Met xMM.

[NoIDidn't]

I would be very angry if my H went to meet with the xOW without my knowledge. I would think that the two of them were up to something behind my back again.

 

If it were a friend that was the xOW, I would recommend that she not meet with him either. But if she did it anyway and felt that it went well and she got closure, I'd tell her I'm glad she got what she felt she needed but I hope she doesn't put herself in that position again.

 

Its playing with fire. What if he looked better than ever and she then said she couldn't resist his charms again? What if his W decided to follow him because he was acting strange or she was still surveilling his email or other communications and came across this and was overcome with emotion and harmed one of them? What if he was planning to harm my friend?

 

Closure is something you give yourself. I'm amazed at the number of posters here that say they are not Americans and yet insist on something my non-American friends say is a uniquely, and annoyingly, American idea. They believe in moving on with their lives, not seeking or demanding closure.

[fellhard4u]

 

Closure is largely fooling yourself because unlike the movies you don't get it in a moment from a meeting or email or phone call. You get it over time. You don't just move on with your life in a moment either. It's true that getting the last word can help you by giving you back some control and getting things off your chest, it can help you work towards closure. But closure isn't something you get or are given, it's a process.

 

BrighterWashing, I completely agree that closure is not an instantaneous thing and that it is a process which takes time. With time comes perspective and with perspective comes - hopefully - insight as to how and why one did what one did.

 

I think giving her a damn good virtual slap by saying he dislikes her and hates what they did would give her much better closure... She isn't helping herself by clinging to the romantic gentle view of him. I wish I could say wake up! He told me stuff you'd probably want to kill him for about you. You should hate him for putting your career and marriage in my hands. I do not have your best interests, quite the reverse.

 

With all due respect for your pain, if your husband was like so many of the cheating spouses that are mentioned on this and other infidelity-related forums, -including my xMM - it is likely that he was as critical of and negative about you to his xOW as he is of her now that the A is over.

 

From what I've read, disparaging the BS while the A is going on and then bashing xOW after the A is over, is one of the ways cheating spouses are able to justify their own behavior and thus are able to not take true responsibility for the betrayal and pain they have inflicted upon others.

 

It was in fact a shock to learn that, after all the mean and nasty things he had told me about BW over the course of our A, he chose to stay in a marriage to the very person whom he had lambasted so often before DDay.

[wannabdone]

I think it's perfectly appropriate to betray her to me though. I'm in a marriage to him and she had no right to privacy with him from the start.

 

To tell me about her is the right thing to do. To tell her about me isn't An unfortunate asymmetry for the OW.

 

My WH though did not "lambast" her or minimize what he did. In fact to a fault if he criticized her he added that he'd done the same or that it was his fault for letting her or for falling for the lie. It took a long time and a lot of explanations with the backing of our MC for him to see that sounded like defending her. Only when he got that did he start to separate the conversations. When it was about him he would not mention her and when it was about her he would not qualify it by taking the blame himself.

 

I can totally see how MM would minimize and blameshift to the Ow but WH did not. He did eventually realize that preying on a MM when he was depressed and his wide was pregnant was heinous, and different to failing to keep his vows and be loyal to his wife (also heinous).

 

I put all of the blame for cheating on him. I put all of the blame before initiating an pursuing on her. I put all of tw blame for lying on him. I put all of the blame for using my children to manipulate him on her.

 

I do not think that's a phase. I think it's just a response to the facts of the specific case (and this particularly mean and kooky OW).

 

 

I understand what you are saying. Your H and you are married, she is not involved in your M, so his loyalties should be to you.

 

I know in your particular case, the OW is insane. But I think such as in life this depends on the situation itself.

 

I don't think its ever good or healthy to talk about someone else's issues or whatever. I don't see where that would ever help in the healing process. I know a lot of ppl want to know everything, but sometimes I think you can know too much and it henders being able to get over things. Where does it help a BS to know all the sorted details of how someone is screwed up? Or how the OW/OM acted sexually with someones spouse? Or what they did sexually? Shouldn't it be enough to know that your spouse broke the M vowes and slept with someone else? I know as human's we thrist for knowledge. We say knowledge is power. But I think in cases like this, knowledge can turn out to be a powerful tool that makes it impossible for a person to achieve the outcome they are wanting.

[NoIDidn't]

I think it's perfectly appropriate to betray her to me though. I'm in a marriage to him and she had no right to privacy with him from the start.

 

To tell me about her is the right thing to do. To tell her about me isn't An unfortunate asymmetry for the OW.

 

My WH though did not "lambast" her or minimize what he did. In fact to a fault if he criticized her he added that he'd done the same or that it was his fault for letting her or for falling for the lie. It took a long time and a lot of explanations with the backing of our MC for him to see that sounded like defending her. Only when he got that did he start to separate the conversations. When it was about him he would not mention her and when it was about her he would not qualify it by taking the blame himself.

 

I can totally see how MM would minimize and blameshift to the Ow but WH did not. He did eventually realize that preying on a MM when he was depressed and his wide was pregnant was heinous, and different to failing to keep his vows and be loyal to his wife (also heinous).

 

I put all of the blame for cheating on him. I put all of the blame before initiating an pursuing on her. I put all of tw blame for lying on him. I put all of the blame for using my children to manipulate him on her.

 

I do not think that's a phase. I think it's just a response to the facts of the specific case (and this particularly mean and kooky OW).

 

I totally agree with the bolded, but I know we are not really in the right forum for discussion about it.

 

It is a curious asymmetry for OPs to be caught in. They have no expectation of privacy if the MP stays married and wants that marriage to work.

[Pink_orchid]

GG, I don't remember all of your story but I remember your name. I am glad you felt that you were over it all after the meeting. Maybe you weren't sure beforehand. But I understand why you went to meet him.

 

I met up with a former partner once (after I had had another two year relationship in between). I had been devastated when this first relationship ended. I was single again two years later and former partner called to invite me to meet him for drinks. I was curious to know how I would feel upon seeing him again. I actually found I did not feel anywhere near as interested as I thought I might, and I could not wait to make my excuses and get away. I found I held him in contempt more than anything. I was glad of the experience of spending that time with him, however, because it laid it all to rest, as the previous time I had seen him (2 years prior) I still had feelings for him and seeing him again made me realise the feelings were gone.

 

I see there are still numerous good bits of advice on here interspersed with comments from the BS brigade who are ready to pounce on AP's or former AP's... despite the fact you are no longer in an affair GG. And it is SO true. Why do the OW get all the stick? The man was willing to get involved behind his wife's back with another woman (and most likely he pursued ardently) and I will never understand these pathetic women who fail to put the blame where it should be, only on her husband. He is the only one who is answerable to her and who promised to her that he would forsake all others. And I have been in an affair and I have been betrayed so I speak with experience of both.

[NoIDidn't]

I see there are still numerous good bits of advice on here interspersed with comments from the BS brigade who are ready to pounce on AP's or former AP's... despite the fact you are no longer in an affair GG. And it is SO true. Why do the OW get all the stick? The man was willing to get involved behind his wife's back with another woman (and most likely he pursued ardently) and I will never understand these pathetic women who fail to put the blame where it should be, only on her husband. He is the only one who is answerable to her and who promised to her that he would forsake all others. And I have been in an affair and I have been betrayed so I speak with experience of both.

 

BS Brigade? smh

 

There have already been numerous threads on the matter, but a W does hold her H responsible for cheating on her. There seems to be some that don't like it that she hold's the woman helping him responsible too.

 

I find the lack of personal accountability continues to hurt the person long after the A is over.

[Spark1111]

GG, I don't remember all of your story but I remember your name. I am glad you felt that you were over it all after the meeting. Maybe you weren't sure beforehand. But I understand why you went to meet him.

 

I met up with a former partner once (after I had had another two year relationship in between). I had been devastated when this first relationship ended. I was single again two years later and former partner called to invite me to meet him for drinks. I was curious to know how I would feel upon seeing him again. I actually found I did not feel anywhere near as interested as I thought I might, and I could not wait to make my excuses and get away. I found I held him in contempt more than anything. I was glad of the experience of spending that time with him, however, because it laid it all to rest, as the previous time I had seen him (2 years prior) I still had feelings for him and seeing him again made me realise the feelings were gone.

 

I see there are still numerous good bits of advice on here interspersed with comments from the BS brigade who are ready to pounce on AP's or former AP's... despite the fact you are no longer in an affair GG. And it is SO true. Why do the OW get all the stick? The man was willing to get involved behind his wife's back with another woman (and most likely he pursued ardently) and I will never understand these pathetic women who fail to put the blame where it should be, only on her husband. He is the only one who is answerable to her and who promised to her that he would forsake all others. And I have been in an affair and I have been betrayed so I speak with experience of both.

 

Nah....I can hold her accountable for her actions too.

 

And I'm a huge fan of GGs and she knows it!

 

I think it depends on the OW. Mine wasn't the least bit remorseful. In fact, when I finally spoke to her, she absolutely hates my guts, blames him, blames me, and is still the eternal victim.

 

Too bad I had expended so much energy giving her the benefit of the doubt and feeling somewhat empathetic. What a waste of kindness on my part.

 

She turned out to be a crazy, manipulative, lying drama queen who NEVER missed an opportunity to demean me or spend his money!

 

So I'm allowed to blame mostly him, but her too.

 

Just like BS, not all OW are the same. Stop believing they are.

[redcurls]

Lol my non American friends call that "getting the last word" and I think it's an American trait that is also very common anyway amongst those who had a relationship ended by the other party. It's like power was taken away from them and they get it back by getting the last stab in. The xOW is definitely like that, and to be honest if I'd been left I probably would have been.

 

Closure is largely fooling yourself because unlike the movies you don't get it in a moment from a meeting or email or phone call. You get it over time. You don't just move on with your life in a moment either. It's true that getting the last word can help you by giving you back some control and getting things off your chest, it can help you work towards closure. But closure isn't something you get or are given, it's a process.

 

I think anyway. And I think it's seldom a nice process. OW goes on about giving her closure by understanding her pain!?! I think giving her a damn good virtual slap by saying he dislikes her and hates what they did would give her much better closure... She isn't helping herself by clinging to the romantic gentle view of him. I wish I could say wake up! He told me stuff you'd probably want to kill him for about you. You should hate him for putting your career and marriage in my hands. I do not have your best interests, quite the reverse.

 

No point though.

 

 

BW, based on your posts here and in other threads, I looks to me like your H did you a HUGE disservice by telling you all the intimate details of his sexual relationship with his OW. I know you see it as his attempt to be transparent and demonstrate his remorse, but I think, in your case, this full-disclosure is causing you immense pain and hinders your recovery.

 

I'm not saying that your H shouldn't have told you everything that you wanted to know. That is between you and him. He should have done whatever you have asked him to do. My point is, that maybe, just maybe, your desire to know all the details, is now back-firing, with the mind-movies, and your reluctance to performed serious sexual acts, that you have enjoyed, and were actually your only means of achieving climax. I also suspect that your H told you these CERTAIN details, about this specific act, as he KNEW it would be especially painful for you to handle, and that you will decline this specific sexual act from then on. Maybe this was his way of avoiding performing this act with you? Something to think about, no?

 

There is no doubt in my mind that your H would tell you anything he knows you WANT to hear. And I'm sure he is aware of your insecurities. So it's no wonder that he is telling you negative or intimate stuff about his OW, real or made-up. I'm sure he discovered that this would pacify you the most, and he is happily obliging you and providing whatever information, real or not, about OW, to make you happy. I can totally see a WS, wanting to "just make it all go away" saying and doing anything and everything to appease the BS. Just be aware that not everything he tells you is the total truth. He did lie and deceive you for a while, right? So maybe he isn't completely truthful about the details regarding his OW? Just sayin'.

 

You are giving your H's OW so much head space. Why would you do that? Being angry at her will get you nowhere. If she knew about this rage in you, and how deep an effect she has on you, she would be THRILLED to have this much agency over you. Why would you give her this power?

 

It saddens me that you are so wrapped up in your pain and hatred towards your H's OW, that you don't have any leftover energy to devote to re-establishing complete intimacy with your H. I would think that it would be a much more productive manner for you to heal.

[Stellar Wench]

It saddens me that you are so wrapped up in your pain and hatred towards your H's OW, that you don't have any leftover energy to devote to re-establishing complete intimacy with your H. I would think that it would be a much more productive manner for you to heal.

:rolleyes:An OW telling a BW how to heal is about as helpful as a BW telling an OW to just get over it.

[Spark1111]

Spark I agree completely. And you know his Ow is a nut job.

 

Fwiw the stuff that torments me in images/words is not stuff he told me or gave me, it's what I read on DDay. By sheer coincidence the worst revelations were those I stumbled upon. He feared telling me things and went very gently only to find that nothing he revealed was even in the league of what I'd already seen. So I can see why you say that but here it isn't the case.

 

Whatever I have to go through I wouldn't swap with an OW for the world. Apart from anything else I can always say I never deserved this. An OW who knew that's what she was can never say that. She does deserve to be trashed to the wife, she does deserve for he private life to be made public as the wife chooses. She deserves a loss of control over her info shared in the affair.

 

I am doing a lot to heal my marriage but this isn't the forum for that. I will be able to do a lot more when she is out of our lives and has her own mess to deal with. I am looking forward to telling her poor BH in a way. Not his pain but her having to take responsibility.

 

I get this! I really do. I too felt for the first few years that I did not deserve it either!

 

I wracked my brain to figure out my missteps and could not find much, if anything, to deserve this. Neither could anyone who had known us, intimately, for years.

 

Right now you are dealing with tooooo much; an OW who won't leave gracefully and is still trying to insert herself into your marriage and your lives.

 

I understand, as do many others. It is up to you to lay down some sort of gauntlet to get this person to disengage, disappear, get gone.

 

Because you are fighting too many battles on too many fronts and caring for younguns and a baby to boot.

 

You are maxed to the MAX, and that is what comes across in your posts.

 

As for the poster who said you have too much info? Impossible! Having too little info or a spouse who trickle truths is the death knell for most reconciliations. Imagination is ten times worth than the truth.

 

It is what you do not know, what is omitted or denied or lied about, or minimized, that kills more reconciliations than the actual affair.

 

Truth, while painful, is eventually what will set you free.

[carrie999]

Did he force you to have an affair? If not then why should he have kind thoughts for the person who helped him hurt his wifIe and his marriage? I do not know why OW expect to be thought of kindly by the MM if he goes back to his wife. It isn't possible to do that and be reconciling with her. To think of you as anything other than a broken or selfish person like himself at the time would be betraying her all over again.

 

As for consequences of course he should have them and so should you. And 15 months is nothing. It can take 2-5 years to heal from an affair and I'd a WS is truly remorseful they may never forgive themselves.

 

FWIW it sounds like he was reopening the door to you and if I were his wife I'd want to know. Bastard. You'd both be well rid of him.

 

Wow! You don't sound at all bitter. I only stop in occasionally, and it both amuses and saddens me how many betrayed spouses come here to vent. Let's make one thing very clear: if you want to make a difference in this world, you're not doing so here. Go volunteer at a hospital or a soup kitchen. If you want to lecture about ethics, go back and get your PhD and teach.

 

And if you're still unhappy in your marriage, get counseling, and post on the board that is intended for people in your situation. Your words here have no bearing other than to incite arguments unnecessarily.

[Spark1111]

BW, based on your posts here and in other threads, I looks to me like your H did you a HUGE disservice by telling you all the intimate details of his sexual relationship with his OW. I know you see it as his attempt to be transparent and demonstrate his remorse, but I think, in your case, this full-disclosure is causing you immense pain and hinders your recovery.

 

I'm not saying that your H shouldn't have told you everything that you wanted to know. That is between you and him. He should have done whatever you have asked him to do. My point is, that maybe, just maybe, your desire to know all the details, is now back-firing, with the mind-movies, and your reluctance to performed serious sexual acts, that you have enjoyed, and were actually your only means of achieving climax. I also suspect that your H told you these CERTAIN details, about this specific act, as he KNEW it would be especially painful for you to handle, and that you will decline this specific sexual act from then on. Maybe this was his way of avoiding performing this act with you? Something to think about, no?

 

There is no doubt in my mind that your H would tell you anything he knows you WANT to hear. And I'm sure he is aware of your insecurities. So it's no wonder that he is telling you negative or intimate stuff about his OW, real or made-up. I'm sure he discovered that this would pacify you the most, and he is happily obliging you and providing whatever information, real or not, about OW, to make you happy. I can totally see a WS, wanting to "just make it all go away" saying and doing anything and everything to appease the BS. Just be aware that not everything he tells you is the total truth. He did lie and deceive you for a while, right? So maybe he isn't completely truthful about the details regarding his OW? Just sayin'.

 

You are giving your H's OW so much head space. Why would you do that? Being angry at her will get you nowhere. If she knew about this rage in you, and how deep an effect she has on you, she would be THRILLED to have this much agency over you. Why would you give her this power?

 

It saddens me that you are so wrapped up in your pain and hatred towards your H's OW, that you don't have any leftover energy to devote to re-establishing complete intimacy with your H. I would think that it would be a much more productive manner for you to heal.

 

About the bolded: What makes you think after dday, we would believe anything our WS told us?

 

Do you think, after all the lying and sneaking and deception, we would believe him if he said the sky was blue? I'd have to go outside

and stare at the sky for awhile AND still may doubt him.

 

So if he risks his marriage, his legacy, his children's admiration, his reputation to have an affair with a woman, and then tries to convince us he had no feelings for her, we would believe him????

 

This is a myth perpetuated by OW/OM who NEED to believe this is true.

 

It is not.

 

In most cases, NOTHING pacifies a BS but the absolute truth.

 

We do not need you thrown under the bus by our spouse to feel better about ourselves or the marriage. In fact, the more intelligent among us find it ludicrous when the WS spouse tries to do it. It is obviously self-serving and cowardly and we see right through it.

 

We just need the truth.

 

And we hope it leads our spouse to this: The OP was no friend to the marriage. So, if you value the marriage, the OP was no true friend to you or me or the marriage.

 

We will try to sort out the rest. We are smart enough to do so.

 

We do not need you demeaned to feel less pain. We have enough to deal with, and most I know would not respect a spouse who tried to do this after an affair where they deceived us, to now try and curry approval with us.

 

This attempt to divert blame from themselves would be pathetic.

 

And BSs, as a group, are not so stupid as to not realize this truth.

 

No matter what your xMM or MW tells you, or what you assume.

[Angelina527]

Wow! You don't sound at all bitter. I only stop in occasionally, and it both amuses and saddens me how many betrayed spouses come here to vent. Let's make one thing very clear: if you want to make a difference in this world, you're not doing so here. Go volunteer at a hospital or a soup kitchen. If you want to lecture about ethics, go back and get your PhD and teach.

 

And if you're still unhappy in your marriage, get counseling, and post on the board that is intended for people in your situation. Your words here have no bearing other than to incite arguments unnecessarily.

 

 

I would say she has every right to be bitter...she is obviously in pain, so no need to add to it with your callous disregard for the agony a BS feels.

[Gentlegirl2]

Orchid,

I do remember you from a long time ago.

 

I met xMM because I felt after a 3 year relationship, I wanted to end it finally with civilty, not the angry words that went before. I am an oldie and while I use technology, I prefer a face to face communication.

 

When I saw him.. wondered why I put myself through all that crap. It was like meeting up with a person I knew years ago. I only had a vague feeling of knowing him . I didn't feel any contempt for him. I probably didn't feel anything much at all.

 

Yeah.. Spark and anybody else can hold me accountable here. That's what we do for each other.

 

I did really BAD and I admit it. I never knew or saw the lady xMM is married to but I just know I would not like 3 years of my life to be a secret to me. The past is often illuminated by the present.

 

Nice to hear from you again Orchid.

 

GG

[redcurls]

There are enough assumptions going on from both sides.

 

For example:

 

BS thinks that OW always wants to take her place and "have their lives." Well, not really. I certainly wouldn't want a life with a man, who, although quite seem contrite and remorseful (AFTER D-day) was capable of essentially living a double life, regardless of how dense the "FOG" was. Why would I want to be going from day to day, thinking that all is well in my world, thinking that "we are the couple to be envied" etc., only to find out that it was all a lie? Why would I want to look back at every photo, every anniversary card, every family vacation, every holiday, and think that he must have been there in body, but who knows where was his heart? So, thank you, but, no. I want MY life.

 

Or:

 

BS thinks that OW perceive them to be controlling mean bitches, who runs their H's lives. Quite untrue. I actually think that your husbands are EXTREMELY lucky to have wives who are kind enough to forgive their affairs, work really hard at reconciling, continue to excuse their bad behaviors, and essentially accept them for who they are, faults and all. I applaud intelligent wives, who, inspite all evidence pointing to the contrary, chose to stay with a man who lied, cheated, was intimate on many levels with ANOTHER WOMAN for a long period of time, took time and energy (and often money) away from his family. I, for instance, wouldn't put up with any of it. I'm actually quite a mean bitch myself. I would never be able to be this kind, forgiving and understanding. I would haul my husband's cheating a$$ to the nearest cleaners, where I will make sure that I'm well compensated for the pain and devastation he inflicted on me and my kids. But, again, that's just me. My hat's off for all you be BS who are choosing to stay married to a verified cheater. I could never aspire to achieve your gracefulness.

 

Another example:

 

BS thinks that now, when she has full access to her husband's email and phone, when she installed a VAR and camera in his car, and she shoved a GPS up her husband's a$$, she KNOWS exactly, without any doubt whatsoever, that he is faithful and is ACTIVELY re-building their marriage. BUT - can BS monitor her husband's MIND? Can she control his HEART? Can she stop him from WISHING that things were different? Can she stop him from fantasize about OW (and the "horrible and boring" sexual acts they performed together.) Can BS stop her husband from FEELING? Well, maybe the husband never thinks fondly on OW, and all that they shared. Maybe he never uses OW's image and their shared experiences while he is, um, pleasuring himself, or HIS wife. But maybe he DOES?

 

I could find many more examples of assumptions by BS, and I'm sure the reverse can be done just as successfully. But does it really matter? In cases where husbands chooses to stay with their wives - the wives really WON. Right? He is the PRIZE and she was more worthy of his love. Right? A man, who cheated, had an intimate, romantic, sexual, emotional relationship with ANOTHER WOMAN is a PRIZE. He makes his wife feel WORTHY because he CHOSE her. Does BS really measure her self-worth by the decision of a CHEATING husband to stay with her?

[bentnotbroken]

There are enough assumptions going on from both sides.

 

For example:

 

BS thinks that OW always wants to take her place and "have their lives." Well, not really. I certainly wouldn't want a life with a man, who, although quite seem contrite and remorseful (AFTER D-day) was capable of essentially living a double life, regardless of how dense the "FOG" was. Why would I want to be going from day to day, thinking that all is well in my world, thinking that "we are the couple to be envied" etc., only to find out that it was all a lie? Why would I want to look back at every photo, every anniversary card, every family vacation, every holiday, and think that he must have been there in body, but who knows where was his heart? So, thank you, but, no. I want MY life.

 

Or:

 

BS thinks that OW perceive them to be controlling mean bitches, who runs their H's lives. Quite untrue. I actually think that your husbands are EXTREMELY lucky to have wives who are kind enough to forgive their affairs, work really hard at reconciling, continue to excuse their bad behaviors, and essentially accept them for who they are, faults and all. I applaud intelligent wives, who, inspite all evidence pointing to the contrary, chose to stay with a man who lied, cheated, was intimate on many levels with ANOTHER WOMAN for a long period of time, took time and energy (and often money) away from his family. I, for instance, wouldn't put up with any of it. I'm actually quite a mean bitch myself. I would never be able to be this kind, forgiving and understanding. I would haul my husband's cheating a$$ to the nearest cleaners, where I will make sure that I'm well compensated for the pain and devastation he inflicted on me and my kids. But, again, that's just me. My hat's off for all you be BS who are choosing to stay married to a verified cheater. I could never aspire to achieve your gracefulness.

 

Another example:

 

BS thinks that now, when she has full access to her husband's email and phone, when she installed a VAR and camera in his car, and she shoved a GPS up her husband's a$$, she KNOWS exactly, without any doubt whatsoever, that he is faithful and is ACTIVELY re-building their marriage. BUT - can BS monitor her husband's MIND? Can she control his HEART? Can she stop him from WISHING that things were different? Can she stop him from fantasize about OW (and the "horrible and boring" sexual acts they performed together.) Can BS stop her husband from FEELING? Well, maybe the husband never thinks fondly on OW, and all that they shared. Maybe he never uses OW's image and their shared experiences while he is, um, pleasuring himself, or HIS wife. But maybe he DOES?

 

I could find many more examples of assumptions by BS, and I'm sure the reverse can be done just as successfully. But does it really matter? In cases where husbands chooses to stay with their wives - the wives really WON. Right? He is the PRIZE and she was more worthy of his love. Right? A man, who cheated, had an intimate, romantic, sexual, emotional relationship with ANOTHER WOMAN is a PRIZE. He makes his wife feel WORTHY because he CHOSE her. Does BS really measure her self-worth by the decision of a CHEATING husband to stay with her?

 

 

I would say no more than the OW.

[bentnotbroken]

GG, I don't remember all of your story but I remember your name. I am glad you felt that you were over it all after the meeting. Maybe you weren't sure beforehand. But I understand why you went to meet him.

 

I met up with a former partner once (after I had had another two year relationship in between). I had been devastated when this first relationship ended. I was single again two years later and former partner called to invite me to meet him for drinks. I was curious to know how I would feel upon seeing him again. I actually found I did not feel anywhere near as interested as I thought I might, and I could not wait to make my excuses and get away. I found I held him in contempt more than anything. I was glad of the experience of spending that time with him, however, because it laid it all to rest, as the previous time I had seen him (2 years prior) I still had feelings for him and seeing him again made me realise the feelings were gone.

 

I see there are still numerous good bits of advice on here interspersed with comments from the BS brigade who are ready to pounce on AP's or former AP's... despite the fact you are no longer in an affair GG. And it is SO true. Why do the OW get all the stick? The man was willing to get involved behind his wife's back with another woman (and most likely he pursued ardently) and I will never understand these pathetic women who fail to put the blame where it should be, only on her husband. He is the only one who is answerable to her and who promised to her that he would forsake all others. And I have been in an affair and I have been betrayed so I speak with experience of both.

 

 

Unless I missed something, Mr. Messy didn't screw himself. He screwed a woman who knew he was married. That says to me she is 50% responsible for his family's betrayal and 100% responsible for her actions, same as him. Pathetic to me is someone willing to slid into a family and then think the stench of the mess should not stick to them. Just sayin.

[bentnotbroken]

BW, based on your posts here and in other threads, I looks to me like your H did you a HUGE disservice by telling you all the intimate details of his sexual relationship with his OW. I know you see it as his attempt to be transparent and demonstrate his remorse, but I think, in your case, this full-disclosure is causing you immense pain and hinders your recovery.

 

I'm not saying that your H shouldn't have told you everything that you wanted to know. That is between you and him. He should have done whatever you have asked him to do. My point is, that maybe, just maybe, your desire to know all the details, is now back-firing, with the mind-movies, and your reluctance to performed serious sexual acts, that you have enjoyed, and were actually your only means of achieving climax. I also suspect that your H told you these CERTAIN details, about this specific act, as he KNEW it would be especially painful for you to handle, and that you will decline this specific sexual act from then on. Maybe this was his way of avoiding performing this act with you? Something to think about, no?

 

There is no doubt in my mind that your H would tell you anything he knows you WANT to hear. And I'm sure he is aware of your insecurities. So it's no wonder that he is telling you negative or intimate stuff about his OW, real or made-up. I'm sure he discovered that this would pacify you the most, and he is happily obliging you and providing whatever information, real or not, about OW, to make you happy. I can totally see a WS, wanting to "just make it all go away" saying and doing anything and everything to appease the BS. Just be aware that not everything he tells you is the total truth. He did lie and deceive you for a while, right? So maybe he isn't completely truthful about the details regarding his OW? Just sayin'.

 

You are giving your H's OW so much head space. Why would you do that? Being angry at her will get you nowhere. If she knew about this rage in you, and how deep an effect she has on you, she would be THRILLED to have this much agency over you. Why would you give her this power?

 

It saddens me that you are so wrapped up in your pain and hatred towards your H's OW, that you don't have any leftover energy to devote to re-establishing complete intimacy with your H. I would think that it would be a much more productive manner for you to heal.

 

 

You have no clue what it takes for her to heal. I needed every detail so that my mind movies would stop. I have a very vivid imagination. So sadden as you might be pain is part of being betrayed. And unfortunately so is hatred for awhile. You have no clue what her energy level is or where she might be devoting that energy. Productive for you isn't necessarily productive for the next person.

[redcurls]

I would say no more than the OW.

 

 

My self-worth comes from within - I would never measure MY worthiness against the actions of another person. My friends, family, co-workers, AND MM are who THEY are. They actions are THEIRS alone. None of them influences my OWN WORTHINESS.

[bentnotbroken]

My self-worth comes from within - I would never measure MY worthiness against the actions of another person. My friends, family, co-workers, AND MM are who THEY are. They actions are THEIRS alone. None of them influences my OWN WORTHINESS.

 

 

As do many BS. We are in agreement.

[bentnotbroken]

Wow! You don't sound at all bitter. I only stop in occasionally, and it both amuses and saddens me how many betrayed spouses come here to vent. Let's make one thing very clear: if you want to make a difference in this world, you're not doing so here. Go volunteer at a hospital or a soup kitchen. If you want to lecture about ethics, go back and get your PhD and teach.

 

And if you're still unhappy in your marriage, get counseling, and post on the board that is intended for people in your situation. Your words here have no bearing other than to incite arguments unnecessarily.

 

 

Then it sounds as if she is in good company with this post.

[Angelina527]

There are enough assumptions going on from both sides.

 

For example:

 

BS thinks that OW always wants to take her place and "have their lives." Well, not really. I certainly wouldn't want a life with a man, who, although quite seem contrite and remorseful (AFTER D-day) was capable of essentially living a double life, regardless of how dense the "FOG" was. Why would I want to be going from day to day, thinking that all is well in my world, thinking that "we are the couple to be envied" etc., only to find out that it was all a lie? Why would I want to look back at every photo, every anniversary card, every family vacation, every holiday, and think that he must have been there in body, but who knows where was his heart? So, thank you, but, no. I want MY life.

 

Or:

 

BS thinks that OW perceive them to be controlling mean bitches, who runs their H's lives. Quite untrue. I actually think that your husbands are EXTREMELY lucky to have wives who are kind enough to forgive their affairs, work really hard at reconciling, continue to excuse their bad behaviors, and essentially accept them for who they are, faults and all. I applaud intelligent wives, who, inspite all evidence pointing to the contrary, chose to stay with a man who lied, cheated, was intimate on many levels with ANOTHER WOMAN for a long period of time, took time and energy (and often money) away from his family. I, for instance, wouldn't put up with any of it. I'm actually quite a mean bitch myself. I would never be able to be this kind, forgiving and understanding. I would haul my husband's cheating a$$ to the nearest cleaners, where I will make sure that I'm well compensated for the pain and devastation he inflicted on me and my kids. But, again, that's just me. My hat's off for all you be BS who are choosing to stay married to a verified cheater. I could never aspire to achieve your gracefulness.

 

Another example:

 

BS thinks that now, when she has full access to her husband's email and phone, when she installed a VAR and camera in his car, and she shoved a GPS up her husband's a$$, she KNOWS exactly, without any doubt whatsoever, that he is faithful and is ACTIVELY re-building their marriage. BUT - can BS monitor her husband's MIND? Can she control his HEART? Can she stop him from WISHING that things were different? Can she stop him from fantasize about OW (and the "horrible and boring" sexual acts they performed together.) Can BS stop her husband from FEELING? Well, maybe the husband never thinks fondly on OW, and all that they shared. Maybe he never uses OW's image and their shared experiences while he is, um, pleasuring himself, or HIS wife. But maybe he DOES?

 

I could find many more examples of assumptions by BS, and I'm sure the reverse can be done just as successfully. But does it really matter? In cases where husbands chooses to stay with their wives - the wives really WON. Right? He is the PRIZE and she was more worthy of his love. Right? A man, who cheated, had an intimate, romantic, sexual, emotional relationship with ANOTHER WOMAN is a PRIZE. He makes his wife feel WORTHY because he CHOSE her. Does BS really measure her self-worth by the decision of a CHEATING husband to stay with her?

 

[redcurls]

As do many BS. We are in agreement.

 

 

Of course.

 

When BS walks around all smug and victorious because her husband chose to stay married to her - that's because she doesn't measure her self-worth by HIS decision to PICK her.

[bentnotbroken]

Of course.

 

When BS walks around all smug and victorious because her husband chose to stay married to her - that's because she doesn't measure her self-worth by HIS decision to PICK her.

 

 

Some of us walk around smug and victorious because her husband was served with divorce papers even though he begged to stay. I would think some OW are walking around all smug like because he chose her. What would you call her and her self worth......?

[redcurls]

Some of us walk around smug and victorious because her husband was served with divorce papers even though he begged to stay. I would think some OW are walking around all smug like because he chose her. What would you call her and her self worth......?

 

 

If OW measure her self-worth against the decisions of another person, regardless of who he chooses - I would pity her, just as I would pity a BS who does the same.