RedRobin Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 ...and like I said before... looks like we need new words for 'relationship' and 'commit'.
Mantis Toboggan Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 ...and like I said before... looks like we need new words for 'relationship' and 'commit'. A relationship is when you're seeing someone exclusively. Commitment is the act of being true to that person. However, a relationship is something that is built. No matter what the man or woman says, going on 3 dates with a person is not a relationship. Nor does it require a commitment. You don't look at a pile of wood and call it a house. You don't get to know someone on the very top level (aka 3 dates) and call it a commitment. It's built over time. Whether you want it to be that way or not. The REAL part of a relationship is built. Two desperate people who are lonely and in need of company don't just get to label their arrangement as a relationship because it suits them. Seems like some people here want the relationship more than they want the person. 1
Andy_K Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 Okay, another question for the multi-daters: As a non-multi-dater, who tends to date those of the same persuasion, I often find long-term compatibility goals are mentioned at least in passing at some point early in the dating process. By this I mean whether you eventually want to be married, have kids, emigrate, or whatever else. Questions about past experiences and personality traits also come up. Whilst this doesn't tell you if someone is right for you, it very effectively tells you if they aren't, so you can scratch them off and move on to someone else. I'm under the impression that a lot of the people who are into the multi-dating, are the same people who believe actually mentioning any of this stuff is 'way too serious/way too early', and instead won't cover those subjects until much later. Is this correct?
RedRobin Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 Okay, another question for the multi-daters: As a non-multi-dater, who tends to date those of the same persuasion, I often find long-term compatibility goals are mentioned at least in passing at some point early in the dating process. By this I mean whether you eventually want to be married, have kids, emigrate, or whatever else. Questions about past experiences and personality traits also come up. Whilst this doesn't tell you if someone is right for you, it very effectively tells you if they aren't, so you can scratch them off and move on to someone else. I'm under the impression that a lot of the people who are into the multi-dating, are the same people who believe actually mentioning any of this stuff is 'way too serious/way too early', and instead won't cover those subjects until much later. Is this correct? You know what... I hadn't thought of that. The last paragraph. Yea, that might explain part of the disconnect.
Jeremy87 Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 Until exclusivity is discussed you cannot monitor what he does with his free time and what he is doing with his personal life. That would make you a stalker. BULL CHAP BULL ****. stupid women like to call everybody stalkers. anying simple questions makes somebody a stalker? LOL
zengirl Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 So yes, I'm single because I enjoy being single. And because I want a good relationship. Not just any relationship. But if I'm going to label this woman as my girlfriend...if she's going to meet my family, my circle of friends, then it's going to be REAL. Along the way, I'm not leading these girls on. Right, that's akin to how I felt. Granted, I never was of the mindset where I'd date someone for a long time (over a month or whatnot) and keep dating them, despite not seeing myself in a relationship with them either. But unlike some LSers, if I thought a guy had any potential whatsoever, we generally (scheduling issues aside) scheduled our 2nd date on our 1st and it was for not long after, etc. In a month with hubby, we'd had something like 12 dates, and that includes a week I was out of town! I think when you really click with someone you stop seeing others organically because you want to see more and more of THAT person! However, I find many people who want exclusivity early on are too "busy" to make that time commitment as well -- they want the exclusivity, but the want to see you once a week or whatever; that seems weird to me. Quotes because I don't think they're truly THAT busy in many cases (some are, and perhaps they're just not in a good place to build that relationship the way I naturally would've) but rather just want to force dating situations and relationships with people they don't "really click" with. Maybe they've never really clicked with anyone and don't understand the difference! As a non-multi-dater, who tends to date those of the same persuasion, I often find long-term compatibility goals are mentioned at least in passing at some point early in the dating process. By this I mean whether you eventually want to be married, have kids, emigrate, or whatever else. Questions about past experiences and personality traits also come up. Whilst this doesn't tell you if someone is right for you, it very effectively tells you if they aren't, so you can scratch them off and move on to someone else. I'm under the impression that a lot of the people who are into the multi-dating, are the same people who believe actually mentioning any of this stuff is 'way too serious/way too early', and instead won't cover those subjects until much later. Is this correct? Not for me. I'm very big on sharing such things early on! And it was how I scratched many guys off, but (a) Many guys meet those basic criteria and (b) Many of the ones who don't will lie about it for awhile, either to me or themselves. I've not been afraid of scaring a man off by mentioning my priorities in a relationship for years and years, and I often caution not to worry about that stuff on here --- as people waste years in dead-end relationships because of the initial inclination to lie/fib/fudge/accommodate someone on those early dates.
Mantis Toboggan Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 Okay, another question for the multi-daters: As a non-multi-dater, who tends to date those of the same persuasion, I often find long-term compatibility goals are mentioned at least in passing at some point early in the dating process. By this I mean whether you eventually want to be married, have kids, emigrate, or whatever else. Questions about past experiences and personality traits also come up. Whilst this doesn't tell you if someone is right for you, it very effectively tells you if they aren't, so you can scratch them off and move on to someone else. Here's my perspective. How can you define your goals with the person before you know the person? You and Girl X go on a date. You and Girl X both agree that you're seeking a serious relationship. Does that mean that in 2 or 3 months, when you both realize that things aren't working, that you won't break up? Of course not. Well, that's the same thing that happens with me. Except that I don't call a relationship serious until it actually becomes serious. I'm not looking for a relationship title. I'm looking for a person. And when I find her, I will keep her. Until then, how can I define my relationships with a woman? How can I say "I don't know who the person is, but I want something serious with them." Trying to predetermine where your emotions will go seems like trying to control a river. Your emotions flow where they want to. So, if I sit down with a girl on Date#1, I say "I dont want anything serious." that seems absurd, because for all I know 3 months later I might really grow to like her. So if I tell someone before I get to know them that I'm categorizing them as "not serious", that seems a bit unfair doesn't it? I'm under the impression that a lot of the people who are into the multi-dating, are the same people who believe actually mentioning any of this stuff is 'way too serious/way too early', and instead won't cover those subjects until much later. Is this correct? Yeah. It's correct. We're talking about baby steps here. When you're first dating, it can't be about LONG TERM PARTNER. It's about having fun. Do I enjoy this person's company? Next thing you know, you want to see more of them. Even if you were dating other people, this person is slowly winning you over and you're finding that other options are seeing less of you. Like I said, I can't look at someone in the preliminary stages of getting to know them and put them into a category. If someone is worthy of my time, then they have something worthwhile about them. And whether that's just "dating" through the winter, or a 2 year relationship will unfold on its own. So, sure I can tell someone that I'm not looking for anything serious. But how am I supposed to know how I see this person.....before I actually SEE this person? 1
RedRobin Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 Here we go again... the word 'exclusivity' being thrown around by a multidater. You'd think someone was asking you to promise your first born child in exchange for a few dates or couple weeks of your focused attention. How about you just take more care in deciding who you go on dates with in the first place? Rather than waste people's time and money? I can understand now why men hate OLD too.
zengirl Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 Here we go again... the word 'exclusivity' being thrown around by a multidater. You'd think someone was asking you to promise your first born child in exchange for a few dates or couple weeks of your focused attention. How about you just take more care in deciding who you go on dates with in the first place? Rather than waste people's time and money? How can you take more care in the first place when you don't know the person? Why is it such a waste to you if dates don't go anywhere? Isn't it MORE of a waste if you were fixated on making it work with that person, rather than just seeing who they were and if you meshed? I'm so confused why the anger at people who choose to date differently than you, honestly. Exclusivity IS what you're asking people for. Their first born is not, no, nor is commitment necessarily, but exclusivity IS seeing just one person. It's the actual meaning of the word.
Mantis Toboggan Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 (edited) Here we go again... the word 'exclusivity' being thrown around by a multidater. You'd think someone was asking you to promise your first born child in exchange for a few dates or couple weeks of your focused attention. How about you just take more care in deciding who you go on dates with in the first place? Rather than waste people's time and money? I can understand now why men hate OLD too. Take more care in deciding on who I'm going on dates with.....BEFORE GOING ON DATES WITH THEM? You act as if a breakup or a bad date is a personal failure. Breaking up with a person who doesn't fit you is no more of a failure than Winter being the failure of Summer. It's natural to meet people, get to know them, and then determine that things won't work. It doesn't make you wrong or the other person. The whole process of dating is determining who fits your personality. And I cannot do that unless I'm dating the person. And yes, while figuring this out, it would be foolish of me to cut myself off from other options. How can I commit to a person before knowing the person I'm committing to? I mean, "focused attention"....I dont know how old you are, but I'm 30, and dating isn't THAT serious. My job which pays my rent gets focused attention. My friends and family, who I love, get my focused attention. I'm not "focusing" on someone when we're still at the stage where we could both walk away from each other without bothering to explain ourselves. Things get serious when they get serious. You can't FORCE seriousness upon the situaton. Edited March 23, 2012 by Mantis Toboggan
RedRobin Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 Here's my perspective. How can you define your goals with the person before you know the person? You and Girl X go on a date. You and Girl X both agree that you're seeking a serious relationship. Does that mean that in 2 or 3 months, when you both realize that things aren't working, that you won't break up? Of course not. Well, that's the same thing that happens with me. Except that I don't call a relationship serious until it actually becomes serious. I'm not looking for a relationship title. I'm looking for a person. And when I find her, I will keep her. Until then, how can I define my relationships with a woman? How can I say "I don't know who the person is, but I want something serious with them." Trying to predetermine where your emotions will go seems like trying to control a river. Your emotions flow where they want to. So, if I sit down with a girl on Date#1, I say "I dont want anything serious." that seems absurd, because for all I know 3 months later I might really grow to like her. So if I tell someone before I get to know them that I'm categorizing them as "not serious", that seems a bit unfair doesn't it? Yeah. It's correct. We're talking about baby steps here. When you're first dating, it can't be about LONG TERM PARTNER. It's about having fun. Do I enjoy this person's company? Next thing you know, you want to see more of them. Even if you were dating other people, this person is slowly winning you over and you're finding that other options are seeing less of you. Like I said, I can't look at someone in the preliminary stages of getting to know them and put them into a category. If someone is worthy of my time, then they have something worthwhile about them. And whether that's just "dating" through the winter, or a 2 year relationship will unfold on its own. So, sure I can tell someone that I'm not looking for anything serious. But how am I supposed to know how I see this person.....before I actually SEE this person? At what point in your interactions do you tell the women you meet that you are dating other women? Do you tell them right up front, or is it something you kind of hint around at? Do you tell them how many other women you are dating? Do you use condoms every time with every woman (don't fib now)? Have you done any of the behaviors I listed under the multidating behavior/tells? If so, how many? Better-dealing? How often do you cancel a date if your 'favorite' becomes available? How many times have you had sex with two different women you were seeing on the same day? How many times have you told a woman you were working late, or attending to a friend/family member when you really were out with a different woman instead? A few times? Most of the time?
RedRobin Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 How can you take more care in the first place when you don't know the person? Why is it such a waste to you if dates don't go anywhere? Isn't it MORE of a waste if you were fixated on making it work with that person, rather than just seeing who they were and if you meshed? I'm so confused why the anger at people who choose to date differently than you, honestly. Exclusivity IS what you're asking people for. Their first born is not, no, nor is commitment necessarily, but exclusivity IS seeing just one person. It's the actual meaning of the word. How can you get to know anyone while you are spending so much of your time dating others? How can you possibly avoid lying while juggling? I just don't get that.
RedRobin Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 Take more care in deciding on who I'm going on dates with.....BEFORE GOING ON DATES WITH THEM? You act as if a breakup or a bad date is a personal failure. Breaking up with a person who doesn't fit you is no more of a failure than Winter being the failure of Summer. It's natural to meet people, get to know them, and then determine that things won't work. It doesn't make you wrong or the other person. The whole process of dating is determining who fits your personality. And I cannot do that unless I'm dating the person. And yes, while figuring this out, it would be foolish of me to cut myself off from other options. How can I commit to a person before knowing the person I'm committing to? I mean, "focused attention"....I dont know how old you are, but I'm 30, and dating isn't THAT serious. My job which pays my rent gets focused attention. My friends and family, who I love, get my focused attention. I'm not "focusing" on someone when we're still at the stage where we could both walk away from each other without bothering to explain ourselves. Things get serious when they get serious. You can't FORCE seriousness upon the situaton. ok. I get it now. You don't know yourself. (lightbulb goes on over head)
sid3 Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 ok. I get it now. You don't know yourself. (lightbulb goes on over head) It sounds like he just has a different perspective on dating.
RedRobin Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 It sounds like he just has a different perspective on dating. ok, ok. I'll get off my soapbox.
Mantis Toboggan Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 ok. I get it now. You don't know yourself. (lightbulb goes on over head) Ugh. There's nothing else I can say. Yes, I am the evil of mankind and you are truth and justice.
RedRobin Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 Ugh. There's nothing else I can say. Yes, I am the evil of mankind and you are truth and justice. Cheer up. I never said you were evil. ...and, as much as I hate to admit it, I guess we all have our own truth. I'll leave justice to the powers-that-be.
zengirl Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 How can you get to know anyone while you are spending so much of your time dating others? Because I'm spending the same amount of my time dating someone (while dating others) that I would if not dating others. Until I know I like someone, I'm not going to hang out with them every day or even necessarily communicate with them every single day! That's always been true, whether I had multiple prospects at the time or just one. How can you possibly avoid lying while juggling? I just don't get that. If someone asked me if I was seeing others, I would ALWAYS have answered honestly and did the few times it came up. I think it's impolite to go on about it ("You know I had this great/horrible/whatever date with this other chap last night, we went to such-and-such" just seems an odd thing to bring up, just as I don't bring up exes on dates either), but I never hid it in any way. It doesn't really feel like juggling -- it just feels like socializing. I am VERY upfront. I will honestly state anything I think the other person would want/need to know about me very early on, and I will definitely answer anything they'd ask. If I had some reason to believe they thought we were exclusive when we weren't, I would correct them. But it's an odd assumption. It's like starting the car in "Drive."
RedRobin Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 But it's an odd assumption. It's like starting the car in "Drive." You've made it very clear how odd you think seeing one person at a time is, yes. To use your analogy, solo dating is checking out one car at a time. Not necessarily in "Drive".
zengirl Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 You've made it very clear how odd you think seeing one person at a time is, yes. To use your analogy, solo dating is checking out one car at a time. Not necessarily in "Drive". No. . . I don't think it's necessarily odd to happen to be seeing one person at a time (if no one else piques your interest) and I certainly don't think it's odd if you know and like the person. What I think is odd is expecting someone you don't know well to operate with dating exclusivity (seeing only you and not even considering other options) from Date #1.
RedRobin Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 (edited) No. . . I don't think it's necessarily odd to happen to be seeing one person at a time (if no one else piques your interest) and I certainly don't think it's odd if you know and like the person. What I think is odd is expecting someone you don't know well to operate with dating exclusivity (seeing only you and not even considering other options) from Date #1. You really are holding onto that word 'exclusivity' like a death grip. You use the word 'odd' alot. I get it. You think solo dating is odd and that spending a few weeks getting to know someone in the early stages without the distraction of a bevy of 'dates' is odd. Yes, I GOT IT. You know what I think is odd? People who leave the impression of being into you while they date other people... and expecting I'm going to trust them. Edited March 23, 2012 by RedRobin
zengirl Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 You really are holding onto that word 'exclusivity' like a death grip. You use the word 'odd' alot. I get it. You think solo dating is odd and that spending a few weeks getting to know someone in the early stages without the distraction of a bevy of 'dates' is odd. Yes, I GOT IT. Why do you feel the need to rephrase my statements to fit your worldview? (I also find that odd.) That's not what I actually said, at all. That's what you think "not multi-dating" means, but not what I think it means. I think precisely what I've said. Not what you said. I'm using the world exclusivity to mean what it means. If you insist people don't see others when they date you (or in your case, apparently, when they date anyone, as you clearly see other styles than your own as bad in a variety of ways you've stated), then how is that not exclusivity? At any rate, my way of dating worked for me. *shrugs* I doubt I'll need to date or multi-date or have The Talk again.
zengirl Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 You know what I think is odd? People who leave the impression of being into you while they date other people... and expecting I'm going to trust them. I never gave any "impressions." I acted how I wanted to act on the date, saw a guy again if I wanted to see him, and stopped seeing others if I figured I knew I saw him as a LT prospect. For me, knowing someone is a LT prospect has usually taken time. I'm not sure how you know that so early on and know the guy you went on a date with last night is a better LT prospect than the cute guy from your book club (or whatever) who just asked you out is.
RedRobin Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 Why do you feel the need to rephrase my statements to fit your worldview? (I also find that odd.) That's not what I actually said, at all. That's what you think "not multi-dating" means, but not what I think it means. I think precisely what I've said. Not what you said. I'm using the world exclusivity to mean what it means. If you insist people don't see others when they date you (or in your case, apparently, when they date anyone, as you clearly see other styles than your own as bad in a variety of ways you've stated), then how is that not exclusivity? At any rate, my way of dating worked for me. *shrugs* I doubt I'll need to date or multi-date or have The Talk again. Good. I hope you don't.
RedRobin Posted March 23, 2012 Posted March 23, 2012 I'm not sure how you know that so early on and know the guy you went on a date with last night is a better LT prospect than the cute guy from your book club (or whatever) who just asked you out is. Experience? Plus I don't need to pile up dates like a horshoe crab just to say I can.
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