PuntserVA Posted June 6, 2012 Posted June 6, 2012 My wife is a perfectly lovely woman who, by all accounts, adores me. We've been married five years, together for nearly 10. Our relationship started with an emotional affair, though -- and I hope this is not TMI -- we did not have intercourse until our wedding night. This marriage is tons better than my first one. We do not have children together and are not planning to do so. (I'm 50, she's nearly 40). I think most people would describe our marriage as good. But ... At work four years ago I became emotionally and then physically involved with another woman. Two years ago, I encouraged this woman to move across the country back to where she grew up, and helped her get that job. But we have kept up our relationship throughout this time, including meeting a few times on my business trips, and yes, having sex. It is, by both accounts, a love affair. I have hurt her many times by not leaving my wife. She has been dating, and two weeks ago, she got engaged. I wasn't really aware the relationship was super serious until around the time we last saw each other. The news hit me like a ton of bricks. Now I feel intense feelings for this woman, I can't stop thinking about her, and I can barely sleep. She tells me she still loves me, will always love me. "You didn't want me 100 percent," she says in explaining why she went in the direction she did. I can't imagine this woman not in my life. And she tells me she wants me to be in hers. She admits she's confused. (Personally I think that means she shouldn't get married, but I think she probably will). And she wants to see me again. Here's how I feel: -- trapped. If I left my wife, I'd be a total cad (not that I'm not already). I'd lose most of my friends, wreak total havoc on her, and I don't know if I'd be with the other woman anyway because she might not have me. Yet I can't give the other woman up, and she says she doesn't want to give me up. -- like the worst person in the world. I really hate myself. I strung this woman along for 3 years, even though I did a lot for her and it wasn't just about sex (especially since we didn't see each other much the last two years). -- hurt that this other woman didn't let me know that she was getting so serious, so I could prepare. -- like an idiot because what right did I have to do that? I'm not sure what I'm asking for her, and I'm sure tons of people will say I'm awful. Others will say for me to give up on this other woman. Maybe others will say just be patient. My wife has no clue, I'm sure. As of this moment, I'm not planning on telling her. Fire away.
woinlove Posted June 6, 2012 Posted June 6, 2012 My wife is a perfectly lovely woman who, by all accounts, adores me. We've been married five years, together for nearly 10. Our relationship started with an emotional affair, though -- and I hope this is not TMI -- we did not have intercourse until our wedding night. This marriage is tons better than my first one. We do not have children together and are not planning to do so. (I'm 50, she's nearly 40). I think most people would describe our marriage as good. But ... At work four years ago I became emotionally and then physically involved with another woman. Two years ago, I encouraged this woman to move across the country back to where she grew up, and helped her get that job. But we have kept up our relationship throughout this time, including meeting a few times on my business trips, and yes, having sex. It is, by both accounts, a love affair. I have hurt her many times by not leaving my wife. She has been dating, and two weeks ago, she got engaged. I wasn't really aware the relationship was super serious until around the time we last saw each other. The news hit me like a ton of bricks. Now I feel intense feelings for this woman, I can't stop thinking about her, and I can barely sleep. She tells me she still loves me, will always love me. "You didn't want me 100 percent," she says in explaining why she went in the direction she did. I can't imagine this woman not in my life. And she tells me she wants me to be in hers. She admits she's confused. (Personally I think that means she shouldn't get married, but I think she probably will). And she wants to see me again. Here's how I feel: -- trapped. If I left my wife, I'd be a total cad (not that I'm not already). I'd lose most of my friends, wreak total havoc on her, and I don't know if I'd be with the other woman anyway because she might not have me. Yet I can't give the other woman up, and she says she doesn't want to give me up. -- like the worst person in the world. I really hate myself. I strung this woman along for 3 years, even though I did a lot for her and it wasn't just about sex (especially since we didn't see each other much the last two years). -- hurt that this other woman didn't let me know that she was getting so serious, so I could prepare. -- like an idiot because what right did I have to do that? I'm not sure what I'm asking for her, and I'm sure tons of people will say I'm awful. Others will say for me to give up on this other woman. Maybe others will say just be patient. My wife has no clue, I'm sure. As of this moment, I'm not planning on telling her. Fire away. Your story sounds typical of someone who is not really happy and satisfied in themselves and is more likely to want something they can't have. For people in that mode, competition can really drive up their desire. If you and your affair partner decide to try to make a go of it, so the competition for each of you is out of the picture, chances are one or both of you will once again find a new affair partner. Such a life brings a lot of intensity, drama, and a mix of feel-good chemicals, desire, maybe some addiction thrown in, but not a lot of lasting happiness and satisfaction with yourself. If you want to feel better about yourself and stop hurting others in such a cruel way, at your age, you likely need therapy. You will have to change. If you do decide to go this route, since you are going to change anyway, I'd suggest you consider telling your wife to help bring about true change and not just a bandaid to get you through the current mess. If you don't want to go this route and do the work necessary to change, I think it matters a lot less than you think whether you stay with your current wife or divorce to be with your AP, or find someone new altogether.
Spark1111 Posted June 6, 2012 Posted June 6, 2012 You sound like a man who always wants what he cannot have, or always suffers from the grass is greener syndrome. Your personal life sure is complicated and has been for awhile. Do you think the reason for this is you? Because you are the one constant throughout three relationships now. I agree with your OW. If you really wanted her, you would have been with her full time. She has found a man who wants that with her. I would wish her well and turn your attentions to your second wife. What is she not providing you with that you have turned outside the marriage to another? Seeing someone a few times a year on business trips is hardly a relationship based in reality. It sounds more like a fun fantasy; might have been good while it lasted, but hey, she wants what you have: Someone who loves her enough to be there 24/7 for her. The bigger question is you, who already hads that, finds it is still not enough. Why is that? 1
whichwayisup Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 You and your wife got together due to an affair and now things are stale with her, you hooked up with another woman, allowed yourself to go down that path again. Counselling. figure it out! you owe your wife the truth so she can decide if she wants to stay married to you. Give her that opportunity or end your marriage. As for the OW, you have no right to hold her back from getting married. Let her go. It's cruel and selfish of her to hang onto you, keep the A going and still get married. What type of person does that? Think about that. Again, I say get counselling. Something is broken inside of you. 1
Capris Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 (edited) @PuntserVA I strongly recommenedyou posting your story in the "other women/other men" category. Besides that, i have to tell you, i am posting as "the other woman". I have been in an affair, a loving affair, not a sex-driven one. You said that your current wife came from a relationship that was an affair, if i understood correctly? I honestly know how you feel, from the OW point of view, but, you can not expect from the OW to NOT go on with her life. If you want her, make your discision. Bottom line for me, again, as "the other woman", you will have to think about what YOU want. You have cheated twice, if not more.Do you really want a serious relationship or do you want to live your life fooling around? The answer is in your hands, not the OW's. Lets say you ditch your wife for the OW...if you do not make it clear and true to yourself on what YOU want from other people, you will end up *AGAIN* in the same situation. So, trust me, its not what the OW wants, its what YOU want. Try to be honest with YOU first, the rest will follow. Im not going to "fire away", as i know how it is, being in an affair.Its torn up. I was torn up . Morally and as an indivisual. I cant say that what you're doing is right, yet ive done the same. These stuff happens and, you already know! Put aside your ego and think aout who you really are. Do you want a wife for life? Do you want an open marriage? Think , decide and go for whatever you have decided. Take care and consider posting this in the OW/M category. Besides what ive said to you, as the other woman, i understand. Edited June 7, 2012 by Capris
Philosoraptor Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 Well first let me say that I'm very sorry you're in this position. I do though feel worse for your wife as her life has been nothing short of a total lie. I would start by seeing a therapist and figuring out the best way to tell your wife. Be completely honest with everything and accept that your choices caused this situation. Your wife may leave, she may stay... but the best thing you can do for her is to be honest and give her the choice to not live this lie anymore.
SBC Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 Hi! I dont think you are awful...just awfully confused. In my mind, the best thing to cure a confused mind is time alone. You need to come clean to your wife, and tell her you want a divorce. Because you do want a divorce, otherwise you would not have fallen in love with another. But instead of jumping from one marriage to the next, you need time alone. Time alone to figure out who you are, and what it is you want. It is not easy, but if you can work through it, the rewards are immeasurably positive.
skywriter Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 Hi PuntserVA, Yes you do need time. Your OW, is moving on has been open and honest with you about her needs to have a normal, healthy relationship. She deserves this. I think she has moved on in a very loving way. She doesn't sound like she ever gave you an ultimatum. She just realised what she wanted and moved towards that, explaining her intentions along the way. What a lovely person she sounds like. I hope you won't try to keep her in your life. She doesn't need to continue on with you. You aren't leaving and lifes to short.
2sure Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 I left a reply last night when I was a bit cranky, and thankfully see it has been removed - hopefully before OP got up this morning and read it. I see you are struggling - no differently than anyone with a broken heart does. No cure for it, just time - as you know. But while you're waiting to heal - might want to think about addressing a few other issues. I think that something within you is making you unhappy and that your "affairs" are a form of self medication. Wouldnt it be wonderful to be free of heartbreak, free of guilt, and also free to love your present wife the way she deserves and the way not to long ago, you wanted to? 1
Radagast Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 I'm not sure what I'm asking for her, and I'm sure tons of people will say I'm awful. Others will say for me to give up on this other woman. Maybe others will say just be patient. My wife has no clue, I'm sure. As of this moment, I'm not planning on telling her. Maybe I just need time. I don't know. But I feel like my life is over. What would be your ideal outcome? If you imagine yourself in five, or ten years time, what do you see? Who do you see yourself with? Are you still with your wife? Are you with your lover? Are you with both, as you have been these last years? You need to decide what you really want in life. It seems from what you are writing here that you do not see the present situation as sustainable once she gets married, in which case you need to decide whether your current wife alone is enough for you and whether you would be happy with her and no other lover, or whether being with her would likely lead you to search out another lover to replace the one you will be losing when she marries. Or whether you'd like to make a last-ditch attempt to be with your lover full-time, if she would have you, by you leaving your current wife and she leaving her fiance and the two of you trying a full-time relationship with each other. From what you have written here it is hard to guess which way you are leaning, so I am guessing that you are not sure yourself. In which case I would suggest some counselling to speak through the issues to find out where your heart really lies. It is unfair to yourself and to whoever you are with to continue in this state of confusion. You will likely become depressed unless you are able to resolve this adequately. I hope you can find your answers within yourself and make your decisions and follow your passion. Living life in grey in a technicolour world would be a great pity. Good luck. 4
Owl Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 My wife, shortly after the end of her EA and at the beginning of our reconciliation, came across a quote attributed to Confuscious..."No matter where you go, go there with all of your heart". Radagast is right. You need to figure out what it really is that you want here. Your marriage, or your affair partner. Choose which one truly is the relationship you HAVE TO HAVE in your life. Then...end the other one first, before pursuing the one you chose. And..."go there with all of your heart". 4
MissBee Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 Your lack of choices and continued cake eating indicates very selfish self centered behavior and conflict avoidance. By your own admission stringing one woman along for 3 years and keeping your wife in the dark. I think you need to seek some ic and find out why you have chosen to hurt the people you profess to love and also why you have gotten yourself into a situation in which you even say that you hate yourself. Until you address what is inside of you that sabotages yourself and hurts people you proclaim to love, you need to be alone. I also think you should tell your wife the truth so she gets a choice about her life with you and if she wants to stand by you while you figure it out or if she wants to close the door. Don't contact ow either, let her go and I just hope she can open her eyes to how badly you've treated her and completely shut the door. To reiterate, fix what is broken within yourself, tell your wife what you've posted here and don't contact the ow. To fail to address your brokenness will only cause you more self inflicted pain down the road. I oughta know. I agree... He had an emotional affair and met his wife....and now while with his wife he had another affair. Simply finding a new partner or marrying your affair partner doesn't address your problems...as it is not the other person or the marriage, but you. You need to address how you allow yourself, more than once, to enter into inappropriate relationships while with another. I do not believe that going after the OW is somehow a solution...as I am sure you love her so much now, just like you loved your wife so much when she was your EA partner...then once you have that person, what next? You have admitted your selfishness in the situation and you cannot expect that this OW should put life on hold for you. You don't want to leave your wife, you feel you have a good marriage, yet you don't want the OW to move on. It doesn't work like that....well it can, if the OW allows it, but since she has chosen to move on, you have to respect that and put your own feelings aside. 1
nofool4u Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 But ... At work four years ago I became emotionally and then physically involved with another woman. We'd have lunch, go out sometimes, play golf together. We just had the best time all the time. And, I'll admit, having great sex. No more needs to be said. You don't have children with your wife, so that makes it especially easy to set her free so she can move on with her life before she wastes her youth, since she is still fairly young. Here's how I feel: -- trapped. You are far from trapped. You have no children together, and dare I say very little assets in the short time you've been married to really have to fight over in court. You can leave easily If I left my wife, I'd be a total cad (not that I'm not already). I'd lose most of my friends, Sorry, but that isn't your wife's problem. Are you seriously suggesting that you fool your wife into thinking you have a real marriage when all you want to do is be with this other woman? In my book, that is mental cruelty. wreak total havoc on her Trust me, that would be nothing compared to if you did this later on after her 30's, and possibly 40's have passed her by. She is still relatively young, and she needs to get out there and find someone else before you waste the younger years of her life. and I don't know if I'd be with the other woman anyway because she might not have me. Once again, that isn't your wife's problem. That is just the chance you'll have to take if you want to do right by your wife. And doing right by your wife means setting her free. -- like the worst person in the world. I really hate myself. Deeply. I clarly strung this woman along for 3 years Sorry, but thats just too bad for her. She knew you were married. Only person you are really stringing along is your wife. I'm not sure what I'm asking for her, and I'm sure tons of people will say I'm awful. Others will say for me to give up on this other woman. Maybe others will say just be patient. No, I'm saying set your wife free so she can find someone that is true to her. Don't waste anymore of time or years off her young life. 4
Spark1111 Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 Punter..... Imagine every action and emotion you are expressing here for the OW, and now imagine if your wife behaved that way with another man you knew nothing about for the last three years. What would you do? Would that hurt you? Would you forgive her? Try to make it work with her? Be a better spouse? Or set her free? What does Punter want? If you really loved your OW, why did you stay married to your wife? If you really loved your wife, why did string the OW along for so many years? Do you know what you want in a long-term committed relationship? 2
TigerCub Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 I've seen this before. MM/MW who come here after their OW/OM has moved on. Their pain seems to be never-ending. If there is any chance for you to save your relationship with your OW, I recommend you take that chance wholeheartedly. You ARE going to regret it otherwise. Ditch the marriage and go after her! That is my recommendation. Which OW? His current wife was his OW at some point. And look what he's done to her now. I'm just saying that OP seems to have some need/void in him that he can't fill and so he thinks that this NEXT OW will be the answer. So even if he leaves his wife for this OW, I predict that a little while after, he will go out searching for yet another OW to fill whatever void that's inside him. I'm not saying that affairs aren't based on love and that OP doesn't love both women, I just think that he needs to go to counseling to get to the root of why he keeps doing what he does. OP. If your OW does get married, I urge you to leave her lone. If you insist on remaining in her life, it will just complicate things and drag out both of your healing processes. Also, personally I don't think your OW should get married at all if she's still in love with you - that's completely unfair to the husband to be - but I guess it is what it is. Very sad situation. I hope you do get some counseling and find some peace. 4
MissBee Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 Which OW? His current wife was his OW at some point. And look what he's done to her now. I'm just saying that OP seems to have some need/void in him that he can't fill and so he thinks that this NEXT OW will be the answer. So even if he leaves his wife for this OW, I predict that a little while after, he will go out searching for yet another OW to fill whatever void that's inside him. I'm not saying that affairs aren't based on love and that OP doesn't love both women, I just think that he needs to go to counseling to get to the root of why he keeps doing what he does. I hope you do get some counseling and find some peace. I couldn't agree more! The idea that if he just somehow goes off to be with his OW and divorce his wife, all will be well, makes no sense in relation to the rest of his story. That advice is the Hollywood version and not realistic. He has to come to grips with his own issues and why he has more than once "fallen inlove" while in another relationship. That is the only thing that will help the situation overall....as simply finding a new woman is a temporary solution to what may be a chronic problem.
eleanorrigby Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 Just go ahead and tell your wife what is going on. She was an OW and is hip to the game, she knows how these things work. 2
jwi71 Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 Get IC and a D. The problem is you OP. Fix yourself first then consider trying to have an R with another. The only way the cyclical nature of your M's stops is if YOU stop it. Until you look internally, running off to marry yet another OW only perpetuates this for you. 1
Emme Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 You really took a bullet to the heart. I know the feeling. What I see is a man who looks outside his relationship for stimulation. You don't look to your partner for fulfillment. You did it with your now wife and this OW. That's something for you to work on. You'll be fine. I have a feeling that you will be able to move on with your life if she does marry this man. You might not have ownership over her as you would like but that just means the dynamic of the relationship is changing. I don't see where you will suffer. You can still have contact with her to ease into this new transition in your life. I believe that she was fair with you more so than you were with her. Be grateful that she even acknowledges your feelings to let you know what's going on in her life. Personally I wouldn't have told you anything. You have now had this woman and now its time to let her go. You can do it. Be mature and let go. It's the another stage in life where you learn not everything is about you. Be selfless. You have had all these years with your wife and was dedicated. Let her have a life with a man who wants her 100%. Completely and totally. Your 25% isn't enough. I don't know if you want to walk away completely. That might be too much for you. If it is, slowly give this woman a chance at love. If her marriage doesn't work then she'll know. It's already sad that she has more devotion to you than her soon to be husband. You never thought she was good enough, so let go. She has found someone who thinks the world of her. Give her a chance. I'm sorry for your pain. I hope it get easier with every day.
Author PuntserVA Posted June 7, 2012 Author Posted June 7, 2012 Thank you Emme. That's pretty good advice. I do need to work on me, clearly. I have a big problem. For all the other posters who referenced my wife, I will say that my first marriage was a LOT worse than this current one. I do need to explore what caused me to stray -- do I just have lousy character? -- but in some sense I feel worse this time because there really is so little excuse for what I did. And yet, the OW is still there. I think she'll get married. And probably move on with her life, and have kids and be happier in a healthy relationship. Which right now just kills me to think about. I'm such a jerk. 1
eleanorrigby Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 I'm such a jerk. So what is your plan to remedy this?
TigerCub Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 Thank you Emme. That's pretty good advice. I do need to work on me, clearly. I have a big problem. For all the other posters who referenced my wife, I will say that my first marriage was a LOT worse than this current one. I do need to explore what caused me to stray -- do I just have lousy character? -- but in some sense I feel worse this time because there really is so little excuse for what I did. And yet, the OW is still there. I think she'll get married. And probably move on with her life, and have kids and be happier in a healthy relationship. Which right now just kills me to think about. I'm such a jerk. I know you're in so much pain, but at least its good that this is forcing you to look inside yourself and possibly seek help in finding those answers. Good luck to you
TigerCub Posted June 7, 2012 Posted June 7, 2012 The above.........I'm having trouble finding the words to express my frustration and not get spanked. Why? Well.........IF you really cared about the ow, that is exactly what you would want for her..............but you clearly don't because you said "it's just about kills me to think about" By your own admission you strung her along for 3 freakin years......and she finally had enough and now you don't want her to be healthy and happy??? Really?? Wow, the selfishness you exude is appalling and your wife, even more so. When you start exhibiting some compassion and some inkling of doing the right thing here then I can extend some compassion for you but until then, I can't. hey LG, just like I could feel OP's pain in his post, I certainly can feel your frustration in this one I totally get what you're saying, but these are his feelings. Feeling don't have to make sense or be just, they are what they are. I do agree that stringing along OW for that long is wrong - but she allowed it. I do agree that what OP says shows selfishness, but I do also believe that he loved her, and thinking that she would be happy with someone else hurts him. He can't help how he feels. We all know "if you truly love something, let it go and set it free and if it returns it was meant to be" - but I do think that its easier said than done. He wanted it all - is it fair or right? - no, but that's the way he played his hand. I think everyone in this triangle now turned square is in for a crap load of pain, and that truly is sad. 1
Author PuntserVA Posted June 7, 2012 Author Posted June 7, 2012 I accept that I'm a jerk and selfish, and I'm not really looking for compassion. I'm the cheater, I'm a jerk, so fine. Condemn me all you want. But try to also remember that I actually encouraged her to move across the country, and even understood when she was dating. I never told her I was going to leave my wife, so she started moving on. But she also wanted to stay with me. There is more detail to this story even than I've written here. I'm not at all saying OW should break up with the guy. After all, they've been dating for a while. And she still saw me. I think that says something about her. And us. But anyway, if she wants to go ahead with it without figuring herself out, I'll just have to deal.
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