I seriously think being born female makes dating 2x more easier.

[zengirl]

SOme of the women have stated the variety of guys they have went on dates with.

 

Some is not a number we can do math with. We have no measurement for average, not so average, or hot. We have no measurement for how many women have gone on dates or haven't - or how many men for that matter, though as oaks writes below, the amount is likely fairly equal.

 

I know many women who've gone months without a date. Hell, even sometimes a year without a date.

 

None of this is "math" unfortunately. Math requires numbers we can actually count or at least estimate based on more than you've provided.

 

In that scenario more men are going on dates than women (because you've got a small number of women - the ones with many options - dating a large number of men).

 

And that's the opposite of what is sometimes claimed - that ALL the women are dating a small % of men. I really don't understand how it can be both ways. (I suspect it's not either way, personally.)

 

Now, standard deviation... that's a whole other thread.)

 

True.

[zengirl]

It relates 100% to the OP which what I am referring to.

Which I keep trying to steer towards & which you keep trying to derail by going on tangents that DO NOT have anything to do with the OP.

 

The OP states women have it easier when it comes to dating.

More options = Easier.

If more options doesn't equal easier for women then their standards are too high.

 

What I am saying - which is not tangential - is you haven't proved the thesis that women have more reasonable options than men or that men have less unreasonable options because the only difference is generally women approach men less, thus men don't have to go through the motions of rejection their unreasonable options.

 

I don't believe men have LESS options total - though they get approached less. At any rate, people have no idea how many options they have unless they are asking literally EVERY person out who crosses their path.

 

ETA: The only difference, between men and women and options, is when/how they filter them out. Typically men filter their bad options out simply by not approaching, though some men will get approaches occasionally. Typically women have to filter their bad options out by declining approaches.

Edited July 17, 2012 by zengirl

[ThaWholigan]

At the end of the day, this topic helps absolutely no one.

It helps the people who want to prove how hard they have it.

 

There are things that "average" men can do to improve their attractiveness - the problem is they spend to much time lamenting over how women have too high standards than actually attempting to raise their own standards, and meet them. I learned about a bunch of things, how to improve my walk, body language, expression, I educated myself on fitness and sculpting one's body, advanced my social skills, and learned about style and got better at grooming. Probably more stuff (like educating myself about money, although that's more important for my personal goals). This is not impossible. I didn't even do it all for the purpose of dating, I did it for my social life in general.

 

These are not impossible things. If you do all of those things, you won't be moaning about women's standards anymore. Because you'll be meeting them. Women don't have it easier just because they have more options. They are allowed to be unhappy with their options . I think there are quite a few guys just don't know how to be attractive personally. And that isn't even THAT many to be honest, as most guys I know do alright with women anyway.

[somedude81]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: this attitude is precisely your problem. Here you are, trying to convince people who are looking for relationships that all that should matter is not being fat, ugly or psycho. No wonder they pass you up! I want to contribute much more than that to a relationship and am turned off by guys who act like they should happily lap up crumbs instead of focusing on whether or not we can build a life together. You disempower yourself and then complain that women don't take pity on you.

Do you really think I tell girls I'm interested in that the only thing I care about is them not being fat, psycho or ugly? And no, that is not why girls pass me up.

Every guy I have dated has had options, many options tbh. They all have a past full of dates and girlfriends. I know there is a subset of guys (and girls) that can't get dates, but it's not the norm IME. The majority of people date. LS obviously attracts many guys that can't get dates, but that isn't the norm! It's just not. I see people dating all over the place, all the time.

I'm not at all surprised that every guy you've dated has options, what else can one expect from a guy that's dated you?

 

That just means you haven't dated or spent time with the type of guys that normally do bad with women. There are millions of guys out there who absolutely struggle with girls, they just don't know girls like you and that's why guys like them are not known to you either.

 

Your experiences are different from somebody like verhrzn who is part of the geek/nerd culture. She's actually dated guys just like me.

I feel badly for anyone who wants to date and "can't". It's unfortunate. I don't believe for one second though that your average guy struggles as much as LS men would like us to believe.

I don't think the LS men are a significatn amount of the population to be considered average. At least not yet. *queue ominous music*

 

I also don't buy that the average guys only requirement is "don't be fat or ugly".

The more trouble one has with dating, the less restrictive he becomes.

 

Also, the fat and ugly requirements are just the baseline. Ideally once I can start dating not fat and ugly girls, I'll start getting some actual requirements.

 

And then, as somebody who has never even had a relationship, how am I supposed to know what qualities actually matter?

[phineas]

Well, it's math, but it's not entirely intuitive...

 

In that scenario more men are going on dates than women (because you've got a small number of women - the ones with many options - dating a large number of men). I'm not sure that this really supports the idea that it's easier for women to get dates, if that's where you were going. If it's a true reflection of what happens is also points towards there being a larger proportion of women (than men) who are getting no dating action, because the guys with few 'options' are having those 'option' slots taken up by the few women with many 'options'.

 

 

The math to do is the same math that shows that number of sexual partners for men and number of sexual partners for women (over a lifetime, or at milestone ages or whatever) must be about the same, despite the huge disparity in the reported rates (men report higher numbers than women, consistently over many studies), for the same reason: each coupling (whether it's having sex or going on a date) is a tick in the "man" column and a tick in the "woman" column. (and the number of men and women is the same, or close enough to the same to not be an issue, so when you do the division to get a mean average you get the same result for each sex. Now, standard deviation... that's a whole other thread.)

 

We aren't talking about sex unless you want to toss in FWB & EX's that don't count because their ex's. LOL!

 

Personally, I've had more casual sex with more different women AFTER my divorce in the last two yrs than I did throughout my late teen' s, 20's & early 30's.

 

I have a few divorced friends my own age who tell me the same thing. Women arn't as picky when they get older.

 

I'm trying to keep this relative to the OP who I believe is late teens early 20's.

 

what i'm saying is if you take a random group of say 50 women & 50 men in their teens/ early 20's & ask them how many different people they had been out with on a romantic basis in the last few months to a yr & if you could get them to tell the truth i'm telling you the women will have a higher number.

 

At that age, women have more options.

Their shooting guy down left & right.

 

Just go to a club/ dance bar (if you could stand being in such a place. LOL!) and just feel awkward & observe.

 

Short version : My cousin came into town to visit so I hooked him up with some of the very younger people I work with & went with them. LOL!

 

It's a bunch of average guys not tall/ overly handsome/ built that are i'll admit awkward & nervous approaching women who look at them like their looser's or creeps while they try to get some hot dudes attention who happens to be tall / built / handsome.

They ultimately go home alone or if their lucky the hot dude is drunk enough to throw them a bone & lose their number.

 

Rinse, repeat.

 

This is how I see it in the early 20's these days.

[Cracker Jack]

Exactly, Wholigan. Nothing's impossible for many of these guys. They just tell themselves it's impossible and before you know it, it shapes their view on life and gets them excited to participate in a lame topic like this. It's just stupid.

 

Dedicate yourself to becoming the best man you can be and live. Having a pissing contest on who struggles more or has it easier is just a waste of time. Not really that hard to understand. And yeah, I can honestly say in my experiences, the "average" or even the "terrible" (I'm talking lowest of the low. Drug addicted, abusive, purse snatching, beligerent, etc) man has never had as many struggles as the guys on here. I simply don't care if women have it easier. I'm also very happy that I was born a man. Fu** all that other noise.

[jobaba]

It helps the people who want to prove how hard they have it.

 

There are things that "average" men can do to improve their attractiveness - the problem is they spend to much time lamenting over how women have too high standards than actually attempting to raise their own standards, and meet them. I learned about a bunch of things, how to improve my walk, body language, expression, I educated myself on fitness and sculpting one's body, advanced my social skills, and learned about style and got better at grooming. Probably more stuff (like educating myself about money, although that's more important for my personal goals). This is not impossible. I didn't even do it all for the purpose of dating, I did it for my social life in general.

 

These are not impossible things. If you do all of those things, you won't be moaning about women's standards anymore. Because you'll be meeting them. Women don't have it easier just because they have more options. They are allowed to be unhappy with their options . I think there are quite a few guys just don't know how to be attractive personally. And that isn't even THAT many to be honest, as most guys I know do alright with women anyway.

 

Hmmm.

 

I think your attitude is commendable but I disagree with it.

 

I'm significantly older than you, and so I represent the 'product' if you will of many years of improvement.

 

Just for starters, when I was your age, I could barely play the guitar. Now ... I'm awesome. I can also walk and sit down at a table with four women without so much as a sip of alcohol and start charming away. When I was your age, I'd be a quivering mess. I also have two more degrees.

 

I've had a few relationships, but not many, and I'd venture to guess that at least the majority of them (all 2 of 3 lol) would have dated me back when them and me were your age.

 

I'll be honest. A lot of it is about looks.

 

And since you think you are good looking and I think your personality is fine now, I'd just hit the street and start playing the numbers now.

 

It's really all about numbers and knowing the kind of girl you want and most importantly don't want.

[veggirl]

I'm not at all surprised that every guy you've dated has options, what else can one expect from a guy that's dated you?

 

That just means you haven't dated or spent time with the type of guys that normally do bad with women. There are millions of guys out there who absolutely struggle with girls, they just don't know girls like you and that's why guys like them are not known to you either.

 

Your experiences are different from somebody like verhrzn who is part of the geek/nerd culture. She's actually dated guys just like me.

 

I don't think the LS men are a significatn amount of the population to be considered average. At least not yet. *queue ominous music*

 

 

The more trouble one has with dating, the less restrictive he becomes.

 

Also, the fat and ugly requirements are just the baseline. Ideally once I can start dating not fat and ugly girls, I'll start getting some actual requirements.

 

And then, as somebody who has never even had a relationship, how am I supposed to know what qualities actually matter?

 

Fair enough, SD. I do see your point.

[zengirl]

Your experiences are different from somebody like verhrzn who is part of the geek/nerd culture. She's actually dated guys just like me.

 

I think she's dated men who left her for other girls. . . IIRC

 

At any rate, I'm heavily into geek/nerd culture, and my experiences match up with veggirl's in that respect. I know loads of nerdy guys who fit exactly what she described. I'm not saying SOME nerdy guys don't struggle, but there are many nerds who get dates. Especially during and after college. (HS may be a different story, but nerdy girls don't exactly do great there either.)

 

I'm trying to keep this relative to the OP who I believe is late teens early 20's.

 

what i'm saying is if you take a random group of say 50 women & 50 men in their teens/ early 20's & ask them how many different people they had been out with on a romantic basis in the last few months to a yr & if you could get them to tell the truth i'm telling you the women will have a higher number.

 

Well, I would agree that women have more potential options at that age and perhaps do better, though I wouldn't say all or even most girls are shooting down guys 'left and right.' I know women who struggled at that age. But the thread wasn't about a specific age range. But why would that age range - the age range when many men would say women are most desirable - relate to all women? At any rate, I think it evens out by mid-20s for most folks.

[veggirl]

Tried to edit but was too slow. anyway, SD I think I saw your picture once and you were good-looking. I am surprised that *you* are in this subset of dateless tbh (note: dateless not R-less), I'd esp think a nerdy type of girl would like you. But yeah I am not part of that culture, you are correct and maybe I even assume more people date than actually do.

 

(where has V been anyway? anyone know? have not seen her around lately)

[phineas]

What I am saying - which is not tangential - is you haven't proved the thesis that women have more reasonable options than men or that men have less unreasonable options because the only difference is generally women approach men less, thus men don't have to go through the motions of rejection their unreasonable options.

 

I don't believe men have LESS options total - though they get approached less. At any rate, people have no idea how many options they have unless they are asking literally EVERY person out who crosses their path.

 

ETA: The only difference, between men and women and options, is when/how they filter them out. Typically men filter their bad options out simply by not approaching, though some men will get approaches occasionally. Typically women have to filter their bad options out by declining approaches.

 

So men have to do work and women don't?

Is that what you are saying?

 

How does that not translate into women have it easier?

 

Also OP clearly stated he approached 10 women & was shot down by each of them.

What's the average guys filter? Not fat & not ugly.

 

So that theory is shot.

I work with guys in their 20's & I've seen them approach women in bars over & over again & get shot down.

There is no filtering past : not fat & not ugly & what is not ugly is negotiable.

Men are simply not as picky as women.

 

so your theory men pre-filter is blown out of the water.

Unless you are going to claim most women are obese.

Then you have an argument.

 

Do you even know any 20yr olds?

I'm surrounded by them on the job.

I see what goes on & OP has a firm handle on the situation.

It sucks to be him at his age if he isn't tall / built / good looking.

[SJC2008]

That's the understatement of the century. Girls have it INFINITELY easier than guys do during their prime sex years (which is what really counts).

 

A guy must:

 

- lift weights while maintaining little to no body fat

- play the numbers game like mad, to the exclusion of almost everything else in life

- not be pushy when it comes to sex but be able to perform like a pornstar once the girl's ready (assuming he even manages to get a girl)

 

A girl doesn't have to a thing. She can sit back, take it easy, and laugh as every guy she comes into contact with stumbles to win her approval. The world's her oyster.

 

Some women are like that. They are the ones who are 30+ on dating sites freaking out that they aren't married and don't have kids yet.

[ThaWholigan]

Hmmm.

 

I think your attitude is commendable but I disagree with it.

 

I'm significantly older than you, and so I represent the 'product' if you will of many years of improvement.

 

Just for starters, when I was your age, I could barely play the guitar. Now ... I'm awesome. I can also walk and sit down at a table with four women without so much as a sip of alcohol and start charming away. When I was your age, I'd be a quivering mess. I also have two more degrees.

 

I've had a few relationships, but not many, and I'd venture to guess that at least the majority of them (all 2 of 3 lol) would have dated me back when them and me were your age.

 

I'll be honest. A lot of it is about looks.

 

And since you think you are good looking and I think your personality is fine now, I'd just hit the street and start playing the numbers now.

 

It's really all about numbers and knowing the kind of girl you want and most importantly don't want.

For the record Jobaba, I think most of the guys could learn a lot from you. You possess the one attribute that these guys (and myself) needed in the first place:

 

Perseverance. The numbers game is indeed a very valid way of approaching things.

[zengirl]

So men have to do work and women don't?

Is that what you are saying?

 

No, I simply don't think approaching is the only way one works in dating.

 

How does that not translate into women have it easier?

 

See above.

 

Also OP clearly stated he approached 10 women & was shot down by each of them. What's the average guys filter? Not fat & not ugly.

 

We know nothing about how suitable the matches were and how the approaches were and how many women he filtered out as "fat" and "ugly" and whatever else. Nope, no math there.

 

so your theory men pre-filter is blown out of the water.

Unless you are going to claim most women are obese.

Then you have an argument.

 

I would suggest that many women do not meet individual men's physical standards, yes. Not saying 'obese' per se, though the average woman in the U.S. is plus-sized. Size 16, I believe.

 

Do you even know any 20yr olds?

 

Yep, college kids are working for me in my camps right now. Though I don't know many actually. I am also only 27. I had a miserable dating life in college, though most of that was - if not 'my fault', at least due to where I was in my life. I don't disagree, however, that (all other factors being equal) a 20 year old woman is more desirable to men than a 20 year old man is to women since women may date older at that age but men rarely do.

 

I also know many men who dated in college who weren't tall or good looking. And many women who couldn't get a date. So, I do think it varies more than the OP lets on. That's not to say there isn't some difference AT THAT AGE. But that's not the premise of the OP.

[phineas]

I think she's dated men who left her for other girls. . . IIRC

 

At any rate, I'm heavily into geek/nerd culture, and my experiences match up with veggirl's in that respect. I know loads of nerdy guys who fit exactly what she described. I'm not saying SOME nerdy guys don't struggle, but there are many nerds who get dates. Especially during and after college. (HS may be a different story, but nerdy girls don't exactly do great there either.)

 

 

 

Well, I would agree that women have more potential options at that age and perhaps do better, though I wouldn't say all or even most girls are shooting down guys 'left and right.' I know women who struggled at that age. But the thread wasn't about a specific age range. But why would that age range - the age range when many men would say women are most desirable - relate to all women? At any rate, I think it evens out by mid-20s for most folks.

 

I'd say late 20's when women are looking to settle down. Either the the guys who did bad with women stop being so awkword & fill out a little or women lower their standards.

 

If we moved to my age group it's a whole different story. I get women approaching me, I approach women ect. OLD was a total failure for me but I do better in real life when i'm actually looking.

I'm not right now but they still seem to find me occasionally & i've got few circling.

[Bob_Funk]

We aren't talking about sex unless you want to toss in FWB & EX's that don't count because their ex's. LOL!

 

Personally, I've had more casual sex with more different women AFTER my divorce in the last two yrs than I did throughout my late teen' s, 20's & early 30's.

 

I have a few divorced friends my own age who tell me the same thing. Women arn't as picky when they get older.

 

I'm trying to keep this relative to the OP who I believe is late teens early 20's.

 

what i'm saying is if you take a random group of say 50 women & 50 men in their teens/ early 20's & ask them how many different people they had been out with on a romantic basis in the last few months to a yr & if you could get them to tell the truth i'm telling you the women will have a higher number.

 

At that age, women have more options.

Their shooting guy down left & right.

 

Just go to a club/ dance bar (if you could stand being in such a place. LOL!) and just feel awkward & observe.

 

Short version : My cousin came into town to visit so I hooked him up with some of the very younger people I work with & went with them. LOL!

 

It's a bunch of average guys not tall/ overly handsome/ built that are i'll admit awkward & nervous approaching women who look at them like their looser's or creeps while they try to get some hot dudes attention who happens to be tall / built / handsome.

They ultimately go home alone or if their lucky the hot dude is drunk enough to throw them a bone & lose their number.

 

Rinse, repeat.

 

This is how I see it in the early 20's these days.

 

Yep. I know a lot of women on this forum would like to believe I'm just a loser and that my experiences are rare. The truth is I've known plenty of guys over the years who've had it just as bad or even worse than me. Guys who were treated like sub-humans by every girl they approached, just because they were ethnic, under 5'8", too skinny, or didn't have the best facial symmetry. Meanwhile their female equivalents - girls they sgould have ben able to date - were living like rockstars.

 

I actually think this pattern continues until the late 20's nowadays. Cold comfort to virile young men with fire in their loins.

[zengirl]

I'd say late 20's when women are looking to settle down. Either the the guys who did bad with women stop being so awkword & fill out a little or women lower their standards.

 

Perhaps late 20s for men, mid 20s for women, I don't know. Most of the men I know didn't do well in HS but many did okay in college and started to do much better once they were real, full-fledged adults. And that's in the so-called "nerdy" community. And I mean some serious nerds. And, yes, I think a lot of it has to do with them stopping being so awkward and in my 'community' of people (the nerd girls and guys) even has to do with the nerd girls becoming less awkward and more comfortable sending signals and putting themselves out there to guys. Nerds, in particular, just have trouble connecting to each other until they learn those skills.

 

That seems to be when most people settle into their real Rs anyway. Some people do get lucky -- I almost married my HS sweetheart, and only a drunk driver stopped us. But most of us struggle in some way or another when young.

[SJC2008]

This is a joke right? Most of the guys who have contacted me online, I'm not even interested in. I'm 25 and quite are few who have contacted me are 40+ which is not what I wanted. It's not easier. I ended it with someone recently as he lied that he wanted a relationship to get sex. This is what really *hits me about guys. Then I'm blamed here it was my fault for doing the deed to soon. But also guys say on here they won't wait long. Huge catch 22 or what? So what am I supposed to do. Huge contradictory advice here! Yeah women can pull if they want, but it's much, much more difficult to try and find a relationship. I'm 25 and my coworkers are always asking me why I'm not married/ getting pregnant yet. Yet also everyone here thinks if you missed having kids by your 30s it was your fault. But they tell me not to settle!

 

It can be a catch 22 for guys too. The last girl I dated had a rant on her site about keep it in your pants and no quickies in the back or your car etc. I messaged her and told her I'm on the same page with her and don't mind waiting and do you know what she did? She asked me if I was a virgin lol. You can't have your cake and it eat too. Just because I'll wait a couple/few months doesn't mean I'm a v or don't like sex or don't like to eat *ussy because I love to. For me gf material is a woman who WILL NOT jump into the sack right away. An ideal time frame is 2-3 months for me but the longer you wait the more suspicious she'll get that your a v or don't like her. Of course that's not all women but that's the vibe I get.

[SincereOnlineGuy]

I actually do think that women do have it easier in terms of 'dating and sex',

 

 

 

It seems rather silly to add something to the original discussion which obviously changes the equation in a huge way.

 

Having done so, you're not really saying anything that everybody doesn't know already. This is about "dating", per the thread title.

 

When you add sex to the picture, we all know that women can get sex in a snap. We all know that women could pay for a Harvard education when "sex" is added to the equation. We all know that women can finance luxurious lives of travel and luxury with sex.

 

In contrast, one can sit back and read Loveshack threads and gain a pretty good sense that women find "dating" just as difficult as men do, once those men are actually "dating".

 

Sitting home and wanking to online porn and wishing you could bang the prom queen does not count as dating, which is what seems perfectly lost on the OP here.

[SincereOnlineGuy]

Did you even read the OP?

 

 

It is clearly about women having more options & having an easier time getting dates.

 

 

Maybe you should have read the OP, the title of which is quite clear.

 

As illustrated both by the OP, and by yourself now, these were kids in their "late teens". There is nothing "clearly" about "women" in that.

 

As I just pointed out, it doesn't count as "dating" if you're sitting at home wanking to online porn and merely wishing you could bang the prom queen.

[phineas]

Yep. I know a lot of women on this forum would like to believe I'm just a loser and that my experiences are rare. The truth is I've known plenty of guys over the years who've had it just as bad or even worse than me. Guys who were treated like sub-humans by every girl they approached, just because they were ethnic, under 5'8", too skinny, or didn't have the best facial symmetry. Meanwhile their female equivalents - girls they sgould have ben able to date - were living like rockstars.

 

I actually think this pattern continues until the late 20's nowadays. Cold comfort to virile young men with fire in their loins.

 

Well, i'm 5'8" & lifted but was probably a size 34 my early 20's.

It was a slightly different time (15 to 20 yrs ago, dial up AOL & no cell phones) and I either struck a home run (one night stand) or crashed & burned.(friendzoned)

 

I was a full on retard when it came to women. I thought I had to respect the women I liked & thought I had to take my time & wait for sex. wound up not making the moves, putting them on a pedestal, ect. then they'd dump me for someone who slept with them on the first date. LOL!

 

I had the looks & the personality to get them. I was just really really really bad at dating them. LOL!

 

But the way things are today?

[phineas]

Maybe you should have read the OP, the title of which is quite clear.

 

As illustrated both by the OP, and by yourself now, these were kids in their "late teens". There is nothing "clearly" about "women" in that.

 

As I just pointed out, it doesn't count as "dating" if you're sitting at home wanking to online porn and merely wishing you could bang the prom queen.

 

I read it just fine.

 

So your going to take the bold title out of context & ignore the body of his post? LOL!

OP didn't say "dating" as in multiple dates with the same person.

OP said MULTIPLE OPTIONS for dates.

Or are you claiming the word "dating" trumps his entire post & posts that followed clearly stating women his age have more options?

 

also where did op state he wanted to bang the prom queen?

OP stated he was shot down 10 times in a row by the way.

This falls into line with what a lot of men his age are dealing with.

Edited July 17, 2012 by phineas

[jobaba]

 

As I just pointed out, it doesn't count as "dating" if you're sitting at home wanking to online porn and merely wishing you could bang the prom queen.

 

Yea, all these guys have tried and been rejected. That's what causes bitterness and whine (cheese and wine ).

 

I can still remember being a bright and bushy tailed lad in my late teens thinking I could score that really hot gal or even the cute one if she just could see my stuff. But no bitterness back then. Definitely no whining about how women had it easier.

 

That's the natural progression my friend.

[phineas]

No, I simply don't think approaching is the only way one works in dating.

 

 

 

See above.

 

 

 

We know nothing about how suitable the matches were and how the approaches were and how many women he filtered out as "fat" and "ugly" and whatever else. Nope, no math there.

 

 

 

I would suggest that many women do not meet individual men's physical standards, yes. Not saying 'obese' per se, though the average woman in the U.S. is plus-sized. Size 16, I believe.

 

 

 

Yep, college kids are working for me in my camps right now. Though I don't know many actually. I am also only 27. I had a miserable dating life in college, though most of that was - if not 'my fault', at least due to where I was in my life. I don't disagree, however, that (all other factors being equal) a 20 year old woman is more desirable to men than a 20 year old man is to women since women may date older at that age but men rarely do.

 

I also know many men who dated in college who weren't tall or good looking. And many women who couldn't get a date. So, I do think it varies more than the OP lets on. That's not to say there isn't some difference AT THAT AGE. But that's not the premise of the OP.

 

Here is your math.

 

OP approached 10 women. Shot down each time.

take any woman who is approached by 10 men.

what happens?

 

Doesn't matter. In the case of the man he has no control of the outcome.

The woman does.

 

Do you really need a spreadsheet to see the one who holds the power has it easier?

[zengirl]

Here is your math.

 

OP approached 10 women. Shot down each time.

take any woman who is approached by 10 men.

what happens?

 

Doesn't matter. In the case of the man he has no control of the outcome.

The woman does.

 

Do you really need a spreadsheet to see the one who holds the power has it easier?

 

Even by that logic, only the women who get approached (which may be the same subset of women) have the power.

 

Personally, I don't necessarily think there's any more or less power in being a gatekeeper as there is in being the asker.

 

I also don't think that 'having power' equates to having it easy. On that, we entirely disagree.

 

What about all the girls who never even want to go out because they never get that attention? What about the girls who have to fend off attention from guys they don't want but not turn off guys they do want? What about all the girls who go out and see guy after guy approach their prettier friend? These things happen, too.

 

Rejection sucks, but the idea that the ONLY way it can be experienced is by approaching and being shot down is false. Many women feel rejected simply by not being the woman who is approached, while others around them are. At any rate, none of this conflates to 'easier.'