Tell tale signs of an A...

May 2, 2012

It makes sense, I was just showing a different perspective because I don't think there can ever be a LIST of what shows an affair. I know maybe people say don't confront, don't ask, but if someone starts working out suddenly, why not ask about that? What prompted it? Wouldn't that be a healthy place to start? Or even something similiar to "It makes me feel like you are hiding something the way you act with your phone, why do you do that?"

Donna's answer is spot on. When I first noticed the changes, I asked. When I saw the different colognes (4 of them) now displayed on the dresser, I asked my H how come he'd all of a sudden decided to try out new ones. He was a one cologne man and had been for years.

Then there was the sex. You know how when you're used to being together, you kind of know what certain nudges mean. Like nudge A means move into X position. You don't really have to discuss it. Suddenly, you find yourself having to ask "You want me to do what?" and they have to explain. "turn around, bend and curve your back..." WTF? The person literally organizes your body into a position you are unfamiliar with but obviously he knows a lot about. Huh?? Of course I asked!!!

Lies, lies, lies. The cologne? Oh his friend Steven sells them now and recommended them. All 4 of them? The sex? Of course one asks when the WS is very relaxed and one is careful not to sound suspicious or disgusted. "Baby, remember when you made me do X, Y and Z? What brought that on? We've never done that before." My H told me that it was something he always wanted to try and that night it just came naturally. In other words, he's super creative in bed. Lies, lies, lies...but I wasn't able to see them as lies at the time.

May 2, 2012

After reading findingnemo's post, I remembered something from the first time XH cheated. I remember we had what I would call "angry sex" and I don't mean good hard sex; I mean angry, not loving. At the time, I knew something was off, but didn't know about the OW. I guess later, I decided he was angry that I was not her. Either way, it was disconcerting. Wow, that sure is not a good memory and haven't thought about it for years. UGH

May 2, 2012

Angry sex? Wow. And I thought only violent abusers had "angry sex". (((((Hugs Steen)))))

May 2, 2012

Thanks findingnemo.

Maybe "angry sex" is not really the right way to express it. It was not violent, but like he was pissed at me...oh, I guess I just can't explain without getting too graphic. Maybe cold and uncaring describes it better. Ewwww, my stomach hurts..........

May 3, 2012

Let me get this. If your married and all of a sudden your spouse starts taking an interest in your schedule, then you're supposed to start lying and deceiving them? Wow, that is really going to nurture the marriage.

I agree somewhat on this with xeno.

If it is completely out of character then that would be a red flag. As in my XW never cared about my schedule for over a decade and all of a sudden wanted to know when I was coming home.

In my case my GF does this all the time. But I sometimes wonder about the timing. I work nights and she is always asleep when I come in and sometimes she asks me questions if I happen to show up earlier than normal instead of being glad that I got off early. See what I mean?

My GF did in fact cheat on me at least once that I know of and she still does this calling me at work to check up on me all the time. It just makes me wonder sometimes.

If a person does this, they could be planning on doing things and going places while you are away. Showing up early from work is the classic way of discovering an affair. Happens all the time. Surely you know this?

May 3, 2012

Suddenly starts asking what time you'll be getting home after work each evening.
This went over my head at first, but looking back, I now see it for what it was: checking up to see what time he needed to put on his "everything is ok, here's dinner" act when I got home from work.

After doing some reading on the subject, turns out this is a HUGE tell for both affairs and emotional affairs. Sudden interest in your daily schedule so that dinner is ready when you're home isn't as loving as it comes off. If this happens to you, lie about coming home late and show up during your lunch hour

Holly crap! Now you got me worried. My Fiancee does this all the time.

On a side now here is another list.

Signs of a cheating wife. I marked the ones that applied to my XW. Cant believe how much I trusted her and how blind I was to these:

1)She sets up a separate cell phone account that is billed to her office...yep!

2)She stops confiding in you and seeking advice from you...yep!

3)She stops wearing her wedding ring...big yep!

4)She shows a sudden interest in a different type of music...yep!

5)Spends an excessive amount of time on the computer when you are asleep...yep!

6)Your spouse seems less comfortable around you and is "touchy"...big yep!

7)She has a definite change in attitude towards everyone in the home...yep!

8)She uses a low voice or whisper on the phone or hangs up quickly when you are around...yep!

9)Begins to delete all incoming phone calls from the caller ID or hides her phone from you...big yep! GF still does this.

10)Deletes all incoming e-mails when they used to accumulate or locks up her PC from you...big yep! GF still does this.

11)Picks fights or arguments over insignificant stuff in order to have an excuse to stomp out of the house...yep!

12)She no longer want sex or makes excuses to not have sex...big yep!

13)She suddenly has to work late and has all kinds of new obligations that take her away from home repeatedly or for long periods of time...yep!

14)She moves emotionally away from you. She doesn't want to be in the same bed with you because they feel they are being unfaithful to the other man...big yep!

15)She talks to you and she treats you abusively or with disdain, disrespect or excessive sarcasm. They may also demonstrate an unexplained aloofness or indifference in the relationship. Or she may begin to find fault in everything you do in an attempt to justify their affair...big yep!

16)You notice that she is reluctant to kiss you or accept your affection...big yep!

17)She ignores or criticizes your affections and thoughtful ways. Example : "don't smother me." ...big yep!

18)When she gets mysterious phone calls or when she hurries to answer the phone, leave the room to talk on the phone and when you ask who called, they say, "No one", "Wrong number", or "Why do you care?"...big yep! GF did this as well at one time.

19)She dresses up and wears makeup for everybody except you...big yep!

I am very leery of these signs now. And one in particular helped me catch my GF when she got up early in the morning on the weekend, took a shower and put on makeup to return a library book. Sheesh really? I went with her and she paniced and texed her XH she could not make it. Only she accidentally sent it to my number instead of his. Talk about a hint!

It's horrible what paranoia and insecurity can do to a person after being betrayed. I dont like feeling like this but my ears are to the ground all the time. Being betrayed not just once but twice by two women I loved is hard enough. Its a small miracle I trust anybody anymore.

May 3, 2012

TBH, if I felt I had to take my work's phone to the toilet or have it stapled to my side, I would quit the dammed job. The phone to the bathroom should have been a red flag to me, but I trusted him, so it wasn't. I wouldn't let that pass if it ever happened again.

May 3, 2012

Thanks findingnemo.
Maybe "angry sex" is not really the right way to express it. It was not violent, but like he was pissed at me...oh, I guess I just can't explain without getting too graphic. Maybe cold and uncaring describes it better. Ewwww, my stomach hurts..........

No, you described it properly the first time. It's angry sex.

May 3, 2012

I think it is ALL about attitude.....and trusting your gut!

If my spouse improves himself in a million different ways, I think I should support that and NOT allow my insecurities to defeat him, AS LONG AS I feel he is still loving and supportive of me and US!

In the best marriages, growth is always supported.

But the red flag should always be if they change for the better and begin to emotionally distance themselves from you, demean you, stop sharing all their joys and new experiences with you.

Then, you have to trust your gut that they ARE trying to outgrow, outdistance you......for someone else; either existing, or on the horizon.

May 3, 2012

her damn iphone

encrypted files on the mac

stopped going with me to see my elderly father

lots and lots of new clothes

frequent trips to 'help her grandmother'

wet wipes in the glovebox. (gross, i know)

lots of unusual cash withdrawals

May 3, 2012

Change is good. Sometimes it's even welcome. But when that change occurs outside of your knowledge, influence, input....something isn't right.

And while we discuss the signs, I now realize that there so many early signs that are small and seem insignificant. My H's mood had improved so much, that he would be singing in the shower. He would be humming while pouring his coffee. He was just so damn happy many times and I had no idea why. Of course, it made me smile because it meant fun in our home as opposed to the dread I'd feel knowing he'd be back soon. The complaining stopped... completely. It was like he was on a happy drug.

I love nice things...beautiful things and he couldn't care less. I had bought lots of hip sneakers, polo shirts, jeans but he never wore them. That is until the As. Suddenly he was fashion conscious, designer conscious. He would ask me what brand something was and thank me (belatedly) for buying them for him. He would ask how he looked, while whistling joyfully and staring at himself in the mirror. Oh the joys of being loved by younger women!!! They made him feel like a stud, I bet.

Change is good but now I know that when it has nothing to do with me, I'm probably screwed.

May 3, 2012

Change is good. Sometimes it's even welcome. But when that change occurs outside of your knowledge, influence, input....something isn't right.

And while we discuss the signs, I now realize that there so many early signs that are small and seem insignificant. My H's mood had improved so much, that he would be singing in the shower. He would be humming while pouring his coffee. He was just so damn happy many times and I had no idea why. Of course, it made me smile because it meant fun in our home as opposed to the dread I'd feel knowing he'd be back soon. The complaining stopped... completely. It was like he was on a happy drug.

I love nice things...beautiful things and he couldn't care less. I had bought lots of hip sneakers, polo shirts, jeans but he never wore them. That is until the As. Suddenly he was fashion conscious, designer conscious. He would ask me what brand something was and thank me (belatedly) for buying them for him. He would ask how he looked, while whistling joyfully and staring at himself in the mirror. Oh the joys of being loved by younger women!!! They made him feel like a stud, I bet.

Change is good but now I know that when it has nothing to do with me, I'm probably screwed.

Pun intended?

May 3, 2012

Pun intended?

Hmmm...I guess so.

May 3, 2012

Drinking heavily after work / socially to numb guilt
Going out 'for an hour or two' rolling in very late on a work night
Suddenly a party animal downing shots etc out of character
Spending money can't afford on clothes/underwear/Hair/socialising
mobile phone glued to her..bathroom/toilet/bag/
messages/call history deleted always excused as memory full
any opportunity to stay out overnight if i was
used 1 close corrupt friend & two distant whose numbers i didnt have to 'cover'
went to places legitimately first and then 'went on' after to make the lie seem closest to truth
used work email & work direct dial to continue affair(inaccessible to me)
left for work 15 mins earlier & returned 15/20 late to talk on phone
worked through lunch to gain extra hour for lunch next day to meet
shopping for 3hrs? after work but coming home with 4 items
visit to grandma but leaving 30mins early to talk on phone/meet
desire to have 'freedom' and 'last blast' before settling down for good
suggests wild idea of six months dating others before settling down
Affair partner invited to social events & meals at the home
'' '' staying over as guest, sneaking into bed as i slept next door
encouraged me to 'get out more' dropping me off/picking me up so she knew where I would be at all times
excessive phone bills (£100's) altho no access to this at time
extra effort to look good when only meeting a mate at the pub
shaved hair in the bath when only meeting a mate at the pub
picked holes in everything perceived wrong with relationship
was throwing up & having diarrhea from guilt (unknown at time)
eating less,drinking more,acting distant,no sex/affection
neglecting basic tasks in the home
arguments & blaming me for them & her unhappiness
normal visits to relatives,friends & making future plans ie-xmas
cancelled plans for holiday using excuse that house related chores/gardening/decorating needed doing
Ordered a skip..watched me help fill it
desire to access large sum of money loan/re-mortgage (unknown that hotel bills/credit cards/phpne bills had stacked up & a pay off to get me out was coming)
asked for 'space'
moved out to give 'us space' (unkown I was enabling affair)
stopped using facebook & home computer
Affair outed after discovering online phone records & confronting.. even then, initially denied until faced with irrefutable evidence
What a horrible list to type, cannot believe this happened to me.

May 3, 2012

Drinking heavily after work / socially to numb guilt
Going out 'for an hour or two' rolling in very late on a work night
Suddenly a party animal downing shots etc out of character
Spending money can't afford on clothes/underwear/Hair/socialising
mobile phone glued to her..bathroom/toilet/bag/
messages/call history deleted always excused as memory full
any opportunity to stay out overnight if i was
used 1 close corrupt friend & two distant whose numbers i didnt have to 'cover'
went to places legitimately first and then 'went on' after to make the lie seem closest to truth
used work email & work direct dial to continue affair(inaccessible to me)
left for work 15 mins earlier & returned 15/20 late to talk on phone
worked through lunch to gain extra hour for lunch next day to meet
shopping for 3hrs? after work but coming home with 4 items
visit to grandma but leaving 30mins early to talk on phone/meet
desire to have 'freedom' and 'last blast' before settling down for good
suggests wild idea of six months dating others before settling down
Affair partner invited to social events & meals at the home
'' '' staying over as guest, sneaking into bed as i slept next door
encouraged me to 'get out more' dropping me off/picking me up so she knew where I would be at all times
excessive phone bills (£100's) altho no access to this at time
extra effort to look good when only meeting a mate at the pub
shaved hair in the bath when only meeting a mate at the pub
picked holes in everything perceived wrong with relationship
was throwing up & having diarrhea from guilt (unknown at time)
eating less,drinking more,acting distant,no sex/affection
neglecting basic tasks in the home
arguments & blaming me for them & her unhappiness
normal visits to relatives,friends & making future plans ie-xmas
cancelled plans for holiday using excuse that house related chores/gardening/decorating needed doing
Ordered a skip..watched me help fill it
desire to access large sum of money loan/re-mortgage (unknown that hotel bills/credit cards/phpne bills had stacked up & a pay off to get me out was coming)
asked for 'space'
moved out to give 'us space' (unkown I was enabling affair)
stopped using facebook & home computer
Affair outed after discovering online phone records & confronting.. even then, initially denied until faced with irrefutable evidence
What a horrible list to type, cannot believe this happened to me.

Wow! It's amazing all the effort that goes into hiding an A. I would get fed up pretty quickly. All that because the WS doesn't want to tell the truth that they think they've found someone else? All that because the WS wants to keep the BS as a back up plan? Jeez...if they have to turn themselves into pseudo-intelligence officers to pull As off, then I'm not surprised that they almost always get caught.

Thanks, inpieces. I'm sorry that you went through all that.

May 3, 2012

g450,

A lot of things on your list I also experienced, as a BW.I also experienced the different sexual moves that nemo spoke of.

You spoke of the paranoria and insecurity, this comes from repeatedly being gaslighted when you are trying to find out the truth! They make you think you are crazy for seeing signs with their constant denials.

This is one reason d-day was a relief for me, I knew without a doubt I could trust my instints.

May 3, 2012

Uggh!

My H conducted his A almost entirely in his lunchtimes with a work colleague. I had virtually no signs that could indicate an A for sure.

He was a little more distant than normal, is about all I can say. He didn't even have a mobile/cell phone at the time.

May 3, 2012

Sid,

This was one reason it took me so long to find out the truth behind his whole personality change.

There was no missing money, no cell phone, no late working hours, we still had sex on a regular basis.(he used pay phones to communicate)

All his cheating took place during lunch hours or during the business day! He had a delivery route and all 3 of the OW worked at businesses he delivered to. They did the deed either in the back rooms of the business or in her car that was in the company parking lot.

May 3, 2012

Drinking heavily after work / socially to numb guilt
Going out 'for an hour or two' rolling in very late on a work night
Suddenly a party animal downing shots etc out of character
Spending money can't afford on clothes/underwear/Hair/socialising
mobile phone glued to her..bathroom/toilet/bag/
messages/call history deleted always excused as memory full
any opportunity to stay out overnight if i was
used 1 close corrupt friend & two distant whose numbers i didnt have to 'cover'
went to places legitimately first and then 'went on' after to make the lie seem closest to truth
used work email & work direct dial to continue affair(inaccessible to me)
left for work 15 mins earlier & returned 15/20 late to talk on phone
worked through lunch to gain extra hour for lunch next day to meet
shopping for 3hrs? after work but coming home with 4 items
visit to grandma but leaving 30mins early to talk on phone/meet
desire to have 'freedom' and 'last blast' before settling down for good
suggests wild idea of six months dating others before settling down
Affair partner invited to social events & meals at the home
'' '' staying over as guest, sneaking into bed as i slept next door
encouraged me to 'get out more' dropping me off/picking me up so she knew where I would be at all times
excessive phone bills (£100's) altho no access to this at time
extra effort to look good when only meeting a mate at the pub
shaved hair in the bath when only meeting a mate at the pub
picked holes in everything perceived wrong with relationship
was throwing up & having diarrhea from guilt (unknown at time)
eating less,drinking more,acting distant,no sex/affection
neglecting basic tasks in the home
arguments & blaming me for them & her unhappiness
normal visits to relatives,friends & making future plans ie-xmas
cancelled plans for holiday using excuse that house related chores/gardening/decorating needed doing
Ordered a skip..watched me help fill it
desire to access large sum of money loan/re-mortgage (unknown that hotel bills/credit cards/phpne bills had stacked up & a pay off to get me out was coming)
asked for 'space'
moved out to give 'us space' (unkown I was enabling affair)
stopped using facebook & home computer
Affair outed after discovering online phone records & confronting.. even then, initially denied until faced with irrefutable evidence
What a horrible list to type, cannot believe this happened to me.

Really, so sorry. It is a horrible list and how cruel she was. I hope you are moving in the right direction for you.

May 3, 2012

g450,

A lot of things on your list I also experienced, as a BW.I also experienced the different sexual moves that nemo spoke of.

You spoke of the paranoria and insecurity, this comes from repeatedly being gaslighted when you are trying to find out the truth! They make you think you are crazy for seeing signs with their constant denials.

This is one reason d-day was a relief for me, I knew without a doubt I could trust my instints.

Yeah I remember XW throwing all these new sexual moves on me as well. This was right about the time she went through menopause. What is scarry is that this happened years before she divorced me. Looking back, she could have very well had an affair with her HS sweetheart under my nose for years. But it would have had to be very rarily because he lived out of state. I remember my Son calling me at 3am from grandmas house saying Mom still isnt back from her HS reunion etc. She could have hooked up with him at least once a year AFAIK. All the signs and I did nothing.

So many of us are trusting fools.

May 4, 2012

If your wife laughs at you, unable to keep a straight face when asked if she has a lover or boyfriend....watch out!! I know someone having an affair who reacts this way, trying to laugh it off and playing along jokingly saying, "of course I do...do you want to meet him?" The bottom line is that even if there are no signs, if your gut instinct tells you that something is off then don't ignore it. If you're in a marriage or long term relationship and your sex life has taken a nosedive, don't buy this BS that it's because of the kids, her career, pre-menopause , or whatever excuse. If she's hot and attractive, she's still getting it somewhere....don't stick your head in the sand.

May 4, 2012

sudden emotional disengagement
buys flashy new underwear
goes on out-of-town trips with male co-worker
unusual work hours
accusative
defensive
recent attention to physical fitness and dress
gut feeling that something isn't right
semen stains on her underwear when you haven't had sex in a month
mocking laughter

and for good measure, here are Dr. Robert Hare's symptoms of a sociopath:

superficial
egocentric and entitled
lack of remorse or guilt
lack of empathy
deceitful and manipulative

and finally, let's quote the Bible:

"Such is the way of an adulterous woman; she eateth, and wipeth her mouth, and saith, I have done no wickedness." Prov. 30:20

"For by means of a whorish woman a man is brought to a piece of bread: and the adulteress will hunt for the precious life." Prov. 6:26

"For she hath cast down many wounded: yea, many strong men have been slain by her. Her house is the way to hell, going down to the chambers of death." Prov. 7:26, 27

May 4, 2012

...

and finally, let's quote the Bible:

"Such is the way of an adulterous woman; she eateth, and wipeth her mouth, and saith, I have done no wickedness." Prov. 30:20

"For by means of a whorish woman a man is brought to a piece of bread: and the adulteress will hunt for the precious life." Prov. 6:26

"For she hath cast down many wounded: yea, many strong men have been slain by her. Her house is the way to hell, going down to the chambers of death." Prov. 7:26, 27

I'm a bit confused here - are you saying the signs of a cheating wife include her quoting strange passages from the bible?

Or, are you saying that the bible contains a list of such signs including:

Eating a meal, wiping her mouth, giving bread to a man, slaying strong men.

I haven't slain any men lately but I've done all the rest and I've never been a cheating wife!

May 4, 2012

Thanks everybody... I think we do see the signs but are so busy with daily activities that we ignore them. Sometimes it may also be a defense mechanism. We may not want to deal with it at that point for any number of reasons.

But once I started considering that my H could be cheating...signs started cropping up everywhere. They were so blatant that I couldn't ignore them. I still have photographs of one of the OW. One day I woke up early and decided to drive my H's car. I rarely did. There I found a bunch of photos of this woman. I took them and kept quiet. From then on, I'd take very opportunity I had to search his car. That's how I found the deodorants. Always brand new because I would take those out too.

But here's the funny thing. I also found my call records, with certain numbers highlighted. He was checking up on ME. Ironic. to get my call records, he'd paid someone at the phone company because he couldn't access my bills. They went to the office. Imagine the lengths a cheater will go to just to make sure you're not cheating. Disgusting!!!

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