Els Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 That's been debunked several times on this forum. You really shouldn't repeat it as if it's factual. But then again LS isn't always about facts. Actually, it is statistically true. What has been debunked is not the fact, but the factors that contribute to it. It isn't just that 'women' innately get less because they're women - it's because women naturally tend to push for salaries less, or take less short term risks, or prioritize their families more, etc. But if we are to speak about choices that people make, any gender discrepancies can be 'debunked' by that as well. For example, if you took all of the time that some women spend on their appearance (let's say 20 hours/week - 10 hours of exercise and 10 of maintenance/preparing to go out), and put all of that into SD solely trying to get women, either by working out himself or going to social events and talking to women, I would think that he would have the same success rate that they do. 1
fortyninethousand322 Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 Actually, it is statistically true. What has been debunked is not the fact, but the factors that contribute to it. It isn't just that 'women' innately get less because they're women - it's because women naturally tend to push for salaries less, or take less short term risks, or prioritize their families more, etc. But if we are to speak about choices that people make, any gender discrepancies can be 'debunked' by that as well. For example, if you took all of the time that some women spend on their appearance (let's say 20 hours/week - 10 hours of exercise and 10 of maintenance/preparing to go out), and put all of that into SD solely trying to get women, either by working out himself or going to social events and talking to women, I would think that he would have the same success rate that they do. I'd agree with that.
ScreamingTrees Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 Well, of course. Most people aren't super confident at any age. It's just that many guys only notice the most beautiful, most confident girls, and fail to see everyone else. When I hear guys whining "how come women can pick any guy they want?" I always want to say "how come you only look at the few women who can pick any guy they want?" I could be checking out a random girl who might look like, say, this.. sitting in a seat near mine on a public bus, but I usually just assume the worst. I could never see myself cold approaching, but I never seem to run into girls like this socially. I'd say she's above average at best, objectively speaking, but I do find her beautiful in her own unique way. I believe that I'm not reaching beyond my means, but I've never blatantly hit on a girl, let alone a girl that I find myself attracted to. I could never bring myself to really make my attraction known, especially when there's the uncertainty of mutual attraction.. way out of my comfort zone.
somedude81 Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 Actually, it is statistically true. What has been debunked is not the fact, but the factors that contribute to it. It isn't just that 'women' innately get less because they're women - it's because women naturally tend to push for salaries less, or take less short term risks, or prioritize their families more, etc. That make sense. And of course that means that men are not to blame here. For example, if you took all of the time that some women spend on their appearance (let's say 20 hours/week - 10 hours of exercise and 10 of maintenance/preparing to go out), and put all of that into SD solely trying to get women, either by working out himself or going to social events and talking to women, I would think that he would have the same success rate that they do. Sure, maybe my sucess will go up. But have the same success rate as a woman who does all that stuff, that's LOLABLE. I wouldn't even come close to the success rate of the average woman. *waits for rebuttal*
Els Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 Sure, maybe my sucess will go up. But have the same success rate as a woman who does all that stuff, that's LOLABLE. I wouldn't even come close to the success rate of the average woman. *waits for rebuttal* Why don't you try it? What have you got to lose? At the very least, you yourself admitted that it would go up, no? Which is better than staying down? 2
somedude81 Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 Why don't you try it? What have you got to lose? At the very least, you yourself admitted that it would go up, no? Which is better than staying down? Yeah, I can work out and focus on my appearance, that's easy enough. Though what are these social events you speak of? BTW, just talking to girls isn't enough. I need to do more. My whole conversation style and boldenss/flirtyness levels need to change. Getting some confidence somehow won't hurt either.
Els Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 And how do you intend to improve your conversation style and boldness without practicing, hm? Social events depends on where you live. You're in a reasonably big city, or near it, I think, so there should be a multitude to choose from. How much time are you spending working out nowadays?
somedude81 Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 And how do you intend to improve your conversation style and boldness without practicing, hm? Social events depends on where you live. You're in a reasonably big city, or near it, I think, so there should be a multitude to choose from. How much time are you spending working out nowadays? I don't work out nearly as much as I used to. I just feel tired all the time. Don't know if it's because I'm getting older, or it's something else... Of course I need to practice with conversation. Right now it's just with girls at my work, but I need to put myself in more situation where I can have regular conversations. I've got a few ideas, it will happen in time.
Cypress25 Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 That make sense. And of course that means that men are not to blame here. No one is blaming men. That's just the way our society is. In white collar jobs, men start at a higher base pay than women, and that's before negotiations even start. You could say that women don't negotiate their salary as aggressively as men, but even when they do, they still end up with a lower salary because they started off with a lower offer from their employer. And most employers do that in part because they assume their female employees will focus on family more than career, even if they don't have a family yet. From their very first day on the job, it's assumed that women won't work as hard as men. Even when they do, their salary doesn't reflect it. Sure, maybe my sucess will go up. But have the same success rate as a woman who does all that stuff, that's LOLABLE. I wouldn't even come close to the success rate of the average woman. *waits for rebuttal* So what do you want, somedude? Do you want to be a woman? There's an operation for that, you know. If you really think you'd do better as a woman, go right ahead. Otherwise, be grateful you don't have a uterus that bleeds every month, and work with what you've got. 1
Els Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 I don't work out nearly as much as I used to. I just feel tired all the time. Don't know if it's because I'm getting older, or it's something else... Of course I need to practice with conversation. Right now it's just with girls at my work, but I need to put myself in more situation where I can have regular conversations. I've got a few ideas, it will happen in time. Sounds good. In the meantime, IMO it would serve your future prospects well for you to stop beating yourself over the head about how horrible it is to be a man and how women have it so much easier. The longer you ingrain this sort of mentality within yourself, the longer it will take to break it even when you DO get lucky, and really, I'd hate to see you lose your 1st R over something so predictable. Step up the effort and your chances will improve sooner. 30 is way too young to use the 'I'm getting old so I feel tired' excuse.
somedude81 Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 Sounds good. In the meantime, IMO it would serve your future prospects well for you to stop beating yourself over the head about how horrible it is to be a man and how women have it so much easier. The longer you ingrain this sort of mentality within yourself, the longer it will take to break it even when you DO get lucky, and really, I'd hate to see you lose your 1st R over something so predictable. How could that belief cause a relationship to end? And the mentality has already been completely ingrained. But the key is, it won't matter once I can actually get into a relationship. I'd finally be one of the haves. Step up the effort and your chances will improve sooner. 30 is way too young to use the 'I'm getting old so I feel tired' excuse. Yeah it's most likely not my age, just all in my head. But the being tired thing is very real. I'm just very worried.
Els Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 How could that belief cause a relationship to end? I don't understand how a reasonably intelligent guy like you can even ask this, SD, I really don't. How can it not?
somedude81 Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 I don't understand how a reasonably intelligent guy like you can even ask this, SD, I really don't. How can it not? Please enlighten me. Or else I'm going to think it goes like this. "You know babe, men really have it much harder than women do in dating." "You're a sexist pig, I hate you. Go to hell" The end
january2011 Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 It's part of the 'poor me' attitude. It's very difficult to remain patient listening to that kind of talk coming from anyone over a long period of time, male or female. We're all allowed to feel sorry for ourselves now and again, but not all the time. Our support networks can only take so much before they lose their patience and tell you to man/woman up and go out there and do something about it. 1
somedude81 Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 It's part of the 'poor me' attitude. It's very difficult to remain patient listening to that kind of talk coming from anyone over a long period of time, male or female. We're all allowed to feel sorry for ourselves now and again, but not all the time. Our support networks can only take so much before they lose their patience and tell you to man/woman up and go out there and do something about it. Hah, as if I'd be lame enough to actually talk about this type of stuff with a girl I'm dating. Seriously, if I have a GF, why would I complain at all about how bad things were?
january2011 Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 Hah, as if I'd be lame enough to actually talk about this type of stuff with a girl I'm dating. Seriously, if I have a GF, why would I complain at all about how bad things were? Some people do exchange war stories about dating. Some couples even have intellectual debates about life, love and the universe.
somedude81 Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 Some people do exchange war stories about dating. Some couples even have intellectual debates about life, love and the universe. Oh. Then would it be OK for me to tell the truth of my experiences? I'm sure she'd wonder why at 30+, she'd be my first GF. Or maybe I should just be vague on those topics.
Author jobaba Posted April 17, 2012 Author Posted April 17, 2012 Oh. Then would it be OK for me to tell the truth of my experiences? I'm sure she'd wonder why at 30+, she'd be my first GF. Or maybe I should just be vague on those topics. Depends on the couple. My last girlfriend, I didn't know much about her dating history, and I really didn't care to ask. My current, she told me all about all of her boyfriends back to age 12 and all the details by the third date. Just be vague. Say you've dated some girls but haven't had anything serious in a while.
Flummox Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 You can't judge a person's personality or sense of self worth based on their appearance. My female friends who didn't put on an ounce of makeup during the day had the most sex partners because they slept around, and knew how to play the dating game, whereas the ones who looked like they put far more effort into their appearance only had one partner or none at all.
Flummox Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 Your theory is backwards. Women that dress up a lot in college are the ones that have low self esteem. Although I don't think you can judge personality or self worth by looking at appearance, this is probably more accurate. Many women who don't wear any makeup think they look great without it.
january2011 Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 Oh. Then would it be OK for me to tell the truth of my experiences? I'm sure she'd wonder why at 30+, she'd be my first GF. Or maybe I should just be vague on those topics. As jobaba wrote, it depends on the couple. You'll need to get to know her a bit more before you decide how much detail to give. Some people like to know everything, some like to know just the headlines. What's important is that the depth of sharing is mutually agreed. For example, if you tend to ask a lot of questions, then you'll be most compatible with someone who doesn't mind sharing (shout out to Erica for pointing this out to me). However, if you don't like to talk in great detail about your past then you're unlikely to be compatible with someone who asks more probing questions, as you'll find that invasive. So, you'll need to play it by ear depending on your girlfriend and how you personally feel about sharing information about your past.
casanovadude81 Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 That's because the average girl, can just about get any guy she wants. The only exception are the super alpha guys, who are already swimming in girls. I wish this were true. If you only believed, it can be. If only you believed your advice applied to you. I could be checking out a random girl who might look like, say, this.. sitting in a seat near mine on a public bus, but I usually just assume the worst. I could never see myself cold approaching, but I never seem to run into girls like this socially. I'd say she's above average at best, objectively speaking, but I do find her beautiful in her own unique way. I believe that I'm not reaching beyond my means, but I've never blatantly hit on a girl, let alone a girl that I find myself attracted to. I could never bring myself to really make my attraction known, especially when there's the uncertainty of mutual attraction.. way out of my comfort zone. You should just give it a try with these random girls you see on the bus or where ever. What are you so afraid of? I assure you it's all in your head.
WhiteChocolate Posted April 17, 2012 Posted April 17, 2012 I don't think it's as complicated as you make it to be. All a girl has to do is flirt, drop some obvious hints and if the guy has half a brain, he'll ask her out. It's super easy for a girl. If you only believed, it can be. We'll see how this goes with the guy I currently like.
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