Intuition/paranoia/insecurity

[eleanorhurting]

How do you tell the difference between your "gut feeling" and your insecurities?

 

I have started seeing someone recently but I am very paranoid. I am paranoid that he just wants to pump and dump. He has not really given me any indication of this and we have not slept together but in the back of my mind I have this huge fear that he is just trying to get in and get out and that he is using the fact that I knew him from before and that he knows that I had this problem in the past to get me to trust him and then when I least expect it pull the rug from under me.

 

I am scared that he is not truly into me and that he just enjoys my attention/having someone to make out with/the possibility of having sex in the future.

 

This happened to me about a year ago and I was very naive and still vulnerable from a breakup that had happened 4 months before (definitely too soon) and I totally let the person walk all over me. It was a low blow for my self esteem.

 

After that I went to therapy and we worked on issues that I had such as fear of being alone, fear of abandonment, seeking validation from others and being more assertive (this was from October-December).

 

Since then I have met people and hung out casually (nothing physical) but this is the first person that I have actually liked and had something develop with and I am so scared.

 

I don't know if it is a gut feeling or if it is just my plain old insecurities creeping up on me.

 

how can you tell?

[Nightsky]

What are you more afraid of that he will pump/dump you or that you won't be able to handle it if he does?

 

Do you really like him, is he worth the risk or are you just afraid to be alone? Is it that you really like him so now you're afraid to lose him? Could you even just walk away at this point knowing pump and dump is a risk?

 

Do you think you'd be ok if some one else did something like that I mean you have no control over it and there is no such thing as a sure thing?

 

What are you thinking?

[xxoo]

How well do you know him? If you knew him from before, what was his character then?

[eleanorhurting]

What are you more afraid of that he will pump/dump you or that you won't be able to handle it if he does?

 

Do you really like him, is he worth the risk or are you just afraid to be alone? Is it that you really like him so now you're afraid to lose him? Could you even just walk away at this point knowing pump and dump is a risk?

 

Do you think you'd be ok if some one else did something like that I mean you have no control over it and there is no such thing as a sure thing?

 

What are you thinking?

 

I think I would be really disappointed in myself for letting it happen to me again. To allow myself to have feelings for someone and feel completely vulnerable and that they had insincere intentions and tried to fool me into thinking otherwise.

 

Maybe if someone randomly who I just met tried to pump and dump then I would not care and I would walk away. But from someone who knows me and knows my weaknesses then it would hurt a lot.

[dasein]

Not that hard IMO. Is he genuinely interested in your life? Does he express interest in the things you do in a continuous way, for example if you mention you have a cold, does he ask about it later without prompting? If you mention family does he remember their names and things about them? Same with your friends, does he know the names of your best friends? Does he remember individual things you have said about yourself?

 

Has he shared facets of his life with you? Does he talk about things he does, his friends and family. Are there indicia of "we should do that sometime" or "you would really like..." as part of his sharing experiences with you? signaling that he wants to involve you more in his life?

 

Do you do nonsexual "hanging out" things together? and not just night dates where sex could take place? Is he patient, involved and interested during these times? or act like he is in a hurry to leave or get away?

 

If you think about it, it's pretty easy to tell when someone is truly interested, sometimes we fool ourselves into accepting less because we have become invested.

[jobaba]

OP, you are really going to be a doctor?

 

This isn't a slight, but haven't got the personality of a doctor at all. I know many doctors and they are cold and calculated.

 

My best friend's brother is a cardiologist and he says his brother hasn't ever talked about relationships or problems with him ... ever. And he's always had women.

 

I know many other doctors who are similar. I think it's one of those things, you have to be somewhat emotionless when dealing with the inevitability of death.

Edited April 12, 2012 by jobaba

[eleanorhurting]

Not that hard IMO. Is he genuinely interested in your life? Does he express interest in the things you do in a continuous way, for example if you mention you have a cold, does he ask about it later without prompting? If you mention family does he remember their names and things about them? Same with your friends, does he know the names of your best friends? Does he remember individual things you have said about yourself?

 

Has he shared facets of his life with you? Does he talk about things he does, his friends and family. Are there indicia of "we should do that sometime" or "you would really like..." as part of his sharing experiences with you? signaling that he wants to involve you more in his life?

 

Do you do nonsexual "hanging out" things together? and not just night dates where sex could take place? Is he patient, involved and interested during these times? or act like he is in a hurry to leave or get away?

 

If you think about it, it's pretty easy to tell when someone is truly interested, sometimes we fool ourselves into accepting less because we have become invested.

 

Yes, he pays attention to my life. He knows my family member's names, my sister's names.

 

He knows when I have deadlines, he asks me how my tests or presentations go.

 

Now that I have face book again he face book stalks me which is kind of cute honestly. I am not one for status whoring or anything like that but for example last night I changed my profile picture and within an hour he sent me a text telling me he really liked how I looked with the dress I was wearing in my new picture.

 

Don't ask me why but he knows when I am going to get my period. Thats more than I can say I never even know! But apparently last month I complained that I was in menstrual pain around the 14th so last week when I had a huge zit on my forehead he reminded me that I was going to get my period soon.

 

 

Yes, these are all good things but I am still doubtful.

 

I think one of the things that is troubling me is that we are trying to keep things on the down low and I question his motives about this. I don't want to make a big deal out of it and then have it blow up in my face but I don't know if he does this because he just wants to secretly screw me and then ditch and have no one ever know about it.

[eleanorhurting]

OP, you are really going to be a doctor?

 

This isn't a slight, but haven't got the personality of a doctor at all. I know many doctors and they are cold and calculated.

 

My best friend's brother is a cardiologist and he says his brother hasn't ever talked about relationships or problems with him ... ever. And he's always had women.

 

I know many other doctors who are similar. I think it's one of those things, you have to be somewhat emotionless when dealing with the inevitability of death.

 

I am going to be a psychiatrist if that makes any difference to you.

 

And the first time I saw someone die I totally flipped out.

[xxoo]

I think one of the things that is troubling me is that we are trying to keep things on the down low and I question his motives about this. I don't want to make a big deal out of it and then have it blow up in my face but I don't know if he does this because he just wants to secretly screw me and then ditch and have no one ever know about it.

 

If you know him pretty well (and it sounds like you do), and you want a relationship with him, you should be able to talk to him about this stuff--the worries about keeping it quiet, the worries about being dumped after sex.

 

I vote talk to him. He sounds really sweet

[jobaba]

I am going to be a psychiatrist if that makes any difference to you.

 

And the first time I saw someone die I totally flipped out.

 

Yea. Sounds like a good choice then.

[Nightsky]

OP, you are really going to be a doctor?

 

This isn't a slight, but haven't got the personality of a doctor at all. I know many doctors and they are cold and calculated.

 

My best friend's brother is a cardiologist and he says his brother hasn't ever talked about relationships or problems with him ... ever. And he's always had women.

 

I know many other doctors who are similar. I think it's one of those things, you have to be somewhat emotionless when dealing with the inevitability of death.

 

Doctors are just people like the rest of us. If anything it must be a very stressful time in her life as well as an exciting one so try not to be so judgmental and compare every one to your best friends brother the cardiologist who it sounds like you don't eve know well.

 

 

I think one of the things that is troubling me is that we are trying to keep things on the down low and I question his motives about this. I don't want to make a big deal out of it and then have it blow up in my face but I don't know if he does this because he just wants to secretly screw me and then ditch and have no one ever know about it.

 

I am guilty of usualy having sex with a girl before I introduce her to family and friends. Although I have done it the other way before too. Just talk to him in a kind caring way without accusing him of wanting to hurt you. Make it about liking him and wanting things to go farther but being scared and how being open would help you. Something like that might make you feel better.

[dasein]

I don't know if he does this because he just wants to secretly screw me and then ditch and have no one ever know about it.

 

You will never know for sure, and people do change their minds, so if you do know for sure, things can change in an instant. I know that doesn't help one bit sorry.

 

But what your posts to this thread reveal is that you are navigating your relationships with past baggage unduly. I'm cynical myself, so can't fault you there, think that's wise today actually. But when you start using language like "pump n dump" or "screw then ditch," early in a relationship that sounds normal and healthy, there's more than just basic cynicism going on that calls your attitudes about sex generally into question.

 

Until you can view sex as something mutually "good clean fun" and pleasurable for both, a mutual expression of affection and healthy lust that rewards you both, as opposed to something a normal attentive guy is trying to take from you, would suggest having no sex at all. Good luck.

[fishtaco]

I think the issue here is you can't handle it.

 

If he pulls a fast one on you, it's not your fault. It happens to every single one of us. It's how you handle it, and how you get back on your feet that matters.

 

It happened to me. Yeah, I'm a guy. I was with this woman I wanted a relationship with for six month. We were sexually active, I even took her on a weekend cruise. When it was time, she simply vanished, didn't even tell me "it's not working out" or whatever. Months later I got a "I'm sorry" text message.

 

You know what I did? I went and dated someone else.

 

The cruise? Calculated risk. It was during off season, so it wasn't expensive. I've been wanting to go on a cruise anyway, so it was great that I was there with her, and we f-ked the whole time. I was more disappointed with how she handled the exit than paying for the cruise.

 

But in retrospect, sex was had, bullet was dodged, it was alright. At the time, it didn't feel too good.

[jobaba]

Doctors are just people like the rest of us. If anything it must be a very stressful time in her life as well as an exciting one so try not to be so judgmental and compare every one to your best friends brother the cardiologist who it sounds like you don't eve know well.

 

Nah. I didn't mean it like that at all. I know a lot of doctors and many are like that. I didn't mean it as an insult. If it came off like that, I apologize.

[threebyfate]

What does psychiatry tell you about patterns of behaviour and sample sizes?

[lilyblue]

Not that hard IMO. Is he genuinely interested in your life? Does he express interest in the things you do in a continuous way, for example if you mention you have a cold, does he ask about it later without prompting? If you mention family does he remember their names and things about them? Same with your friends, does he know the names of your best friends? Does he remember individual things you have said about yourself?

 

Has he shared facets of his life with you? Does he talk about things he does, his friends and family. Are there indicia of "we should do that sometime" or "you would really like..." as part of his sharing experiences with you? signaling that he wants to involve you more in his life?

 

Do you do nonsexual "hanging out" things together? and not just night dates where sex could take place? Is he patient, involved and interested during these times? or act like he is in a hurry to leave or get away?

 

If you think about it, it's pretty easy to tell when someone is truly interested, sometimes we fool ourselves into accepting less because we have become invested.

 

From experience, all of this means nothing. And it's not easy to tell what someone's true intentions are. Sometimes they can say all the right things. OP I share many of the same concerns as you though I'm not seeing anyone right now. I'm not sure how I'll deal with it if/when the time comes.

[Eternal Sunshine]

1 data point:

 

Late 2010, I was basically pumped and dumped. It happened after 6 weeks where the guy showed interest in every aspect of my life. He saw me during day time, he put up FB pictures of us, he called every day, he introduced me to his friends. He told me that he never has causal sex and is looking for his soulmate.

 

Yet, after we had sex twice he dumped me. Correction - he proposed a purely sexual relationship. He simply couldn't keep up the act of being a boyfriend. I declined, and that was that. I later found out that he was involved in orgies (so much for his claim of no casual sex lol). Good thing I always insist on protection.

 

Moral of the story? I felt he was a complete creep and an a-hole. It's really no reflection on me. The guy that pumped and dumped you? It's ALL him.

[eleanorhurting]

From experience, all of this means nothing. And it's not easy to tell what someone's true intentions are. Sometimes they can say all the right things. OP I share many of the same concerns as you though I'm not seeing anyone right now. I'm not sure how I'll deal with it if/when the time comes.

 

agreed. many people know how to say or act the right way although usually with time the true colors shine through

[Ninjainpajamas]

People who are trying to build credibility through their words instead of their actions are typically the people pulling a fast one...as with Eternal Sunshine from a guys point of view that's pretty damn predictable, because men are trying to "convince" you more than demonstrate it.

 

Another sign is an unrealistic burst of progression after meeting...such as with Eternal Sunshine (sorry), the FB pics, the calling everyday, the over-the-top attention and affection that seems "too fast". Men who move quickly move that way to get you caught up in the tornado, but it's like being drunk...every idea sounds exciting and yeah let's do it! yet after you sober up you're like oh wow, that was a stupid idea and shouldn't have done all that...so consider that a form of love drunk If you will.

 

The best way is to communicate what you're looking for and what you want, expect and need out of a relationship with a guy. IF he's interested he's going to really listen, be patient, and adjust to your needs (within reason of course) and have a desire to put in the effort.

 

What's hardest for men is the "effort"...phone calls, texts, taking you out every weekend is not really considered effort, especially If he's local and It's not much of a challenge. The more a guy is willing to go out of his way for you the more likely he is interested in you.

 

Of course all guys can "pretend" they are after more and the more they know the more they can press all the right buttons and try to gain your trust...which is essentially what men are trying to achieve...but time is a revealing process for men...they can't keep up the act forever, and they can't hold out and invest their time and energy into something they really don't want to commit to.

 

Go slow with the guy, If he's in a rush it's going to be painful and he's going to start to crack. If he's genuine he's going to stick around and he might get frustrated but he'll communicate with you and express himself instead of just disappear on you.

 

It's when you feel comfortable enough to be with him and you've waited a reasonable time getting to know him, what kind of person he is like, what kind of reputation he has, how many women he's surrounded by, what kind of interests he has, all those things will tell you a lot about what a guy is about If you don't do what a lot of women do and ignore all the red flags and just let it slide.

 

Build an emotional relationship before building a physical one and lay the groundwork for a good relationship instead of banging and expecting everything to just fall into place.

 

Ultimately nothing is ever a hundred percent proof, you can't control life and people. But you can do a lot of things to figure out what a person is about and what they're expecting and wanting from you before finding out the hard way, a lot of women could have avoided obvious blunders in their past If they just used a little brain power rather than "I like this guy so much, maybe we'll be together forever"...If you're too afraid to confront men and ask them the hard questions and have real genuine conversations ibefore getting physical then It's your fault for not doing anything to prevent yourself from being screwed over.

 

If you did what you can, and actually weren't scared and attempted to have a conversation and the guy backs out...well you know your answer.

 

If you did what everything you could, and he still pulled a fast one on you then you need figure out what you missed from that last experience. But at least you'll be smarter the next time around and be a better judge of character IF you learn.

 

Too many women go blindly into everything with men then wonder why they get burned....there's a reason the guys who you encounter are the fast movers, It's typically because they are the most aggressive and shameless.

 

You want qualities in a man like;

 

Pride

Empathy

Self-awareness

Integrity

Respect

Values

Morals

In the mindset of what you are looking for...commitment or not

 

You want to avoid men with qualities like;

 

Ego

Jealousy

Selfish

Self-centered

Disrespectful (see how he treats others, those he does not have to care about)

Superficial

Dishonesty

Unsympathetic

 

Learn the man, their past, and their way of thinking without your emotions...and you'll figure out the the quality of the man.

[johan]

Patience, grasshopper. You must not jump to conclusions. Wait for three indicators before you decide things are good or that they are bad.

[Ninjainpajamas]

To answer your questions on insecurity vs gut feeling;

 

Insecurity will be without any merit, no facts, evidence or particular reaction to what one has said or done or even "struck" himself in a certain light without merit.

 

Gut feeling will be an internal reaction/sense/feeling after what a man particular says or does that seems a little wishy wash, It doesn't quite add up or make much sense, you see the truth but you try and delude it with a desire to trust and give the benefit of the doubt so that you can continue on, even though you know what it was he said or did was off and you get a sense of him being untrustworthy.

 

Have faith in yourself, don't "try" so hard..take things at a casual and comfortable pace. Let the trust be earned, don't try and give it.

[Kamille]

This is how I handle it.

 

1. I take responsibility for my sexuality. That means that I have when I feel like it, because I want to, and because I know I will enjoy it. I don't have sex to please someone else or in the hopes it will lead to a relationship. For some people, this means not having sex until they know they're in a committed relationship. For me, this means I accept that I can live with the consequences afterwards, no matter what they are. (Even if things don't work out).

 

2. When I can't distinguish between anxiety / gut feeling, I give myself the time to figure it out. I remind myself there's no emergency. I trust my own judgement, but also know I can forgive myself when I make a mistake. Not only can I forgive myself, but I also learn from them.

 

To allow myself to have feelings for someone and feel completely vulnerable and that they had insincere intentions and tried to fool me into thinking otherwise.

 

 

3. I don't miss-assign responsibility. If someone lies to you, that's on them. It hurts, and feeling betrayed is normal, but you cannot control an insincere person. Don't internalize the moral deficiencies of others.

[dasein]

From experience, all of this means nothing. And it's not easy to tell what someone's true intentions are. Sometimes they can say all the right things. OP I share many of the same concerns as you though I'm not seeing anyone right now. I'm not sure how I'll deal with it if/when the time comes.

 

Disagree. Outside of pathological pro liars, and that's just an occupational hazard and accepted risk we all take dating, it's very easy to tell when someone is truly interested or not or likely to get sex or whatever they want and fade. It takes a little time and face to face, but you shouldn't be having sex that soon anyway if looking for a relationship.

 

Now if the guy is walking around town at night with sunglasses on, giving out love beads and reading women's palms in clubs...

[freestyle]

I find it very odd that the man is keeping track of your periods....

 

In an established relationship, it's okay---but with someone new??It seems odd to me. (as if he's rushing intimacy on an emotional level)

[johan]

I find it very odd that the man is keeping track of your periods...

 

I have been, too. It's not that big a deal. I keep track of everyone's on here. Yours is coming in 8 days.