Author livingstrong Posted June 11, 2012 Author Posted June 11, 2012 Hey there Dr., sex is a biological drive. As you begin to recognize a toxic pattern, you can effect change. Sex was a healing part of the cycle. When the pain after sex is acknowledged within you, I suspect you'll grieve the loss of that too. We all resist change. Honestly, I think the sex worked, it's your one path to convert her back to you. The phantom man isn't going to cock block you!!! Draw a couple decision trees and kinda map out how you feel. Your an analytical guy. Nobody said that letting toxic go was going to be easy. You can win the sexual encounter but at what cost to your self? Your brain is telling you things have been toxic for a long time. Your ego is telling you she has this want for you sexually and that is how you'll make it all go to the good. Look for the gray between black and white. Grey is the living zone of the emotionally healthy. Failure is not in your glossary. Think in terms of choosing to make solid, healthy decisions. For you to be with her requires her to get healthy too. It's not about justifying her position of I want to be young and carefree. I find myself, especially when feeling emotional to want to move forward with the separation agreement, etc. I don't have an attorney or anything right now but I see this going down a dark path. Very confusing as to what steps to take and when. As it stands, we share a bank account. She spends money pretty freely. I see her still spending money on things for her new house, etc. Will all this stuff become bargaining chips, etc? Should I be taking protective steps now? Not sure how to navigate through all this stuff.
Balzac Posted June 11, 2012 Posted June 11, 2012 Focusing on the rather insignificant spending is folly. Your ability to earn is close to unlimited! It's unlikely she will write a check for her new home absent your cooperation. In reality she can and will be entitled to 50% of income until you stop the money clock by filing. Don't succumb to scary stories of mythical proportion absent factual documentation. As you begin your journey to take control of your separation / divorce process you'll gather facts and come up with several financial plans. Providing for your children is primary. I doubt your wife or soon to be ex wife wi suffer as many of lesser means do. It's not really about that. Each step toward cutting the financial pie, giving her independence and self responsibility can lead her to a desire for self healing. The best you can do is find a few lawyers to interview. Make a decision and start the process of maneuvering what she has not done. In the big financial picture it is in her best interest to keep the joint money clock ticking.
2sunny Posted June 11, 2012 Posted June 11, 2012 I find myself, especially when feeling emotional to want to move forward with the separation agreement, etc. I don't have an attorney or anything right now but I see this going down a dark path. Very confusing as to what steps to take and when. As it stands, we share a bank account. She spends money pretty freely. I see her still spending money on things for her new house, etc. Will all this stuff become bargaining chips, etc? Should I be taking protective steps now? Not sure how to navigate through all this stuff. Cut off the freely spending money. She can earn her own. This will be her reality - may as well start now. Books? Read the big book. Do your steps with a sponsor - you will gain clarity. If she wants a new life - let HER earn the money for the changes she wants.
Balzac Posted June 11, 2012 Posted June 11, 2012 There are of course strategic planning moves. You'll want to secure the best, most capable accounting/financial specialist to value your business. Some attorneys have one they work well with. You'll want expert tax advice for structuring the payout to her. Not to make expensive tax payments that could benefit her and the children. You'll want to update estate planning with trusts to protect your assets and provide for the children. These are all emotionally driven business decisions. The sooner you focus on a clean split, the more personal power you'll feel and I do not see any reason for a dark place.
Balzac Posted June 11, 2012 Posted June 11, 2012 Cut off the freely spending money. She can earn her own. This will be her reality - may as well start now. Books? Read the big book. Do your steps with a sponsor - you will gain clarity. If she wants a new life - let HER earn the money for the changes she wants. Whether she earns her income from working a job or from return on investments; Livestrong has no say in her future decisions. In that we agree. The more he can put the pieces into place for that to happen sooner than later, the better. Letting go is the task.
2sunny Posted June 11, 2012 Posted June 11, 2012 Whether she earns her income from working a job or from return on investments; Livestrong has no say in her future decisions. In that we agree. The more he can put the pieces into place for that to happen sooner than later, the better. Letting go is the task. If he doesn't willingly give her as much money as she wishes - in fact with hold except for basic needs - she would quickly more likely get a paying job.
Balzac Posted June 11, 2012 Posted June 11, 2012 It could also motivate her to rush to the court for defined funds to set up a second household. She remaining in the current house, with the children and him funding needs as established historically. I'm not saying she wouldn't work, I'm just curious about how childcare is accomplished during her absence. Livestrong has fairly flexible work hours but accommodations become necessary. No argument from me that profligate spending should be curtailed.
Author livingstrong Posted June 11, 2012 Author Posted June 11, 2012 Called a realtor friend today to discuss what needs to be done to the house to get it back on the market. Our home is gi-normous - many rooms still have boxes or no furniture at all. Hoping not to take a loss on the house. In the planning phase. I'm headed back to PA for business this week so the time apart should be good. Last night I read a love letter (unsent) from one year ago that my wife (wondering at what point I'll refer to her as STBX) sent to her EA. Talked about how she thought of him constantly and how she'd be divorced in a year. Crazy thing is that it was written only one month before we bought the house and moved down here together to NC. OUCH!!! Not sure if it's unhealthy or not for me to read things like that but it certainly adds clarity to my clouded mind which loathes in denial about how bad things really are. You get sort of used to living a certain way and accept it as the norm after a while. So back to planning phase: Steps: 1) Need to find good legal 2) Meeting with accountant back in Pittsburgh 3) Get the house ready to sell 4) Save and figure out how to stop her spending 5) Keep focus on myself, my health and recovery, and the kids 6) Keep posting and getting help and guidance from others Objectives: 1) Be strategic and tactful so that she is not spooked, things get ugly, and then she picks the kids up and moves back to PA while I am left to sell the house 2) Get company affairs in order for protection 3) Sell the home (without taking a huge loss) and get back to PA in a separate residence close to my kids 4) Keep growing no matter how many steps back I take to move forward
Author livingstrong Posted June 12, 2012 Author Posted June 12, 2012 Great meeting tonight. I typed out my amends to her tonight - got a log off my chest. Did it for ME. Headed to PA tomorrow for about 1 week. It'll be nice to get away and have some space. Happy to report...NO DRAMA TODAY!!
2sunny Posted June 12, 2012 Posted June 12, 2012 Read the instructions for step 9. You overlooked significant info. Face to face is highly suggested. The idea is to "set things right" at ANY cost to you - only considering the other person you harmed. Not yourself. Unless your amend is for yourself ( usually from allowing abuse) then honoring self is required as NEW BEHAVIOR from you. Having a new, healthy boundary in these situations is critical. If the amend is to her - you need to talk it through with your sponsor and see her in person. The idea is to restore her the peace of mind you may have stolen - and clear your head of any negative feelings or emotions so that you have a clear head and a clean day - EVERY day you are here.
Author livingstrong Posted June 13, 2012 Author Posted June 13, 2012 Read the instructions for step 9. You overlooked significant info. Face to face is highly suggested. The idea is to "set things right" at ANY cost to you - only considering the other person you harmed. Not yourself. Unless your amend is for yourself ( usually from allowing abuse) then honoring self is required as NEW BEHAVIOR from you. Having a new, healthy boundary in these situations is critical. If the amend is to her - you need to talk it through with your sponsor and see her in person. The idea is to restore her the peace of mind you may have stolen - and clear your head of any negative feelings or emotions so that you have a clear head and a clean day - EVERY day you are here. I made the amends to her for me to help move on and let go of the guilt from the past. I've felt a bit more centered over the past few days. Doing a lot of reading and introspection while away. Boundaries seem to be an issue with me. There is a fine line between being strategic and acting emotional. As it stands, I'll be in the guest house for at least a few months. That means I'll have to be there knowing she is talking to her EA. This drives me crazy (as you know). The alternative is to pull the plug from everything and just jump ship - car (in company's name), kick her out, finances, credit cards canceled, cell phone cut off - the whole shi-bang. That doesn't feel right to me thought...feels too emotional and not centered. And I'm focusing on me right now.
2sunny Posted June 13, 2012 Posted June 13, 2012 I made the amends to her for me to help move on and let go of the guilt from the past. I've felt a bit more centered over the past few days. Doing a lot of reading and introspection while away. Boundaries seem to be an issue with me. There is a fine line between being strategic and acting emotional. As it stands, I'll be in the guest house for at least a few months. That means I'll have to be there knowing she is talking to her EA. This drives me crazy (as you know). The alternative is to pull the plug from everything and just jump ship - car (in company's name), kick her out, finances, credit cards canceled, cell phone cut off - the whole shi-bang. That doesn't feel right to me thought...feels too emotional and not centered. And I'm focusing on me right now. Read the instructions. It's NOT about YOU in step 9 - unless you experienced abuse...
Author livingstrong Posted June 14, 2012 Author Posted June 14, 2012 Life is a bit better today - pity-party is over. Still waking up early with some feelings of anxiety but they go away. Putting a lot of focus into the kids right now and planning for my future life. Emotions are much milder I've noticed as I accept the reality of my situation. There are still reactionary periods revolving around emotion but those are less frequent. I can feel my heart hardening now as I prepare to move away from my relationship and the thought of this family as I've known it. Seeing the texts and emails my wife sends to him through the day still hurts but is having less of an impact on how I feel. It bothers me that she is communicating with in the presence of my kids (via text and email) but that is something I cannot change so I'll accept it. Thank you guys for continuing to support (and challenge) me through this period of difficulty.
2sunny Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 Since she isn't acting married and has no intention of honoring the M - have you served her divorce papers? Have you cut off all sources of her money? She wants to live as a single gal - she needs to understands that a single gal has to work to make money and support herself and her spending. Ask an atty what her support money would be monthly. Give her that - and have her pay half the expenses to you for both houses. That includes all expenses! You may as well show her how difficult it is to make things work and ends meet when someone else isn't supplying endless amounts of money. Make it hurt! Keeping her comfortable does not motivate her to see what life she's about to create. I D after 23 years with my exH. I had to work. I've had to cut back. I've had to get creative because my money isn't anywhere near what I was used to when we were married. It's hard! She may not realize how entitled and spoiled she is - until she is FORCED to do without the things she's accustomed to.
Author livingstrong Posted June 15, 2012 Author Posted June 15, 2012 Cutting off all sources of funding to her would hurt my kids, and I do not wish to do that. I want to learn to set healthy boundaries, however those lines can get blurred quickly. My wife has clearly demonstrated time and time again that she has little-to-no respect for me or our "marriage" (and I use that term lightly). So the question becomes, how do I set these limits and be consistent without harming my kids. Everything seems like it hurts my kids...for example...I recently bought a new Infinity SUV for the company that she drives. Sending it back will put her back in an older Navigator. Do I want my kids in a reliable vehicle???...yes. This is just one example. I'm extremely conflicted about a lot of this stuff. If it were up to her, we would sell the house, move back to PA, get "separated" and see where it goes - all awhile spending freely and doing what she wishes. I'm wanting to set a boundary here and do it on MY terms. Just not quite sure how to procede. I'll keep praying.
2sunny Posted June 15, 2012 Posted June 15, 2012 Cutting off all sources of funding to her would hurt my kids, and I do not wish to do that. I want to learn to set healthy boundaries, however those lines can get blurred quickly. My wife has clearly demonstrated time and time again that she has little-to-no respect for me or our "marriage" (and I use that term lightly). So the question becomes, how do I set these limits and be consistent without harming my kids. Everything seems like it hurts my kids...for example...I recently bought a new Infinity SUV for the company that she drives. Sending it back will put her back in an older Navigator. Do I want my kids in a reliable vehicle???...yes. This is just one example. I'm extremely conflicted about a lot of this stuff. If it were up to her, we would sell the house, move back to PA, get "separated" and see where it goes - all awhile spending freely and doing what she wishes. I'm wanting to set a boundary here and do it on MY terms. Just not quite sure how to procede. I'll keep praying. Well - in order to get things to settle into a predictable pattern while you're separating is best for all. Best to file in the county you have residency the past 6-12 months. Best to ask the judge to NOT allow the kids to leave the county without consent. Best not to talk badly of the other parent in front of the kids. Best to outline the terms of the separation in the papers filed. Best to have her awarded a certain amount of money and begin her NEW life and how she plans to make ends meet with the money she's awarded each month. Best to start changing everything so she gets the idea that HER CHOICES have now changed all of your lives forever moving forward. Best to leave her out of any decisions you make- decide on your own what's BEST for you and the kids -let her decide things on her own. Don't "help her" decide anything... That's for HER to DO now. The caris the least of your worries - look at the bigger picture - all the while knowing that all the little things add up to the big picture. Think of YOUR best interest now - you and the kids. Ask for sole custody if you can. Provide for yourselves and let her think she may be all on her own - the judge can decide the outcome in the end - but at least ask for it all now!
Author livingstrong Posted June 16, 2012 Author Posted June 16, 2012 Unfortunately, in the state of NC, you have to be separated for full year before filing for divorce....and in PA it's 2 years!!! This seems crazy. I'm trying with everything I have to take one day at a time and surprisingly, things seem a little clearer now when I look at the situation outside of myself. There has really been NO relationship (outside of sickness and codependency for quite some time now). It's not what I want long-term. I do much better when I don't have to be around her. I know this as fact.
onthefence210 Posted June 16, 2012 Posted June 16, 2012 Unfortunately, in the state of NC, you have to be separated for full year before filing for divorce....and in PA it's 2 years!!! This seems crazy. I'm trying with everything I have to take one day at a time and surprisingly, things seem a little clearer now when I look at the situation outside of myself. There has really been NO relationship (outside of sickness and codependency for quite some time now). It's not what I want long-term. I do much better when I don't have to be around her. I know this as fact. It's also illegal in NC to have an affair. Not quite sure if it is PA but I know you can sue for alienation of affection. Not sure if I missed, but did you confront the AP? Not that it matters I guess at this point. I was in IC for a yr while I was having an EA. believe me, I lied to her to keep from being judged and ultimately for seeing the truth of what I was doing. I now have a new IC who I've been nothing but honest with and she helped me to see the truth in my life and that helped to take the rosy glasses off not just in my A but in my marriage. Emotional abuse is awful, and it wears you down. I think you are on a healing path. And boundaries...what are those? I guess the internal ones that we kno are there and just seem like common sense can be made to feel like walls to keep people far enough away so they can't hurt you. I never knew how dysfunctional my family was until I had to look at who I'd become. Good luck!!
Balzac Posted June 16, 2012 Posted June 16, 2012 Read the instructions for step 9. You overlooked significant info. Face to face is highly suggested. The idea is to "set things right" at ANY cost to you - only considering the other person you harmed. Not yourself. Unless your amend is for yourself ( usually from allowing abuse) then honoring self is required as NEW BEHAVIOR from you. Having a new, healthy boundary in these situations is critical. If the amend is to her - you need to talk it through with your sponsor and see her in person. The idea is to restore her the peace of mind you may have stolen - and clear your head of any negative feelings or emotions so that you have a clear head and a clean day - EVERY day you are here. Unfortunately, in the state of NC, you have to be separated for full year before filing for divorce....and in PA it's 2 years!!! This seems crazy. I'm trying with everything I have to take one day at a time and surprisingly, things seem a little clearer now when I look at the situation outside of myself. There has really been NO relationship (outside of sickness and codependency for quite some time now). It's not what I want long-term. I do much better when I don't have to be around her. I know this as fact. I actually think uncontested is 1 year and most issues are an agreed entry. It seems you both now want a divorce so were you informed to plan for contested? Seems to me an agreed date isn't likely to come into question. Your issue may be easily solved.
Author livingstrong Posted June 19, 2012 Author Posted June 19, 2012 The Father's Day mess - So after a long week back in PA, I get home to NC Sunday night and happen to notice that my wife decided to go out and buy herself a new MacBook Air while I was gone (using our joint account of course). Well...I picked it up and noticed she had her "secret" email open so I took the computer and ran into the kids bathroom upstairs and forwarded about half of the emails to myself. She proceded to dis-assemble the door knob, scream at me, and try to elicit our 15 year old son to break down the door. Yep---and it gets worse. After reading the emails and seeing the depth of the emotional affair, I realized that I was not able to live with her unter this circumstance (until the house sells) and forcefully told her to leave. She proceded to: A: Threaten suicide by cutting her wrists B: Actually use a knife to make an indentation in her wrist C: Punch and slap at me Eventually, the night passed. I stayed cool throughout and was proud of myself for doing so. Yesterday morning she still refused to stop the communication. I went to my iC session later in the day (thank goodness) and the counselor once again emphasized that my marriage is over. She told me I am hanging on to something that's miserable and to focus on taking care of myself for a change. I hear this all the time but it carries different meaning when it comes from your counselor who believes in marriage and has been married for 36 years herself. When I got home, she told me "they" had a conversation and had mutually decided to terminate the affair. My wife seems sad, yet relieved, but this changes nothing between her and I. Oh and I also found a bundle of $100 bills equaling $2K stashed away in a notebook in her purse. So I'm proceeding...Dividing bank accounts, protecting asset, getting counsel, etc. I'm moving forward as if this is over and I'm letting go. So now it's time to focus.
jaymz Posted June 20, 2012 Posted June 20, 2012 The only thing you missed was calling the police as she a) attacked you, b) wielding a deadly weapon and c) threatening to kill herself. Clinical as this sounds, it would have helped you. As RobF would say, "tell her you get it now, she wants to be with the OM and you wont stand in their way. Pack her stuff up, put it in the garage and tell her she has got x days to collect it before the garbage man takes it" Now she is your STBXW.
2sunny Posted June 20, 2012 Posted June 20, 2012 The Father's Day mess - So after a long week back in PA, I get home to NC Sunday night and happen to notice that my wife decided to go out and buy herself a new MacBook Air while I was gone (using our joint account of course). Well...I picked it up and noticed she had her "secret" email open so I took the computer and ran into the kids bathroom upstairs and forwarded about half of the emails to myself. She proceded to dis-assemble the door knob, scream at me, and try to elicit our 15 year old son to break down the door. Yep---and it gets worse. After reading the emails and seeing the depth of the emotional affair, I realized that I was not able to live with her unter this circumstance (until the house sells) and forcefully told her to leave. She proceded to: A: Threaten suicide by cutting her wrists B: Actually use a knife to make an indentation in her wrist C: Punch and slap at me Eventually, the night passed. I stayed cool throughout and was proud of myself for doing so. Yesterday morning she still refused to stop the communication. I went to my iC session later in the day (thank goodness) and the counselor once again emphasized that my marriage is over. She told me I am hanging on to something that's miserable and to focus on taking care of myself for a change. I hear this all the time but it carries different meaning when it comes from your counselor who believes in marriage and has been married for 36 years herself. When I got home, she told me "they" had a conversation and had mutually decided to terminate the affair. My wife seems sad, yet relieved, but this changes nothing between her and I. Oh and I also found a bundle of $100 bills equaling $2K stashed away in a notebook in her purse. So I'm proceeding...Dividing bank accounts, protecting asset, getting counsel, etc. I'm moving forward as if this is over and I'm letting go. So now it's time to focus. She is messed up! State in the D papers hat she needs to pay you back for the computer amount. And she probably told her OM about your situation Sunday night - he probably realized how UNSTABLE she is... And ended things with her. IF she doesn't have HIM - she may want you as her second choice. I hope THAT'S NOT GOOD ENOUGH FOR YOU.
Author livingstrong Posted June 20, 2012 Author Posted June 20, 2012 Met with attorney today. He said basically I'm screwed and better get ready for a huge payout for a long time. This whole process seems so daunting right now. How much easier would it be to reconcile? I realize this would only lead to more and greater problems down the road. Exhausting. Looks like it's going to get ugly here. She was pissed that I transferred the money and threatened me with attorneys, etc. I just know that once we go down that road it's going to be on. She negotiates from a purely emotional position and does not have rationale to even logically discuss the situation. I'm just exhausted today guys. Have to get back on track. I will never be okay with being second-best and her family hates me. I'm not fond of them either so I guess it evens out in the end.
2sunny Posted June 20, 2012 Posted June 20, 2012 Many times - its worth it to pay big money to get negativity out of your daily life.
notbroken Posted June 20, 2012 Posted June 20, 2012 Sorry you are going through this but your marriage is over - either now or sometime soon. The longer it takes you to reach an agreement the more the anger will grow and it will be more difficult to do. Draw up a fair agreement asap and get out as soon as you can do it. Waiting is just going to have the emotions get even uglier.
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