norajane Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 If your man shared his thoughts and fears how would you react? Be honest. I welcome it. It helps me understand him better. And I like that he feels close enough to me that he is comfortable coming to me with it...it strengthens our bond.
Author Woggle Posted March 16, 2012 Author Posted March 16, 2012 One think I want to know is why is there such a gap between what women tell me and what men tell me? Men tell me all the time to never show weakness in front of a woman and in many cases they have the evidence to back it up.
Nightsky Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 One think I want to know is why is there such a gap between what women tell me and what men tell me? Men tell me all the time to never show weakness in front of a woman and in many cases they have the evidence to back it up. You already know the answer to this question. Look you can't go on what men or women say. You must think for yourself. Thing is with guys you'll be able to spot the BS easier and find common ground to relate to what they are saying. Hearing what women say helps to but just like with men you have to call BS on something and think for yourself. You need to trust yourself.
xxoo Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 (edited) If your man shared his thoughts and fears how would you react? Be honest. Here's the thing... You've admitted that you pull away and distance yourself sometimes. If she doesn't know why you do that, she'll fill in her own reason--possibly assuming some things that you wouldn't want her to assume. She may assume you are angry with her, or that you are bored with her, or that you don't love her as much. She may distance herself in response to those assumptions. Men do the same thing. They observe a behavior they don't understand, and they fill in the reason for that behavior based on their own perspective and experience. So, in your case, she may simply be relieved. Oh, okay, it's your issue. Thank god it isn't me. This I can handle. I agree that you don't need to dump the entirety of your issues on her. She is your partner, not your therapist. But she should have some idea of your history, and how it has affected you (she does know your history, doesn't she? ). She should be able to handle that. Edited March 16, 2012 by xxoo
Ruby Slippers Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 I am sick of trying to pretend to be something I am not just so she won't lose attraction. If she only loves you when you're pretending to be someone you're not, then she doesn't really love you. But you say she loved you even when you showed your vulnerabilities. So that suggests she loves you as you are. There is no better way to get past fears and hangups than exposing them to people who love you, and being accepted and loved in spite of your weaknesses. That's what real love is. So, as I see it, if you don't show your wife who you really are, you're inhibiting her ability to fully love you, and compromising the relationship. You don't have to turn into a helpless pile of tears when you reveal your weak points. You can simply express them, then let the healing begin.
donnamaybe Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 One think I want to know is why is there such a gap between what women tell me and what men tell me? Men tell me all the time to never show weakness in front of a woman and in many cases they have the evidence to back it up. What evidence? The stories of some guys? Maybe they had hideous creatures like your ex for girlfriends. Or it could be that some know only "whiney bytche" behavior or "macho A-hole" and have no idea how to just act frickin' normal and immediately run off any sane woman. Do the ones agreeing with you on this forum even have girlfriends?
Author Woggle Posted March 16, 2012 Author Posted March 16, 2012 What evidence? The stories of some guys? Maybe they had hideous creatures like your ex for girlfriends. Or it could be that some know only "whiney bytche" behavior or "macho A-hole" and have no idea how to just act frickin' normal and immediately run off any sane woman. Do the ones agreeing with you on this forum even have girlfriends? I know my father got crap all the time for not acting like man. Maybe I am just letting their stories scare me.
Duckduckgoose Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 My exH was open and showed me vulnerabilities. Honestly it brought out the nurturing part of me. It made me appreciate him more. My boyfriend now isn't so good with showing emotions. Maybe it's just a waiting game.
norajane Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 I know my father got crap all the time for not acting like man. Maybe I am just letting their stories scare me. You aren't married to the insane woman that was your mother. You are married to your wife. Big difference. So stop treating your wife as though you are married to your mother. You don't have to guard yourself against your wife.
Untouchable_Fire Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 It all depends on the woman and the situation. When in doubt... just keep your emotions to yourself and pretend to be happy. That nearly always produces good outcomes. Find another outlet for those emotions. You ask a question like this and most women instantly imagine a guy they love being sweet, romantic and emotionally open with them... and they like that fantasy. So... take the answers they give you here with a grain of salt. I've dated women that loved to be nurturing... they take care of you when your feeling down. It's better to be more open with them... just make sure not to go crazy with it. I have also dated two women who were like sharks and emotional vulnerability is blood in the water to them. I think both had a strong tendency to be control freaks if that helps. So... you have to figure out what kind of woman you are dealing with. How do you think she would react?
SJC2008 Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 I wouldn't want to cry in front of my wife/gf if I had one but I would want to know I could if I did. I've cried 4x since I was 16. Once at 16 when I had a horrible argument with my dad and twice when he died at 20. And once when my sister was in the hospital at 18. Any women who has a problem with a man crying once in a blue moon is a cold bitch. Emotional support is paramount in any r. I'm not saying it's ok for a man to be alice in wonderland but SOME times is ok like in sits I've been in. 1
threebyfate Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 Oh sure, women hate it when men are vulnerable. That's why I stayed with my husband after he cried when our son was born and why I stayed with him after he broke down in therapy, after the miscarriage. Stop insulting us anymore Woggle. So sick of your crap. Women have pandered to your mood for years on this site. And the insults never stop. Grow up.
Author Woggle Posted March 16, 2012 Author Posted March 16, 2012 Oh sure, women hate it when men are vulnerable. That's why I stayed with my husband after he cried when our son was born and why I stayed with him after he broke down in therapy, after the miscarriage. Stop insulting us anymore Woggle. So sick of your crap. Women have pandered to your mood for years on this site. And the insults never stop. Grow up. I am trying to get past this and that is why I am asking this question. Maybe you stayed with your husband but I have seen enough real life examples to know I am not just being paranoid. I am not trying to insult you.
Emilia Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 I know my father got crap all the time for not acting like man. Maybe I am just letting their stories scare me. Did he get crap from men or women?
Author Woggle Posted March 16, 2012 Author Posted March 16, 2012 Did he get crap from men or women? My mother. He was never allowed to show the slightest of being anything other than an alpha male or he would have hell to pay. Somebody described it as a shark smelling blood and that is what it was.
anne1707 Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 I am trying to get past this and that is why I am asking this question. Maybe you stayed with your husband but I have seen enough real life examples to know I am not just being paranoid. I am not trying to insult you. Woggle Everytime you start one of these threads, you are insulting most, if not all, women. Sure there are some women who are to be avoided and will do some of the things you complain of. But the majority won't. Here in this thread, woman after woman has posted to say they love it when their man opens up to them, that they appreciate that trust and that they love their man for it. Yet you still continue to believe that women are b*tches and will laugh with their female friends about how pathetic men are. You insult us when you start these threads. You insult us further when you don't believe our responses. You insult us when you use posts from an absolute minority of posters as "evidence" that you are right to have your views. You insult us when you concede that there are (only) a few good women on this site. You insult us when you say "ah well I don't mean you of course" to one poster but still leave the rest of women as no better than pondlife in your view. Apart from obvious trolls and some repeatedly bitter posters, I find your threads to be some of the most offensive on this site. You show complete disdain for one gender. You are doing to women what you constantly accuse women of doing to men. I think I can probably speak for plenty of others on this site - both men and women - when I say that I am tired of this. Your thread is about whether you should open up to your wife. I think you should. It will then allow her to decide whether she wants to stay married to someone who shows no respect for her gender and who is constantly judging others in such an extremely negative way.
Author Woggle Posted March 16, 2012 Author Posted March 16, 2012 I start these threads because I want to get past this. I praise the women on here all the time who do try to help me. I am always speaking positively about Donnamaybe so why am I always accused of insulting all women?
Emilia Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 My mother. He was never allowed to show the slightest of being anything other than an alpha male or he would have hell to pay. Somebody described it as a shark smelling blood and that is what it was. You don't think that perhaps that had more to do with your parents struggling in a marriage and not loving eachother anymore? I was married for 9 years and I am divorced now. The fights I had with my ex husband were always related to eachothers perceived weaknesses as unfortunately you can really hurt someone when you know them well. I don't behave like that anymore and he acknowledged years later as well that we both went too far in our marriage. But for original topic of showing vulnerability as a man: I think it depends on how you handle your perceived weaknesses. There are certain things that are hard to handle in anyone regardless of gender: some people really let themselves go and become emotionally high maintenance, need constant reassurance and that's tiresome. When I'm showing upset or vulnerability over an issue I usually do so calmly and with as much perspective as possible. I find emotionally unstable or unpredictable people very difficult to deal with, they make me uneasy (that's probably true for most I'd imagine) regardless whether they are male or female. However if I see that they just wish to express how they feel while still being in control then that's something I welcome because I want to know when they feel upset over something. As a man yes you can cry and get upset and I'd rather my other half did that and I would feel horrified if he thought he wasn't comfortable enough with me to do so. But if you throw tantrums and lash out then that's a different ballgame entirely.
anne1707 Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 I start these threads because I want to get past this. I praise the women on here all the time who do try to help me. I am always speaking positively about Donnamaybe so why am I always accused of insulting all women? An example of what I meant - one woman only is seen as good (and she is) - but you leave the rest of us in the gutter. Do you not also realise that we are insulted not just for ourselves who post on here but for her friends and relatives who happen to be female and do not post on here. We are insulted for ALL women, including the ones who are not here trying to help you. 1
Taramere Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 Women how do you feel when a man is vulnerable and turns to you for emotional support? Does it make you closer or does it make you lose attraction to them? There's no fixed answer. I aim to manage my emotions without imposing on others for the majority of the time, and tend only to be emotional around other people if I've gauged that they want me to do so/are open to it. Or, on extremely rare occasions, if I feel so overcome by sad feelings that I simply must talk to somebody. I suppose I would expect the same from a man. That he'll have a variety of ways of managing emotions. That talking to me would be one of them, but not a method he would be exclusively dependent on. There has to be some level of vulnerability and humanness for you to feel connected to another person though, I think. 1
Author Woggle Posted March 16, 2012 Author Posted March 16, 2012 An example of what I meant - one woman only is seen as good (and she is) - but you leave the rest of us in the gutter. Do you not also realise that we are insulted not just for ourselves who post on here but for her friends and relatives who happen to be female and do not post on here. We are insulted for ALL women, including the ones who are not here trying to help you. The thing is not all women are good and neither are all men. Calling out certain women does not mean I am insulting all of them.
anne1707 Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 Everybody here keeps telling me that I should open up to my wife and while I see what they are saying I see so many examples of how this backfires that I am scared to. I always makes sure I act like the strong alpha male around her because that is what women seem attracted to. I come on here to vent when I am feeling down or I am sometimes talk to my friends but I never turn to her for emotional support because I don't want her to lose attraction. I even hide when I am not feeling good. Am I doing this wrong? Believe I am even afraid of opening up around women in group therapy because I am afraid they will laugh at me like my ex did when I cried at my friend's funeral. Women how do you feel when a man is vulnerable and turns to you for emotional support? Does it make you closer or does it make you lose attraction to them? She is a very caring person and in the beginning I was never afraid to show that side of me but then I see what happens to men who do show that side and I hear how many other men tell me never to let a woman see you as weak and I changed it up. I am sick of trying to pretend to be something I am not just so she won't lose attraction. I hate to say this but there is a big gap between what women say and what women do and when most men tell me I am right I tend to believe it. One think I want to know is why is there such a gap between what women tell me and what men tell me? Men tell me all the time to never show weakness in front of a woman and in many cases they have the evidence to back it up. I am trying to get past this and that is why I am asking this question. Maybe you stayed with your husband but I have seen enough real life examples to know I am not just being paranoid. I am not trying to insult you. The thing is not all women are good and neither are all men. Calling out certain women does not mean I am insulting all of them. But Woggle you are not calling out certain women, you are calling out all women apart from an absolute handful who you specify. That is extremely insulting.
Taramere Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 But Woggle you are not calling out certain women, you are calling out all women apart from an absolute handful who you specify. That is extremely insulting. I'm not sure whether the issue here is that Woggle finds women generally unsympathetic (a perception that merits challenge in view of the amount of time and empathic support he has received from various women on here over the years) or if he feels oppressed by stereotypical expectations of men (big boys don't cry etc). It seems to be a common belief among men who have a marked distrust of women that we aim to make them vulnerable with a view to exploiting or controlling them. It's the trust v mistrust dilemma that faces everybody in early childhood, and particularly Woggle on account of him not negotiating it successfully...not through fault of his own, but on account of poor parenting, exacerbated by a disastrous first marriage. Now, as an adult, he's still struggling with it - and probably always will. Is that something that we, as women, need to feel insulted by? I don't think so. Poor Woggle...it's his issue, and one that will almost certainly plague him for the rest of his life. None of us can wave a magic wand and make it go away. Nor can his wife. The question is whether it will destroy his marriage. It needn't, if his wife simply accepts him as he is - trust dilemmas and all. From what he's said on this board, she appears to...so presumably from her perspective the good in Woggle outweighs the problems presented by his trust issues.
anne1707 Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 Is that something that we, as women, need to feel insulted by? I don't think so. Poor Woggle...it's his issue, and one that will almost certainly plague him for the rest of his life. None of us can wave a magic wand and make it go away. Nor can his wife. In the sense that I feel his posts are insulting when I read them yet when away from them, they mean nothing to me then yes it is definitley his problem. He is the one whose life is being derailed by these thoughts. The question is whether it will destroy his marriage. It needn't, if his wife simply accepts him as he is - trust dilemmas and all. From what he's said on this board, she appears to...so presumably from her perspective the good in Woggle outweighs the problems presented by his trust issues. She certainly seems to accept what she knows about Woggle. But he has also said that he has not told her many of these thoughts he has - he is hiding his lack of trust from her.
Emilia Posted March 16, 2012 Posted March 16, 2012 I'm not sure whether the issue here is that Woggle finds women generally unsympathetic (a perception that merits challenge in view of the amount of time and empathic support he has received from various women on here over the years) or if he feels oppressed by stereotypical expectations of men (big boys don't cry etc). It seems to be a common belief among men who have a marked distrust of women that we aim to make them vulnerable with a view to exploiting or controlling them. It's the trust v mistrust dilemma that faces everybody in early childhood, and particularly Woggle on account of him not negotiating it successfully...not through fault of his own, but on account of poor parenting, exacerbated by a disastrous first marriage. Now, as an adult, he's still struggling with it - and probably always will. Is that something that we, as women, need to feel insulted by? I don't think so. Poor Woggle...it's his issue, and one that will almost certainly plague him for the rest of his life. None of us can wave a magic wand and make it go away. Nor can his wife. The question is whether it will destroy his marriage. It needn't, if his wife simply accepts him as he is - trust dilemmas and all. From what he's said on this board, she appears to...so presumably from her perspective the good in Woggle outweighs the problems presented by his trust issues. Spot on as usual 1
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