Emme Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 The above.........I'm having trouble finding the words to express my frustration and not get spanked. Why? Well.........IF you really cared about the ow, that is exactly what you would want for her..............but you clearly don't because you said "it's just about kills me to think about" By your own admission you strung her along for 3 freakin years......and she finally had enough and now you don't want her to be healthy and happy??? Really?? Wow, the selfishness you exude is appalling and your wife, even more so. When you start exhibiting some compassion and some inkling of doing the right thing here then I can extend some compassion for you but until then, I can't. Breathe LG... Breathe honey... Breathe. His post was hard to take but in the end he's worse off than many of us. He needs all the help he can get.
findingnemo Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 I think the important thing is to figure out how you can be happy and satisfied with life on your own. What I mean is that you need to get to a point where the person you love doesn't really define you. Sometimes we want our partners to be perfect, to be the rock, always be the solution to our inner loneliness. Many times this only happens for a short time. Then we are with someone we love but need something from another person. The guilt of cheating makes us feel like shyte...so we remain essentially unfulfilled. I was the OW with a MM who felt just like you did. At least that's how he explained it. I couldn't and still can't bring myself to be angry at him. I know what leaving his W and kids would have cost him. I'm sure I'd have stayed M if it was me. I moved on...but I loved him still. He stayed M but says he loves me still. The A ended a long time ago but sometimes I can't help but wonder how it can be that he loves two women. I got M but didn't really love my H. I also discussed "moving on" with my MM. He had an almost real time update on how my R was going. We basically continued an emotional A without the usual declarations of love. 8 years later, I still have those feelings. But you know what, I'm happy I ended the A. I'm happy that I did move on and have lovely children. And most of the time, I'm perfectly happy on my own. I don't need him to feel fulfilled. How I feel about him is something I've accepted...it is what it is. It's freedom. I can date, I can be single for long periods and I'm fine. That's what I want for you. Love isn't supposed to bring anyone such pain, confusion, self-disgust. Love is a wonderful thing. So the fact that you have all these negative feelings about the situation tells me the problem lies within you. It's a hard thing to admit but it can be the key to freedom and inner joy. Go to IC first. Talk it out. Figure out what those thoughts you have really mean. Then decide what you will do. Your W deserves to be loved fully. The OW deserves to be loved fully. YOU deserve to be loved fully. Find out why there seems to be so much love around you and yet, you aren't happy or satisfied. Admitting this doenst make you a loser or a wimp. It makes you human. Acknowledging you have a problem is the first step to solving it. You have realized this and so came here. Now it's time to tackle the problem. First IC, then put that love you have for your W to good use. Give her the freedom of choice. It's the best gift you can give her. Also do the same for your OW. You can only do this when you know what it is you want. Thinking you're a jerk, a selfish person etc won't solve the problem. The problem has made you a jerk. It made you selfish. So what exactly is the problem? Good luck. I suspect you are starting a journey of self discovery that will be painful but will lead to real fulfillment for you. 2
Author PuntserVA Posted June 7, 2012 Author Posted June 7, 2012 YOU are the one who said you strung her along and now you are saying that you didn't because you encouraged her to move............the contradictions aren't making sense. Which is it? Also it sounds like she has figured herself out and she is moving on, I hope you have some courtesy and respect for her choices now and you leave her alone. It would be wrong of you to bust into her life at this point. I let her move, so clearly I wasn't trapping her all THAT much. And I'm not trying to bust into her life -- she's actually telling me her feelings haven't changed and that she still wants me in her life.
MissBee Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 I think the important thing is to figure out how you can be happy and satisfied with life on your own. What I mean is that you need to get to a point where the person you love doesn't really define you. Sometimes we want our partners to be perfect, to be the rock, always be the solution to our inner loneliness. Many times this only happens for a short time. Then we are with someone we love but need something from another person. The guilt of cheating makes us feel like shyte...so we remain essentially unfulfilled. I was the OW with a MM who felt just like you did. At least that's how he explained it. I couldn't and still can't bring myself to be angry at him. I know what leaving his W and kids would have cost him. I'm sure I'd have stayed M if it was me. I moved on...but I loved him still. He stayed M but says he loves me still. The A ended a long time ago but sometimes I can't help but wonder how it can be that he loves two women. I got M but didn't really love my H. I also discussed "moving on" with my MM. He had an almost real time update on how my R was going. We basically continued an emotional A without the usual declarations of love. 8 years later, I still have those feelings. But you know what, I'm happy I ended the A. I'm happy that I did move on and have lovely children. And most of the time, I'm perfectly happy on my own. I don't need him to feel fulfilled. How I feel about him is something I've accepted...it is what it is. It's freedom. I can date, I can be single for long periods and I'm fine. That's what I want for you. Love isn't supposed to bring anyone such pain, confusion, self-disgust. Love is a wonderful thing. So the fact that you have all these negative feelings about the situation tells me the problem lies within you. It's a hard thing to admit but it can be the key to freedom and inner joy. Go to IC first. Talk it out. Figure out what those thoughts you have really mean. Then decide what you will do. Your W deserves to be loved fully. The OW deserves to be loved fully. YOU deserve to be loved fully. Find out why there seems to be so much love around you and yet, you aren't happy or satisfied. Admitting this doenst make you a loser or a wimp. It makes you human. Acknowledging you have a problem is the first step to solving it. You have realized this and so came here. Now it's time to tackle the problem. First IC, then put that love you have for your W to good use. Give her the freedom of choice. It's the best gift you can give her. Also do the same for your OW. You can only do this when you know what it is you want. Thinking you're a jerk, a selfish person etc won't solve the problem. The problem has made you a jerk. It made you selfish. So what exactly is the problem? Good luck. I suspect you are starting a journey of self discovery that will be painful but will lead to real fulfillment for you. This is such a beautiful and true post findingnemo. 1
Author PuntserVA Posted June 7, 2012 Author Posted June 7, 2012 I like it too. IC is independent counselor, right? Just checking.
Spark1111 Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 I like it too. IC is independent counselor, right? Just checking. yes, Individual counselor, as opposed to MC, marriage counselor. Admitting your a jerk, while it may satisfy some, or even yourself, is still a deflection from finding out WHY you are a jerk. I am not being snarky here. I am trying to point out a very important nuance. I think you need to figure out what you need in a relationship. You need to communicate that to your signifigant other, whether spouse of girlfriend, in a clear concise manner so that you do not go around hurting others and hurting yourself. So unless you commit to the really hard work of finding out the why of your jerkiness, you may never get to internal happiness and peace and you may leave a string of broken hearts and unfulfilled promises and vows in your wake. Why live like that? If it was really working for you, you wouldn't be seeking advice from all of us. So you must realize that this path is not only unsatisfactory to you, but to those you are in relationships with. What do you plan to do about it? What is your goal here? 2
Emme Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 PuntserVA Question, by any chance do you suffer from ADD or ADHD?
pteromom Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 If you really love her, you should let her go and commit herself fully to her fiance. Yes, it will hurt, but it is time to stop being selfish and allow her to go find some happiness. As for your marriage, that's up to you. The decision should not be made based on an OW. It should be made based on how your marriage meets your needs, and if not, whether you feel it is possible to work on it so it does meet your needs. Either work on your marriage or work on a divorce. 1
Author PuntserVA Posted June 7, 2012 Author Posted June 7, 2012 PuntserVA Question, by any chance do you suffer from ADD or ADHD? I don't know. I was going to answer earlier but I got distracted.
nofool4u Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 I accept that I'm a jerk and selfish, and I'm not really looking for compassion. I'm the cheater, I'm a jerk, so fine. Condemn me all you want. But try to also remember that I actually encouraged her to move across the country, and even understood when she was dating. I have to ask the question, so what? What does encouraging this OW to move across the country have to do with what you are doing to your wife?
pteromom Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 With a man she doesn't fully love? This is a receipt for disaster. Two people with the wrong people. How do you know she doesn't fully love him?
MissBee Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 Serial monogamy. Anyone heard of that? The problem is that the OP seems to feel an obligation to stay in his present marriage even though it is time to move on. I bet if the OP lived in my country where serial monogamy is the name of the game he wouldn't be having any problems at all. How do you know it is time for him to move on?
MissBee Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 No need to enlighten me on my simplicity. I do understand very well and it's still cake eating as I see it. Simply put.......he keeps one woman (his wife) in the dark and by his own admission he strung another (ow) along. He didn't/couldn't commit to either one and apparently has a history of it. Why......he is the one who needs to figure it out. One should encourage him to look within himself and to not continue on a cycle where he himself admits that he has self hatred and contempt. He won't find peace and happiness with someone else until he is at peace with himself. It's not complicated. Many things in life don't need complex explanations of dynamics and in my opinion it's an easy route to make justifications for hurting people. In society at large a lot of people don't understand the term cake eating or the longer version: "You can't have your cake and eat it too". When I was a kid, I didn't get it...it made no sense to me. What was the point of having a cake if you couldn't eat it, I thought! :laugh:Later on I realized that term and the shorter term cake-eating is about trying to simultaneously have two incompatible things. It's tricky wording though, so it's easily misinterpreted. The definition of cake-eating is to have something both ways. That said...a MM who chooses to not leave his wife and also have an OW is having it both ways. If you choose a parallel relationship, you're having it both ways. I don't see the argument or confusion about that. For whatever reason: fear, cowardice, selfishness, confusion, mental illness, love, money, whatever....someone is choosing to have something both ways. It's very simple. We all cake eat at some point or another. But yess those pushing for him to be with the OW are missing the point....being with someone else won't solve his problems. His wife or OW cannot solve this problem. He needs to look within himself, focus on himself and address his own issues before he can be a good partner to someone else. That's the only useful solution IMO. 3
whichwayisup Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 Do counselling on your own. Maybe it's time to take a huge step back, separate from your wife and keep no contact with your OW. BE ALONE for a while to figure out what you want/who you want and then go from there.
Stephanie Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 I merged the duplicate thread posted in the OM/OW forum for two reasons: 1) Cross posting threads isn't allowed 2) Infidelity is the correct forum for a WS to post a new thread about his situation. Thanks
Furious Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 My wife is a perfectly lovely woman who, by all accounts, adores me. We've been married five years, together for nearly 10. Our relationship started with an emotional affair, though -- and I hope this is not TMI -- we did not have intercourse until our wedding night. This marriage is tons better than my first one. We do not have children together and are not planning to do so. (I'm 50, she's nearly 40). I think most people would describe our marriage as good. But ... At work four years ago I became emotionally and then physically involved with another woman. Two years ago, I encouraged this woman to move across the country back to where she grew up, and helped her get that job. But we have kept up our relationship throughout this time, including meeting a few times on my business trips, and yes, having sex. Fire away. In your post you mention that you've been married for five years and together for ten. You also say that your affair began four years ago. So the affair began only one year after you married. Were you feeling trapped by the finality of marriage? I think it's important to look back at just after your wedding to get a better grasp on your mind frame at that time. 1
MissBee Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 (edited) Having a full-blown relationship with someone other than the wife says so IMO. Thanks for that. I think it is indeed time to end all his relationships or put them on pause and focus on a relationship with himself. Edited June 8, 2012 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
MissBee Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 In your post you mention that you've been married for five years and together for ten. You also say that your affair began four years ago. So the affair began only one year after you married. Were you feeling trapped by the finality of marriage? I think it's important to look back at just after your wedding to get a better grasp on your mind frame at that time. This is astute, I agree.
Author PuntserVA Posted June 8, 2012 Author Posted June 8, 2012 I guess I'm going to have no choice but to move on. I am figuring out the path to get a counselor to fix what is wrong inside of me. I'm not sleeping or eating well, so I guess that's a sign of depression. Actions have consequences, they say, and I'm going to learn that in spades. I am fairly certain OW will move on with her wedding. If that's a mistake, it's hers to make. She loved me tremendously over the past three 1/2 years, but she also fought with me a lot, probably because she was insecure about where she stood. That's my fault no doubt, but it's contributed to the extremely low impression I have of myself now. I don't know whether or how to tell the W, but I guess I'll figure that out in due course.
skywriter Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 Good luck in your future Punter. I know how hard this must be on you. I'm not even close to be over the MM that I fell hard for. You may always carry feelings for her in your heart and that's ok. ...and yea, actions have consequences, and I hold myself responsible for my actions.
Author PuntserVA Posted June 8, 2012 Author Posted June 8, 2012 She intends to get married, but she wrote this to me: "I love you because you are the most incredible person that I've ever met. Smart, funny, true, genuine, giving. I've never ever connected with someone the way I do with you. And I never will." She also says she doesn't understand how I would be so upset when before her engagement I took trips with my wife and, to her, was "happily married."
Spark1111 Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 She intends to get married, but she wrote this to me: "I love you because you are the most incredible person that I've ever met. Smart, funny, true, genuine, giving. I've never ever connected with someone the way I do with you. And I never will." She also says she doesn't understand how I would be so upset when before her engagement I took trips with my wife and, to her, was "happily married." Hmmm..... Are you happily married? But still had an affair? I think she is letting you down gently....as the dumper usually does. It leaves the door open to re-kindle your relationship in the event her marriage grows dull (all those compliments.) Or, you were a fling for her also. No great emotional investment since you were happily married and not leaving your wife for her. She's moved on. What about you? Are you going to try and make your marriage stronger? Or look for a new affair partner?
Furious Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 She intends to get married, but she wrote this to me: "I love you because you are the most incredible person that I've ever met. Smart, funny, true, genuine, giving. I've never ever connected with someone the way I do with you. And I never will." She also says she doesn't understand how I would be so upset when before her engagement I took trips with my wife and, to her, was "happily married." Does her future husband know about you? She is going to build a life with him on a foundation of lies and that is despicable. You may be funny and smart as she says, but I think she is wrong about you being genuine and giving. Why do you both feel the need to play these games with your wife and her future husband as if they are merely pieces on a board game that they don't even know they're playing in. 2
Steen719 Posted June 8, 2012 Posted June 8, 2012 She intends to get married, but she wrote this to me: "I love you because you are the most incredible person that I've ever met. Smart, funny, true, genuine, giving. I've never ever connected with someone the way I do with you. And I never will." You may want to watch this video, posted by firemanq My Wife Knows Everything - YouTube Everyone starts out thinking the other person is wonderful and if it is long distance on top of an affair...whew! This is not reality and as funny as the video is, it is mostly true and you and your OW are playing with other people's lives and how can you think it is right to do that? She also says she doesn't understand how I would be so upset when before her engagement I took trips with my wife and, to her, was "happily married." Yeah, Ok...well....I am surprised that you can't see her manipulation of you. Your poor wife and her poor sap of a future husband. Sheesh! really? 1
Author PuntserVA Posted June 8, 2012 Author Posted June 8, 2012 Does her future husband know about you? She is going to build a life with him on a foundation of lies and that is despicable. You may be funny and smart as she says, but I think she is wrong about you being genuine and giving. Why do you both feel the need to play these games with your wife and her future husband as if they are merely pieces on a board game that they don't even know they're playing in. I don't think of it as a game, but it's a relevant question. I wish I knew the answer. I don't know how I'm going to accept myself again. And my poor wife -- she always professes her love for me and here I've screwed it up for years. I don't think I can tell her. I think I have to find myself and then try to give her a better husband than what she has. And wish the OW well. I don't think she's going to have a happy marriage, frankly, but I don't think that can be my problem any more.
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