Does "Be Confident" Just Mean "Be an Extrovert"...?

[iris219]

I consider myself an introvert, but I’m confident. One of my best friends says it’s one of my most remarkable qualities.

 

Also, as was stated before, being an introvert isn’t the same thing as being shy. Just because I’m not loud or talking to every random person doesn’t mean I’m uncomfortable interacting with people. I don’t think anyone would label me as shy—it would be the opposite in fact. Being an introvert simply means I don’t thrive off constant interaction with others; I don’t need it to feel emotionally and mentally secure the way some people do.

 

I’m very attracted to self-assured introverts. I love quiet confidence in men. Very sexy. An extrovert will talk to anyone. An introvert saves their energy for those who really matter. I think that’s why I like them so much. Introverts often seem more genuine to me, maybe because I can relate. The loudest person in the room could be the most insecure. Sometimes it seems like extroverts do things just for attention and validation, and that’s not an attractive quality to me personally. I always take the guy who’s sitting back and observing over the loud one, every time. I seek out these kind of men. (Though of course, he’ll have to eventually talk to me. If he's painfully shy and can't hold a conversation, that's not going to work.)

 

As far as dating goes:

Not having confidence will definitely hurt you.

Being shy can hurt you if it's disabling, meaning you never talk to anyone.

Being an introvert won't hurt you and will work in your favor with women who value these types of men.

 

I don’t think people automatically characterize someone as shy or anti-social just because they aren’t the most outgoing. These people are often, possibly mistakingly, labeled as thinkers or those with depth, which, again, works in your favor.

[monkey00]

Got it. But what does "be confident" really mean in a common social sense...? Is there even a definitive meaning for it? And could "be an extrovert" be one of those meanings...?

 

I feel confidence wanes with everyone from time to time. It's relative to the situation and how you act and react to it. You're either the master of your domain given the circumstances of the situation or at least you should do your best with what you have and what you know.

 

E.G: At a bar guy A can be great at getting numbers from women and guy B usually fails, guy A has the confidence in that setting - it is his domain. Flip the situation to skiing or being a handyman Guy B does it with ease - this is his domain, guy A is a nerve wrack and asking all sorts of questions. See what I mean?

[zengirl]

I will say I've pretty much exclusively been in Rs with introverts, most of whom were also confident and happy (and eventually married one such man).

 

"Be confident" is one of the most proliferated bits of dating advice you'll find anywhere, whether it's on LS, reading online articles, or talking with people in real life. But what does it really mean to "be confident"? When asked this, people will come up with a wide range of answers, including "believe in yourself," "do what you want and approach who you want without caring what others think," and "go after what you want."

 

As far as a comprehensive definition, I think Pyro defined it for us very well:

 

Confidence means that you like who you are (no need to BS) and you don't fear rejection.

 

We can embellish to say how we identify it, but I can't imagine needing any better definition of what confidence, at it's heart, actually is, as it relates to dating. The whole key for dating is the not fearing rejection (and to analyze it further than necessary: not letting rejection or external factors shake your sense of self-concept, which is something that people with confidence have no fear of), but confidence is basically just being comfortable with who you are and, to fancy it up a bit, your 'self-concept.'

 

That improves your life, which in turn also improves your dating life. When you don't fear rejection, you seek more opportunities. When you seek more opportunities and are positive about yourself, you have more success. You still fail. Oh, you fail loads! But it doesn't matter so much. Things are just easier - at least they feel easier and you're always okay. You're also a a safer person to be around, because you're going to be okay and you know who you are, which makes you more of a 'stable' commodity, socially. None of that relates to being extroverted at all.

 

I know many people with confidence who are not extroverts. Of course, that's not to say extroverts don't have an edge on dating - I think perhaps they do and that being comfortable with extroversion to some degree, even if an introvert, is generally required for most socializing with new and relatively unknown people. But most people aren't really introverts or extroverts, though we label that way, but at a place on the introversion/extroversion spectrum. I suspect people who are reasonably balanced, on either side, do better socially than people far at the ends - too far into extroversion and you often lack quality in your social dynamics and too far into introversion and the quantity is too low to get you anywhere.

 

We might visualize a suave, well-dressed man who can smooth talk women, or a very social person who has presence and "owns a room." That is, we visualize an extrovert.

 

That is not at all what I visualize when thinking of confidence. I think of someone who is comfortable in the room, whether chatting up others or sitting alone quietly with a drink, content. The key to confidence is comfort in the settings you choose to be in. Of course while people either have or lack basic self-confidence, different people have different levels of confidence in different situations. For instance, I rock job interviews and first dates, so I've always been really confident in those situations. Many people do just fine who are a bit nervous about those things or have less comfort in those situations but have learned to deal with their discomfort, accept it, and accept themselves as they are. That's confidence too at work.

 

Is "being confident" merely exhibiting the behaviors of an extrovert? There is an entire PUA industry that teaches methods of, in essence, "faking confidence," but isn't all that just encouraging an otherwise "unconfident" person to be more extroverted?

 

I do agree that faked confidence often errs in really producing more extroversion, faked or not. But faked confidence is really nothing like real confidence.

 

I disagree that confidence and extroversion are mutually exclusive. There is no causation but there is certainly some correlation.

 

If you look up definitions of both there is some overlap.

 

Here are traits of confident people from selfgrowth.com article:

 

1. They are ambitious.

2. They are goal oriented.

3. They have learned to communicate.

4. They are loving and kind.

5. They are open to others.

6. They reinfornce confidence with words.

 

I would say that 3, 5 and 6 are also traits of extroverts...hence correlation.

 

Hm, interesting thought, ES. I wouldn't say that "learning to communicate" necessarily requires extroversion. I know many introverts who are excellent communicators. I would say that extroverts are perhaps more open to socializing with strangers, so I see some correlation with 5, but not all extroverts exhibit that quality either (many prefer lies and charms to true openness). I don't see the correlation to 6 and extroversion, as introverts use words too. They may use fewer words, with fewer people, but they still use them, and many do so quite well.

[Ninjainpajamas]

It can be dynamic in social setting...how confidence may appear.

 

For example sometimes I'm not really feeling like I have a lot in common with the group of people I'm around or the vibe is off for me, so I'll just fade to black and remain a spectator...I may find their humor or conversation boring and flat, so I'll just make fun of people in my head partly because I can be a jerk and partly because I can always think of something funny whether I say it or not...but hey If I didn't say it then I'm not that big of a jerk right?

 

Depending on the crowd I may care less to participate, plus sometimes I'm not just feeling like being sociable, sometimes I like to just blend in. So those people might see me as a quiet, introvert with unknown confidence.

 

However in another opposite situation, I can be very personable, humorous, center of attention kind of guy that people will more or less usually like...I can usually build a good rapport with men or women equally whether they are introverted or extroverted, I understand both dynamics. I can be openly generous and friendly, and definitely come off very confident although that's not what I'm trying to do...impress people.

 

Both of those personalities If you will, are apart of who I am. Some people may even have viewed me as an introvert and then in another situation an extrovert because I responded/acted out differently in that particular setting, so it just depends.

 

I think I have a good balance generally, I'll adapt to situations where people are introverts as well as extroverts, I know how to carry myself in each situation...what boundaries to respect with introverts and what expectations extroverts may have in displaying a more outgoing demeanor.

 

I also don't believe in faking who you are, just trying to branch out and expand upon who you already are...if that makes you an introvert or extrovert so be it, I think everyone can learn from opposites on how to improve themselves, I don't think it's so cut and dry as people make it out to be and making all these judgments about either or.

Edited July 11, 2012 by Ninjainpajamas

[veggirl]

I would take most advice re: "confidence" that is given on LS with a huge grain of salt as far as application in a real world setting. Many on LS, who have nothing but good intentions as far as I can see, live in a rosy world that I am apparently not privy to--where as long as you genuinely think you are great, you will succeed. In MY world, yes confidence is often a euphemism for extrovert. Sure an extrovert can have raging insecurity beneath the surface, but as far as *initial* impressions, they are more likely to come off as confident than the quiet bookworm in the corner who could be confident as hell. I agree with ES summation on how they overlap.

 

Putting yourself out there generally takes confidence in a social setting. People naturally view someone who is chatting with the room, making the rounds, etc as someone who is an extrovert.

 

I do think that in approaching women, coming off as an extrovert would be more helpful advice to many of the guys on here. Yes the ones with crippling insecurity will still have that issue and it should be dealt with separately. But saying "be confident" is so vague, telling someone "be more extroverted" is just more practical as far as approaching the opposite sex / getting dates. Whether or not the Rs progress beyond that, who knows, but just getting them could build up some of the confidence in these guys.

[Star Gazer]

Talk about getting personal, ouch!

 

Personal? I'm speaking a fact. That's what his profile says. Given that Hokie has often expressed insecurity and a feeling of being less-than for being Asian, coupled with that headline, does it sound like he's a confident person when it comes to dating?

[zengirl]

Matter of fact, I think this whole thread relies on the definition of extroversion. Psychologically defined, it's a continuum, generally based on what one is concerned with (others or inner life) and how one 'recharges' (with others or alone), but people often instead use it to describe whether one is socially adept or not. Many introverts can be socially adept. I think we have some on LS!

[monkey00]

I think we have some on LS!

 

[Star Gazer]

Matter of fact, I think this whole thread relies on the definition of extroversion. Psychologically defined, it's a continuum, generally based on what one is concerned with (others or inner life) and how one 'recharges' (with others or alone), but people often instead use it to describe whether one is socially adept or not. Many introverts can be socially adept. I think we have some on LS!

 

Yes! People misunderstand extroversion and introversion all the time. It kinda drives me nuts.

[Eternal Sunshine]

Yes! People misunderstand extroversion and introversion all the time. It kinda drives me nuts.

 

Yep, they are actually not that easy to define and can mean different things to different people.

[ThaWholigan]

Matter of fact, I think this whole thread relies on the definition of extroversion. Psychologically defined, it's a continuum, generally based on what one is concerned with (others or inner life) and how one 'recharges' (with others or alone), but people often instead use it to describe whether one is socially adept or not. Many introverts can be socially adept. I think we have some on LS!

 

Agreed. I am very much introverted despite my large social circle. Socializing wasn't a natural thing to me, so I had to force myself to be comfortable with it and be more extroverted. But generally, once I had the skills to do well, I was quite happy maintaining my introverted self. I generally have to recharge a lot after being around a lot of people.

 

I think that when people say "be confident" it is a little too vague, and is up there with "just be yourself" when it comes to dating advice. But if you can give someone the dynamics and the tools to build confidence and make it a process that is practical, then that is better. It's one thing to be annoyed when people give the "confidence" advice, but it's another thing to scoff when people actually give a process that makes confidence possible.

[Eternal Sunshine]

That's why "be extroverted" is better advice. This basically helped me immensely, even if I had to fake it. The core confidence is harder to build though and still eludes me.

 

I simply think that majority of people will perceive extroverts as more confident than introverts, even if that's not the case.

[USMCHokie]

That's why "be extroverted" is better advice. This basically helped me immensely, even if I had to fake it. The core confidence is harder to build though and still eludes me.

 

I simply think that majority of people will perceive extroverts as more confident than introverts, even if that's not the case.

 

And one of my points is that perception is a often more important consideration than reality when it comes to all things social.

[zengirl]

That's why "be extroverted" is better advice. This basically helped me immensely, even if I had to fake it. The core confidence is harder to build though and still eludes me.

 

I simply think that majority of people will perceive extroverts as more confident than introverts, even if that's not the case.

 

Well, you can't just 'be' extroverted really. You can act it. I don't think it gives you the same thing as the confidence, but it is a good way to potentially build social adeptness if that eludes you, which is what TW's story basically suggests.

 

I would say social adeptness itself is absolutely key to dating. More so than confidence. Though confidence is more key to happiness in general. Extroverts may have an easier time with social adeptness, but I think that's debatable. What they actually have is a higher incentive to develop it earlier.

[Eternal Sunshine]

And one of my points is that perception is a often more important consideration than reality when it comes to all things social.

 

Absolutely. Perception is everything.

[Eternal Sunshine]

Well, you can't just 'be' extroverted really. You can act it. I don't think it gives you the same thing as the confidence, but it is a good way to potentially build social adeptness if that eludes you, which is what TW's story basically suggests.

 

I would say social adeptness itself is absolutely key to dating. More so than confidence. Though confidence is more key to happiness in general. Extroverts may have an easier time with social adeptness, but I think that's debatable. What they actually have is a higher incentive to develop it earlier.

 

I meant act it. I did and it really works. It may look a bit fake at first but if you keep at it, you can get really good. It's especially effective in new social settings, where people haven't already built up a perception of you being shy and quiet.

 

Again extroversion and social adeptness are highly correlated in my opinion.

 

Core confidence will make you happier but it's not easily recognized by others.

[USMCHokie]

Absolutely. Perception is everything.

 

No, it's not everything...but it's something a lot of folks ignore or feel "doesn't matter"...I think it's a product of the self esteem era...they want to feel superior to external influence, so they tell themselves they can transcend social perception. For some, that isn't an issue since society will perceive them positively regardless of their attitude...e.g., they are good looking, etc.

[Star Gazer]

I meant act it. I did and it really works. It may look a bit fake at first but if you keep at it, you can get really good. It's especially effective in new social settings, where people haven't already built up a perception of you being shy and quiet.

 

Again extroversion and social adeptness are highly correlated in my opinion.

 

Core confidence will make you happier but it's not easily recognized by others.

 

You are still confusing what it means to be an extrovert. You can't ACT like an extrovert.

 

Introverts are not ipso facto shy. They are more concerned with themselves/the inside than others/the outside, and lose energy from being around people. Extroverts are more concerned with others/the outside than themselves/the inside and GAIN energy from being around people.

 

In short, there are outgoing, social introverts. Being an introvert doesn't mean sitting in a corner being shy.

[ThaWholigan]

No, it's not everything...but it's something a lot of folks ignore or feel "doesn't matter"...I think it's a product of the self esteem era...they want to feel superior to external influence, so they tell themselves they can transcend social perception. For some, that isn't an issue since society will perceive them positively regardless of their attitude...e.g., they are good looking, etc.

It's not about transcending social perception - it's about handling social perception and external influence in a way that doesn't include being bitter and depressed .

[Eternal Sunshine]

No, it's not everything...but it's something a lot of folks ignore or feel "doesn't matter"...I think it's a product of the self esteem era...they want to feel superior to external influence, so they tell themselves they can transcend social perception. For some, that isn't an issue since society will perceive them positively regardless of their attitude...e.g., they are good looking, etc.

 

 

It is everything in a sense. How you perceive others and the world is your reality. How others perceive you and the world is their reality.

 

How you perceive that others perceive you is also your reality (since you are never going to know what they are REALLY thinking). What is "objective reality" doesn't even matter. Perhaps I went on a bit of tangent but that's what I meant with perception is everything comment.

[Star Gazer]

No, it's not everything...but it's something a lot of folks ignore or feel "doesn't matter"...I think it's a product of the self esteem era...they want to feel superior to external influence, so they tell themselves they can transcend social perception. For some, that isn't an issue since society will perceive them positively regardless of their attitude...e.g., they are good looking, etc.

 

The self esteem "era"?

 

It seems you don't believe that people can "feel superior to external influence" and that they have to "tell themselves" things.

 

That's projection.

[Eternal Sunshine]

You are still confusing what it means to be an extrovert. You can't ACT like an extrovert.

 

Introverts are not ipso facto shy. They are more concerned with themselves/the inside than others/the outside, and lose energy from being around people. Extroverts are more concerned with others/the outside than themselves/the inside and GAIN energy from being around people.

 

In short, there are outgoing, social introverts. Being an introvert doesn't mean sitting in a corner being shy.

 

Point taken. What I really meant to say is "act outgoing".

[USMCHokie]

It's not about transcending social perception - it's about handling social perception and external influence in a way that doesn't include being bitter and depressed .

 

Well of course, each person should find a way to handle social perception. so as to not become embittered by it. However, common advice here often dictates that one should transcend, or rise above, social perception. For example, if SD says that short men have a certain negative social perception, he simply has to transcend that perception...that is, "rise above" it and practically ignore that it exists. That's what I mean by transcending in this case.

[Star Gazer]

Point taken. What I really meant to say is "act outgoing".

 

And some people will be attracted to outgoing personalities. But being outgoing doesn't mean being confident. I don't relate the two at all. They're separate animals, that exist independently of each other.

 

In fact, the most confident, self-assured people I know are those who are the quietest in general. The loud, outgoing people who need attention reek of insecurity to me.

[Eternal Sunshine]

And some people will be attracted to outgoing personalities. But being outgoing doesn't mean being confident. I don't relate the two at all. They're separate animals, that exist independently of each other.

 

In fact, the most confident, self-assured people I know are those who are the quietest in general. The loud, outgoing people who need attention reek of insecurity to me.

 

For sure, they are not the same. But in a social setting, people often mistake talkativeness and loudness as confidence.