Olivia_19742004 Posted July 5, 2004 Posted July 5, 2004 Recently I had decided to leave my husband that I've been with for four years because of his inability to take responsibility for his behavior regarding porn. You can read my previous post at: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t23000/15-3 --- Last night he found me crying downstairs. Needless to say I haven't followed through with my plan to leave. I told him that we weren't working out. He hasn't gone to the doctors or read the book he purchased on addiction. I told him I know he's still looking at porn. He stared straight into my eyes and told me he hasn't looked at porn. About three or four weeks ago I put a program called Netspy on his computer. I felt so guilty after doing that I immediately took it off, but I lied and told him I put it on and knew he had been looking at porn again. He still lied to me and told me he hadn't. He asked me if things had been getting better between us. We've been spending more time together and talking. I agreed that things had improved, but that it takes more to fix things then just spending more time together and having sex more often. He claimed he's petrified of doctors and that is why he hasn't gone. I pointed out that he hadn't even read the book and he said he'd read it tonight. He stayed up until 1:30 am reading it. He came into the bedroom and of course I was still awake. We began talking about the book and he claimed it didn't really apply that much to him because he's not the typical porn addict. He doesn't spend large amounts of money on porn and his tastes in porn stay the same. He does acknowledge some form of problem because he lies about it and has (up until a month ago) preferred porn to sharing intimacy with me. He proceeded to tell me that a section in the book called co-addict fits me and that I have issues. He claims that since my low self-esteem isn't part of the solution it must be part of the problem and I'm partly to blame for the situation we're in. I asked him to clarify that he was actually saying I am responsible for him looking at porn and he didn't say it directly but did state that I have issues and I needed to see a therapist. He stated that he wanted to be able to take care of this on his own without seeing a therapist and I informed him that he wasn't doing very well since he's still looking at porn. He finally admitted that he has been looking but doesn't understand what the problem is. As long as he feels he's treating me right he doesn't see porn as a problem. He kept saying, "is it the porn or the neglect"? I tried to explain to him that the porn is a combination of the problem. I don't have a problem with porn. I have a problem with him and how he behaves when he's looking at porn. I tried to tell him it's like being an alcoholic. You can't keep drinking and claim you're fixing the problem just because your being nice to your wife. How can he seriously think it's okay to just keep looking? He said he's so tired of hearing about how he's treated me for four years. He said he's going to call the doctor tomorrow just get this to end. He's tired of having the talk and the emotional strain. He claims that I invaded his privacy by putting something on his computer and now I am a liar in the relationship, too so I am also to blame for our problems. He doesn't understand why I needed him to make the call to the doctor on his own. He doesn't understand why I needed him to read the book on his own. Nothing he's done to stop what has happened or to show me that he fully understands how he's made me feel (he's even said he can't fully empathize with what I feel) hasn't been on his own. Every step he's taken has been because I've pushed him into a corner. He feels that that is normal. He calls it "intervention" and that any person that has an addiction has to have that happen for them to have the light bulb go off. This man is thirty-three years old. I feel like I'm dealing with someone that has multiple personalities. On one hand when we're not talking about the porn he's loving and affectionate and dotes on every need. As soon as anything comes up about the porn or the way he's treated me for the last four years it's a huge issue. It's my fault for bringing it up. It's my fault for not just enjoying life. Someone tell me I'm not crazy. I feel like an idiot. I feel pathetic that I'm in this situation and he can be so convincing and so analytical that he makes it seem like the way I've handled things was wrong. That this is how it works. That I am to blame for some of this. He said I needed to stop playing the victim and bringing up how he's treated me for four years. It's so easy to come on here and look at someone's problem and give them some advice. I've done it many times. It's so much easier when it's someone else's life. Someone kick me in the ass. Someone tell me that I'm acting weak by putting up with this. Someone tell me something. Anything to wake me up.
uriel Posted July 5, 2004 Posted July 5, 2004 You're focusing on the addictive dimension of your husband's porn use, and I think that's right. He's obviously got some dysfunction if he's preferring porn to being intimate with you, lying about his use, and putting his continued use ahead of your marriage. What bothers me most for your sake is his emotional insensitivity and possibly even outright emotional abuse of you (if he's name-calling, showing contempt, and belittling you). At the very least, he's putting the blame on you, saying your emotional needs are unreasonable, and putting you on a sex schedule that makes you feel undesirable. You need couples therapy right now and probably individual therapy for him as well. If he won't do the individual therapy, I'd demand couples therapy as a last measure before legal separation and divorce. No -- you're not crazy. You're unhappy in the marriage, and you have reason to be. You've already tried to cope with this for four years, you say, with no lasting results. Time to get outside help and move on if he's not willing to make a real commitment to change. -- uriel
Butterfly_Queen Posted July 6, 2004 Posted July 6, 2004 Hi, I agree 100% with uriel. I have had this same type of problem before as well and my H just called a thearpist last week after over a year of telling me he was going to call about counseling. My H's accuse was that he was ashamed or embarrassed by his addiction. That may be the case and its understandable, but i had to put my foot down and tell him to get over the shamefullnes and swallow some of that pride if our marriage meant anything to him. I'm so sorry you're going through this. It is hard. My H also gave me the accuse about how he didn't need a counselor and that he could knock the addiction himself. Well, that doesn't work. Most of the time people with any type of addictions need some kind of help. I have been going to a counsleor myself for almost a year now on how to help myself cope. My H did make the call to see about talking to a counsleor but hasn't made an appoinment yet, so we shall see how long that takes. I hope all works out for you.
Author Olivia_19742004 Posted July 6, 2004 Author Posted July 6, 2004 Thanks for the comments. I'm filing for divorce. I was trying very hard to be the understanding wife until he decided to bombard me with claims that I'm a significant part of the problem. I'll take blame for letting this continue. I'll take blame for getting into the relationship in the first place. I'll even take blame for looking at his computer to see if he was lying to me. But I'm sure as hell not taking blame for him looking at porn and masturbating.
Butterfly_Queen Posted July 6, 2004 Posted July 6, 2004 Oh Olivia, I'm so sorry, and don't you think for one minute this is your fault, because its not. He is saying all that crap to you about it being your fault, you're to blame and all that as an excuse. What a coward, its a shame he can't own up to whats going on in his marriage and take responsibilty for the fact he had a hand in it too. Maybe you're better off without him after all. Once again, I'm sorry you're going through this. Best of luck and keep us posted.
faux Posted July 7, 2004 Posted July 7, 2004 After carefully reading both of your posts (This and the one that you linked), I must say that it appears that the issue here is not porn, or any form of addiction. Again, I carefully analyzed the information you provided, and it seems as though you have a few things going on with yourself, which are proving quite detrimental to your relationship. File for divorce if you want to, but I am not certain I can agree with your views on this situation. If you want to wake up, maybe look into therapy for yourself. I am not saying that only one person is to blame here. There are obviously issues from both your husband and yourself which are causing problems. I do not believe that pornography is one of them.
blue17 Posted July 7, 2004 Posted July 7, 2004 There are a couple things I noticed that you mentioned.... "He does acknowledge some form of problem because he lies about it and has (up until a month ago)preferred porn to sharing intimacy with me." So right there, you admit that he is trying to solve his problem. In your own words, you just said that he prefers being with you than his porn. As long as that is the case, what is the big deal about the whole thing? Many guys look at porn on a regular basis, even when they are in relationships. They are attracted to the physical qualities of the pornstars, nothing more. When guys use it they have no emotional attachment, and use it to relieve stress, and sometimes boredom. You also mention that he says he was partially blaming you for his problem. Well.....I can't really blame him for suggesting it since that is what the book is saying. It's not like he is looking for a scapegoat, but when you read in a reliable book that it may not be entirely his fault, he is open to explore all options. I think the main problem is that he says he will stop looking at it, but then continues to do so. I don't think its about the porn so much (since we established he's spending more time with you)...but rather the fact that he has lied a lot about his use. That would irritate me too.....if someone lied about something over and over. You have a reason to be upset...but like many guys...when you are so used to looking at porn its hard to stop at a snap of a finger.
Author Olivia_19742004 Posted July 7, 2004 Author Posted July 7, 2004 It's not just the porn. You're exactly right. It's also comments like this: "I don't have a high libido" - But he jerks off every day "I don't think you're sexual" - But I want sex every day "I'd <insert sexual fantasy> if you wanted to but it won't do **** for me" - But he'll experience fantasies with porn "Sex isn't a priority to me" - But porn is "I'm vanilla" - His comment when I asked if we can try different things sexually "People with fetishes have issues." - But his porn isn't a fetish.. "Porn is personal and not a couple activity" - His response to me asking to share porn with me. "I don't have any" - His response to me asking if he'd like to share some of his fantasies "I'm not really into lingerie" - His response to my wearing lingerie "I can't have sex in the morning, it makes me too tired" - But he can stay up late jerking off "I can't have sex at night. I'm too tired" - Okay but go jerk off when I go to bed "We can plan to have sex after I get all the things I want to do done" - Okay..but won't you be too tired then? "I'm not in the mood for sex. I need to read my book" - Okay. "You need to see a therapist and find out why you keep getting into ****ed up relationships" - And you want me to stay? "Every time something is missing it's your fault" - Even after he finds he moved it. "You're still here aren't you? You haven't walked out the door, yet" - His comment to me saying I not going to put up with him talking so nasty to me. "Because I'm an a**h***" - His comment when I asked why he prefers to jerk off when I would LOVE to have sex. If he wanted to jerk off twenty times a day but treated me as though he loved me and I was beautiful and shared intimacy with me every day I'd have to problem with the porn. If he didn't lie to my face when he looked me in the eyes, I'd have no problem with the porn. If he touched my body like he loved it I'd have no problem with the porn. I have always been very open and communicated my feelings in my relationship. I have always told him if he ever met someone he wanted to have sex with that all he had to do was talk to me about it. I don't think I own this man. I don't think he should be with me and no one the rest of his life. I'm very understanding of human nature. I'm very understanding of individual needs. I'm very understanding of the porn. What I don't understand is why it is acceptable to treat someone the way he's treated me. Why is it acceptable for a husband to see his wife crying because he hasn't touched her sexually in over a month and all he can say is, "it's not something to cry over"? I may have low self-esteem because of how I've grown up. I may get angry and think I'm fat one day. I have internalized a lot of what has happened. But that doesn't excuse what he's done. The only thing he did was try to talk to me more and initiate sex. It really takes more than just ****ing me more often to fix everything that has happened for four years. He said he was an addict. He told me he needed help. He said he has done this since he was around 9 years old. He was the one that said he has seen relationships fade off because of his increased porn. He said he was going to go to therapy. He said he bought the book and was going to read it. He didn't. And he continued to look at porn. But what I'm hearing is that I need to just ignore all this. I need to just deal with this and figure out why it's bothering me so much. I need to figure out why I have low self-esteem and figure out why his porn is such a problem. I just don't understand how some of you don't get it. Take the porn away. Make it disappear and then tell me. Do you think what they're doing is acceptable? Do you think the disgust, hatred and anger that we see in their eyes when we ask them why they don't want to make love to us is acceptable? I understand things even less than I did yesterday..
Kasey70 Posted July 7, 2004 Posted July 7, 2004 Hi Olivia, you will get a lot of different reponses. You will have people tell you its no big deal and others will say that it is. Only you can decide what you need to do and whats best for your relationship. Everyone has different opinons or views on different things. You will get helpful advice sometimes and other times advice that just doesn't make sense. Its all in how others see things. These forums are great for asking questions and getting advice, however sometimes to many opinons can feed peoples imaginations in the wrong way. I have found it to be helpful before, but at the same time a one on one counselor is sometimes the best bet, because you get one person telling you what you may or may not need to do, not everyone under the sun. Once again plesae continue to post here if you feel the need too. Like I said it can be helpful. Also try to do the counseling thing as well, if you haven't already done so. If your H wont go, thats on him, but at least get some help for yourself, for your own sanity. Best of luck.
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