Men think they know when a woman fakes...but they really don't.

[RedRobin]

Your right RR.

 

This exchange between Ninja and OP doesnt at all say shed trade up her bf in a second if a better option sprung up.

 

Saying "lets hope that happens to me to", when "that" is dumping her bf for a different option 6 months down the road, clearly doesnt show her lack of commitment to her man.

 

Youre right...I was wrong...shes clearly committed and deeply and truly loves her boyfriend.

 

How off the mark was I? /sarcasm

 

I believe she has said many times that she has never had an orgasm with a man.

 

Not hot ones... not older ones...

 

She is choosing personality first, and seems to be reconciling herself with being non-orgasmic. For those who have orgasms easily, I realize it sounds sad. I and many others have suggested she talk to a counselor, do some reading, etc...

 

Do I think that is permanent? Who knows.

 

What I do know is that people break up for all kinds of reasons. You are single, right? Why is that? Yes, we know. You don't 'settle'. Your choice.

 

I do recall from another thread though, that you are worried about what your future wife's body will look like after children. You plan on dumping your future wife if a better deal comes along with a hotter body?

 

Is that what you are afraid of??

 

I sure hope you tell her that before she decides to marry you and especially before she has your kids!! And you are all wrapped around the axle for a woman faking an orgasm? Something that doesn't even affect the guy?

 

Give me a break...

Edited July 3, 2012 by RedRobin

[kaylan]

I believe she has said many times that she has never had an orgasm with a man.

 

Not hot ones... not older ones...

OMG ITS NOT ABOUT THE ORGASM.

 

Its about her enjoyment of sex with her bf...which she has none. Theres no attraction either. Thats a problem. She knows she could definitely enjoy sex better with a man shes attracted to...and her post makes it seem like shed leave this guy if the opportunity for a better catch presented itself.

 

Thats not fair to her bf.

 

She is choosing personality first, and seems to be reconciling herself with being non-orgasmic. For those who have orgasms easily, I realize it sounds sad. I and many others have suggested she talk to a counselor, do some reading, etc...

 

Do I think that is permanent? Who knows.

Are you dense? I am not, nor have I ever said choosing personality first was bad. I said personality was equally important as sexuality in a relationship. Of which they have NO chemistry and she has NO attraction for him. A big part of her being non orgasmic is she keeps sleeping with men she isnt attracted to you. Big DUH moment dont you think.

 

Yet youd rather her settle for unattractive men when there are attractive good men out there. I dont believe she needs a counselor. I believe she needs a man she feels lust for.

What I do know is that people break up for all kinds of reasons. You are single, right? Why is that? Yes, we know. You don't 'settle'. Your choice.

Im single also because Im 25 and am not ready to settle down with a girlfriend yet.

I do recall from another thread though, that you are worried about what your future wife's body will look like after children. You plan on dumping your future wife if a better deal comes along with a hotter body?

 

Is that what you are afraid of??

I think "attraction fears" are a valid concern for many people when it comes to relationships. Why? Because a lot of us know that many folks let themselves go in relationships or dont try to maintain themselves after kids, be they male or female.

 

Sure the emotional and mental connection might be the same...but the physical attraction was a part of the package...and if someones emotional or mental attitude changed to their partner...wouldnt you expect them to have concern? So is it wrong to be concerned about losing sexual attraction for your mate...when sexual chemistry is as much of an important bond to relationships as the other parts can be?

 

And no...I wouldnt dump my wife because I wouldnt have to worry about her letting herself go. I date fit and active women. Women who pride themselves on being sexy and healthy...so "letting oneself go" wont be an issue for my wife or I in my later years. I dont want to be all unhealthy, overweight, sluggish, and beckoning death the way many Americans do.

 

 

I sure hope you tell her that before she decides to marry you and especially before she has your kids!! And you are all wrapped around the axle for a woman faking an orgasm? Something that doesn't even affect the guy?

 

Give me a break...

How does faking an orgasm not affect the guy? Im the one having sex with her right? You do realize plenty of women get fed up with faking and end up bailing on guys all the time right? But thats mainly her fault for not speaking up.

 

Either way, I wont have any of these problems...because Im going to be with a woman like-minded to myself. Shell be honest, open about communication, and have a desire to lead a fit healthy life. So our sex life, and emotional and mental life will be just fine.

Edited July 3, 2012 by kaylan

[Leopard]

Not everyone falls in love.

 

People who wait to fall in love die old and alone. I already know a few people like that.

 

What i'm doing is the smarter thing. After all, everyone who is suggesting to wait to fall in love or find someone for great sex is still single.

[Leopard]

"I'm 25 and not ready to settle down yet"

 

Even you Kaylan admit that you aren't ready to SETTLE, which is why you are single. You didn't say "I haven't fallen in love yet or found the right girl."

 

So there you go.

[Els]

Not everyone falls in love.

 

People who wait to fall in love die old and alone. I already know a few people like that.

 

What i'm doing is the smarter thing. After all, everyone who is suggesting to wait to fall in love or find someone for great sex is still single.

 

No, hon, many of us are not single.

 

Look, if you want to remain in a loveless R, it's entirely your prerogative. But it's something that your partner needs to know about so he isn't led on and deceived indefinitely, thinking that you love him when you do not.

[xxoo]

Not everyone falls in love.

 

People who wait to fall in love die old and alone. I already know a few people like that.

 

What i'm doing is the smarter thing. After all, everyone who is suggesting to wait to fall in love or find someone for great sex is still single.

 

I'm married. I always advise to wait to fall in love. I can't imagine how it can work long term without love.

[RedRobin]

"I'm 25 and not ready to settle down yet"

 

Even you Kaylan admit that you aren't ready to SETTLE, which is why you are single. You didn't say "I haven't fallen in love yet or found the right girl."

 

So there you go.

 

I'm also banking on the fact that (like most men) he feels he's got forever to find someone, and that his dating cache will only improve with age...

 

Can't tell you how many 'hot' men in their 40's I've come across who are now desperately trying to find spouses after they screwed through their 20's and 30's and watched all the 'good' women get snatched up.

 

Then they come here and b*tch that the only women they can find are divorced and/or with kids...

 

awwww!!!

[zengirl]

Not everyone falls in love.

 

People who wait to fall in love die old and alone. I already know a few people like that.

 

What i'm doing is the smarter thing. After all, everyone who is suggesting to wait to fall in love or find someone for great sex is still single.

 

Married, too. I would certainly advise people wait to fall in love. Being single is far better than being in an unfulfilled R and never having the chance to have a R that's right for you.

 

No, life isn't about orgasms (though they're nice), but it sounds like there are far deeper issues at work in this R and far greater chasms that are harder to bridge. You should be living your life. Not faking your life. And it sounds like you're faking a hell of a lot more than just orgasms.

[RedRobin]

I'm married. I always advise to wait to fall in love. I can't imagine how it can work long term without love.

 

Lots of people who started out in love end up divorced. Love can and does grow over time. Those who use the concept of 'love' to define commitment are missing some pieces... 'love' can mean many things to many people.

 

I know it is a foreign concept to some... but the ability and willingness to maintain a commitment are what make it work. "Love" just makes it easier for people to want to do that.

[Els]

Lots of people who started out in love end up divorced. Love can and does grow over time. Those who use the concept of 'love' to define commitment are missing some pieces... 'love' can mean many things to many people.

 

I know it is a foreign concept to some... but the ability and willingness to maintain a commitment are what make it work. "Love" just makes it easier for people to want to do that.

 

This is like saying that people who take care of their health eventually die or fall sick too, so why should we take care of our health?

 

Yes, plenty of Rs that started out with love ended up collapsing... often because one or both people fell out of love. In an R that didn't even start off with love, you don't even need to wait for them to fall out of love - they never were to begin with.

 

Love can mean many different things to many different people, but when someone affirmatively says that they are not in love, without a second thought, it's pretty safe to say that they're not in love in ANY way, period. If they were, they would have thought that they are, because, as you said, love means THAT to them.

[xxoo]

I know it is a foreign concept to some... but the ability and willingness to maintain a commitment are what make it work. "Love" just makes it easier for people to want to do that.

 

Love makes it a pleasure

[RedRobin]

Yes, plenty of Rs that started out with love ended up collapsing... often because one or both people fell out of love. In an R that didn't even start off with love, you don't even need to wait for them to fall out of love - they never were to begin with.

 

Do you have any friends who are from traditional societies with arranged marriages?

 

I do. I used to think it was this horrible thing where families tied up the man or woman and dragged them kicking and screaming to the altar (I'm sure it does happen, so I'm not minimizing the worst of it...)

 

In the highest castes, that is not how it works though... they find people they have things in common with, who they have some reasonable assurance they could grow to love. They don't base their life-time decisions on infatuation and lust. THAT is what I'm talking about.

 

These marriages are remarkably long-lived.

 

I could be wrong, but I've always gotten the sense that the OP feels she could grow to love her BF. If she were completely repulsed by her BF, then I imagine that wouldn't be the case.

 

That's all I'm saying...

[RedRobin]

Love makes it a pleasure

 

I agree... and in a culture where marriage isn't required in order to survive, then why not go for something that is easy and pleasurable?

 

I will also say, that the requirement that alot of people have for the 'feelings' of love... is the biggest reason we have so many divorces. They go from relationship to relationship to maintain that 'fix' instead of 'settling' for attachment love... which is totally different than romantic love.

[xxoo]

I'm not going to comment on the arranged marriage here, but would in a thread on that topic. I do know many such couples.

 

I agree... and in a culture where marriage isn't required in order to survive, then why not go for something that is easy and pleasurable?

 

I will also say, that the requirement that alot of people have for the 'feelings' of love... is the biggest reason we have so many divorces. They go from relationship to relationship to maintain that 'fix' instead of 'settling' for attachment love... which is totally different than romantic love.

 

That happens, and is a completely different issue. Marrying someone you never loved is not an improvement, imo. Learning relationship skills to preserve love is.

 

Romantic love can last a lifetime.

[zengirl]

Do you have any friends who are from traditional societies with arranged marriages?

 

I do. I won't veer to much into that topic, but I wouldn't compare that to the OP's case. People who agree to and have arranged marriages for cultural reasons because it aligns with their values and goals are different than people who 'settle' for the best they can get, when unhappy with it, and sustain an essentially fake relationship where their dissatisfaction is unknown.

[nofool4u]

So to answer your question, yes, I need to fake to keep (him) because he will stray (he confessed he thought about cheating during that time because he felt so low and needed a sexually release and confidence boost).

 

Thats pretty damn sad that anyone would have to do something like that, or anything else for that matter, to keep someone that has cheating in their character.

 

If a woman told me they thought about cheating, I'd open the door and tell her to walk through it.

[kaylan]

"I'm 25 and not ready to settle down yet"

 

Even you Kaylan admit that you aren't ready to SETTLE, which is why you are single. You didn't say "I haven't fallen in love yet or found the right girl."

 

So there you go.

I think you are confusing the meanings of "settle" and "settle down".

 

One who SETTLES ON a partner, doesnt go for the partner they true wanted. They settle on fundemental needs and/or wants in a relationship.

 

One who SETTLES DOWN WITH a partner has decided they dont wanna do the single life thing anymore.

 

So maybe I shouldnt have used the world "settle" since it confused you...even though I used to word "down" with it. People tend to know that "settle down" just means a person is ready for a relationship. It doesnt mean they settle.

 

In my case Im not really looking for the right girl yet. But if I stumble upon a nice girl, or decide to start looking for the right girl, I wont be settling in order to settle down.

 

Understand now?

[kaylan]

I'm also banking on the fact that (like most men) he feels he's got forever to find someone, and that his dating cache will only improve with age...

 

Can't tell you how many 'hot' men in their 40's I've come across who are now desperately trying to find spouses after they screwed through their 20's and 30's and watched all the 'good' women get snatched up.

 

Then they come here and b*tch that the only women they can find are divorced and/or with kids...

 

awwww!!!

Actually I dont think my dating cache will improve with age. Because most women will be shacked up already or have baggage from previous relationships when were in our 30s and 40s. And I dont think I have forever either. I just dont sit and freaking worry about it and im not biting my nails thinking "times running out". Im enjoying my life as I see fit and Im not worried about when to find the right girl. Ill meet her when I meet her...and if I dont meet her Ill have fun dating along the way. Im not stressing it as I dont force life.

 

Why do you act so angry and bitter with your condescension toward people who dont date like you? To be honest, I know Im a catch. Im an attractive guy whos going places, so I doubt ill have an issue getting snatched up. I know thats not what you wanna hear since youre older and single at the moment. You just wish people would join your club with you it seems.

 

Excuse me for not being jaded like you and OP. I dont believe in stringing people along with lies, having them think I feel love for them, when in reality I lament about not having found love before marriage. Its just sad when OP is saying emotional and physical compatibility arent out there...and that shes basically going to get married just because.

[Leopard]

No, hon, many of us are not single.

 

Look, if you want to remain in a loveless R, it's entirely your prerogative. But it's something that your partner needs to know about so he isn't led on and deceived indefinitely, thinking that you love him when you do not.

 

But I do love him. I'm just not in love with him.

 

I'm married. I always advise to wait to fall in love. I can't imagine how it can work long term without love.

 

It can The many successful married couples that I know married for other reasons, and it never was "passionate romance".

 

I agree... and in a culture where marriage isn't required in order to survive, then why not go for something that is easy and pleasurable?

 

I will also say, that the requirement that alot of people have for the 'feelings' of love... is the biggest reason we have so many divorces. They go from relationship to relationship to maintain that 'fix' instead of 'settling' for attachment love... which is totally different than romantic love.

 

I think that's how I love him. It's attachment love, caring love, appreciation love. Not romantic, passionate, crazy love.

 

I have had that kind of love before and it was my most short lived relationship lol

 

I do. I won't veer to much into that topic, but I wouldn't compare that to the OP's case. People who agree to and have arranged marriages for cultural reasons because it aligns with their values and goals are different than people who 'settle' for the best they can get, when unhappy with it, and sustain an essentially fake relationship where their dissatisfaction is unknown.

 

But i'm not unhappy. This has been my longest and happiest relationship up to date (for many reasons).

 

I don't understand why everyone thinks you need to have a great sex life to be happy. Not everyone thinks like that. Some people prefer other qualities that make them more happy than great sex.

 

If a woman told me they thought about cheating, I'd open the door and tell her to walk through it.

 

Even if the reason was because you admitted you couldn't come with her?

Edited July 3, 2012 by Leopard

[nofool4u]

Even if the reason was because you admitted you couldn't come with her?

 

Yup. My ability to come or not has nothing to do with a woman wanting to cheat. If a woman wants to cheat because I can't come, then thats one worthless excuse making POS woman.

 

Just like if a man wants to cheat if his woman can't come. Its nothing more than an excuse to mess around.

[Leopard]

Yup. My ability to come or not has nothing to do with a woman wanting to cheat. If a woman wants to cheat because I can't come, then thats one worthless excuse making POS woman.

 

Just like if a man wants to cheat if his woman can't come. Its nothing more than an excuse to mess around.

 

Really?

 

If a man told me he couldn't orgasm with me, why would I want to be with him? I wouldn't feel so hot anymore and would want to be with a man who was actually turned on by me.

 

If he loved me and was happy otherwise, and sex didn't matter all that much, I would rather he keep his mouth shut. After all, if it's not a big deal to him, why would he burden me with knowing if it doesn't matter anyways? I would just feel worse about myself.

 

Not saying I would cheat, but if another man showed extreme interest and was attracted to me, in the right circumstances who is to say that nothing would happen? Especially since we know how much more likely (and easy) men are to get into bed with another woman.

[kaylan]

^ the irony of this last post xD

 

Dont you think your bf would feel exactly as you described OP. But you just make him live a lie =/

[Els]

Do you have any friends who are from traditional societies with arranged marriages?

 

I do. I used to think it was this horrible thing where families tied up the man or woman and dragged them kicking and screaming to the altar (I'm sure it does happen, so I'm not minimizing the worst of it...)

 

In the highest castes, that is not how it works though... they find people they have things in common with, who they have some reasonable assurance they could grow to love. They don't base their life-time decisions on infatuation and lust. THAT is what I'm talking about.

 

These marriages are remarkably long-lived.

 

I could be wrong, but I've always gotten the sense that the OP feels she could grow to love her BF. If she were completely repulsed by her BF, then I imagine that wouldn't be the case.

 

That's all I'm saying...

 

As a matter of fact, I do know people who have had arranged marriages, and I was born in such a culture myself (though things were already changing when I was born, but plenty of my older relatives had arranged marriages).

 

I agree that such marriages can possibly turn out happy in the sense that both people define happiness - security, financial support, children, societal acceptance, and having someone to rely on for practical matters (though many also don't, but the people just stay in them out of duty). But that isn't the same thing. In an arranged marriage, BOTH people know what they're getting into. They KNOW it isn't for 'love'. In the OP's case, her bf doesn't. I don't know how to explain the difference to you and the OP in a clearer manner.

 

But I do love him. I'm just not in love with him.

 

I think that's how I love him. It's attachment love, caring love, appreciation love. Not romantic, passionate, crazy love.

 

I have had that kind of love before and it was my most short lived relationship lol

 

What will you do in the future when you meet someone with whom you develop romantic, passionate, crazy love for, and you are (hypothetically) married to your current bf?

 

 

I don't understand why everyone thinks you need to have a great sex life to be happy. Not everyone thinks like that. Some people prefer other qualities that make them more happy than great sex.

 

I don't understand why you keep making this the issue. Many of our posts clearly state that this isn't all about the sex. There are way deeper issues in your R that you have yet to acknowledge. Also, even if it isn't about the sex for YOU, clearly it is for your bf, since even a couple of weeks of failed orgasm led him to consider cheating. Why can you not admit that this is a problem? It will be a problem. Deception is not a healthy foundation for a relationship, and a relationship cannot possibly be healthy if you have to perpetually deceive your partner in order to keep him from cheating. THIS is what all this is about!

[Jane2011]

I haven't read this thread.

 

(Okay, the truth is, I hardly read any of the threads I respond to, though sometimes I do heavily skim some of the later posts).

 

But, um, I don't know how a woman can fake. I can never do it. I just feel like it would be obvious I'm faking.

 

The most I do is act like I'm having a really good, impassioned time....

[Christine52]

Yes, I agree with the article..

 

For one of my partners I could only orgasm during oral sex. He took his time, and I literally had to teach him how I liked it. He was very receptive to it, and enjoyed seeing me orgasm! Other partners may not be as patient, so you need to find a lover who puts your pleasure first, and then will come after Or if he comes first, that he'll be willing to go down on you so it's mutually rewarding.