and we probably moved too fast for them. Plus, my ex-husband is supportive of my relationship with my partner, so my kids are well adjusted). If you are both in such a rush to sort this out and make it okay, then it says to me that you are insecure about the future of your relationship. And let me tell you - when my partner is with his kids, I never ever ever ever text or call or even email. And every time I give him space and room and love to be a father to his kids, he has more respect and love for me than the day before. Great post Stripey! Your situations shows the realistic hardships that exist, and how mature adults, who are emotionally healthy and who care about their kids and prioritize them, handle things. When you're a parent your dating life isn't just for you and your personal happiness only, but every decision you make directly impacts your kids for better or worse. You and your partner obviously realize this and suspended your own desire to move in together etc. when you saw how it was affecting your kids. That's really commendable and I think eventually when the kids get older they will look back and see people who tried to do the right thing. Rosie, you should really read and re-read Stripey's perspective. What you and your MM are doing is the total opposite and nothing seems to be in the best interest of the kids, but your desires and his to be together at all cost. Your situation reads more like two 16 year olds defying their parents and trying to be together against everyone's opposition, acting on impulse and drama, without thought to consequences...versus grown individuals who are mature and who understand children and relationships and who have conscientious plans that are not solely about what they feel right this second. I definitely agree that all this rush seems to be because you guys are not secure in the relationship. Slow it down. Agree to not be a part of their lives for a while. Agree to see if the relationship will even last another year. Although all of us here are different and may not always agree...it seems like there is a consensus here that you guys are rushing and just making things worse for yourselves and you need to step way back and just deal with each other and growing the relationship, deal with your MM and his issues, deal with why you feel insecure, as you do...you already said before you're scared he will go back to his wife. Deal with the real problems of your relationship versus forcing the kids, wife and family to magically embrace you. I think you guys are substituting the real work and looking at the real issues by simply trying to force a perfect situation where without any work or time, everyone will simply embrace you and you will live happily ever after. I think it's a way of avoiding that you two actually need to see if you can really work and address your relationship in couple's counseling. Once you ignore that...then frankly, the kids, wife, relatives etc. are irrelevant, as it is extremely hard for people to accept a relationship that seems unstable to begin with. Once time has passed and you guys are more secure, you won't need to rush and be self-centered, and then people may naturally see your happiness and stability and come around. But right now it seems like you all are running around like crazed chickens, you can't stop texting each other constantly, having "surprise meetings", being self-centered (which is probably also driven by insecurity) and fighting with the stbxW. Amidst all that, it is hard to embrace you guys and it is no way appropriate to try to incorporate the kids and relatives into this drama. You make it seem like once the kids come around everything will be fine and that all is perfect except the kids and his family still talking to the wife. But that's not true. I think the kids are being used as THE obstacle and problem, when there are other issues to address, and when you address them, the kids thing will probably follow suit a lot more easily. Edited July 17, 2012 by MissBee
ac11442 Posted July 17, 2012 Posted July 17, 2012 Ok, honestly I don't know why any of us are wasting our virtual breath on this. I read the Vacation with the Kids thread and now this one. It's just more of the same. Rosie: between the vacation and this you continue to post and defend your situation hoping that eventually someone, ANYONE, will side with you, tell you it's okay to force these kids to socialize with the woman their father is currently (and I do use the word currently on purpose) snogging. Guess what???? No one is going to. It's a horrible idea, it will end in disaster. Poster after poster has told you this and you refuse to listen. You WANT it to be all perfect and wonderful, not for the kids, not so it'll be easier on them, you've NEVER ONCE said anything even close to that! You want it because you want him. You said THAT plain as day. After all, you are in love. Whatever. Seriously, both you and MM (and he still is MM) are about the most selfish self centered immature people I have ever heard about in my life. Oh, and guess what else? MM's W kicked him out. Yes, I'm saying it again. She kicked him to the curb. I know, I know, he was planning on leaving. Again...whatever. Like EVERYONE ELSE HERE HAS SAID if she hadn't done it he wouldn't have left. Yes they would still be together, yes he would still be stringing you along, and yes he would continue to tell you how he's "planning on leaving" but can't right now because it's almost Christmas, or it's the kid's birthday, or it's summer vacation. Or maybe his choice of excuse would be how his wife is stalling, she'll take him to the cleaners, he needs to get his affairs in order before he can leave to make it as easy a transition as possible. It really doesn't matter what excuse is. When I wanted to leave my husband guess what I did??? I moved out. It sucked, it was hard, and it was a long drawn out thing AFTER THE FACT. But yep, it was that easy. I packed some of my things and moved out. This is reality. But you will continue to post here until you finally find someone to agree that you should force your way, wanted or not, into the children's lives just so you and MM can be happy. You did the same thing with the Vacation thing. Guess what? No one EVER agreed that he should blow off his kids for you. They didn't agree then, they won't now. I don't mean to be rude or nasty. I really don't. But we all know that both Rosie and her MM are attention mongers. They need it to survive. I, for one, will no longer feed the beast. People come here for support and advice for real honest issues, not just to get their sympathy and attention 'fix'. I've had my say and I'm out. So Rosie, I wish you luck. I really do. And I wish those kids luck. They are, after all, the ones that are really going to need it. I'm sure we'll be reading threads from them in 10 years about their dysfunctional relationships. But hey, at least we'll know the background! 3
Trimmer Posted July 17, 2012 Posted July 17, 2012 (edited) So how long do we wait? A year? i know we've been over this on here but it just seems so long. And he is very anxioius to get us together, even for a fun hour or so, so that they can get to know me. I'm going to try to hold off but not sure how long I'll be able to do that. Rosie, I can't find it now, but do I recall that in your previous thread, you mentioned that your father left your mother for another woman, and you didn't like her and didn't really come to accept her until you were an adult? How long did it ultimately take you to accept your new step parent? Would it have helped speed things up if you were forced to spend "fun" time with her, when you didn't want to, to get to know her? He was out with his kid and I was around so we had a 'surprise' meeting in a shop, then went for a coffee. It went ok, but his wife was very angry as she said her son was upset and that MM had asked him to lie to her about it. He didn't seem upset when he was with us but who knows. It was kind of dumb but we were anxious to see how it would go. You (both of you) weren't really thinking about the CHILD here; you weren't thinking about what was truly best for him. Admit it: your main concern, and the source of your anxiety is because you are in a hurry to remove the children as obstacles. He says he never asked his son to lie. It's his wife who said it. She sent me an email after that meeting, explaining why she thought it was wrong to do that and that she was upset that he asked his son to lie. I don't know who's telling the truth. He said he mentioned to his son that his mum might not like hearing about it. Again, even if we take that at face value, he put his son in a terrible position even just by having him meet you, and especially by mentioning that his mom might not like hearing about it. THINK ABOUT IT: The son's parents are breaking up. All he wants - no matter how unrealistic - is for things to go back to the way they were, where he didn't have to worry about them being separated. And now, his dad puts him in the position where he has to choose a side. You're with me or against me. That's a very, very bad move as a parent. He's been through a lot the past 8 months, having to rebuild his life from scratch, and I sometimes think it's made him a bit crazy at times, trying to make it all work. Ach, when you say "he's been through a lot...", you make it sound like he's just a poor victim of circumstance. In fact, he's put himself through a lot - everything that happened was something that he brought to his own doorstep. Don't fool yourself that either he or you are some kind of victims here... He does need me. When she threw him out he was texting me, begging me to meet him, telling me I was his life boat and that he needed me. He needs me for support, but isn't that part of love? Support, maybe. Dependency (his life-boat?), no. Remember in the other thread, we talked about how you make him happy, and how that puts GREAT pressure on you, as if he gets a little bit bored, and he perceives that you don't "make him happy" any more, what is the pattern he has demonstrated in his previous relationship: he goes outside to find excitement. It doesn't really matter who you are inside, or what you are doing, all it takes is for him to believe that you are getting stale or boring. And the fact that you welcome his dependence on you to "be happy" even makes things worse, because once thing get stale and he starts stepping out on you in some way (just like he did on his wife, even before you) then in his mind, he can blame it on you since it's been established that it's your "job" to make him happy. You don't do your job, his solution is to go outside. Edited July 17, 2012 by Trimmer 1
frozensprouts Posted July 17, 2012 Posted July 17, 2012 Rosie, I'm wondering what the scenario was when your married man was kicked out by his wife...I have a feeling it may have gone very differently form what he is telling you... from my own experience ( and after hearing the experiences of many others) what happens when a husband/wife finds out their spouse is cheating may be very different that what the person cheating relates to the person they are cheating with. It seems that when they get caught, the person who was, up until that point, saying they were desperate to leave all of a sudden often wants to stay more than anything else in the world...they beg and plead with their spouse to reconsider and not end the relationship. It's weird that happens. I have a feeling that's what happened in your married guys case too. As for him saying he left to be with you...i don't get that. he had other affairs, but never left to be with them. you say it's because he loves you...but if he didn't love you and you were just another "fling" would he have stayed with his wife after you and just went on to the next person and had another fling, and another and another? Sounds like it...what does that tell you about him? I know you love this guy...but it's possible to be hopelessly, desperately in love with someone and it still be the a negative thing for you. That won't get any better as long as he refuses to see that any of the problems are his doing...he blames everyone else for his problems and his bad feelings...he's blaming his wife, even his kids. What happens when he can't blame them anymore? who will he blame then? you? 1
freestyle Posted July 17, 2012 Posted July 17, 2012 It strikes me that this MM is using his own children as a weapon to "punish" his wife---with zero regard for how that might affect the children. It's beneath contempt. 3
jade4071 Posted July 18, 2012 Posted July 18, 2012 You did well despite your childhood. Were you a MOW or OW at some point? That can be inherited. Yes, during my first marriage. My first husband cheated on me early on with his ex-wife. I cheated on him near the end. Not at all in my current marriage of 17 years.
Capris Posted July 18, 2012 Posted July 18, 2012 Forum seems to be having alot of spammers on here lately.
Recommended Posts