Ladies, be assured, this forum does NOT represent the majority of men

[fortyninethousand322]

Really? How many men do YOU know personally who are in relationships with multiple women (who themselves aren't with multiple men)?

 

I don't know a single polygynous relationship IRL.

 

I know a lot of people who are dating one woman and cheating on her with another. The woman the guy cheats with is only with him and his gf is obviously only with him. This happens more with men than with women.

[Els]

I know a lot of people who are dating one woman and cheating on her with another. The woman the guy cheats with is only with him and his gf is obviously only with him. This happens more with men than with women.

 

How are you so certain? The thing about cheating is that if it is done sneakily enough, people often don't know.

 

I think you only need to talk to some of the BS on this forum to find out that men and women are equally prone to cheating.

[fortyninethousand322]

How are you so certain? The thing about cheating is that if it is done sneakily enough, people often don't know.

 

I think you only need to talk to some of the BS on this forum to find out that men and women are equally prone to cheating.

 

I've seen it way more with men than women. I even know some women who admitted that they got played by a guy they thought was only seeing them but who was seeing another woman at the same time.

[TheBigQuestion]

OP is completely off-base. LoveShack is a PUA haven?? Since when? I can think of only a tiny handful of posters, most of whom aren't even around anymore, who utilized/promoted PUA techniques.

 

As far as what this site being representative of men as a whole, it definitely isn't. The male LS demographic seems pretty equally divided between Lovable Losers and normal, level-headed guys who are either in relationships or have had success with women. I fall into the latter group I suppose. A majority of men in the real world aren't virgins or have extremely limited experience with women by the time they reach their mid-20s. There is also a third contingent of men that border on misogynistic, although many just troll to get a rise out of people.

 

What I'm 100% sure of, however, is that the attitudes of the majority of female LS regulars hold are not representative of women OR men in real life.

[Radu]

I don't understand the need to be rude or try to be cruel. Can you explain what you're trying to achieve? I assume there is something going wrong for you in your own life, and you like the idea of venting it on strangers who can't hurt you.

.

 

 

They are sexually attracted to the other gender, but they resent the other gender.

They stay on LS or other forums and only focus on the negatives that the opposite gender has.

Thus they both love and hate that gender.

 

It affected me in the past too, and untill i forced myself to see the good in women i was very very bitter. After i got over it, things started improving for me (took me a while though).

You have to take ppl as they are, the good, the bad and the damn ugly (talking about personality here).

Edited April 17, 2012 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Radu]

My point stands, if you continue to hate the gender you are sexually attracted, you will end up all alone.

Edited April 17, 2012 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[january2011]

Bar the more rational posters, in real life, I have never met any of the other (fe)male stereotypes that exist on this forum. Therefore, it has never cross my mind that these stereotypes represent the majority of (wo)men.

[Mme. Chaucer]

I have gotten the hint. Thus my bitterness, and why I get angry when people on this forum continue to claim that "guys find lots of things attractive!" "looks don't matter that much!" "guys have lots of different standards!"

 

 

Just because some posters validate your worst opinions of men doesn't mean that they are representative of men in general. They are most likely representative of men who can't get a date.

 

How about practicing engaging with the posters who say positive things to you and about women rather than triumphantly latching onto those who say the crap.

Edited April 17, 2012 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Radu]

Just because some posters validate your worst opinions of men doesn't mean that they are representative of men in general. They are most likely representative of men who can't get a date.

 

How about practicing engaging with the posters who say positive things to you and about women rather than triumphantly latching onto those who say the crap.

 

 

I'm a lurker, i've been watching this forum for going on 6 months before i joined.

If you will read their threads or posts you will see that they have some sort of hate towards the opposite sex.

That hatred comes off when you engage the opposite sex (in RL) and was for me the object of much rejection.

They have been on this forum for ages and have been told nothing but positive things, yet here we are.

Edited April 17, 2012 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[wwwjd]

Wow! a lot happened when I went to lunch.

 

My post was about me seeming like a minority on here, came expecting a wide variety of discussions (which there are) but more and more feels like a bar where hot guys get drunk and brag, and I never go to bars, or drink, and get mixed up in any of that time wasting over dramatic nonesense, so I am feeling out of place here. I posted up to show there are more that "that type" of guy out there. They just aren't posting here.

 

In my life, my circles and all that, I haven't know many or any that I can recall of multi-daters, cheaters, adulterers, PUA, etc etc etc so, IN MY PERSPECTIVE, everything I see on here is the MINORITY in the real world. That is just MY angle on it. I do know they exist, but I rarely ever see it, am near it, have no time for it, and don't put up with it. So, as one of those type of guys, I just wanted to state what I see: my type, your average decent guy, is not well represented her.

 

But, very interesting responses!! Keep it going. The net is about discussion. Glad this one is continuing.

Edited April 17, 2012 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Stephanie]

For those of you ladies reading all these threads about DAY GAMING, pick up artists, how much sex guys want and how fast...

 

PLEASE BE ASSURED this does not represent a accurate cross section of what is out there for you to meet.

 

This forum seems to draw a particular segment of individuals - first up, people that know how to use google to find "How to pickup women" websites, and etc.

 

Just because a certain number of people go online to a site like this to post and seek info about dating and relationships does not automatically mean they are an accurately balanced typical cross section of the guys that are out there. I have seen a decent slice of varied individuals here that keeps the perspectives and opinions diverse and interesting, but the net ALSO forces people into a party where they normally wouldn't be.

 

For example, I would not be caught in the same room with any sort of guy bragging about how he expects kisses on first dates, or how he banged 4 different women last week. Not saying that is wrong for them, just that *I* would not be found in the same room with them discussing, well, anything. So, I would guess, there is a large majority of guys out there that are NOT posting on this particular website, who's perspective and opinions are NOT heard. Guys who don't use terms like "Pump and Dump" or guys who idea of meeting women doesn't have to revolve around alcohol.

 

Make of this what you will, I just wanted to post up, there are much more wider versions of males that I have personally seen than the type on THIS particular website.

 

If you choose to only keep looking in clubs and bars, you choose to keep finding this same type of guy. And nothing changes if you change nothing.

 

Alternate perspectives exist outside this tiny biosphere of a forum.

 

The topic for discussion in this thread is whether or not the posters in this forum represent a true cross section of people dating "in real life". This thread is getting highly off topic with inside discussion on beauty, health, etc.

 

Let's keep this thread on topic.

[verhrzn]

Just because some psoters validate your worst opinions of men doesn't mean that they are representative of men in general. They are most likely representative of men who can't get a date.

 

How about practicing engaging with the posters who say positive things to you and about women rather than triumphantly latching onto those who say the crap.

 

Again, I don't think it's all men. I've posted extensively that I think there DO exist non-shallow guys... but they are married/taken. Most of the married/engaged guys I've met are sweet, funny, good-hearted guys who value personality. Which is WHY they are married... because there are more kind/interesting women than there are hot/kind women, so if you as a guy judge more on personality than looks, you're gonna find a fantastic selection.

 

However, I DO think this forum confirms my assumptions about single men... or, as you put it, "men who can't get a date." Which, frankly, is my demographic. I mean, if a guy can easily get a date, he's not gonna want to date me (because there are lots and lots of better women than me.) So the type of guy I focus on are the types on this forum... but those types, don't want me, because of their high standards. (Which is also a big part of WHY they can't get dates.)

 

Positive posts are all well and good, but they are not strictly helpful. They run a very serious risk of blinding me to the reality that men just don't want to date me, because of the attitudes you see exhibited on this forum and in real life. What good does ignoring the reality do?

Edited April 17, 2012 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Radu]

Again, I don't think it's all men. I've posted extensively that I think there DO exist non-shallow guys... but they are married/taken. Most of the married/engaged guys I've met are sweet, funny, good-hearted guys who value personality. Which is WHY they are married... because there are more kind/interesting women than there are hot/kind women, so if you as a guy judge more on personality than looks, you're gonna find a fantastic selection.

 

However, I DO think this forum confirms my assumptions about single men... or, as you put it, "men who can't get a date." Which, frankly, is my demographic. I mean, if a guy can easily get a date, he's not gonna want to date me (because there are lots and lots of better women than me.) So the type of guy I focus on are the types on this forum... but those types, don't want me, because of their high standards. (Which is also a big part of WHY they can't get dates.)

 

Positive posts are all well and good, but they are not strictly helpful. They run a very serious risk of blinding me to the reality that men just don't want to date me, because of the attitudes you see exhibited on this forum and in real life. What good does ignoring the reality do?

 

 

Here's a new twist on things.

 

Maybe they are lighthearted, funny, sweet because they are in a relationship and all the pressure is off.

[somedude81]

Well I'm out of this thread.

 

It was fun talking about this stuff which I wouldn't dare do in real life.

 

Thanks zengirl for helping me see that I sometimes use poor words that can unintentionally offend.

[zengirl]

Again, I don't think it's all men. I've posted extensively that I think there DO exist non-shallow guys... but they are married/taken. Most of the married/engaged guys I've met are sweet, funny, good-hearted guys who value personality. Which is WHY they are married... because there are more kind/interesting women than there are hot/kind women, so if you as a guy judge more on personality than looks, you're gonna find a fantastic selection.

 

OK, I get the, "That's why they're married" thing (though many jerks of each gender are also married, frankly). But THIS makes no sense:

 

However, I DO think this forum confirms my assumptions about single men... or, as you put it, "men who can't get a date."

 

Those are two different groups. I know loads of single men IRL. I don't know any man IRL who truly cannot get a date (I know some that, at times, have struggled because they were in need of some self-improvement to get through a blocked phase, but not perpetually). I do know a few perpetually single men and women but they can get dates too and go on dates sometimes. "Can't get a date" is an extreme version of men who are far over represented on LS. You won't find such men often, and I don't think you should make them your demographic. I know women with far less in looks and career than you, V, who do well with men. It's because they have better social capital, self-esteem, and less blocks towards interpersonal relationships than you do. All of which can be built with time and energy directed towards it. This is the same thing for the men on this board who are perpetually thwarted, though you have a leg up on many such posters because you are already more inclined to look within and examine yourself much of the time than others.

[wwwjd]

I've posted extensively that I think there DO exist non-shallow guys... but they are married/taken.

 

Not ALL of them. I am here, not "shallow", not married or taken. If one exists, then many more exist.

 

Which is why I posted this thread. not everyone is a shallow player

[jobaba]

 

2nd: my post was about me seeming like a minority on here, came expecting a wide variety of discussions (which there are) but more and more feels like a bar where hot guys get drunk and brag, and I never go to bars, or drink, and get mixed up in any of that time wasting over dramatic nonesense, so I am feeling out of place here. I posted up to show there are more that "that type" of guy out there. They just aren't posting here.

 

 

I haven't seen much of that on here. If anything, this board is more populated with men who have trouble getting women.

 

If anything, there's more women on here like that ... talking of rejecting men for relatively trivial dealbreakers and talking about how many other batters they have for the next week.

 

I know the guys you speak of in real life. They're not on online relationship forums. They're at bars getting drunk, having women throw themselves at them, and judging big booty contests (yes, I am thinking of particular guys and instances).

Edited April 17, 2012 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[SteveC80]

I ddint know having physical requirements and havign to be attracted to somebody you want to date was such a awful thing:confused:

 

Most people men and women have to be somewhat attracted to somebody physically for it to work i couldnt imagine being with somebody that i cringe at the thought of even making out with them or being naked together

 

If they say looks dont matter at all therye either full of it or arent good looking enough to get soebmody they are attracted to

 

People are as shallow and picky as they can afford to be

 

It's only the people who arent attatcive to the opposite sex for whatever reason that complain about the rules of attraction ans how shallow they are

[zengirl]

I know lots of people like some of the posters on LS in real life, though of course there are many types of people who'd never post on such a forum. So it can't be truly indicative of LS. I disagree that there's that much PUA culture on here, though. There's some, but not THAT much, and plenty of the men on here are the same types I've met IRL. I know many guys like forum posters such as USMCHokie, fishtaco, johan, ThaWholigan, NinjainPajamas, and EasyHeart (if he were younger), for instance, though I'd say those men are all vastly different types of people in many ways. I also know many women like Elswyth, V, Madame Chaucer, Eternal Sunshine, Stargazer, and Kamille. Again, all very different types of people, IMO. I think many of the real people here fit archetypes that would be applicable to people IRL, but of course such a forum cannot represent society as a whole neatly or correctly.

 

Honestly, I'm sure all the people where I'm like, "Is anyone like that IRL?" are representative of the many, many types of people I never happen to get to know very well (that doesn't mean they're bad types, but obviously people have social circles). So, I guess I disagree that men on LS aren't like me IRL (same with the women) because there are many that are and also A LOT of men on LS who don't fit the stereotypes in the OP of this post! Most men here, for instance, don't seem to be all that enamored with PUA culture. Hell, plenty of them are married and don't appear to be poised to cheat. Though, really, we never know who anyone is on here, except what they appear to be within the context of LS.

 

P.S. Sorry to anyone who's name I used, if it bothered you. Hopefully, it did not. Just illustrating how different, vast, and real the array of posters on here is.

Edited April 17, 2012 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Mme. Chaucer]

I disagree that there's that much PUA culture on here, though. There's some, but not THAT much,

 

You're right, there's not that much, but most of it that's here probably arrived during the "sosuave" migration, and they are very vocal artists who seem ready to shout others down and back each other up with their agenda. So they can seem pretty daunting at times.

 

I'd never heard of this stuff until encountering those guys here on LS.

[LZ2000]

To be honest, the only thing going through my mind when I joined this forum is to find solace from my most recent breakup and to give solace to those who truly needs it the most.

 

I'm not intentionally here to look for a girl to engage in online sex or anything of that sort, but I do understand how hard it is to resist the basic needs of a person to want to reach out and seek for human companionship.

Edited April 16, 2012 by LZ2000

[Woggle]

All of those married guys you speak of were single at one point in time.

[dasein]

I'd never heard of this stuff until encountering those guys here on LS.

 

Shocker that you would actually admit that, and I suspect that is the state of knowledge of most/all of the "PUA debunkers" here on LS, OP included.

 

Men use tools to change the world around us, it's what we do. Is it really that surprising that jargon/vocabulary has arisen to describe the male use of social tools that is no different at all from women applying makeup, wearing heels, using flattering clothing?

 

First and foremost, PUA as it commonly exists on the net, is a business, similar to the large "relationship advice" segment of books and media that women consume. The goal is to sell product, and in that it is no more nor less "dishonest" than any other business with customers.

 

Next, PUA is just an abbreviation for the "art of seduction," that has been going on back and forth between the genders for thousands of years, specifically, teaching socially inexperienced and misinformed men how to make themselves more attractive to women and achieve the results they seek, whether it's sex, a date, a GF or a wife. Only the ignorant write it off as merely "bedpost notching." It's like someone killing someone with a shotgun and the hue and cry "shotguns are evil" goes up among the ignorant. PUA doesn't screw women over, men with bad intent do.

 

Because approaching members of the opposite sex is still mostly a male pastime/expectation, and because that pastime includes lots of risk of rejection and feelings of inadequacy, those who don't regularly approach people they are interested in need to step back and evaluate whether their blanket criticisms are a) informed at all, and b) warranted in the least. As expressed here, all the uproar about PUA comes from a position of near total ignorance.

 

Almost every aspect of PUA you all complain about so much here on LS is shorthand for a healthy attitude about oneself and the people one seeks to attract. Men who develop healthy attitudes about their sexual desire and how to attract women naturally need not apply, PUA exists for the remedial purpose of helping men who are either doing nothing at all or are doing something wrong.

 

1. Women have been complaining forever with respect to dating that men have a tendency to go on and on about themselves and are boring. I have seen this estimate 1000s of times leveled by women over the years. Yet suggest that men learn to become more engaging conversationalists, more romantic, more seductive, and suddenly adult women are reduced to little children who can't discern a line from sincere interest, the victims of bad ole PUAs who are seeking to hypnotize women somehow into doing something they wouldn't otherwise do. Demeaning to women and utter bullsh-t. There are millions of women out there looking for an excuse to have sex, to be seduced, and this has been true ever since a troubadour sang a sappy ass song outside a window. Romcoms are full of men doing the exact same things that pack theaters, yet women whine are disgusting somehow IRL.

 

If it didn't work, and you all didn't enjoy it, we wouldn't do it.

 

2. Rejection, humiliation are very real risks that men who are doing things right have to tolerate, let alone men who are doing things wrong. In the same way that doctors use BMI to depersonalize and objectify talking about their patients' morbid obesity as opposed to "man, you are really a fatass," PUAs selling their wares use all manner and type of acronyms and lingo to provide the illusion of impersonal interaction to a very personal, risky process. If the acronyms and terms such as AFC, 4 person set, negging, AMOG, etc. are used to depersonalize the process, to make it more systematic, less ego-crushing, for men who have been crushed again and again by ever ruder and nastier types of female rejection today, where's the great big f-cking harm in that?

Edited April 16, 2012 by dasein

[wwwjd]

I'm not anti PUA, per say, just not my thang, and nor did I expect that stuff here in a discussion forum. I feel PUA gives it self a negative connotation. I don't go out to "Pick Up" anyone, or try to get action from it. I like to meet women, see if we get along, entertain each other, maybe grow deeper and closer over time. Not go out and become an "Artist" at Picking Up people.

 

Sooooo... I wanted to tell all the disenchanted women here there are guys out there that aren't like that.

[dasein]

I like to meet women, see if we get along, entertain each other, maybe grow deeper and closer over time. Not go out and become an "Artist" at Picking Up people.

 

What you describe above is exactly the same as what PUA is, regardless of the lingo. It's shorthand for "interpersonal seduction skills." Every couple of years some female "flirting expert" comes out with a book, yet because it's coming from a woman, is just A-OK with everyone, gets favorable press, talk show appearances, etc. A man tries to sell his version of a flirting class on the net, and suddenly it's lumped under a convenient whipping boy catchall "PUA" and is manipulative and disgusting by default? Pffft.

 

Have had to watch and listen to this double standard as applied to women and men in how the genders seek relationship help and advice for 30 years now, and it's about enough. Lumping all male relationship advice under "PUA" is just as disingenuous as lumping all female relationship advice under "Gold-dig 101" would be.

 

And as regards the broader topic, you've been here what 2-3 weeks now? Yet feel it's your "forum job" to make a thread singling out and negatively categorizing whole groups of other posters whom you really don't know anything at all about as deficient somehow and not representative of the real world?

 

Was going to do a "women on LS aren't representative of women in the real world" thread, but that would make me every bit as bad (even though light years more informed on the issue), so thought better of it.

Edited April 17, 2012 by a LoveShack.org Moderator