How important is having a closure talk? Need your insight, …

[rosadeldesierto]

I need answers… LDR of 3 years is over… 1 year engaged… 2 breakups… 4 months of strict NC

 

I’ve been reading posts here since breakup and I found people I can relate tons but was not able to post before because my low levels of energy due to depression.

 

Backgrounds: We live in different countries. Believe it or not, we were physically together for just 9 weeks in 3 years because he was struggling with money, myself with immigration difficulties to visit his country. He visited twice and I was able to visit him just once. Of course we spent hours and hours online and were very committed about that but I don’t know if that counts.

 

First breakup: I was the dumper. My reasons: I was very honest and told him that I was not happy and feeling miserable of not knowing when I could see him again. I couldn’t handle about the LDR anymore. I was madly in love with him but our relationship it turned to no end sight someway. On the top of this, he was getting cold and distant. My mistake: I asked him to be friends… But I didn’t mean that at all.

After breakup he contacted me a few times by email to ask how I was doing or if he could help (never got it about this part… help???) but I got focused on move on. 3 months after we broke up I was lurking online for him (invisible status) then found he was accepting that woman as a friend. Yes, I know, I was not moving on but just pretending… I got SO DAMN jealous. I guess it worked for me as a dumper because actually I was still so in love with my ex. I wrote him an email then poured my heart. We had a conversation then he confessed his plans before breakup were to come and propose. I literally begged him to do that as you can imagine. I promised to be patient.

 

He came to visit then proposed. All my family and friends adored him. I reapplied for a visa to visit him and got rejected. I was devastated. After months of research finally I found out that gfs/ bfs or even wives or husbands from countries where a visa is required they cannot get a visa… Unless… They have tons of money… Yep… The only option it was to get married then to apply for a sponsorship but still no guarantee. BIG DEAL again… He was facing money issues because he bought a house… Besides he was paying for his car. He would be done about the car payments in about 2 more years and I thought that I could wait so he could show more money when apply for a sponsorship. That meant plans about the wedding were uncertain…

 

Second breakup: after 11 months of engagement, he dumped me. His reasons: he realized that I was not his priority number one and I didn’t deserve that. He said he lied to us because since we break up for the first time, he felt we lost connection. He tried hard to bring that feeling back but couldn’t. He was so heartbroken that he cannot love me with a whole heart anymore and I don’t deserve that either. He also said that he wanted me in his life so he hopes in the future I can forgive him then we’ll be in touch again to give support each other about job or family issues (what????) and still play games online as we used to (it sucks). He said that he always will be there for me.

 

My mistake which apparently could lead to break up: I used this stupid white lie. It happened he got online one hour late (never did and always texted to let me know), he also was getting cold and not affectionate. When we said bye I promised to email him as usual next day but I didn’t. 2 days after I told him my internet connection was not working then will try to get it fix by the weekend. We were supposed to be online as every Wednesday. I got his email breaking up with me on Friday.

 

There was a clear pattern about break ups: I was stressing out tons about my job. I was down because noticed him so cold, distant and not affectionate at all. Ex bf was dealing with grief himself or close to people in grief. He also was burnt out. First time he drove his dad who lost his ex of cancer for even 5 hours a day by 2 weeks. Last time he helped caregiving a friend of 10 years who died of cancer too.

 

My questions are:

 

Don’t you think his reasons are cheesy and he’s blaming me some way about the first breakup?...

 

What really does he mean when he said that he wants me forever in his life? He mentioned that many times since we met. He stated if for some reason it didn’t work then he would love we were friends in the future as mature people do… Or is he a narcissistic guy who wants me to be in a platonic love? In my opinion, I always told him that I don’t believe you can be friends with someone you are so in love which was my case. I’m absolutely convinced about not being friends while there are active feelings. I am very determined that I don’t want to go for more pain. After the first breakup he said that I had no idea how much it hurt him that I didn’t want to be in touch.

 

What does he mean about losing connection? That means trust on me about the possibility of dumping him anytime?

 

How healthy it would be to have a closure talk in order to heal? I just texted him thanking and saying that I would email him but never did. I’ve been avoiding this closure talk for many reasons. First, I’ve been in shock and devastated since breakup. My mind has been a mess. I’ve been in total wreck. I went to strict NC because I cannot handle about my feelings. I dread to get more hurt or to end up insulting him because I am so because such a waste of time. But yes, I find it is pointless to hate him just because he stopped loving me but cannot convince my heart...

 

On the other hand, I think that I need that closure talk because I just want to know the truth. I would rather him to tell me that he quit because he couldn’t make it because he’s no money… Or he found someone new…

Or he’s so in grief because losses but not such a cheesy bull*t… Darn… I know what grief is. My dad died of cancer in my arms. I lost a beloved boyfriend of 5 years because such an awful disease. I always was there for him. I’ve been in grief since he got ill and then when he died. I know how hell is… I also saw how my grandma was dying. How it could be someone can get so depressed because a coworker of 10 years died?

 

Do you think he just took the chance to get rid of our relationship because I used that stupid white lie of the internet connection was broken?

 

If I go for the closure talk, do you think it would be good to mention the stupid lie that I regret?

 

I’ve been reading here it could be someone can be so depressed that just removes the stressors of his life… Do you think it could happen?

 

I don’t want to be friends because I found this very selfish from him… He knows that I love him fondly… How could I get just bread crumbles of affection and one day knowing he’s a new girlfriend?... I just hate he thinks that I am so immature because I think you cannot be friends with an ex. I hate he’s playing mind games when he talks about forgiveness and being friends…

 

We are in our forties and you can tell we are so embarrassing immature… I am a kind of young widow who tried to rebuild my life finding someone that I really liked. He got divorced and lived with a woman for 10 years. It seems to me he didn’t even love her since the beginning. He fell in love with her kids. I guess he can fake feelings very easy. What I know for sure is that he can repress his emotions very well. I cannot blame him, he had a terrible childhood.

 

I’d wish I could write a sour letter to make him feel just as miserable as I am now… You know, to push the right buttons to make him feel so miserable… The fact is that I’ve been lost in anger and depression for 4 months. My friends have been very supportive and keeping busy at work helps tons but every day I feel that I am drowning slowly in bitterness and despair... Needless to say that I’m stuck in denial and my mind is still a real mess.

 

Thanks for reading this. (I also posted in the LDR section with some changes because have questions most specific to the topic).

[mike588]

Stay away from LDRs...chalk it up to experience. I'm not trying to give you a hard time but I just don't understand how people can have a LDR especially it you just met and one moves away or meeting online.

 

People need to see..be with...touch..hold..sleep with the other to really get to know them.

 

Personally I just don't see them lasting...we all need that human interaction.

[Nohbody]

You give yourself closure. Another person can't give it to you.

[rosadeldesierto]

Thanks a lot for your responses...

 

It makes all sense to me...

[budley12]

Personally my problem with getting closure it that from my experience with my ex it was never good enough. There was always one more question I wanted to ask. There was always one more "are you sure you want me out of your life". To this day I still have questions and doubts that he made the "right" decision or the decision he truly wanted to make (he is easily persuaded by outside parties). But I totally agree with Nohbody - "you give yourself closure". Even if our ex's did answer some of our questions they may be lying. For instance my ex sugar coated the breakup to make it seem like he wasn't the "bad guy" by saying "there wasn't anyone else, and that isn't why we were breaking up" -total BS! He was with the new guy before we had even broken up.

[rosadeldesierto]

Thanks budley12,

 

I understand... I guess that I am just wondering if letting him know about my feelings it could help for me to move on:confused:

[CopingGal]

I'm all for closure if you feel you can trust the person and if that person was respectful in the relationship. You can have a good, healthy talk and get out what you both need to say.

 

I don't believe in the closure talk if the partner that was dated is a lying, worthless bastard and would say anything that sounds good even if they are all lies.

[Ajax]

Even if our ex's did answer some of our questions they may be lying. For instance my ex sugar coated the breakup to make it seem like he wasn't the "bad guy" by saying "there wasn't anyone else, and that isn't why we were breaking up" -total BS! He was with the new guy before we had even broken up.

 

I was going to say something along these lines as well, but budley12 got the same point across. Long story short, I had the "closure" talk with my ex about two weeks after the breakup. She wanted to set my mind and heart at ease by letting me know that she was going through something that I "wouldn't understand" and that she needed to sort her life out and couldn't be in a relationship to do that.

 

Well, I didn't really buy it even at the time, but I gave her the benefit of the doubt. The talk itself certainly didn't give me closure. And a few months later I found out that she was indeed lying through her teeth, as I discovered through a friend's Facebook page that the anniversary of her relationship with her new man was the same day we had the "closure" talk. Read into that what you will.

 

What brought me closure, and it took almost a year, is to accept what happened, forgive yourself for "not being good enough," do your best to forgive your ex, and live your life the best you can. Once you've distanced yourself from the relationship and have a different perspective, closure comes on its own, and not because of anything your ex has said or done.

[betterdeal]

As one door closes, another one opens...

 

Perhaps that's why we reject closing the first door, so we don't open the next one, until we are ready to do so. So, in short, closure is a choice that you will make, when you feel ready enough to face the immense beauty and joy of connecting with another person on a deep, naked, visible and vulnerable way, again.

 

Give it time.

[SilverBlueAndGold]

Personally my problem with getting closure it that from my experience with my ex it was never good enough. There was always one more question I wanted to ask. There was always one more "are you sure you want me out of your life". To this day I still have questions and doubts that he made the "right" decision or the decision he truly wanted to make (he is easily persuaded by outside parties). But I totally agree with Nohbody - "you give yourself closure". Even if our ex's did answer some of our questions they may be lying. For instance my ex sugar coated the breakup to make it seem like he wasn't the "bad guy" by saying "there wasn't anyone else, and that isn't why we were breaking up" -total BS! He was with the new guy before we had even broken up.

 

Wise words...sometimes we just have to tell ourselves that we will never get the closure we need from somebody else. In fact it may help to think of it as an actual death, where no closure is possible at all. Otherwise we run the risk of being held back by an emotional cord that will never let us really move on.

[Fitz]

Wise words...sometimes we just have to tell ourselves that we will never get the closure we need from somebody else. In fact it may help to think of it as an actual death, where no closure is possible at all. Otherwise we run the risk of being held back by an emotional cord that will never let us really move on.

 

Yes, its very much like a death.

 

You can never truly go back to the way things were. Even if your ex comes back to you, there will still be old baggage between you. Sure, you may be able to start a NEW relationship, but the old relationship is dead. The innocence you had together is forever gone.

 

Its like a death because it can randomly enter your mind and cause both joy and sadness.

 

Its like a death because people change. And the person you fell in love with may be a completely different person from the one who later broke up with you.

 

And like a death, you aren't going to get a perfect explanation.

 

I understand the impulse to confront your ex. Personally I'd love to take my own Ex into an interrogation room for a few hours, and squeeze the truth out of her... But like others have said here, closure has to come from within yourself.

[rosadeldesierto]

Thanks a lot, everybody!

 

I guess one of the reasons I've been obssesing about the closure talk is that I want him to know that I hate he wasted my time. I mean... I am not in my twenties or thirties. But yes, I cannot fool myself. I was there waiting and enduring for him because I decided to be like that.

 

Sigh... I would love to pour all my crappy feelings into him... It is amazing that I found on him the guy I ever dreamed:(... Too good to be true...

[CopingGal]

Ever since I told my ex that he was dead to me, I have felt better. He's a worthless bastard, so he deserved it. As I said before, I am going to work on forgiveness, but he still no longer exists as far as I'm concerned. I have no time for abusive worthless bastards in my life.

[rosadeldesierto]

Thanks for stopping here, CopingGal

 

I'm glad that worked for you. I'd wish my ex was a real bastard but just the opposite. Maybe what I hate the most is how he was faking all the time to be the perfect guy.

 

I understand how some of you can handle about treating this as death but unfortunately, it cannot work for me. I lost a boyfriend so I know about real hell talking about someone you are so in love is dead. Believe me, that's so damn different.

 

However I have to admit that at some point I wondered if I could manage to think that my ex is dead to ease things for me... Nope... I couldn't... My perspective is completely different:lmao:.

[betterdeal]

What was it about an LDR that appealed to you?

[rosadeldesierto]

Interesting question, betterdeal

 

There are a few reasons:

 

First, I was so in despair because grief for losing the love of my life... I was left with too much love to give and wanting to receive the same. It happened that I saw this friend so excited to be dating online... She was pushy that I should try the same. The answer was that I wanted joy back in my life someway. To feel alive again...

 

On the other hand, I am not a social person at all. I'm not proud to say that I am very shy and picky. I just got focussed to find someone that I could like. I tried local but was such a naive even considering any place around the world. Well, I can be very shallow too:o...

[blotter]

What more closure do you need? This person knew you for three years, talked to you probably every day, got to know you better than most people in your life. They took a long hard look at who you are, and said "meh, I can do better". What more do you want to hear from him?

[rosadeldesierto]

blotter,

 

I think a closure talk involves 2 people... Not just to listen (read) his monologue or knowing more about his thinking...

 

The point is that I am looking for healing.. I am thinking of myself to be heard (read)... But no doubt he doesn't care about my feelings anymore.

 

Maybe I'm just looking to vent or learning about my flaws and what not to do next time I am in a relationship. I cannot stand he sugar coated his reasons and would love him to tell me the truth. I cannot stand either that bull**** of being friends in the future if someday I "kindly" forgive him (his words).

[betterdeal]

Interesting question, betterdeal

 

There are a few reasons:

 

First, I was so in despair because grief for losing the love of my life... I was left with too much love to give and wanting to receive the same. It happened that I saw this friend so excited to be dating online... She was pushy that I should try the same. The answer was that I wanted joy back in my life someway. To feel alive again...

 

On the other hand, I am not a social person at all. I'm not proud to say that I am very shy and picky. I just got focussed to find someone that I could like. I tried local but was such a naive even considering any place around the world. Well, I can be very shallow too:o...

 

I don't buy the first reason you give. You're intelligent and made a free choice (as in, you weren't forced to do it). There was something about it that appealed to you about your friend's suggestion.

 

The second paragraph rings more true to me. You wanted to connect, but you're shy and have been hurt by your previous loss. An LDR offers a way to connect with someone but with a lot of space, allowing you to maintain your privacy, and also preventing you from getting too close.

 

Is that what you want now? A more hands off sort of relationship?

[SilverBlueAndGold]

blotter,

 

I think a closure talk involves 2 people... Not just to listen (read) his monologue or knowing more about his thinking...

 

The point is that I am looking for healing.. I am thinking of myself to be heard (read)... But no doubt he doesn't care about my feelings anymore.

 

Maybe I'm just looking to vent or learning about my flaws and what not to do next time I am in a relationship. I cannot stand he sugar coated his reasons and would love him to tell me the truth. I cannot stand either that bull**** of being friends in the future if someday I "kindly" forgive him (his words).

 

You are right, closure talk does involve two people. But that is not always possible, which is why I gave the example of death.

 

Your story reminds me a bit of mine, in that my ex and I were really close and even talked of marriage. We thought we would spend the rest of our lives together, I promised her the world. And I meant it. But things didn't work out. For a number of reasons, some are mine and some are hers. The bottom line is we were incompatible no matter how much we convinced ourselves otherwise.

 

Now that we are apart, there is no way I will ever get closure; she is convinced that everything I ever said was a lie, that I just used her and that I am a huge A-hole. It hurts like you would not believe because I know it's not true. But that is her defense mechenism and it's easier to hate me and believe that I am a loser than accept the truth.

 

Not saying that is the case with you, but it sounds like you cannot know exactly what he is feeling so I thought I would offer a viewpoint from the other side. I am in a lot of pain, I miss her dearly and would like nothing else than to make that clear. But I know I can't, so I carry the burden of being the bad guy and I am working on accepting that. Even though she is trash talking me left and right I refuse to hate her, and my silence is probably taken as proof but that is absolutely not the case.

 

So you see, it's impossible to know exactly what somebody else is feeling especially when they won't communicate with you but sometimes there is just no other option.

 

I hope you find peace with this, but I don't think you can as long as you expect resolution from him because it may never come.

[rosadeldesierto]

I don't buy the first reason you give. You're intelligent and made a free choice (as in, you weren't forced to do it). There was something about it that appealed to you about your friend's suggestion.

 

You cannot buy the first reason because -Honestly that I'm not justifying myself but... just a very few people here maybe know or will know how real hell is when it happens the love of your life is dead. Believe me when I said what we are going through could be WORSE. When the one you love dies there's no one you can confront or blame because you were left with such a wonderful love inside and that's not fair. I'm a young widow and I'd wish that could change but the more I live then I know that I have to accept my scars.

 

On the other hand, yes, I hate myself because I realize that what I'm going through now it should be NOTHING compared to what I lived before but my stubborn heart is bleeding. When I met this guy I warned him about my heart in bad shape. Geeee... He said that he will kiss all the pieces. He did, and now I feel he made dust of them.

 

Friends were pushy because they saw me how depressed I was. They said that I was still young and beautiful and more than that, that I needed a "reason to live". That was all true for me. Regarding that friend, she was someone who unfortunately was out of an abusive marriage/husband and she said that she wanted to know how real love is. Pretty sad and pathetic you are in your fifties and looking for that. She wanted someone who cared of her. Well... I know it might not sound very motivating. Those are the details.

 

Is that what you want now? A more hands off sort of relationship?

 

I am so darn hurting that all that I want is to get some inner peace somehow. I am building -as someone said here, my own China Great wall. Friends are mad at me because I lost my faith in love. I am not looking, nor expecting to find Mr. Right anymore. Love sucks for me. Sorry but I guess I am so bitter. And... LOL... I love hands on sort of relationship. The problem it is that I cannot hide it is important for me to find a man who physically attracts me. Yeah, I can be shallow.

[rosadeldesierto]

You are right, closure talk does involve two people. But that is not always possible, which is why I gave the example of death.

 

I understand now... Sorry but it takes me a while to get the point. That's because as sure you've noticed, I'm not an English native speaker. Besides cultural issues are always my concern in terms that I simply don't get it. On the top of this because I am a young widow, the concept of death is not easy to handle.

 

 

Not saying that is the case with you, but it sounds like you cannot know exactly what he is feeling so I thought I would offer a viewpoint from the other side. I am in a lot of pain, I miss her dearly and would like nothing else than to make that clear

 

Thanks for your words and I'm so sorry to hear that... Problem with my ex is about his traumatic childhood. He can repress his feelings and emotions amazingly well. Even we were together for just 9 weeks, I can tell I never saw him angry or mad which is not normal:confused:. I guess he would never tell me the truth:( after all.

[SilverBlueAndGold]

 

 

 

 

Thanks for your words and I'm so sorry to hear that... Problem with my ex is about his traumatic childhood. He can repress his feelings and emotions amazingly well. Even we were together for just 9 weeks, I can tell I never saw him angry or mad which is not normal:confused:. I guess he would never tell me the truth:( after all.

 

You know, I think I can understand that. Sometimes us guys think it is better to hold in our feelings for all sorts of reasons; it's the "manly" thing to do, or it's a sign of weakness, or in my case to avoid conflict. It's not always intentional but can still be damaging. I know this because I have caused problems in my own relationships by trying to control situations and not just letting conflict happen. Sometimes its better to allow the conflict to get things out in the open, otherwise they can fester and resentment can brew.

 

I know what you mean by suppressing emotion; it was over a year before I ever even saw my ex cry. And when I did was after the breakup. I can honestly say that I have never known any other woman that acted that way, it was a bit unsettling to be honest.

 

I know it's a tough time for you and I am not trying to belittle your pain, just trying to show you another possible side to things. Even the toughest guy has feelings although you may not be able to see them.

[rosadeldesierto]

I know it's a tough time for you and I am not trying to belittle your pain, just trying to show you another possible side to things. Even the toughest guy has feelings although you may not be able to see them.

 

Thanks from the bottom of my heart for sharing with me that. My impression is now my ex could be kind of hurting but just because as you mentioned regarding your story, now he is the "bad" guy.

 

But I have to confess that I've been really insensitive about my ex. It is going to sound really awful and selfish but I never cared about his feelings because I was pretty convinced he could handle no matter what. I am the emotional and he's not. He always said: If I am emotional then I'm not rational.

 

When we first broke up we both cried... I never ever thought he was sincere while crying. For me he was faking all the time. I never gave any credit to his feelings. Feel bad about saying this. But I know he can protect himself like no one.

 

When we got back together, then he said that nothing hurt him more than me not wanting to interact with him... I never understand that part. Now I can read his emails that time asking how I was doing. So cold and distant. I was nasty giving him some advice to cope. Sometimes is very easy to be the dumper.. He just said that he was keeping busy and some way in denial. Now I guess it was too much for him to say that: being in denial... My side, I can tell that time I hated he was not strong to do his best until I literally begged him to get back in the virtual world:lmao:. Considering he could figuring out about his feelings, I knew he was going to be ok soon or at least to pretend. Nobody was going to see any difference.

 

I'd just wish this pain could go away. I've been off for one week and one more is coming so I am half a way of my struggling because every damn second, I want to break NC

[betterdeal]

You cannot buy the first reason because -Honestly that I'm not justifying myself but... just a very few people here maybe know or will know how real hell is when it happens the love of your life is dead. Believe me when I said what we are going through could be WORSE. When the one you love dies there's no one you can confront or blame because you were left with such a wonderful love inside and that's not fair. I'm a young widow and I'd wish that could change but the more I live then I know that I have to accept my scars.

 

None of that makes your decision to follows your friend's advice anything less than your choice. You choose to do it - and be a penpal for three years - because it suited you. This is not a bad thing. What I'd like to impress on you is you made a choice and this sort-of relationship, with lots of words but no physical suited your needs at the time. Given the circumstances, your terrible loss and the pain that I can only begin to image that brought, it is entirely understandable that you made such a choice.

 

On the other hand, yes, I hate myself because I realize that what I'm going through now it should be NOTHING compared to what I lived before but my stubborn heart is bleeding. When I met this guy I warned him about my heart in bad shape. Geeee... He said that he will kiss all the pieces. He did, and now I feel he made dust of them.

 

Don't be so hard on yourself, sweetheart. Your loss then is not comparable to your loss now. It's like comparing apples and oranges. There is no league of pain, and certainly no league for how much pain you feel when sad events happen. There are myriad things that affect how intense a feeling feels at any time: the event that triggers that feeling is not all that contributes how intense it feel right now. You are not a bad person for hurting because of your most recent loss.

 

Friends were pushy because they saw me how depressed I was. They said that I was still young and beautiful and more than that, that I needed a "reason to live". That was all true for me. Regarding that friend, she was someone who unfortunately was out of an abusive marriage/husband and she said that she wanted to know how real love is. Pretty sad and pathetic you are in your fifties and looking for that. She wanted someone who cared of her. Well... I know it might not sound very motivating. Those are the details.

 

Better late than never for her, and for you, you made the best decision you could given the circumstances you were in.

 

I am so darn hurting that all that I want is to get some inner peace somehow. I am building -as someone said here, my own China Great wall. Friends are mad at me because I lost my faith in love. I am not looking, nor expecting to find Mr. Right anymore. Love sucks for me. Sorry but I guess I am so bitter. And... LOL... I love hands on sort of relationship. The problem it is that I cannot hide it is important for me to find a man who physically attracts me. Yeah, I can be shallow.

 

You are beautiful. You have had a rough time and you would do well to spend a little time grieving and finding that inner peace. You feel guilt regards your earlier love and now you feel unsure about what you "should" feel about your recent loss. There is no "should". Feel how you feel. Accept how you feel, let it happen, acknowledge how you feel. That's how it will pass. It's like a voice inside that will not stop until it is heard. Once it is heard, it will quieten down. It won't disappear overnight, but it will quieten. Reconnect with yourself, accept yourself and in time you will feel better.

 

It's okay to not be okay.

Edited April 8, 2012 by betterdeal