RedRobin Posted May 16, 2012 Posted May 16, 2012 Looks like we disagree again. FWB is when there is friendship. After you f-k, you go watch a movie, hang out with some mutual friends. Um, and this is why people get it confused with a 'relationship'. Whatever 'relationship' means to people these days. F-buddy, after you f-k, you say I had a good time, take a shower, go home. You do NOT hang out. Thanks for clarifying. If I ever decide to have a FWB, f-buddy, bed buddy, or non-exclusive relationship that involves sex, I'll make sure to bring the most current f-ing dictionary with me. I understand many women, maybe even you, prefer to believe that men are robots with penises. Some do. But you kinda have men to blame for acting like they can and do. So you can't blame women for believing them. Me on the other hand... absolutely not. I work around all men and I know for sure that they do get attached to the women they are having sex with. Another reason why I don't do FWB. I'm not going to do that to another person. I wouldn't like it done to me. Plus, I really am not about to finesse the bizarre dramatics that come with figuring out what kind of F they are. But that's not true. Feelings can and will develop, from spending quality time together. I would argue that quality time is even more powerful than sex. Hence I roll my eyes when women claim they get attached from sex, but at the same time they have no qualms about spending time with the guy, as long as there's no sexy time, as if attachment won't grow out of that. Of course it does... but then I don't multi-date, so the man knows in advance he is not sharing my intimate emotional space with others either. See, I'm consistent that way. So for people that are committed to make it sex only, f-buddy is better, because they do NOT spend quality time together, and feelings will be less likely to develop -- they are not friends. FWB, you are veering closer to an actual relationship. That is the difference. It's okay if you want to denounce these alternate association types with disgust. Because anyone that does not view the world the same as you do deserve your insult. And by all means don't engage in these activities. But that doesn't take away the differences. If someone feels insulted, that is their problem. I'm only stating my preferences and why. As far as the differences go... well, that is a subject of debate. The OP started this thread because the differences apparently weren't obvious enough.
oldshirt Posted May 16, 2012 Posted May 16, 2012 Think of it in terms of status, desirability and options. If these guys that you are talking about are of lower status, lower attractiveness/desirability than you and have fewer options then they are going to want to stick. If you hit up some playa' that is of higher status, higher attractiveness/desirability and has lots of options for poontang/relationships then he will be glad to just put it to ya and then go on about his business. That's what players do. Little nerdy beta boys are going to try to latch on no matter what you say. A playa' is going to play you and use you for his fun and games no matter what you say.
fishtaco Posted May 16, 2012 Posted May 16, 2012 Thanks for clarifying. If I ever decide to have a FWB, f-buddy, bed buddy, or non-exclusive relationship that involves sex, I'll make sure to bring the most current f-ing dictionary with me. Then why are you in this thread? This does not apply to you, this is in an area you have no business talking about, because you don't know, and you don't want to know. If someone feels insulted, that is their problem. I'm only stating my preferences and why. If all you did was state your preferences, then it'd be perfectly fine. You do more than just that. You spout off your baseless opinions about things you don't know, and you do it in a way where you are putting a group of people down. That's their problem? For someone who is supposedly on the high road, it's not a very high-road-ish thing to do.
RedRobin Posted May 16, 2012 Posted May 16, 2012 (edited) Then why are you in this thread? This does not apply to you, this is in an area you have no business talking about, because you don't know, and you don't want to know. If all you did was state your preferences, then it'd be perfectly fine. You do more than just that. You spout off your baseless opinions about things you don't know, and you do it in a way where you are putting a group of people down. That's their problem? For someone who is supposedly on the high road, it's not a very high-road-ish thing to do. The original question was... "why don't FWB work out" I believe I offered some reasons why... one of them is because of lack of clarity. If one has to have a checklist detailing the differences between a f-buddy, bed buddy, FWB, etc... then there is a problem... and goes a long ways towards answering the original question. I'm not the only person on this thread offering personal opinions. IMHO, any regular sex that is not within the context of an exclusive relationship is best defined as a f-buddy. Not out of my personal 'disgust' for the other terms... but rather to make it clear where you really stand in terms of priorities. Keeps things simple. All the other descriptions are rather a bit of 'polish' and does more to muddy the waters than anything else. If others need to fancy it up a bit, I guess that is their choice. Edited May 16, 2012 by RedRobin
fishtaco Posted May 16, 2012 Posted May 16, 2012 I'm not the only person on this thread offering personal opinions. Again, personal opinions are fine, you do more than that. Here's an analogy. The nice way: I like red dresses, but I can see how other people like dresses of other colors. If you want to choose dresses of other colors, beware, it should match your accessories. The neutral way: I like red dresses, I don't like dresses of other colors. The RedRobin way: I like red dresses. Anyone that don't like red dresses have extremely bad taste and need to have their eyes checked. I have no problem with personal opinions. I just don't see why it has to be paired with put downs when you express them.
Pierre Posted May 16, 2012 Posted May 16, 2012 There is an evolution in the usage of words that greatly benefit men. Years ago the term slutty or easy was used for women that put out without being in a relationship. Then someone suggested the term f****buddy to make the female feel a bit better about putting out. From there it evolved into FWB and after a short time FWB has become accepted as some sort of relationship. For example here is a quote from a woman that is looking for a FWB. I think I'm about to start being fwb with a guy I met online, its a mutual agreement, kind of what I want right now because I cant be bothered with a full on relationship but I kind of miss sex haha, what can I say! With the usage of the FWB term she feels good about herself and does not need to be judged by simply liking sex as many men do.
ascendotum Posted May 16, 2012 Posted May 16, 2012 If you get a cold from coworkers you recover in about 7 days. If you get HIV from your sexual partner you die in about 7 years. Also, the last 2-3 years of the 7 years you have to suffer terribly taking a bunch of medications and you are not able to function. You are helpless and hopeless one on one dealing with painful process of diyng. This is the worst case scenario. What % of the hetero male population in your state has HIV. So does this mean you have never had casual sex, no ons, no flings, no fwb (unless they supply very recent pathology tests + you have to wait around a couple of months for the antibodies to be detected for HIV)...and even then with an affair or fwb there is a reasonable chance they can be sleeping with other people.
RedRobin Posted May 16, 2012 Posted May 16, 2012 With the usage of the FWB term she feels good about herself and does not need to be judged by simply liking sex as many men do. I'm glad we've evolved a bit to the point where women are allowed to enjoy sex as many men do. I think we should evolve a bit further and dispense with the flowery labels altogether though. 1
Pierre Posted May 16, 2012 Posted May 16, 2012 I'm glad we've evolved a bit to the point where women are allowed to enjoy sex as many men do. I think we should evolve a bit further and dispense with the flowery labels altogether though. I actually agree. I believe women will become more like men. In fact, they already have.
Ruby Slippers Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 I agree that FWB relationships are by nature precarious. However, I do not agree that FWB automatically = **** buddies. FWB is just a label for a relationship that functions as the people agree it will function. It drives me insane that i can't just have a FWB..Not even sexually. Just hanging out, having fun, cuddles n kisses..i wonder if i have this vibe that makes people believe i want something serious when i always say im not ready for something serious. In your case, OP, it sounds like the problem is that these men are not getting the primary "benefit" that they want - sex. They think they can coax you from making out to sex, and are taking up the challenge. If you do not ever intend to have sex, you should probably state that outright. I won't argue with the assertion that FWB is tricky. Even though I have been totally honest with the FWBs I've had, they still always seem to want more. Maybe that's because I pick "safer" men who are more oriented to monogamous partnership and are less likely to have multiple FWBs. That is simply because these men are the most attractive to me. For me, having a mere **** buddy is undesirable. I would get very little pleasure from having sex with a guy I didn't have at least some intellectual/romantic/affectionate connection with. My FWBs have been a casual version of boyfriend, without the commitment from either side. We both get to enjoy sex, affection, fun, conversation, and maybe even the occasional date, as well as the freedom to keep looking for someone more suitable for a long-term relationship. I have found these relationships to be in some ways more, less, and equally fulfilling when compared to conventional relationships. My favorite aspect of them has been the total honesty. We can be completely honest without reserve because we're not concerned about impressing the other person as a long-term mate. And this is quite freeing. FWB is a temporary arrangement to meet some of your basic human needs until you find something with long-term merit. On Maslow's hierarchy of needs, sex is defined as a BASIC human need, right on par with food, water, and sleep. I certainly function far better when I am having sex and getting some romantic affection at least occasionally.
irc333 Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 Just curious, do you necessarily have to be physically attracted to the person you're just having an FWB relationship with?
sid3 Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 Just curious, do you necessarily have to be physically attracted to the person you're just having an FWB relationship with? Of course not, you can find them totally repulsive. Seriously?
Pierre Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 Could be that some women cannot do better than FWB? It seems women rationalize their FWB status.
mesmerized Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 Could be that some women cannot do better than FWB? It seems women rationalize their FWB status. Yes, it's true for some cases but not always. There are a lot of guys I could sleep with but I wouldn't want them to be the father of my children or wouldn't want to introduce them to others as a boyfriend.
RedRobin Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 Could be that some women cannot do better than FWB? It seems women rationalize their FWB status. Maybe. There is alot of pressure on women to accept FWB. Even worse, it seems to have become a 'step' that is now added to the dating process on the way to a LTR, which really pisses me off. Noone wants to be viewed as a prude or not liking sex if they hold out for a LTR... especially when the reverse is true. I'm reminded of a quote in a cute little movie called "Ratatoille"... The 'chef' was saying to a food critic "You are thin for a man who likes food." The critic says "I don't like food. I LOVE it. If I don't LOVE it, I don't swallow." 1
sid3 Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 Maybe. There is alot of pressure on women to accept FWB. Even worse, it seems to have become a 'step' that is now added to the dating process on the way to a LTR, which really pisses me off. Noone wants to be viewed as a prude or not liking sex if they hold out for a LTR... especially when the reverse is true. I'm reminded of a quote in a cute little movie called "Ratatoille"... The 'chef' was saying to a food critic "You are thin for a man who likes food." The critic says "I don't like food. I LOVE it. If I don't LOVE it, I don't swallow." At least the critic had the decency to respond.
SJC2008 Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 IMO FWB=F-buddy. Why? Well if it were sort of a relationship or the beginnings of a relationship as some of the ladies here try to rationalize it as it would be an OPEN relationship because there is no exclusivity if that's a word. So therefore FWB=F-buddy, try to rationalize all you want ladies. I love the way men and women think differently: Woman: "You won't hold me and cuddle with me because I won't have sex with you?", Man: "You want me to hold you and cuddle with you and you won't have sex with me?" LOL
Woggle Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 Some people can do it but I find that FWB kind of arrangements work better in theory than in practice. I did it once and it was a complete disaster which resulted in me having a stalker. I rarely see successful ones that last very long because somebody ends up getting hurt. To me it's either sex buddies or relationships and there is nothing wrong with having purely a sex buddy. Let's call things what they are.
ascendotum Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 Maybe. There is alot of pressure on women to accept FWB. Even worse, it seems to have become a 'step' that is now added to the dating process on the way to a LTR, which really pisses me off. Noone wants to be viewed as a prude or not liking sex if they hold out for a LTR... especially when the reverse is true. I agree with SJC, that I really don't think FWB/FB is a natual progression to a LTR these days. I reckon I tend to see as many relationships fade into FWBs. I think there is a difference between F-buddy and FWB, but with a few of the women I now the nature of their relationship, they never use the FB term (which I get), in fact some even call the guy a bf, even though they never go out, has his own place and he only drops by for sex & meals. I do agree there is more pressure on women as regards the FWB these days. As more of the more desirable guys have them (and in many cases multiple concurrent), the more other guys across the board tend to want the nsa relationship. I know women claim that the guy they choose for a realtionship partner is more special than their FB lover, but a lot of guys don't buy it. (circumstances differ tho)
Ruby Slippers Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 I do think there are a lot of forces at work that are breaking down the family unit, and this has been going on for a while. People are conditioned to avoid committed, pair-bonding relationships from all angles. Just one example is the ad industry angle that there's always a better option around the corner. Powerful brainwashing forces are at work all the time - and most people are overwhelmed by them. I'm a pretty free and non-conforming thinker, but I still get brainwashed. We all do. That said, I've never felt pressure to have a casual relationship. I've only ever felt pressure - from many directions, including from within - to find Mr. Right. That's the hard part.
oaks Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 Well needless to say we don't talk anymore because he started becoming a little stalker and im kinda like WHY??? Not sure what he did to be described as a stalker from what you wrote... it just sounds like he wanted a more committed relationship than you did. The title question, Why does FWB never work out?, is largely for that reason - one person wants FWB (however we define that - I see different opinions in this thread) but the other person wants a committed, exclusive relationship and that difference of desire pulls the 'relationship' apart from one end or the other. But, FWB can work. It's just that you haven't managed to find someone on the same wavelength yet.
oaks Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 However, I do not agree that FWB automatically = **** buddies. FWB is just a label for a relationship that functions as the people agree it will function. I agree that FWB and f-buddy are (or, can be) different things. (In my view, the latter is closer to 'just sex' and the former is closer to bf/gf but without such labels or commitment and perhaps without exclusivity, too.) I see opinions expressed in here that these terms are now the same thing or interchangeable terms or that FWB is now a tame euphemism for f-buddy and I think I disagree slightly, although I suspect that some people who are really just someone's f-buddy might call it FWB because it's more socially acceptable than saying "yeah, (s)he just calls me up and f...s me when (s)he's horny". So, to that degree, they are the same because people overuse FWB to mean something else. My FWBs have been a casual version of boyfriend, without the commitment from either side. We both get to enjoy sex, affection, fun, conversation, and maybe even the occasional date, as well as the freedom to keep looking for someone more suitable for a long-term relationship. That makes sense. For anyone struggling with making FWB work because the other party wants more... the positive way to look at this is that the other party considers you to be a high quality partner, or "relationship material". This isn't necessarily a bad thing! (even if it spoils the FWB relationship) 1
bac Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 This is the worst case scenario. What % of the hetero male population in your state has HIV. So does this mean you have never had casual sex, no ons, no flings, no fwb (unless they supply very recent pathology tests + you have to wait around a couple of months for the antibodies to be detected for HIV)...and even then with an affair or fwb there is a reasonable chance they can be sleeping with other people. I had plenty of sex including ons. It is not about my state. There are plenty HIV in any location. The problem is that the men who are into any kinds of sex including ons, FWBs, serious relationships do not want to use condom. They do not want to use it in any state and in any country. You need to force them to use condoms. They are all willing to have unprotected sex with any stranger without any doubts.
Pierre Posted May 17, 2012 Posted May 17, 2012 I had plenty of sex including ons. It is not about my state. There are plenty HIV in any location. The problem is that the men who are into any kinds of sex including ons, FWBs, serious relationships do not want to use condom. They do not want to use it in any state and in any country. You need to force them to use condoms. They are all willing to have unprotected sex with any stranger without any doubts. Condoms are not romantic. Furthermore, it is like kissing a girl through a glass window. Another reason why sex within a GF/BF committed setting is better.
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