Why is inexperience viewed so negatively all the time??

[ThaWholigan]

This is not meant to be an inflammatory post, merely a curious one ....

 

I ask in light of a thread I've just been posting in, and although I have been meaning to make this thread for a while, have decided against often......

 

I find that a lot of women seem to have many derogatory remarks about a man's inexperience, even if many times they will tend to be positive toward us personally. It's very off-putting to a lot of the guys and luckily I tend not to put too much personal and emotional stock into it, but my inquisitiveness got the better of me tonight .

 

On the flip side, we seem to view our inexperience as negatively as women do, hence why our confidence and self-esteem is so affected by it. It seems we do not put too much faith in our ability to improve in this area, especially socially, and we have to realise this will perpetuate the problem and also cause more women to privately chastise us.

 

Also, if a man with a lack of experience decides to date someone he wouldn't normally consider, surely a woman can understand why he would come to this particular decision? It seems many women simply don't, when in fact dating as a man does work differently.

 

Discuss freely, don't be inflammatory

[fortyninethousand322]

I'll be perfectly honest, if I were a woman with a reasonable amount of dating and/or sexual experience I'd be leery of dating someone like me too. The idea of teaching someone how relationships, kissing, even sex works must be infuriating to someone who's done it for years. It's sort of like teaching someone who's been raised by wolves how to eat with utensils and walk properly.

 

I view it negatively from my own perspective because it sucks wanting to go on dates and seemingly not being able to. Or to see all your friends dating (or even married with kids) and you still haven't even kissed a girl yet. Also, the clock ticking. I'm at that stage where inexperience transitions from "aww that's cute" to "eww he's weird". I feel like I should be getting started ASAP or else I'll be left behind permanently.

[darkmoon]

i am a woman with a "reasonable amount of dating experience" this is what i am certain of; socially it's better to be chatty cuz no convo is dull and some say rude but convo keeps things lively/moving, sex is something you do with someone not to them and because unusual/unique as any part of anatomy is so there is no standard good in bed

Edited April 14, 2012 by darkmoon

[threebyfate]

So you understand my perspective from the other thread, it wasn't solely surrounding the inexperience. It surrounded the trashing, folded into the inexperience. With some guys, there are valid reasons why they're inexperienced, rather than being late bloomers.

[ThaWholigan]

I'll be perfectly honest, if I were a woman with a reasonable amount of dating and/or sexual experience I'd be leery of dating someone like me too. The idea of teaching someone how relationships, kissing, even sex works must be infuriating to someone who's done it for years. It's sort of like teaching someone who's been raised by wolves how to eat with utensils and walk properly.

 

I view it negatively from my own perspective because it sucks wanting to go on dates and seemingly not being able to. Or to see all your friends dating (or even married with kids) and you still haven't even kissed a girl yet. Also, the clock ticking. I'm at that stage where inexperience transitions from "aww that's cute" to "eww he's weird". I feel like I should be getting started ASAP or else I'll be left behind permanently.

 

I suppose so, but then I suppose we have to ask ourselves what are we to do. Well, I know what to do and I'm doing it. Other guys.....well you can lead a horse to the trough of water......

 

I understand you though, I don't tell everyone I'm a virgin, but the few who know tend to be derogatory to an extent - "why aint you got laid yet? man, you need to just go and get some pussy, full stop". My brothers are still trying to get me to go to an escort .

 

I also understand it from the woman's POV, but at the same time - are we complete idiots that we can't learn how to do this stuff?? There are even programs dedicated to helping you, plus certain things you can try in private. I really get you though, sometimes it does piss me off when I actually want to date or I'm horny and want sex, and I have to just chill and bare it because I don't seem to be able to.

 

The best thing I can say is to not lose your head and your nerve. I can still be positive about things and about my future, so I prefer to dwell on that, rather than the fact that up to now, I haven't had the pleasure of dating or sex, or indeed a relationship. Such is life....

[oldshirt]

It's not necessarily specifically the 'inexperience' that people have the issue with per se. It's timidness, fearfullness, spinelessness and lack of assertiveness and initiative that people have the problem with.

 

If someone is inexperienced because they have strong personal convictions against premaritial sexual activity and have resisted temptations because of those convictions and yet they are still a strong, determined and fearless person who doesn't let others intimidate him or push him around, he will likely be desired by women even though he is inexperienced by comparison to many of peers without such convictions. Some women will even desire him more because of his strong beleifs and convictions and his strength to stand up to temptations.

 

Conversely if someone else has the same level of inexperience but their inexperience is because they are too timid and fearfull to talk to girls and lack the social skills to interact with them in an effective and confident manner, then that person will probably be seen as undesirable by women.

 

In those cases the determining factor of desirability wasn't their level of experience per se but was rather how strong they were and their level of social status and social skills vs whether they were perceived as weak and timid and fearfull.

 

Bottom line is weak, timid, fearfull, easily manipulated/pushed around, lack of confidence and lack of social skills = lack of desirability and lack of respect and will probably be subject to derogatory comments and being looked down on.

 

Whereas if someone is strong, assertive, fearless, has good social skills and is confident in their interations with people and does not allow themselves to be manipulated or pushed around they will be respected and desired even if they have the same level of inexperience as the nerd-boy.

[ThaWholigan]

So you understand my perspective from the other thread, it wasn't solely surrounding the inexperience. It surrounded the trashing, folded into the inexperience. With some guys, there are valid reasons why they're inexperienced, rather than being late bloomers.

I do indeed. Part of that inexperience may possibly be lack of social skills however, which lead to him "trashing his exes".

 

It does not stop me from feeling for them though, because I know exactly what their going through.

[Jane2011]

I'm on my way to eat out with family, so just a quick response.

 

I think if you're under 25 and inexperienced, you're not in any unusual category just yet. You're still just a late bloomer.

 

As for making unusual choices if you are an older guy and inexperienced, I think it just has to be balanced. Like, yes, if you're a 30 year old virgin, maybe you should choose someone different than the 32 year old divorced woman who's had tons of boyfriends on top of a husband. But you needn't go for a 20 year old who's never had a boyfriend, either, nor say that that is your only realistic route. There are women who are similar to you that may come in a number of variations. You might, for instance, date a 28 year old who has only had a boyfriend or two and just shares your general relationships-and-dating greenness in some way.

 

Not sure if that's what you're talking about though...

[threebyfate]

I do indeed. Part of that inexperience may possibly be lack of social skills however, which lead to him "trashing his exes".

 

It does not stop me from feeling for them though, because I know exactly what their going through.

I'm going to flip genders on you. Let's pretend you and I are dating and I link pictures of you to a friend and make nasty remarks about your appearance.

 

See where I'm coming from? It has nothing to do with social skills.

[ThaWholigan]

I'm going to flip genders on you. Let's pretend you and I are dating and I link pictures of you to a friend and make nasty remarks about your appearance.

 

See where I'm coming from? It has nothing to do with social skills.

Point taken. Although I should add that we only have OP's word for exactly what he said about them. But I admit you're right about that.....

[fortyninethousand322]

It's not necessarily specifically the 'inexperience' that people have the issue with per se. It's timidness, fearfullness, spinelessness and lack of assertiveness and initiative that people have the problem with.

 

If someone is inexperienced because they have strong personal convictions against premaritial sexual activity and have resisted temptations because of those convictions and yet they are still a strong, determined and fearless person who doesn't let others intimidate him or push him around, he will likely be desired by women even though he is inexperienced by comparison to many of peers without such convictions. Some women will even desire him more because of his strong beleifs and convictions and his strength to stand up to temptations.

 

Conversely if someone else has the same level of inexperience but their inexperience is because they are too timid and fearfull to talk to girls and lack the social skills to interact with them in an effective and confident manner, then that person will probably be seen as undesirable by women.

 

In those cases the determining factor of desirability wasn't their level of experience per se but was rather how strong they were and their level of social status and social skills vs whether they were perceived as weak and timid and fearfull.

 

Bottom line is weak, timid, fearfull, easily manipulated/pushed around, lack of confidence and lack of social skills = lack of desirability and lack of respect and will probably be subject to derogatory comments and being looked down on.

 

Whereas if someone is strong, assertive, fearless, has good social skills and is confident in their interations with people and does not allow themselves to be manipulated or pushed around they will be respected and desired even if they have the same level of inexperience as the nerd-boy.

 

I don't know if I totally buy into this. I'm one of those people who can be easily manipulated or mistreated by women. If I didn't check myself often I could easily be played. Easily. But, whenever I get even the slightest hint that that's what happening I break off contact with that woman. To this day I've never had a woman I broke contact with come around. And the one time I ignored that instinct and just went with it, I was played, and I was played pretty hard.

 

Being assertive isn't enough. You can avoid being bitten by the lion if you refuse to step into his cage, but it doesn't make you a lion tamer.

[ThaWholigan]

It's not necessarily specifically the 'inexperience' that people have the issue with per se. It's timidness, fearfullness, spinelessness and lack of assertiveness and initiative that people have the problem with.

 

If someone is inexperienced because they have strong personal convictions against premaritial sexual activity and have resisted temptations because of those convictions and yet they are still a strong, determined and fearless person who doesn't let others intimidate him or push him around, he will likely be desired by women even though he is inexperienced by comparison to many of peers without such convictions. Some women will even desire him more because of his strong beleifs and convictions and his strength to stand up to temptations.

 

Conversely if someone else has the same level of inexperience but their inexperience is because they are too timid and fearfull to talk to girls and lack the social skills to interact with them in an effective and confident manner, then that person will probably be seen as undesirable by women.

 

In those cases the determining factor of desirability wasn't their level of experience per se but was rather how strong they were and their level of social status and social skills vs whether they were perceived as weak and timid and fearfull.

 

Bottom line is weak, timid, fearfull, easily manipulated/pushed around, lack of confidence and lack of social skills = lack of desirability and lack of respect and will probably be subject to derogatory comments and being looked down on.

 

Whereas if someone is strong, assertive, fearless, has good social skills and is confident in their interations with people and does not allow themselves to be manipulated or pushed around they will be respected and desired even if they have the same level of inexperience as the nerd-boy.

Agreed with much of this. Although I'd imagine that if you have these attributes, inexperience will quickly become experience, regardless of ones view . I think that inexperienced men should be cultivating these attributes, as I am doing for myself currently. It seems though that they have a mentality that is easily overrun for a variety of reasons, and do seem to need to be given the room to thrive and flourish, although they need to give it to themselves if they are at a certain age.

[fortyninethousand322]

I suppose so, but then I suppose we have to ask ourselves what are we to do. Well, I know what to do and I'm doing it. Other guys.....well you can lead a horse to the trough of water......

 

I understand you though, I don't tell everyone I'm a virgin, but the few who know tend to be derogatory to an extent - "why aint you got laid yet? man, you need to just go and get some pussy, full stop". My brothers are still trying to get me to go to an escort .

 

I also understand it from the woman's POV, but at the same time - are we complete idiots that we can't learn how to do this stuff?? There are even programs dedicated to helping you, plus certain things you can try in private. I really get you though, sometimes it does piss me off when I actually want to date or I'm horny and want sex, and I have to just chill and bare it because I don't seem to be able to.

 

The best thing I can say is to not lose your head and your nerve. I can still be positive about things and about my future, so I prefer to dwell on that, rather than the fact that up to now, I haven't had the pleasure of dating or sex, or indeed a relationship. Such is life....

 

Re: what this thread is talking about based on the other thread: I definitely think it's a fine line to cross. I've often questioned myself and asked if maybe my standards are too high (women I'm attracted to probably have lots of other, better guys interested in them so why bother is what I tell myself from time to time). If a guy felt like he should "date down" so to speak and work his way up, I can't really fault him. I can fault him for the alleged negative bashing he did though.

 

But as for inexperience in general, for the longest time I had hoped it would just click. That I would basically be guided along like a train on a rail and everything would work out. Years later I see that's a crock of bs.

[ThaWholigan]

Re: what this thread is talking about based on the other thread: I definitely think it's a fine line to cross. I've often questioned myself and asked if maybe my standards are too high (women I'm attracted to probably have lots of other, better guys interested in them so why bother is what I tell myself from time to time). If a guy felt like he should "date down" so to speak and work his way up, I can't really fault him. I can fault him for the alleged negative bashing he did though.

 

But as for inexperience in general, for the longest time I had hoped it would just click. That I would basically be guided along like a train on a rail and everything would work out. Years later I see that's a crock of bs.

I used to think that way too. When I hit college, I knew something was up. It was me that was ****ing up. I had allowed myself to lose a lot of confidence and self-esteem. Most of my inexperience issues is tied to my issue of knowing that I was very different from people in some capacity. I didn't like it, I wanted to be normal like everyone else, but I just couldn't do it. I was upset about it, and I thought girls thought I was weird too, so I allowed that to flood my mind.

 

Especially the one girl I ended up having some feelings for, I messed up so badly when at certain points I really could have dated her. But you live and learn......

 

I think the myth of inexperienced men is that somehow it's the fault of the woman's "pickiness" as to why we are such, when really we have a part to play in our own stagnation - I know I have a huge part to play in mine. I do wish I had more balls back then when it came to girls, but I had to use my balls for other things i.e. my disability and my hideous lack of verbal reasoning and social skills up to a certain age.

[Badsingularity]

Men are the doers and in order for them to do it good, they have to have a certain amount of experience. Women know this.

 

Also, the reasons women are attracted to men with experience are the same reasons that many women are bisexual, and that so many women seem to compete for and are subconciously more attracted to taken men.

 

I'm not going to go into those reasons right now though, because most would not believe them or be able to grasp them.

 

That being said. There are plenty of experienced women that will give inexperienced men a chance if they like them.

[tigressA]

I definitely don't see inexperience as a negative thing, generally. It's when inexperienced guys blame women for their own blatantly obvious shortcomings that it's a turn-off.

 

There is one guy I dated who comes to mind after having read Oldshirt's post. He was a virgin, he hadn't had any significant romantic relationships. He wasn't desperate to be with just anyone though, and he wasn't afraid to pursue who he did like. He fell really hard for me, and shamefully I didn't treat him or his love for me as well as what was deserved. He was, far and away, the most mature, grounded, and overall good guy I was with (and I had a couple of years on him too). I was just too much of an idiot to see it at the time.

[ThaWholigan]

I definitely don't see inexperience as a negative thing, generally. It's when inexperienced guys blame women for their own blatantly obvious shortcomings that it's a turn-off.

 

There is one guy I dated who comes to mind after having read Oldshirt's post. He was a virgin, he hadn't had any significant romantic relationships. He wasn't desperate to be with just anyone though, and he wasn't afraid to pursue who he did like. He fell really hard for me, and shamefully I didn't treat him or his love for me as well as what was deserved. He was, far and away, the most mature, grounded, and overall good guy I was with (and I had a couple of years on him too). I was just too much of an idiot to see it at the time.

Thank you for sharing that

 

I think it's the desperation more than anything that causes derogatory remarks to be said about them. I am glad that I have never been desperate to just date anyone that I don't find attractive, but I am only young still.

[samsungxoxo]

Actually I've always wanted a man like that and he never showed up. I'm now 25 years old and only had 1 relationship but I'm still waiting for him.

 

It would be cool. I don't mind if he only had either very few gfs or nothing.

 

Where ever you are.... I'm waiting still. Come to me.

[Badsingularity]

Thank you for sharing that

 

I think it's the desperation more than anything that causes derogatory remarks to be said about them. I am glad that I have never been desperate to just date anyone that I don't find attractive, but I am only young still.

 

 

Stay positive and be cool. You're on the right track. Also, always work on your level of awesomeness.

 

Like I said, there are plenty of women who will give a guy with little experience a chance.

[samsungxoxo]

Like I said, there are plenty of women who will give a guy with little experience a chance.

He never appears. It's like finding a needle in a haystack. Nothing but the typical ''alpha wannabe'' man that likes partying, drinking and has had many experience in his youth.

[Feelsgoodman]

I suppose so, but then I suppose we have to ask ourselves what are we to do. Well, I know what to do and I'm doing it. Other guys.....well you can lead a horse to the trough of water......

 

I understand you though, I don't tell everyone I'm a virgin, but the few who know tend to be derogatory to an extent - "why aint you got laid yet? man, you need to just go and get some pussy, full stop". My brothers are still trying to get me to go to an escort .

 

I also understand it from the woman's POV, but at the same time - are we complete idiots that we can't learn how to do this stuff?? There are even programs dedicated to helping you, plus certain things you can try in private. I really get you though, sometimes it does piss me off when I actually want to date or I'm horny and want sex, and I have to just chill and bare it because I don't seem to be able to.

 

The best thing I can say is to not lose your head and your nerve. I can still be positive about things and about my future, so I prefer to dwell on that, rather than the fact that up to now, I haven't had the pleasure of dating or sex, or indeed a relationship. Such is life....

There is no shame in being a virgin. The problem is that our society is so f*cked up that a man's ability to "get pussy" is ranked as the most important quality....above intelligence, integrity, loyalty and just about everything else. Men with limited or no experience are seen as losers because they fail at the most important thing in life, according to our sex-obsessed society.

[ThaWholigan]

There is no shame in being a virgin. The problem is that our society is so f*cked up that a man's ability to "get pussy" is ranked as the most important quality....above intelligence, integrity, loyalty and just about everything else. Men with limited or no experience are seen as losers because they fail at the most important thing in life, according to our sex-obsessed society.

I hear that, around my area that I live, it seems like getting pussy (and swag of course ), is very important compared to other things. When I actually check it though, it actually isn't. There are certain things that those guys have innately that connects with their ability to get girls.

[Badsingularity]

He never appears. It's like finding a needle in a haystack.

 

If the type of guy you want doesn't come to you, then you may need to be proactive and go searching for him.