Is my marriage doomed?

[troublex2]

Hi All,

I'm new to this forum, but I am at the end of my rope and decided to find a blog so I can vent. Not to mention that I hate my job and I'm sitting in my cubicle at work ready to scratch my own eyeballs out.

Long story, short... my marriage has always been 'interesting.' Mainly because I'll admit that I'm a realist and don't go for the touchy feely, long talks and cuddling kind of thing. My husband is the youngest of 3 kids and quite the dreamer. I envy his creativity but his lack of responsibility when it comes to keeping jobs or pulling his weight around the house has always been a sore spot.

Having twins a year and half ago has only put more strain on our relationship. People tell you that having kids changes everything... but why didn't someone grab me by the shoulders and tell me "kids CHANGE EVERYTHING!" I'm exhausted mentally, physically, and financially. I lost my sense of self because I'm consumed with work, motherly duties, and household duties. Let's put it this way, I barely have time to open the mail at the end of the day and I'll take sleep over sex anytime.

Recently, all hubby and I do is argue. I think we're both just so sick and tired and sick of being tired. I think I already mentioned I hate my job too so by the time I get home from work I have no patience with anyone. You'd think after being together 15 years DH would realize that if he chipped in a little more around the house that I wouldn't fly off the handle every damn night.

The reason I decided to post today is because I seem so tired of fighting that I just don't talk to him at all lately. I realize what i'm doing is wrong but its so much easier than the alternative which would just be us arguing. For example, if he tells me he doesn't think I should do "x, y, or z" I just ignore him and do it anyway. Whether that means spending $, or inviting my mom over (she and DH don't get along), or planning me time with friends.

I'm not looking for affirmation that my point of view is right. I just need some advice on how to communicate better. How to juggle work, kids, husband and still have time for myself. How to get out of this slump.

Thanks!

[coffeecat]

No, I don't think your marriage is doomed. You are just at a sore spot. I have children. They are teens now and the roughest times in my marriage is when they were little. I was physically, mentally and emotionally spent as well. I didn't have twins or a job like you, so I can't imagine how hard that would be. I don't really know how to solve a problem like this except for you to talk to your husband about how much you hate your job and that you really , really , need to find another alternative. Explain that it is killing your spirit and sapping your humanity. If he is sensitive and creative then he can think with you on how to solve the problem. Maybe he could support you for awhile while you look for another job- or a similar solution.

 

In essence, I don't think your marriage is doomed, but I think life is too short to not do what you love.

[troublex2]

Coffeecat, thank you for the words of inspiration. I know we probably should seek counseling but its like God, when are we supposed to find the time. We've been "talking" about our issues and saying we're going to stop fighting and help each other more but it just doesn't happen. I try to convince myself that this rough patch will pass. It's just so hard when you're in the thick of it.

[TaraMaiden]

I think truth be known, many people feel as you do, and i bet you've touched a raw nerve with many people.

Tell me, if someone had grabbed you by the shoulders and told you "kids CHANGE EVERYTHING!!" - would you have listened, and not had them?

 

Hindsight is a wonderful thing, because our vision's 20/20.

Hell, if we could look forwards in the same way....

If it is any consolation, i too wish someone had given me a stiff talking to as well, all those years ago.

but then, I felt that way - now in hindsight, i feel this way.

 

One thing i could suggest, if i may, is that you spend the time between leaving work, and getting home, positively.

if you drive, listen to a CD, or if you use public transport, use your phone and download music.

but not just any old stuff.

use positive affirmations, and soothing meditative music (if you drive, not the kind that will induce you to sleep!) Listen to the kind of stuff that will help put you into a more positive frame of mind.

If it doesn't take you that long to get home - take time. Give yourself an extra half hour or so.

and if you have a childminder or babysitter, then bring them in on this....let them know what you'll be doing, and ask for their support.

 

And - trust me on this one - STOP doing unnecessary tasks.

Do what you know you have to do, but don't pick up after your H.

 

You don't say what job you have (whether it's full- or part-time) but in any case, your time at home is consequently obviously cut down and limited.

If you have to work to keep things going financially, that doesn't mean you have to drive yourself into an early grave by doing the work of 2 people when you get home.

I know - I KNOW - it will go against the grain, (trust me, I know!!) but when you see something needs doing, ask yourself - does this need doing because it's a household chore - or does it need doing because he's been too damn lazy to get off his @$$ and do it himself?

 

DON'T pick up after him.

Don't do what you know he's perfectly capable of doing for himself.

Tell him - don't ask him, tell him - you are not going to do the tasks you know he is capable of dong himself do form now on he will have to do everything that so far, you've been doing for him.

 

Also, see if you can budget for someone to come in once or twice a week to do some housework for you.

 

how does that sound so far?

[KathyM]

I think you should sit down with your husband and have a discussion on some topics that need to be discussed. #1: division of labor. Make a list together of all the chores, including child care, that needs to be done every day, every week, every month, and then you divide up the labor equitably--not necessarily equally, but what makes the most sense. Put that person's name by each item to designate who will be responsible for doing that item. Cross out those things that can slide or be put on a more infrequent time frame. Consider hiring outside help to do some things, or even to do child care so you can have time to take care of those things yourself. When you establish a list and come to an agreement on it, that will reduce your arguments substantially. #2: Then set up a daily, weekly, and monthly schedule and pencil in time for you and your husband as a couple, time for your own interests/pursuits, and time needed for job, children, etc. When you have it established in writing, you are more likely to make time for the things you may otherwise put off--like time for yourself. Planning this stuff together, and putting it in writing is what will help to reduce the arguments and help you to allow time for important things that are probably being pushed aside right now.

[troublex2]

Tara, thanks. I will take your advice about giving myself half an hour on the way home to decompress and be more aware of picking & choosing household chores because I shouldn't exhaust myself if H is just being lazy.

 

I do work full time but at this point I'm going to need to start calling in sick for 'mental health' reasons and get some time for ME. Plus I know that working out would help but again there isn't much time to squeeze that in.

 

You're right if someone had shaken me silly and told me not to have kids, like I tell my friends, it wouldn't have changed the fact that I wanted them. It's like a double edge sword. Only when you make a regrettable decision with a job or a pet you are locked in for a limited time. Truth be told, the first year with twins sucked big time. But now they are at a fun age and I actually look forward to seeing them, most people won't admit that they dread going home to their kids, but I tell it like it is. Parenthood is exhausting.

[xxoo]

You'd rather sleep than have sex.....but are you having sex?

 

Speaking generally, women pull away (sexually) when they aren't getting their need for support met in the relationship.

 

And men pull away (supportively) when they aren't getting their need for sex met in the relationship.

 

And it is a bad cycle downward.

 

If you aren't making time for sexual connection, do that. Maybe ask him to get up with the kids on a day you have off, so that you can stay up late having sex with him once a week to start.

[TaraMaiden]

sorry, couldn't go back to edit - I hate typos...What I meant was -

 

you are not going to do the tasks you know he is capable of doing himself so from now on he will have to do everything that so far, you've been doing for him.

 

 

 

Tara, thanks. I will take your advice about giving myself half an hour on the way home to decompress and be more aware of picking & choosing household chores because I shouldn't exhaust myself if H is just being lazy.

 

I do work full time but at this point I'm going to need to start calling in sick for 'mental health' reasons and get some time for ME. Plus I know that working out would help but again there isn't much time to squeeze that in.

can you get someone in to help with the housework?

Discuss that bit with your H. If he suggests it would be more expensive, then you'll have to tell him he MUST pull his weight more....

So, his call..it's either that, or a housekeeper...

 

..... Parenthood is exhausting.

It's also thankless, 24/7, demanding, time-consuming and soul-destroying.

It's a lifetime task and much as it's rewarding, there will be times when you wish you were still childless - and dare I say it, single.

 

But here's the thing:

You can't turn the clock back.

So having the life you've made for yourself, try to find ways to turn it into a joy, rather than an ordeal.

When it comes to cleaning the bathroom, vs. playing with the children - stuff the bathroom.

[troublex2]

Tara, I think you and I would make great friends. We think alike. Your comment "parenthood is... soul-destroying" made me laugh out loud! Also, there are plenty of days I wish I was childless AND single. I don't think any of my friends would admit to that which just makes me resent them more. Kidding. Kind of.

xxoo, yes we have sex but I was just making the point that I'm so tired and sometimes don't even want to see DH's face or have a conversation that often I do choose (or wish I could choose) sleep over sex.

[Ninja'sHusband]

I don't think your M is doomed. I'd get some self help books. Shop around, there's lots of good ones.

[TaraMaiden]

I'm very well acquainted with a similar couple in the uk where the wife actually separated from the husband and took her 3 kids with her.

It ended up with him doing a heck of a lot more after their separation, than before it - because ultimately, he had to.

He paid half towards the childminder - up to then, it had all been coming out of her salary.

He had to stop going out so often at weekends and in the evenings with his buddies, because her shifts meant occasional weekend/evening work - so he had to pull his weight more with the children.

he had to cook, clean and do the laundry for himself - because his wife no longer picked up every scrap of clothing he left lying around for her to wash....

he became a lot more domesticated and proactive.

and they're still together - and he still pulls his weight.

 

It is a well-known documented fact that where women and men in full-time jobs are living together/raising a family - the majority of the domestic chores and aspects of childcare still fall to women.

 

And just to prove it's not an isolated alarmist report:

 

Housework is STILL a woman's job as survey revealed just one in 10 men do more | Mail Online

 

Gender equality? Women STILL do 82 per cent of housework | Mail Online

 

Mothers still do housework, despite women in workplace - Telegraph

 

And it's been going on for decades - because we let it happen.

we're too accommodating.

we believe we're in a lose/lose situation;

If we don't do it - nobody will.

If we DO do it - we still lose because they haven't had to lift a finger.

 

We're too soft.

we give in, because of pride and occasionally - dare I say it - a sense of duty and martyrdom.

Well you have to grit your teeth and be determined that if what it takes is living in a schytt-hole for a while - then so be it.

 

It worked for me.

It can - and will - work for you.

[standtall]

LOL. She doesn't need "self help" books - she needs a husband who isn't an irresponsible LAZY ASS who can't hold a steady job and refuses to lift a finger around the house.

 

That a big conclusion from her original post.

[PinkInTheLimo]

I envy his creativity but his lack of responsibility when it comes to keeping jobs or pulling his weight around the house has always been a sore spot.

 

I fail to understand why women want to live with a guy like that, let alone have children with him. Why do you accept to be his slave? If he does not pull his weight, stop cooking for him, stop taking care of his laundry, stop cleaning up his mess after him.

As long as a person is not extremely old or disabled, there is nothing that prevents them from doing the basic chores in a household.

 

I wonder what kind of mother brings up a guy like that. If I would have a son, I would make sure that he learns to do household tasks.

[xxoo]

That a big conclusion from her original post.

 

As a husband, do you have advice for a wife feeling as the op describes? How could she approach her husband in a way that would be productive, and help the marriage?

[TaraMaiden]

..... his lack of responsibility when it comes to keeping jobs or pulling his weight around the house has always been a sore spot.

Having twins a year and half ago has only put more strain on our relationship. ....

Recently, all hubby and I do is argue. ..... You'd think after being together 15 years DH would realize that if he chipped in a little more around the house that I wouldn't fly off the handle every damn night.

The reason I decided to post today is because I seem so tired of fighting that I just don't talk to him at all lately. ..... How to juggle work, kids, husband and still have time for myself. How to get out of this slump.

Thanks!

 

.....We've been "talking" about our issues and saying we're going to stop fighting and help each other more but it just doesn't happen. I try to convince myself that this rough patch will pass. It's just so hard when you're in the thick of it.

 

Tara, thanks. I will take your advice ....be more aware of picking & choosing household chores because I shouldn't exhaust myself if H is just being lazy.

 

.....but I tell it like it is. Parenthood is exhausting.

 

LOL. She doesn't need "self help" books - she needs a husband who isn't an irresponsible LAZY ASS who can't hold a steady job and refuses to lift a finger around the house.

 

That a big conclusion from her original post.

 

Having picked out the relevant bits, I don't think it's a 'big conclusion' at all.

And relevant to my later post - I think it's the crux of the matter.

Edited April 27, 2012 by TaraMaiden

[standtall]

Having picked out the relevant bits, I don't think it's a 'big conclusion' at all.

And relevant to my later post - I think it's the crux of the matter.

 

I had an issue with the phrase "lazy ass" and "lift a finger". That is extreme, harsh, and inflammatory. Also, the OP did not use those phrases, she by your own quotes, used phrases like "chip in a little more" and "pulling his weight". Quite a bit of difference. I do see it being the crux of the matter as well, but the posters on here are not helping her marriage out by getting on the man hate, you go girl bandwagon. I am sure there is 2 sides to every story with the truth lying somewhere in between, and I realize that most posters can only respond to the issues based on the info that they are given, but I am noticing quite a bit of gender bias by the posters. I was merely trying to tone down the hate directed at the husband.

[mem11363]

Trouble,

Perhaps you start with a short needed changed list. Your column, his column.

 

Take the love busters questionnaire together and be honest. If he is capable of hearing your honest feelings, without shutting you down, and you hearing his, you do this in sequence:

 

You start with a statement of commitment to a happy marriage. This is different than a statement of simply remaining married. And then you go through the questionnaire, and understand how each other feels. This is key and because it comes just before the creation of the schedule, it is constructive input.

 

Your list is what you want him to commit to DOING differently. And his is the same for you. One item on the list could be:

- When we come home and first see each other, recognizing that our bond is the bond that glues the entire family together, we will smile at and hug each other.

- When we ask, and we both should do so, about each others day, it should be understood that there is a difference between humorously describing a toxic boss, and complaining relentlessly and in detail about the same stuff over and over.

- We NEED a certain amount of exercise to manage stress. Lets get a twin stoller and set aside time for a brisk 1/2 hour to an hour walk as a family right before or after dinner. The non-stroller pusher can get "heavy hands" if they want to amplify the workout.

 

And then you draw up a defined weekly schedule. Not fun. Not romantic. Very useful. Who is doing what and when. When one of you forgets something, instead of the other being harsh on them, the phrase "here is what you can do to make it up to me" works well. The "make up" work should be in proportion to the size of the screwup.

 

And then you can overlay the extra stuff - and there won't be a lot of it right now, that you want to add to the "base" schedule. Visiting parents, girls and guys night out.

 

As PART of this, you are both entitled to share whatever resentments you have about the last year or two. And you both need to agree that if BOTH of you stick to the new schedule, you will put the past behind you. Clinging to resentments is maritally toxic.

 

And you should prepare for that session. If you KNOW some of the things he wants you to do differently, be ready to address them.

 

Often, if sex is an issue, there is a desire to deal with it in a totally separate manner. Don't do that if the sexual issues are mostly driven by the stuff happening outside the bedroom. Only address the sexual issues separately if one or both of you dislike what is happening IN bed.

 

If you do schedule sex, there are two ways to do it. One is to say, Friday and Saturday nights are best. Sunday night is usually good. And so forth. The other is to agree to a minimum frequency and then have a planned schedule that the lower desire partner can alter. And altering means, we agreed on X times per week. Amazingly I feel good tonight (Monday) and will initiate. That counts as one of your times. It reduces the number of nights where the LD partner ends up feeling resentful because they really are very tired. This gives them more control over picking times that work best for them. Generally a HD partner will understand and support this.

 

 

 

Hi All,

I'm new to this forum, but I am at the end of my rope and decided to find a blog so I can vent. Not to mention that I hate my job and I'm sitting in my cubicle at work ready to scratch my own eyeballs out.

Long story, short... my marriage has always been 'interesting.' Mainly because I'll admit that I'm a realist and don't go for the touchy feely, long talks and cuddling kind of thing. My husband is the youngest of 3 kids and quite the dreamer. I envy his creativity but his lack of responsibility when it comes to keeping jobs or pulling his weight around the house has always been a sore spot.

Having twins a year and half ago has only put more strain on our relationship. People tell you that having kids changes everything... but why didn't someone grab me by the shoulders and tell me "kids CHANGE EVERYTHING!" I'm exhausted mentally, physically, and financially. I lost my sense of self because I'm consumed with work, motherly duties, and household duties. Let's put it this way, I barely have time to open the mail at the end of the day and I'll take sleep over sex anytime.

Recently, all hubby and I do is argue. I think we're both just so sick and tired and sick of being tired. I think I already mentioned I hate my job too so by the time I get home from work I have no patience with anyone. You'd think after being together 15 years DH would realize that if he chipped in a little more around the house that I wouldn't fly off the handle every damn night.

The reason I decided to post today is because I seem so tired of fighting that I just don't talk to him at all lately. I realize what i'm doing is wrong but its so much easier than the alternative which would just be us arguing. For example, if he tells me he doesn't think I should do "x, y, or z" I just ignore him and do it anyway. Whether that means spending $, or inviting my mom over (she and DH don't get along), or planning me time with friends.

I'm not looking for affirmation that my point of view is right. I just need some advice on how to communicate better. How to juggle work, kids, husband and still have time for myself. How to get out of this slump.

Thanks!

[TaraMaiden]

I had an issue with the phrase "lazy ass" and "lift a finger". That is extreme, harsh, and inflammatory. Also, the OP did not use those phrases, she by your own quotes, used phrases like "chip in a little more" and "pulling his weight". Quite a bit of difference. I do see it being the crux of the matter as well, but the posters on here are not helping her marriage out by getting on the man hate, you go girl bandwagon. I am sure there is 2 sides to every story with the truth lying somewhere in between, and I realize that most posters can only respond to the issues based on the info that they are given, but I am noticing quite a bit of gender bias by the posters. I was merely trying to tone down the hate directed at the husband.

 

Point taken.

And as I also mentioned, women complain vociferously about the lack of support they get at home from their husbands.

various reports, studies and articles would suggest they are justified.

But rather than complain, we need to find a solution to the problem.

 

And trust me - it really IS a problem.

 

Women find themselves in a lose-lose situation, because if they say nothing, nothing gets done by the husband.

If they complain, they get accused of nagging, and of being a martyr, and arguments start.

If they do nothing, but the essential - it just delays the inevitable, because the husband simply doesn't notice it, and the wife ends up doing it anyway, in the end.

 

Do I speak from experience?

What do you think?

 

standtall, Since you object to the terminology used, what would you advise in such a situation?

[giotto]

I would advise shock therapy. Tell him you are going to divorce him if he doesn't "pull his weight"... because, obviously, nothing else is working and never will.

[Lucky_One]

I really really like mem's post and advice. You have a mother close-by obviously, so ask her to take the twins for a weekend (or at least an overnight). Schedule this time to be with your husband doing these tasks - these things that are vital to your marriage becoming one again where you both are safe, nurtured and protected. Try, if finances say, to go somewhere relaxing and fun; time spent in the car together can be a great time to talk as there are very limited distractions.

 

From what you have said, i think that it IS wise for posters to remember that the H very likely has stresses of his own. If he were to come here and say that he is living a life that he hates, and that his wife spends money that they don't have even after they have talked it, or that his wife asks her mother to come over constantly even though the two of them do not get along, then there would likely be a lot more support for him going on here.

 

One thing that I think makes excellent sense that Tara suggested (but I have not seen addressed by the OP) is getting a housecleaner. Even getting someone to come in every other week is a HUGE help. They can do things like floors, baseboards, wash and change sheets, keep little fingerprints off window and doors, scrub toilets and tubs, dust the underneaths of tables, do a load or two of clothes - stuff like that - and then you can cut your time to running a dustcloth over tabletops once a week and hoovering every few days on the floors where the twins roll around the most and keep the laundry up at a reasonable rate.

 

Trust me - if you can afford to take time off work for mental health reasons, then you can afford to use that time/money on a housekeeper. Coming home to a tidy house at least 2 days a month is a fantastic feeling, and you will find that the house will stay tidier when you are proud of it and feel less daunted by it.

[TaraMaiden]

There are actually a whole lot of different options available - but it's all very well, as long as two things happen:

 

One: both parties equally realise that something needs changing, and thwy both work together, cohesively, to efect these changes.

 

Two: Both parties actively work to turning these options into solutions, and keep up the momentum.

 

Nobody ever died wishing they'd spent more hours in the office.