If he expects you to initiate first, I'm assuming he's not that interested

[lospantalonsfancie]

... and being 'mysterious' and not appearing too interested...

 

If that's the case then its clearly working wonders on you. Here you are, bent out of shape about how it on the interwebs. If they DO decide to call you belatedly, you would be good to go. Who said PUA crap doesn't work?

 

Seriously though, depending on the details of your approach, either they aren't sure you are into them and are just testing out the waters by giving you their card and/or number, or they aren't that into you. I'll just point out that, IME, its more likely to be the former than you as a woman may think. Men regularly face women who disingenuously express interest or are fickle regarding who they are interested in, and we constantly have to be wary of such women. Sending you a signal of interest and leaving the ball in your court could be a valid strategy for hedging against that danger.

[6ft180natl]

After having a series of interactions where the guy seemed to expect me to make the first move (ie, first email, first phone call...etc)... I'm starting to get a bit annoyed.

 

Ok, annoyed isn't the right word. I really don't have a problem initiating.

 

My problem is that, after hearing over and over that men assume the woman is desperate if she initiates... Or that I'm somehow defective in some way if I initiate, I'm going to stop doing it.

 

Because, I actually don't feel that way. Desperate or defective. In the past, I've just felt it was more efficient if both people were taking some measures to show interest.

 

Anyway, back to my original thought... I've had multiple men over the course of the past year just give me their card or give their number to a friend to give to me. They don't ask them for mine though.

 

When that happens, all I can think of is that movie "He's just not that into you." and that well, if he were that interested, he'd call me.

 

Giving me his card or expecting me to initiate or ask on things feels kind of lazy and that he isn't interested. The whole dynamic then feels rather 'meh' to me. I'd rather have some back and forth where we are both initiating things.

 

Thoughts?

 

I get how you feel but it is a bit of a double standard I think. Maybe its just me but I think if a man gave his number to a woman through a friend and then the woman gave her number back through that friend most people would assume the next step was for the initiator(the man in this example) to call. It seems like you are a bit resistant to that maybe because you are a woman and want to be chased immediately after you show some interest?

[RedRobin]

Didn't we go through this before? If you want a more assertive man, don't be the aggressor. If you want a more passive man, expect to be the aggressor.

 

I don't see how this has to be either/or. Passive or aggressive. I want a balanced man.

 

In both examples I provided above, I felt I was the original initiator. I approached them to talk with them.

 

Giving me their card sends mixed messages about their level of interest. Hence the thread. If they are passive and expecting me to keep chasing, or if they tend to be the more aggressive type and aren't interested... I guess either way we aren't a match.

 

Since I'm looking for balance, they need to be the one initiating next.

Edited May 21, 2012 by RedRobin

[RedRobin]

If that's the case then its clearly working wonders on you. Here you are, bent out of shape about how it on the interwebs. If they DO decide to call you belatedly, you would be good to go. Who said PUA crap doesn't work?

 

Seriously though, depending on the details of your approach, either they aren't sure you are into them and are just testing out the waters by giving you their card and/or number, or they aren't that into you. I'll just point out that, IME, its more likely to be the former than you as a woman may think. Men regularly face women who disingenuously express interest or are fickle regarding who they are interested in, and we constantly have to be wary of such women. Sending you a signal of interest and leaving the ball in your court could be a valid strategy for hedging against that danger.

 

I know it might appear that way (that it is working wonders on me), but I wouldn't mistake what I feel is valid confusion as an 'in'.

 

Their behavior doesn't make me want them more. Just the opposite. It is a turn off.

[RedRobin]

I have had cards printed for situations just like this. Why? Because in my case there had been women that showed interest at the most inopportune times.

 

Example: I had it happen that a woman was hitting on me while I was getting off a bus and she had to go on. There was no time to exchange contact information or a phone number. I was interested, even though the encounter was brief, but couldn't do anything.

 

And because I had been in more situations like this, I had cards printed for a situation like this in the future.

 

The thing is, it NEVER occurred to me that those women might be carrying cards themselves. The fact is, I just don't know whether they do or not. So I automatically assumed that I should be pro-active and be the one carrying and handing out a card, since I was the one who wanted to get to know her, so that's why I had the cards printed. From my perspective I'm then the one taking pro-active steps towards establishing contact after meeting for the first time. She might be the one to first call or e-mail, but that's because when there's no time to exchange contact details, then there is no other way to go about it. Unless she contacts me in those cases, there is no way for us to ever meet again.

 

RedRobin, you're looking at this too much from your own perspective.

 

Did she call you? Did you ever go out? How did that go?

[RedRobin]

So, the operative action is to push the boundary and ask for her number, with giving out the man's number as a fallback if she declines due to 'security' issues? Sounds reasonable. OP, comment?

 

I'd say, yes. Even better would be.... He asks for her card or number, while he is handing her his info... and then he or she says "I hope to hear from you".

 

This is exactly how it is done in business.

 

Dating really isn't all that different than marketing. At some point, the 'marketer' becomes a stalker. And the person who has something to sell, needs the 'customer' to freakin' call back or show interest that is likely to end up in continued contact.

 

 

I guess the other question might be... ok, let's say I did call the guy. What happens next? Am I supposed to ask him out too? What am I really supposed to do with his number? What if I did ask him out? Seriously. If I were in business and this is the way a potential client behaved, it would leave me to believe they were just looking for something for free or weren't in need of my services.

 

Nah. the whole thing just feels fishy. It feels like I'm being put in the queue. Which is ok. Nothing wrong with having a queue. High fives for them!

[persevere]

Sometimes I'll give a woman my contact info. I think if she's interested, she'll then give me hers. I shouldn't have to ask. Also, men get sick of games. Too many occasions of women not returning their attempts and, well, we sorta quit caring in the respect of initiating. Burnt out.

 

It's not that I'm not interested in getting to know her. Its just that if she calls, then I'll know she's interested and can take it from there.

Edited May 21, 2012 by persevere

[Heart Of A Lion]

Did she call you? Did you ever go out? How did that go?

 

You mean the woman on the bus?

 

I didn't give her a card, because I didn't have any back then. Because that wasn't the first time I got blindsided by a woman that approached me at an inopportune time, I decided to get the cards.

 

I haven't used them so far, because my focus has been elsewhere.

 

It's not about who contacts who first. That's a game, but if you put too much weight on that, then you will miss out on opportunities.

 

The question shouldn't be whether or not he's into you enough when he gives a card, but whether you two are compatible and if there is chemistry between you. And there's only one way to find out the latter and that is to contact him and to go on a date.

 

If you start focusing on who contacts whom first, then you're losing focus on what's really important.

[xxoo]

Do you have cards? When a man hands you his card (or sends one through a friend), can you simply hand/send one back?

 

That way he has the means to contact you if he wishes.

[iris219]

So, if I’m understanding this correctly, the following occurs:

 

1. You meet a man.

2. You talk to him.

3. He ends it by giving you his business card.

 

This would signal lack of interest to me as well. It’s like the guy is saying, “I’m not interested enough to ask her out directly, but I could be talked into going out with her if she asked me.” No thanks.

 

Or, I’d assume he was trying to make a business connection. A business card is so impersonal. That’s not how most people exchange numbers for dating (at least not people I know). The only time I’ve given out my card is AFTER we’d already exchanged contact info (i.e. put each other’s numbers in our phones).

 

I wouldn’t call the business card guys, but I’d attempt to start a dialogue next time I saw him and gauge his interest from there.

 

I also wouldn’t call someone who stealthily gave me his number through a friend. I assume he’s practically a stranger. What would you even have to talk about on the phone? Can you ask the mutual friend to set you up?

 

I am certain that when a man is interested, he will make his interest known. There will no ambiguity. If you are unsure of his intentions, that’s a bad sign. If a man really wants to ask you out, he’ll ask you out, rather than just trying to make you an option or setting a challenge to see how far you'll take it.

[RedRobin]

You mean the woman on the bus?

 

I didn't give her a card, because I didn't have any back then. Because that wasn't the first time I got blindsided by a woman that approached me at an inopportune time, I decided to get the cards.

 

I haven't used them so far, because my focus has been elsewhere.

 

It's not about who contacts who first. That's a game, but if you put too much weight on that, then you will miss out on opportunities.

 

The question shouldn't be whether or not he's into you enough when he gives a card, but whether you two are compatible and if there is chemistry between you. And there's only one way to find out the latter and that is to contact him and to go on a date.

 

If you start focusing on who contacts whom first, then you're losing focus on what's really important.

 

I agree about the focus being on the wrong thing. I'm not one to play games. I usually just forge ahead on what I feel.

 

Obviously, that hasn't worked all that well

 

So, I think I could stand to take a step back and reevaluate. Learn to tone it down and avoid being viewed as some bizarre 'force of nature'.

 

The force of nature thing is what I do to get by in my job. It is not the kind of relationship I want with a man. I keep saying this... but I really just want balance.

 

Anyway, I'm not sure what I would do if I called him anyway. If I talked to him first... then I called him... Am I supposed to be asking him out too? You can see how the whole thing just goes down this whole bizarre path. I have done it in the past... basically call or text to tell him "I enjoyed meeting you. I hope we can talk again." and it was followed with "I hope we can talk again too." Talk about games. Sounds like games on his end.

 

With this last two... I feel like I initiated, and giving me their card or number without asking for mine is not the appropriate response for someone who is sincerely interested.

 

I guess I'd ask you... why didn't you ask for her number? What was holding you back?

[RedRobin]

Do you have cards? When a man hands you his card (or sends one through a friend), can you simply hand/send one back?

 

That way he has the means to contact you if he wishes.

 

Yes. And in the one case where I didn't have a card and he handed me his... I asked him for a second card so that I could give him my number... which I did.

 

Sooprise, soooprise! I never heard from him.

[RedRobin]

So, if I’m understanding this correctly, the following occurs:

 

1. You meet a man.

2. You talk to him.

3. He ends it by giving you his business card.

 

This would signal lack of interest to me as well. It’s like the guy is saying, “I’m not interested enough to ask her out directly, but I could be talked into going out with her if she asked me.” No thanks.

 

Or, I’d assume he was trying to make a business connection. A business card is so impersonal. That’s not how most people exchange numbers for dating (at least not people I know). The only time I’ve given out my card is AFTER we’d already exchanged contact info (i.e. put each other’s numbers in our phones).

 

I wouldn’t call the business card guys, but I’d attempt to start a dialogue next time I saw him and gauge his interest from there.

 

I also wouldn’t call someone who stealthily gave me his number through a friend. I assume he’s practically a stranger. What would you even have to talk about on the phone? Can you ask the mutual friend to set you up?

 

I am certain that when a man is interested, he will make his interest known. There will no ambiguity. If you are unsure of his intentions, that’s a bad sign. If a man really wants to ask you out, he’ll ask you out, rather than just trying to make you an option or setting a challenge to see how far you'll take it.

 

Yes, that is basically the chain of events.

[xxoo]

You can see how the whole thing just goes down this whole bizarre path. I have done it in the past... basically call or text to tell him "I enjoyed meeting you. I hope we can talk again." and it was followed with "I hope we can talk again too." Talk about games. Sounds like games on his end.

 

Yes. And in the one case where I didn't have a card and he handed me his... I asked him for a second card so that I could give him my number... which I did.

 

Sooprise, soooprise! I never heard from him.

 

Well, then you have your answer. Those two weren't interested.

 

But another guy might respond differently.

 

The question is, if you are interested, is it too much effort or risk to return contact and find out?

[persevere]

If a woman calls, then a man knows for sure she's interested. He would not offer his card, info., etc. If he weren't. Contrast that with women who may give you info., wrong numbers, or have no intention of answering. Just to appease the current situation or assuage their ego. That's why men may just give thiers.

[ladyabstrused]

Well I don't know...mixed reviews from different people on this thread. But I think I kind of know how RedRobin feels...perhaps in a different context?

 

See, my SO before used to tell me, that I should be the one deciding on things, making the first moves, initiate etc and when I asked him why, he said it is because by default he is interested and because he doesn't know if I am interested or not, I should be the one initiating.

 

Fine, sometimes, that's okay. But if it's all the time? I don't think that's fair to make the woman do all the initiating, just because, the guy is by default interested. I mean, what if I too don't know if he is interested or not. And he says it's cos he always tells me that he is. No matter what, he is interested. I find this unfair...yet I always give in.

 

Now talking about this, frustrates me!!

[RedRobin]

The question is, if you are interested, is it too much effort or risk to return contact and find out?

 

Right now, yes. For lots of reasons.

 

So, then there is also my answer. I'm guessing both of us (me and the guy) must not be ALL that interested or we'd both find a way.

 

*shrug*

[xxoo]

If a woman calls, then a man knows for sure she's interested. He would not offer his card, info., etc. If he weren't. Contrast that with women who may give you info., wrong numbers, or have no intention of answering. Just to appease the current situation or assuage their ego. That's why men may just give thiers.

 

I'm not so sure about that. If he gives his card, and her calling is met with this:

 

basically call or text to tell him "I enjoyed meeting you. I hope we can talk again." and it was followed with "I hope we can talk again too."

 

then that doesn't sound interested. It sounds like he felt bad rejecting her cleanly, just like the women give out numbers without actually being interested.

[sid3]

Right now, yes. For lots of reasons.

 

such as?

 

So, then there is also my answer. I'm guessing both of us (me and the guy) must not be ALL that interested or we'd both find a way.

 

Maybe the story isn't over yet. Time will tell.

 

I'd go out of my way to ask for your number:o

[RedRobin]

such as?

 

There is someone I'm just getting to know and I'm concerned about developing feelings for more than one person. I prefer to get to know a man one at a time.

 

The problem is, the man I kinda like doesn't live close by. I'm hesitant to become attached to someone who doesn't live a relatively short distance away. So, I'm on fence a little.

 

Maybe the story isn't over yet. Time will tell.

 

I'd go out of my way to ask for your number:o

 

Would you now? Or would you wait for her to offer hers without you asking?

[sid3]

Yes I would, even if i had to bust a nut get it.

 

In fact, I'd have you write it on me with a sharpie so I wouldn't lose it.

 

Then I'd probably want to call you all the time.

[RedRobin]

Sometimes I'll give a woman my contact info. I think if she's interested, she'll then give me hers. I shouldn't have to ask. Also, men get sick of games. Too many occasions of women not returning their attempts and, well, we sorta quit caring in the respect of initiating. Burnt out.

 

It's not that I'm not interested in getting to know her. Its just that if she calls, then I'll know she's interested and can take it from there.

 

I understand. That the dating 'game' can be exhausting and frustrating for men if they are doing all of the pursuing.

 

It's only fair if the woman does some initiating... and certainly reciprocating. I don't have any problems with that. I'm a bit over the top in my ability to initiate, so I'm afraid it has the opposite effect of what I'm intending.

 

When you say, you'd take it from there... what would you do if the woman called? How long would you talk on the phone before asking her out? Would you ask her out on that phone call? Or would you want to chat with her a few more times before going on an official 'date'?

[RedRobin]

Yes I would, even if i had to bust a nut get it.

 

In fact, I'd have you write it on me with a sharpie so I wouldn't lose it.

 

Then I'd probably want to call you all the time.

 

No ambiguity there! Maybe ladies should pack a sharpie with them at all times. ha ha

 

There is some cheesy rock star movie starring Tom Cruise where one of the groupies comes in and he signs her chest. I'm thinking that's more what most guys have in mind.

[westrock]

There is someone I'm just getting to know and I'm concerned about developing feelings for more than one person. I prefer to get to know a man one at a time.

 

The problem is, the man I kinda like doesn't live close by. I'm hesitant to become attached to someone who doesn't live a relatively short distance away. So, I'm on fence a little.

 

You write in your OP about wanting the guy to take more initiative and ask you out, and you're wondering why he is hesitant, but at the same time you don't want to express your interest back to him because in fact there is another guy you currently have feelings for and you're on the fence.

 

No wonder these guys are being hesitant in asking you out. They likely sense you are on the fence or that something is going on because you're not showing any interest back. They're not going to just ask you out if you don't show any interest back.

 

You say yourself that you're concerned about developing feelings for more than one person. In that case, I think you need to sort out your feelings with this other guy first.

[RedRobin]

You write in your OP about wanting the guy to take more initiative and ask you out, and you're wondering why he is hesitant, but at the same time you don't want to express your interest back to him because in fact there is another guy you currently have feelings for and you're on the fence.

 

No wonder these guys are being hesitant in asking you out. They likely sense you are on the fence or that something is going on because you're not showing any interest back. They're not going to just ask you out if you don't show any interest back.

 

You say yourself that you're concerned about developing feelings for more than one person. In that case, I think you need to sort out your feelings with this other guy first.

 

Thank you for your response.

 

I want to reiterate that I did show initial interest to the men I mentioned. I don't feel they showed significant interest back... hence my question. The man I mentioned wasn't in the picture when I initiated contact with these other men. BTW, I initiated contact with the man I'm getting to know, BTW. Guess that is just something I do. ;p

 

But you do have a point... it is very possible that I'm coming across as hesitant in some way... yes, I've been hesitant about meeting new men because I'm on the fence about remaining in this area and have thought of moving. The economy and other factors have kept me stuck here.

 

So, in very real terms, they are competing with 'something'. That might come across. Still.... I'd love an excuse to stay here. I really would. Part of my reasons for leaving is lack of viable relationship options in this area.

 

Which also begs the question... they probably have plenty of dating options of their own. Unless I'm making some kind of earth-shattering impression on them, they may not be likely to step out of their comfort zone either.

 

Life feels like one big High School Dance sometimes!!!

Edited May 21, 2012 by RedRobin