My relationship exploded last night...

[fishtaco]

I don't know what you mean by the "bimbo population"? Who are these bimbos and what makes them less fitting for a relationship? Are they gold diggers?

 

Personally, I think that dating older women at your age is ill advised. If you are 20 and you're dating a hot 24 year old, that's one thing. But 40 and dating a 44 year old? Not a good idea. 40+ is the age at which women start entering the menopause....it's not a good time either for them or the men in their lives. You should be dating women in their 30s (maybe even late 20s).

 

Also, don't date women who are stubborn and headstrong or "modern" in their outlook on relationships and gender roles. If you're interested in a long-term relationship, find yourself and old fashioned woman who was raised right...a woman who understands that her main purpose in life (other than raising kids) is to please her man.

 

Just hot chicks that are not date-able. For example, right before my GF, I was casually dating one. She is ultra insecure, always has to be "sexy" in front of men. She'd throw her own friend under the bus to get attention from men. But because of her obsession with this insecurity, she puts A LOT of effort into looking good, and she pretty much succeeds at it.

 

After I become single, I'm going to call her up. I bet she's still single, or being used by some other dude.

[NXS]

NXS, she's 44. I'm 40. Age has nothing to do with anything BTW. I see people in their 60's engage in who stole who's boyfriend high school drama.

 

This is childish behaviour and you know it, so what if you see 60 year olds engaging in it. At 44 she should be past this kind of bitchy behaviour.

 

 

The third point of contention was that I got upset at her for getting upset at me. Well, no **** Sherlock, this is something minor, why make a mountain out of a molehill? I didn't say it like that of course... remember I was being nice. She said I should hug her and give her loving words or something. Well, I kind of did... at the time, I was hugging her because I had no idea a sledgehammer was about to smack me upside the head, and the first thing was... I'm sorry, I didn't see your txt. That "robotic insincere" thing was actually later on when we were in full conflict mode, and I tried to escape by apologizing repeatedly.

 

Let’s be honest here, you were fuming at this stage, she was 2 hours late, text rather than called and then demanded you give her loving words. Rather than stand your ground you suppressed your feelings and tried to avoid the conflict. She walked all over you and then demanded you take the blame, which you dutifully did.

 

 

Everytime I would focus on one thing, and say, so this is what you're upset about? She would jump to the next one. Say we were talking about contention #1, she would say, no, I understand mistakes happen, but... then brings up 2 or 3. Then we move on to 2 or 3, she goes back to 1.

 

Yep, and she got away with it because you had suppressed your original anger so she had your head spinning and was using emotive manipulation to keep it that way.

 

 

So my analysis? She just wanted to fight. After a couple of hours of going back and forth between these points, I just sat there, and let her rip into me like I was a little puppy that just took a dump on the carpet. Then, after she vented, I did the "cheater's recovery move".... I hugged her and told her I love her. And that worked like a ****ing charm.

 

Sure she wanted a fight, maybe she was having a bad day and wanted an emotional punchbag, or maybe she just wanted a reaction from you. Something other than robotic responses to suppress your anger. Maybe some kind of signal that you’re actually still breathing and pumping blood.

 

 

After that, she slowly became more receptive. She still has to be right. She's a very intelligent and articulate woman. She get's a +10 to articulation during conflict. I'm the opposite. I so did the "soft" method. I took on ALL responsibility for improving. Then finally I was able to get one success... she at least for now, agrees that if conflict happens again, she's willing to let me go away, and talk about it later.

 

 

Hopping around from one point to another while trying to manipulate emotions is not intelligence or articulation. She got away with it ONLY because you suppressed your emotions and couldn’t think straight. That’s why you want to talk later and she doesn’t.

 

Me, I'm a dominant usually, because I don't give a crap, and I don't respond to manipulations usually. Dominant women and I don't get along. I just go for the calling the bluff, sometimes to my own detriment. This acting like a doormat and using side tactics is something new to me.

 

You’re not dominant, you just suppress and then maybe blow up or walk away. You don’t get your needs met because you don’t have expectations of them being met. You’ve tried something different here but it’s not really any different, instead of blowing up or walking away you just tried submission. Again, avoiding expressing and getting your needs met.

 

 

And because the way I am, I have the opposite of zero tolerance. What I value the most is peace and happiness. So when she's late, it really annoys me. But I know she doesn't like to be rushed, so I keep myself busy doing other things so I wouldn't be fidgeting. I never brought this up to her, because I want to keep the peace, so I don't have the right to blow up at her. I should let her know and give her a few chances first.

 

 

Exactly.

 

 

 

 

 

So now I feel like I am going to enact my own zero tolerance policy. This is passive aggressive behavior. And it usually spells the beginning of the end of the relationship.

 

 

 

Well this hasn't worked for you in the past so there's not much chance of it working in the future. The definition of insanity..........

 

 

 

 

 

After this incident, I respect her a bit less now.

 

 

I suspect you respect yourself a bit less, she's no different than she has been in the past.

[dasein]

She is ultra insecure, always has to be "sexy" in front of men. She'd throw her own friend under the bus to get attention from men. But because of her obsession with this insecurity, she puts A LOT of effort into looking good, and she pretty much succeeds at it.

 

Jesus, we have indeed dated the exact same women.

 

If you want a laugh sometime when one of these types is compliment begging, say something like "Baby, I just want to let you know that I will love you long after you have lost your looks, when your hair has gone so gray it can't be dyed, when your eyes are bloodshot, when your skin is all saggy and baggy, I will still love you." The reaction is priceless, the very essence of cognitive dissonance. If their heads were on swivels they would spin and make choochoo train noises, smoke from the ears and all.

[fishtaco]

You’re not dominant, you just suppress and then maybe blow up or walk away. You don’t get your needs met because you don’t have expectations of them being met. You’ve tried something different here but it’s not really any different, instead of blowing up or walking away you just tried submission. Again, avoiding expressing and getting your needs met.

 

Not in this case, because she wants to be dominant, and I want to try something different.

 

To me, dominant means you get your way. Well, I either get my way or I walk. The less dominant ones usually give in because they don't want me to walk.

 

So yes, if you talk about always getting your way, I don't. Sometimes I have to take the alternative, which is no one get their way. But I don't see how you can be always in control and get your way unless you manipulate.

 

I don't manipulate, I just say, this is where I'm going, if you're on board, let's go, if you're not, it's cool, see you later.

 

Maybe that's not dominant. Call it whatever you want, but having a personality like that (at my worse obviously, I'm normally more reasonable), it doesn't jive with a dominant person very well.

 

It's the same way with friendships. The dude that always want to be in control I never get along with them.

 

I suspect you respect yourself a bit less, she's no different than she has been in the past.

 

First part is true. I did a doormat, which I don't respect. But it was worth the experience.

 

Second part doesn't make sense. Respect is my perception of her, it has nothing to do with if she has changed. It's my perception that changed.

[threebyfate]

Just hot chicks that are not date-able. For example, right before my GF, I was casually dating one. She is ultra insecure, always has to be "sexy" in front of men. She'd throw her own friend under the bus to get attention from men. But because of her obsession with this insecurity, she puts A LOT of effort into looking good, and she pretty much succeeds at it.

 

After I become single, I'm going to call her up. I bet she's still single, or being used by some other dude.

This is because you use PUA to get chicks. What you end up is pulling the insecure crazy ones and this feeds into your belief that hot chicks are nuts. It's a terrible cycle to get into.

 

If you want decent relationship material, the PUA methodologies are antithesis of "how to". Relationships require trust and respect, which include building on this "with" each other, rather than working to pull the rug out when the PUA feels insecure. This doesn't mean taking crap like your girlfriend's dishing out. There's a limit and you have to set those boundaries right out the gate AND maintain them.

 

You've got stuff to learn if you're honestly interested in relationship building. But if you're not interested, only looking to crap all over women, then I have zero interest in helping you.

 

Some growing up needs to happen on both sides.

[fishtaco]

Jesus, we have indeed dated the exact same women.

 

If you want a laugh sometime when one of these types is compliment begging, say something like "Baby, I just want to let you know that I will love you long after you have lost your looks, when your hair has gone so gray it can't be dyed, when your eyes are bloodshot, when your skin is all saggy and baggy, I will still love you." The reaction is priceless, the very essence of cognitive dissonance. If their heads were on swivels they would spin and make choochoo train noises, smoke from the ears and all.

 

Bahahaha! That's a good one.

 

Yeah the one I was seeing was constantly talking about getting plastic surgery. She also doesn't make crap for money, probably expected me to pay for it.

 

But we never went past casual.

[fishtaco]

This is because you use PUA to get chicks. What you end up is pulling the insecure crazy ones and this feeds into your belief that hot chicks are nuts. It's a terrible cycle to get into.

 

If you want decent relationship material, the PUA methodologies are antithesis of "how to". Relationships require trust and respect, which include building on this "with" each other, rather than working to pull the rug out when the PUA feels insecure. This doesn't mean taking crap like your girlfriend's dishing out. There's a limit and you have to set those boundaries right out the gate AND maintain them.

 

You've got stuff to learn if you're honestly interested in relationship building. But if you're not interested, only looking to crap all over women, then I have zero interest in helping you.

 

Some growing up needs to happen on both sides.

 

No, I don't do PUA. I just have a few basic dating tricks up my sleeves.

 

I mentioned before, I am unfortunately attracted to these types of women. Hence I get them, because I try, not because I do PUA. I don't crap all over them I don't treat them bad. I just won't get into a relationship with them, and I'm sure you see why that would be a really bad idea.

 

I usually casually date a bunch of women, sometimes sex will happen, sometimes it won't before I decide I want a real relationship.

 

There's nothing wrong with casual dating. And I don't think not entering a committed relationship is crapping all over them. I also don't lie and promise them marriage or paying for their plastic surgery or whatever. If sex happens, it's because they want to. I don't need to trick or coerce or whatever. I multidate, one of them will have sex with me, I just do my thing.

[threebyfate]

Okay, as long as you're honest with them, then I have no issues. If they want more and are too stupid to figure out they're not getting more, that's their problem. :shrugs:

[NXS]

Not in this case, because she wants to be dominant, and I want to try something different.

 

To me, dominant means you get your way. Well, I either get my way or I walk. The less dominant ones usually give in because they don't want me to walk.

 

So yes, if you talk about always getting your way, I don't. Sometimes I have to take the alternative, which is no one get their way. But I don't see how you can be always in control and get your way unless you manipulate.

 

I don't manipulate, I just say, this is where I'm going, if you're on board, let's go, if you're not, it's cool, see you later.

 

Maybe that's not dominant. Call it whatever you want, but having a personality like that (at my worse obviously, I'm normally more reasonable), it doesn't jive with a dominant person very well.

 

It's the same way with friendships. The dude that always want to be in control I never get along with them.

 

The point I'm making is that you wanted her to be on time and to call you when she was outside rather than texting. You didn't properly tell her this expectation in the past, instead you allowed it to continue, causing increasing resentment.

 

From what you've posted here this does not appear to be any different than past relationships. Instead of clearly saying what you expect and enforcing these boundaries you just walk away.

 

 

First part is true. I did a doormat, which I don't respect. But it was worth the experience.

 

Second part doesn't make sense. Respect is my perception of her, it has nothing to do with if she has changed. It's my perception that changed.

 

How has your perception changed? I'm not seeing it.

[fishtaco]

Okay, as long as you're honest with them, then I have no issues. If they want more and are too stupid to figure out they're not getting more, that's their problem. :shrugs:

 

Thank you. I'm glad you agree with this.

 

I think everyone is responsible for themselves. No babysitting.

 

I promise I'm not going to lie, that's not my thing. But I'm not going to do anything nicer than that. It's up to them to keep their eyes open and know what they're doing.

 

In fact, when I call up the insecure chick, I'll tell her straight out, I'm not ready for a relationship after my experience. Then we'll see what she does.

[Star Gazer]

Eh... actually that's a good point.

 

Luckily both of us are relatively good people, so we've only had stupid lover's tiff. But you are right. If something big happens... oh man...

 

I caution you to not assume that what a woman is getting upset over is actually a trivial thing.

 

Remember, when the "issue" you're fighting over is small/silly/trivial, the actual issue in play is usually a much bigger problem.

 

I remember one big fight I got into with an ex over a pair of flip flops. He liked to get my advice on what to wear. He asked me what shoes he should wear to a formal dinner in Vegas followed by a nice lounge. He held up a pair of flip flops and a pair of dress shoes. I said that given the occasion and dress code, he should wear the dress shoes. He got upset that I didn't say the flip flops, the shoes he wears everyday and are more "him." He was furious that I would suggest that he wear the dress shoes. I was annoyed that he was getting mad at me for suggesting dress shoes when he asked me for my opinion and the dress shoes seemed more appropriate.

 

I thought we were literally arguing over fashion - which shoes were more appropriate, something so trivial, so small (the flip flops) - when in reality those flip flops were merely the symbol/example of a much larger problem: He thought I thought he wasn't good enough for me.

[fishtaco]

The point I'm making is that you wanted her to be on time and to call you when she was outside rather than texting. You didn't properly tell her this expectation in the past, instead you allowed it to continue, causing increasing resentment.

 

From what you've posted here this does not appear to be any different than past relationships. Instead of clearly saying what you expect and enforcing these boundaries you just walk away.

 

No, I think you're missing my point. The lateness is something I'm willing to tolerate because I want to keep the peace. But she's throwing her "zero tolerance policy" at me, so guess what, maybe I should start a zero tolerance policy regarding her being late.

 

That's passive aggressive behavior. If she wasn't trying to "assert her dominance" like this, and we didn't have these conflicts, I'd happily tolerate her lateness.

 

 

How has your perception changed? I'm not seeing it.

 

I see that she's not as mentally mature as I thought.

[threebyfate]

fish, you never cease to make me laugh. Such a playah but at least you're honest about it which is why I don't have a problem with you.

 

It's the ones that are dishonest that piss me off.

[fishtaco]

I caution you to not assume that what a woman is getting upset over is actually a trivial thing.

 

Remember, when the "issue" you're fighting over is small/silly/trivial, the actual issue in play is usually a much bigger problem.

 

I remember one big fight I got into with an ex over a pair of flip flops. He liked to get my advice on what to wear. He asked me what shoes he should wear to a formal dinner in Vegas followed by a nice lounge. He held up a pair of flip flops and a pair of dress shoes. I said that given the occasion and dress code, he should wear the dress shoes. He got upset that I didn't say the flip flops, the shoes he wears everyday and are more "him." He was furious that I would suggest that he wear the dress shoes. I was annoyed that he was getting mad at me for suggesting dress shoes when he asked me for my opinion and the dress shoes seemed more appropriate.

 

I thought we were literally arguing over fashion - which shoes were more appropriate, something so trivial, so small (the flip flops) - when in reality those flip flops were merely the symbol/example of a much larger problem: He thought I thought he wasn't good enough for me.

 

Interesting. SG, you have experiences in a side of understanding that is very foreign to me. Reading you posts actually makes some of my GF's actions more clear to me. We luckily don't always fight, but I'd have... huh? moments. They probably symbolize something like your example, but I just didn't get it.

[fishtaco]

fish, you never cease to make me laugh. Such a playah but at least you're honest about it which is why I don't have a problem with you.

 

It's the ones that are dishonest that piss me off.

 

I just don't see the need to lie. I believe you can be straight forward and get casual sex. Because there ARE women that are into casual sex.

 

Plus I'm here saying all these bimbos that are not date-able. Well, guess what, some women consider me not date-able either. But if we both happen to want to play casually, why not? Consenting adults. All good.

[NXS]

No, I think you're missing my point. The lateness is something I'm willing to tolerate because I want to keep the peace. But she's throwing her "zero tolerance policy" at me, so guess what, maybe I should start a zero tolerance policy regarding her being late.

 

That's passive aggressive behavior. If she wasn't trying to "assert her dominance" like this, and we didn't have these conflicts, I'd happily tolerate her lateness.

 

The keeping the peace is the problem, you may be tolerating it but it's just causing resentment to build up. You were pissed off with her before she ever got to her zero tolerance policy.

 

Instead of responding with your zero tolerance policy why not tell her to be on time or not call over? That you're no longer willing to wait 2 hours for her and won't tolerate it in future.

 

You said you wanted to do something different with this one but you haven't really tried anything different. You've just used a different method for avoiding conflict.

[fishtaco]

The keeping the peace is the problem, you may be tolerating it but it's just causing resentment to build up. You were pissed off with her before she ever got to her zero tolerance policy.

 

Instead of responding with your zero tolerance policy why not tell her to be on time or not call over? That you're no longer willing to wait 2 hours for her and won't tolerate it in future.

 

You said you wanted to do something different with this one but you haven't really tried anything different. You've just used a different method for avoiding conflict.

 

Eh sphincter says what?

 

No I have a problem with her blowing up over things that I consider trivial and stupid. I have a problem with her throwing out ultimatums and putting our relationship up for ante so easily. I have a problem because I perceive I was being manipulated.

 

All those are problems. Lateness is an annoyance I can live with. But I'm feeling passive aggressive, which is a bad sign.

[Star Gazer]

I have a problem with her blowing up over things that I consider trivial and stupid.

 

Ahem. *cough, cough*

[NXS]

Eh sphincter says what?

 

No I have a problem with her blowing up over things that I consider trivial and stupid. I have a problem with her throwing out ultimatums and putting our relationship up for ante so easily. I have a problem because I perceive I was being manipulated.

 

All those are problems. Lateness is an annoyance I can live with. But I'm feeling passive aggressive, which is a bad sign.

 

Really? So you were feeling all warm fuzzy feelings when she manipulated you to say loving things to her after being 2 hours late? This was before the ultimatum. You said nothing about her being late, nothing about the text and then went along with her manipulation before the ultimatum.

[fishtaco]

Eh sphincter says what?

 

BTW, that's just something I say when I play around with my friends, don't get offended.

 

Ahem. *cough, cough*

 

I have a problem with her blowing up over things that I CONSIDERED trivial a stupid, but after Star Gazer's insightful posts, I realize they have deeper meanings, and are not trivial or stupid. But our conflict resolution needs a lot of work.

 

Yeah, that's what I meant to say. It was a simple typo that I missed about 80% of that sentence. It can happen to anyone.

[fishtaco]

Really? So you were feeling all warm fuzzy feelings when she manipulated you to say loving things to her after being 2 hours late? This was before the ultimatum. You said nothing about her being late, nothing about the text and then went along with her manipulation before the ultimatum.

 

LOL, she wasn't 2 hours late this time. But in the past, she is usually late a lot.

 

This time she called, then 26 minutes later, she was at my house, although she claimed it was only 15 minutes.

[fishtaco]

Well people of LS, thank you everyone. I'm actually off to take my GF out dancing tonight. It was something planned, and since we are now not in fighting mode, we are going ahead with the plan.

 

I actually feel much better now, I was still pissed off even when I went to the interview earlier. Maybe talking things out here on LS helped. So I'll probably have some enjoyable time with my GF tonight.

 

Thanks all.

[NXS]

LOL, she wasn't 2 hours late this time. But in the past, she is usually late a lot.

 

This time she called, then 26 minutes later, she was at my house, although she claimed it was only 15 minutes.

 

Here's your OP:

 

She didn't get to my place until midnight, so I guess she was just here to sleep.

 

There's a lot of miscommunication or lack of expectations being met going on here, if you think about it.

 

Btw apologies if I'm coming across as being argumentative.

[Star Gazer]

I have a problem with her blowing up over things that I CONSIDERED trivial a stupid, but after Star Gazer's insightful posts, I realize they have deeper meanings, and are not trivial or stupid. But our conflict resolution needs a lot of work.

 

Yeah, that's what I meant to say. It was a simple typo that I missed about 80% of that sentence. It can happen to anyone.

 

 

In all fairness, sometimes they ARE trivial and stupid. Some people act like petulant children no matter what. But in my experience, when someone (anyone, really... male, female, boyfriend, girlfriend, friend, brother, sister, etc.) you once got on with quite well appears upset over something trivial and stupid, that something is usually just the tip of the iceberg.

[Star Gazer]

Well people of LS, thank you everyone. I'm actually off to take my GF out dancing tonight. It was something planned, and since we are now not in fighting mode, we are going ahead with the plan.

 

I actually feel much better now, I was still pissed off even when I went to the interview earlier. Maybe talking things out here on LS helped. So I'll probably have some enjoyable time with my GF tonight.

 

Thanks all.

 

Have fun!!!