Theniceguy24 Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 Here is my story, It's fairly long. Through out my life, I have had many opportunities to be with women who have had nothing but awful relationships. I have dated people who were abused, Dated people who had a bad upbringing, Dated people who had nothing going for them. I have also dated women who were absolutely amazing the entire time with them Until the "bad boy" shows up, and suddenly I am second fiddle for the thousandth time. Lemme start by saying this. I am confident with myself, my personality, my looks, I have zero EGO, I treat girls extremely well, I complement them, I surprise them with cute ideas and I take them out to romantic dates. Yet, all that **** does not matter because every single time, some random guy comes into the picture, and the girl always either cheats on me, breaks up with me, and moves on to the guy who is abuse, bad ass, tough looking. All I hear about is how girls want the "nice guy", the guy who treats her like a beautiful person that she is, yet I do that and get left in the dust constantly. I have been in love before, for 3 years, and she left me because I wanted to get a college education, while she wanted to move in together at the age of 19. Took me absolutely forever to get over her, but when I finally did I started dating another girl (which is the reason I am ranting, lemme explain). I am 26 years old now, I am at a point of my life where I am getting close to the typical time to start a family, yet I am absolutely running out of ideas on what to do. The girl I met is sweet, kind, pretty, smart, has a great personality, and our first few dates were incredible(she was very touchy,feely, we did kiss multiple times with her initiating it)., yet the next day she barely texts me, and now shes just ignoring me. This has been a pattern all my life, everytime I find somebody, either another guy shows up, or I am suddenly not the "type" of guy she is looking for. So I would like to announce right here, that I am SICK and TIRED of being the nice guy who finishes last, Sorry if I hate one night stands and sorry if I respect girls, but maybe It's time for me to change my perspective.
ColoredBlack Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 I agree that its time to change your perspective. Women only respect man who actually act like boys because they are fun and exciting and all the stuff. So if u cant beat em u should probably join em.
dasein Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 Welcome to the forum. Why did you choose the handle you did if you are sick of being the nice guy? have to ask. There's a difference between being "nice" and being too supplicating, it sounds like you have been the latter. Consider not giving away the store too fast when meeting new women. Never ever let a woman think she's got you 100% or you are walking dead from that moment on. Google "cat string theory" for more information. Good luck.
Author Theniceguy24 Posted May 10, 2012 Author Posted May 10, 2012 I agree that its time to change your perspective. Women only respect man who actually act like boys because they are fun and exciting and all the stuff. So if u cant beat em u should probably join em. While this may be the case, I do take her out and do fun stuff with them, I ain't that boring guy, I am always down to do fun things. I understand sometimes the signals women makes, I have had relations with women, and I have never heard any complaints. I just feel that a girl should feel respected, instead of the other.
Author Theniceguy24 Posted May 10, 2012 Author Posted May 10, 2012 Welcome to the forum. Why did you choose the handle you did if you are sick of being the nice guy? have to ask. There's a difference between being "nice" and being too supplicating, it sounds like you have been the latter. Consider not giving away the store too fast when meeting new women. Never ever let a woman think she's got you 100% or you are walking dead from that moment on. Google "cat string theory" for more information. Good luck. No reason on the handle, just the first thing that came up lol. I would agree with everything you are saying, except I am (even tho this sounds lame) quite manly at times, I ain't a total push over or anything like that.
joystickd Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 As a man logically you look at it as: Why go to that guy when I can treat you good? To a woman its: Why do I feel this way about this guy? I talk to a guy that is nice to me but he doesn't make me feel the way this one does. It's not a logical process when it comes to women, nice guys, and "bad boys". You can put logic on it and hell most women can't really logically articulate why. That's because it deals with feelings and emotions. Women like a man with some edge to him because it creates certain feelings inside her. Those women you spoke of just are women that like unhealthy relationships. Most though want a man with some edge and that is a hell of a lot different than being an *********. When you realize you don't need women to make you happy, that you are the prize and that dating isn't a logic process you will have the edge you need to get these women 1
persevere Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 I've battled the "nice syndrome" my entire dating life, so I sympathize. Most women want someone they can "fix" or change. If you are not a challenge, they will move on or not be interested. I, too, have seen women I like move on to total losers. The best advice I can give you is try your best to not be too open. Leave them leeway for the chase. Occasionally, put your foot down on things. Don't always be accomodating or 'available'. Show her you are the leader. It's tough when you are straight up, honest and don't play games. However, this is not what many women want. They want someone they feel somehow they cannot have. Also, when you are really nice, they don't understand it or may even think you are hiding things. If you are a bad boy, they somehow get "stockholm syndrome" and enjoy the sick, emotional attraction to potential danger. The older women get, the more they may appreciate nice guys. However, around your age, they still have not learned enough hard lessons. Still have not seen their peers become single moms or otherwise abused by bad boys. Good luck.
Woggle Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 Stop trying to date women that need fixing. I hate to say this but most women who are in bad relationships over and over again willingly jump into it. Find a woman who has her head on right and actually wants to make something out of her life rather than a drama addict. Stop the knight in shining armor stuff. 8
dasein Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 Sorry, wasn't my intent to question your manliness. In fact, similar problems I had in the past were due to being "too manly" at times, feeling the need to always be a "good sport," "play fair," "be sincere and honorable at all times," "give the benefit of the doubt," "be secure and ignore games," "be strong and shrug things off," "always be a gentleman," all manly qualities, and all counterproductive in varying degrees to building real wet-panty attraction in women. There is nothing you can do to keep them from upgrading you or being shot out of the saddle from time to time, it's their nature, many of them anyway, to be constantly looking for the BBD. It's also their nature to tell us they want the exact opposite things they really want, what really turns them on. Being a successful man with control in dating involves lots of gaming. Yes I said it, let the flames begin. They have dictated those terms to us, so we do what works with them. All those guys shooting you out of the saddle are playing push-pull games, hot and cold, some naturals some learned and worked a great deal at over years. Your success with women is often a factor of your capacity for creating doubt and faux drama in their minds. Refuse to do that, feel "above it" and you become boring. It is not that hard to change your perspective and behavior accordingly without being fake. It starts with not caring too much about any one option, having a bucket of them at all times, which is a very tough first step, the toughest part actually. It takes WORK, like anything else in life. If you give more specific examples, will do my best to help with that. Another thing is seek dating advice from successful men, never women. Women have a penchant to tell you what "sounds right" as opposed to what "is right," the same thing they do when listing arm long list of criteria and then spreading their legs for the first guy who comes along possessing NONE of those qualities who pushes the right buttons and plays the right games. Especially don't listen to "you are meeting the wrong type of women," or "that only works with insecure women." Women are indeed all different, but there are striking similarities in response and attraction formation. ...they don't know , have no experience attracting and dating women whatsoever themselves from whence to speak, but that won't stop them from expressing an opinion, just like it won't stop me from expressing opinions on some things I don't know about sometimes. Dating and seduction, though, is something I know quite a bit about. The reason I harp on this is that I have a hunch you have been laboring under some bad, if well-meaning dating advice from women, as I did in my 20s. 4
Quiet Storm Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 Okay, I am a woman that you should consider listening to because I keep it real. If you are too accomodating and too eager, some women will see you as boring because you are too predictable. You don't want to seem like you are kissing her as5. This can cause you to lose value in her eyes. When men are too accommodating and too eager it can make some women feel like she is his only option, which devalues him. She wants to feel like you have lots of other options but still picked her, above all the others. You can do all the things in the world to make her feel special, but if those things are coming from someone that she perceives as desperate (being too eager can give that impression), she won't feel special. She'll just feel like the words, gifts, & thoughtful ideas are a ploy to keep a desperate guy from being alone. Also, if you are choosing women who have been abused or had rough lives, niceness can be uncomfortable for them. It sounds crazy, but we often gravitate to what we know, because it makes us most comfortable. Women that have not been treated kindly by men in their lives will gravitate towards bad boy types because they feel familiar. So for these types, your kindness could be suffocating, while disrespect is familiar and easy for them. You really shouldn't want these types anyway, as they usually bring a lot of drama and heartache to your life. Also, I notice that you say you don't have an ego. Women may pick up on this. Women (especially young ones) are often attracted to men who feel that they are entitled to the best. This is because if a man believes he is great & that he is entitled to the best, it makes her feel really special. She must be so awesome because this guy that only deserves the best picked her. I know it sounds messed up (and it is), but it's the way some women are. 12
dasein Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 Ok will eat some crow here, the above advice is great advice from a woman. 6
verhrzn Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 Maybe she's ignoring you because she couldn't tell if you were into her. If she had to initiate, she might think you're not interested. There's a lot of gray area between "do not initiate anything on the first date" and "one night stand" for a Nice Guy as yourself to stand in. Furthermore, maybe you should ask yourself if you're trying to play rescuer to bad girls. Why are you chasing after girls who aren't into the same things you are (wanting to move in immediately without an education), or are in bad relationships? If you're consistently choosing girls who need to be rescued because they're abused/date jerks, etc., you might be unintentionally putting them on a pedestal and turning them into an object, instead of the complicated individual they are.
irc333 Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 As a man logically you look at it as: Why go to that guy when I can treat you good? To a woman its: Why do I feel this way about this guy? I talk to a guy that is nice to me but he doesn't make me feel the way this one does. Happens to me all the time...I'm on the right track to attract a woman's attention with my personality, but not enough for me to let them....well...touch them. I can make them laugh (which SHOULD be a turn on to women) but, they won't let me hold their hand. They love my intellect and the fact we are at the same level intelligence-wise....but...they won't let me cuddle with them. They like that I am comfortable in my own skin, they are even comfortable with me...think I a great personality. But a kiss good night? FORGET IT! Yeah, it can get frustrating. Women like me, but not enough to let me touch 'em.
RiverRunning Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 OP, CALL ME?! In all seriousness, sometimes the nice guy is nice to the point of paralysis. He may not initiate enough - or he may be too nice to the point that he just seems plain uninterested. I've gone out with guys who would never make the first move, let alone kiss me. After the first date, I felt like I was putting out my feelers and they just weren't interested. Then a week later I get the "Well, since you're not interested..." e-mail from them. WTF? You never gave me any indication you were interested, dude! The appeal of the bad boy is the confidence, I think. He's direct, he pursues what he wants, etc. He can make a woman feel desired. When I was still in a relationship, another guy onto the scene who was very interested in me. He had confidence out the wazoo. That was something my ex lacked - not to mention the passion and all that. But this guy was flirty, he made me feel, well, HOT, and that wasn't something my boyfriend had done for me in a very long time. The friendship with said guy ended when he pushed it too far, but if things had been different, maybe I WOULD have jumped ship and gone for him (if I hadn't realized, you know, he was crazy). He gave me something I needed and wanted: he was interested, and I knew it. That may mean making some of the first moves, OP. Kissing her at the end of a first date. My ex wasn't very good in bed. He just wasn't. In retrospect, I think a lot of that had to do with a lack of confidence and the belief that he wasn't attractive. I was the only one really putting in effort in the bedroom. But at the time, I figured it was something wrong with me - he wasn't physically attracted, or he was attracted until my clothes came off. You can see how something could easily derail. If you can figure out if there's a kink in your approach, the appeal of the 'bad boy' may taper off.
NateC Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 Happens to me all the time...I'm on the right track to attract a woman's attention with my personality, but not enough for me to let them....well...touch them. I can make them laugh (which SHOULD be a turn on to women) but, they won't let me hold their hand. They love my intellect and the fact we are at the same level intelligence-wise....but...they won't let me cuddle with them. They like that I am comfortable in my own skin, they are even comfortable with me...think I a great personality. But a kiss good night? FORGET IT! Yeah, it can get frustrating. Women like me, but not enough to let me touch 'em. Story of my life...
Woggle Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 The line of thinking that if a man does not initiate on the first date he is not interested is a result of a woman expecting men to be horn dogs who will hump anything that moves. They can't see that there are some men who think with the right head.
Author Theniceguy24 Posted May 10, 2012 Author Posted May 10, 2012 Hey guys, thanks for the advice so far. Let me clarify a few things. 1 - I don't just date girls with bad pasts, I was just giving you an example of the type of girls I have dated. I have dated normal down to earth girls, all the way to hard troubles lives, I don't pick and choose, I respect all the pasts of all women. 2 - While She did initiate the kissing sometimes, I do initiate the kissing most of the time, and I was the one who made the move on the 1st date. (i usually do). 3 - while I agree on the "boring" statement (in a sense), I would rather be boring Once in a awhile, then be a guy who treats a girl unfairly and causes nothing but stress and drama for her. If that is some sort of a sin, then theres my problem right there. But remember, I ain't perfect, of course ill get in arguments sometimes, but I just have a natural respect for women, I dont consider then objects or anything, If they want to be controlled or want me to be aggressive for a night (say sexually) I am willing to do that, no problem. But I won't force a girl to do anything sexually or not without her wanting to do it, even if that makes me look bad.
irc333 Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 Yeah, I can't figure out what's so bad about being "boring". <shrug>. Everyone is boring to a certain extent. Most people have standard lives. Usually women who bore easily, usually are boring themselves. I once saw a headliner or 2in a profile, "Can you keep my interest" one had a headliner stating she BORES easily. (no joke), Usually a woman who bores easily, is usually a spolied brat. 3 - while I agree on the "boring" statement (in a sense), I would rather be boring Once in a awhile, then be a guy who treats a girl unfairly and causes nothing but stress and drama for her. If that is some sort of a sin, then theres my problem right there. But remember, I ain't perfect, of course ill get in arguments sometimes, but I just have a natural respect for women, I dont consider then objects or anything, If they want to be controlled or want me to be aggressive for a night (say sexually) I am willing to do that, no problem. But I won't force a girl to do anything sexually or not without her wanting to do it, even if that makes me look bad. 1
verhrzn Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 The line of thinking that if a man does not initiate on the first date he is not interested is a result of a woman expecting men to be horn dogs who will hump anything that moves. They can't see that there are some men who think with the right head. He doesn't have to initiate humping. Just something like touching me on the arm, or even a light kiss.. some kind of physical indication that he was attracted to me. Last summer, I went on three... I guess they were dates?... with a guy. Except I had no idea they were dates, because he 1) never initiated anything physical, even a hug. Heck, our last "date" I actually hung around his apartment after everyone left until 2 am, being very flirty, and he never gave me any sign back 2) never contacted me between the "dates", and there was usually a few days to a week between us hanging out 3) spent most of the time kinda heckling me (forced me to ride his scooter, argued with me about the play we'd just seen, etc.) Eventually I just went "Okay he's not interested," and just didn't respond to his single text. Imagine my surprise when I run into a few weeks ago, and he asked "Hey, how come you disappeared after our dates were going so well?" Huh?? There's being a nice, respectful guy, and then there's being "nice" to the point of paralyses.
Author Theniceguy24 Posted May 10, 2012 Author Posted May 10, 2012 He doesn't have to initiate humping. Just something like touching me on the arm, or even a light kiss.. some kind of physical indication that he was attracted to me. Last summer, I went on three... I guess they were dates?... with a guy. Except I had no idea they were dates, because he 1) never initiated anything physical, even a hug. Heck, our last "date" I actually hung around his apartment after everyone left until 2 am, being very flirty, and he never gave me any sign back 2) never contacted me between the "dates", and there was usually a few days to a week between us hanging out 3) spent most of the time kinda heckling me (forced me to ride his scooter, argued with me about the play we'd just seen, etc.) Eventually I just went "Okay he's not interested," and just didn't respond to his single text. Imagine my surprise when I run into a few weeks ago, and he asked "Hey, how come you disappeared after our dates were going so well?" Huh?? There's being a nice, respectful guy, and then there's being "nice" to the point of paralyses. That's rather unfortunate, but that's not like my case. I make it clear to the woman I am with on a date or anywhere that I wanna be with her, and do most of what the guy did not do.
Woggle Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 Yeah, I can't figure out what's so bad about being "boring". <shrug>. Everyone is boring to a certain extent. Most people have standard lives. Usually women who bore easily, usually are boring themselves. I once saw a headliner or 2in a profile, "Can you keep my interest" one had a headliner stating she BORES easily. (no joke), Usually a woman who bores easily, is usually a spolied brat. This is the truth. Usually people who are easily tend to be boring themselves. Stay away from women who can't enjoy an easy drama free day without getting bored.
ThaWholigan Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 I have been guilty of overly nice behavior on rare occasions. But that was more damage limitation on my part, as I can be impulsive and very direct......and I don't meet a lot of girls who are into guys who are super direct to the point of not knowing how to create anticipation. I have had to learn how to do this, at the expense of being a little neuter in my past for fear of being too honest and true. That being said, a little unpredictability wouldn't go amiss. There are ways to supplement your nice traits without being a jerk or anything like that. Learn different ways of how to seduce, use your words etc. The info is out there 1
SJC2008 Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 Don't change who you are it seems like you can get girls. Bad luck mabye? Bigger better dealed mabye? Nice guy is over used IMO. Women say nice guy they mean doormat. Dot let a woman be the center of your universe!
ThaWholigan Posted May 10, 2012 Posted May 10, 2012 Yeah, I can't figure out what's so bad about being "boring". <shrug>. Everyone is boring to a certain extent. Most people have standard lives. Usually women who bore easily, usually are boring themselves. I once saw a headliner or 2in a profile, "Can you keep my interest" one had a headliner stating she BORES easily. (no joke), Usually a woman who bores easily, is usually a spolied brat. Boring is devoid of excitement, and there are a subset of women who thrive on such. I agree with you about women who moan about excitement as they are usually quite boring and seem to think that people exist for their entertainment without being remotely entertaining themselves. But there is no excuse for being boring - unless you're looking for a partner who also appreciates your boring nature and is perhaps a little predictable herself .
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