dribliz Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 Well my ex showed up to my graduation. He brought me 20 roses and a beautiful card. I choose to give him some time after but still stood my ground as far as where I was. He took it well and told me he would give me whatever space I needed and just hoped that in the end my happiness ended up involving him. To me that is wonderful for him just to be more concerned about my happiness instead of worrying about just what he wanted is exactly what i need to see. Sid you are doing the right thing and I 'm glad you finally are getting the big picture. Even if your ex goes out and dates or whatever she may even have a relationship or whatever but she still knows you, knows how much you care and knows what you have to offer. She will be thinking and she will remember and know. She will compare in her own mind and that is where she will find her answers. Example.....my ex. I compare how sweet and thoughtful he is and look at things all the time. But I wouldn't be able to even notice those things if he was around buggin me all the time. He is making the best choice. For both of us. Keep talking to me and others on here. Find your strength. Go out. Do stuff. Seeing the confidence to move on and survive is a turn on as well. When you come across as desperate it's a negative look. Good luck! leaving people alone really works. at the end of the day, we must all get over our fears of losing them just cause we aren't in contact with them. we must recongnize the power of what it means to grip our balls. SO TRUE!!!!! If you love them let them go!
dreamguy Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 Mad because you're writing here ? Are you crazy ? This is what forums are for. Keep posting and read our replies. It'll help you survive ! Think about it this way: If you call your ex then you're giving some of your pride in the hope of feeling better. Guess what, you're gonna give that pride for nothing cos you're gonna feel worse for having shown weakness and given them more power and control to tear you to pieces !! DON'T CALL OR TEXT OR EMAIL HIM, period !!
ntovrhm Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 If he wants to contact you he will, he wanted the space, so you have to give it too him. Maybe he is feeling bad and missing you, but maybe he isn't (not to be harsh, but there is no way you will know). What is he isn't missing you, than you texting him will just be an annoyance, or make you look weak . . which is EXACTLY WHAT YOU DON"T WANT TO DO!!!! It seems he had too much control in the realationship already, and that you were doing all the trying and changing. You contacting him will give that up to him again!!!!! That's definitely not what you want to get back into!
Kate Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 god i'm like an addict going for that drink!!! dreamguy -- i am a capricorn. so what does that mean i wonder? you guys are right, i am SO confused...and dreamguy you are inspiring ME not to call based on what you said about MY posts!! i am so missing him right now. i can only hope that he is feeling the same...i'm sure he is...i mean, i keep thinking about the facts: 1) he had a crush on me for a few years and would hang out as friends when he was w/ his ex 2) i helped him out a lot in talking to him about his last break up (i swear, i ONLY wanted to be his friend -- nothing more!! he fell out of love with his ex and i had been there once before so i know i helped him a lot and sounded so rational to him...maybe that will be my saving grace here!! he knows i can think rationally!!) 3) i gave him everything he needed, besides space when things got icky between us. i did everything for him, everything a guy would want a girl to do...and i always had my pride and dignity too...EXCEPT.... 4) when i got drunk we would fight....but 90% of our fights were only when i was drunk...because all of the repressed feelings of lonliness and bitterness came out as a result of his neglecting me emotionally, which he clearly admitted the last time we talked. he said he wasn't ready and wanted to be cause he liked me for so long...so at least it's not like our relationsihp "just didn't work out" on a day to day basis. it was a timing factor, which i guess is sorta an excuse, but... 5) i truly truly believe that he will not find a girl better suited for him or that he would want more than me: FUN, witty, outgoing, confident, smart, ambitious and dead sexy hot!! it's not like he's the only guy in the tri-state area pining over me...but unfortunately he's the only one i wanted!! and i don't know why! (he has a good heart and reminds me of my dad who i love to death!) so what do you guys think will happen if i don't contact him?? consider the fact that in the email i told him not to contact me unless he wanted a 50/50 relationship...and i told him even then, if /when he was ready that i may or may not be in that place....
dreamguy Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 "he never said, "i don't want to be with you anymore" or "this just won't work". it was the stupid "i needs space" -- and honestly, i thikn that is a crock of **** for people to say. what it really means is, "i need space and i'm not afraid of losing you cause you have always been there"." Wow !! Are you reading my mind or what ? This is unbelievable !! Exact same thing happened to me. Guess what, it has been 3 weeks and I haven't made any contact. I'm human and you're human too. You CAN DO IT ! Forget about his pride. Girl you are using your own mind against yourself !! This is no way to be acting smart !! It's all a mind game !! The more you make up ideas (which might be TOTALLY wrong) the faster you're gonna call. And even IF he was dating then 9 out of 10 times it would be a rebound !! She wouldn't even measure up to you and how you made him feel !!
ntovrhm Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 . . .that you were trying to lay it on the line, and take a risk that that would jar him into coming back to you at the risk that if he didn't, he would lose you. The truth is, what would you e-mail him? To say that you are NOT over him, and haven't closed out the possibilty of getting back with him. That you DON"T want a 50/50 relationship? That you want to be friends? (It's too soon for that). He knows what you want, and if and when he wants what you want, he will contact you. You run the risk that he may never contact you, but there are so many other fish in the sea, and want's you are ready, another will give that 50?50 realationship that you need.' It is just too soon!!!!!
Kate Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 i need to stand my ground. you guys are right -- i won't do it. i guess i'm just wanting to cause i don't know what is going on in his life and i was used to knowing... the first time he said he needed space (2times total) i totally gave it to him -- didn't call for 5 days, then my phone blew up twice with a call and another call and voicemail...followed by texts 2 days later...to "Talk about things" -- what that really meant was, "i want to know you still care". he hasn't done that this time, and it has been a week...maybe cause i asked him not to and he is respecting me? it could also be because he is feeling in a good place right now and wants the relatinship to work so he is working on himself. i have to stay positive here... you guys are so right, if i contact him he'll just see it as an annoyance regardless. if i just let it go, it could change his whole perspective. i have to imagine that since i haven't heard from him that means he is working really hard to decide how he will be in a relationship, what he needs to do, etc. when we were together and having issues after drunken fights i started he agreed to read mars and venus. i know the effort is buried deep down within him. so what is he god-like to me? it's something in his eyes, i guess, cause: 1) he is flat broke, 26 and lives with his mom 2) he is shy and doesn't go out of his way to socialize when i introduce him to new friends 3) he walks in front of me at times 4) he never chased me the way a man should 5) he never ever took me on dates -- 2 total, and they were barely dates 6) his friends are all in love with me...and he would always say he didn't understand how i was with him 7) he doesn't have prince charming looks, though he's handsome 8) he's not very ambitious about life in general and i worry i could be bored with him in the future **this is one thing that makes me think i'm better of w/out him... 9) he stayed in his last relationship for another 2 years cause he was afraid to break up with his first love...though he didn't even want to be physical with her...and i had to talk to him about it -- it is a weakness 10) he can be lazy and sometimes doesn't brush his teeth before bed or even after staying at my house the next morning. 11) he spills food all over the place when he eats and leaves it a lot of the time 12) he never gave me a card, note or a flower...or did anything special to let me know he cared.
ntovrhm Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 . . I am going through the same thing, but mine said that maybe sometime when he is back in the area (he is away for the next six months), HE will see how HE feels about me, and if HE feels the same like HE did when HE was with me before, maybe we get can back together. The arrogance of that statement still pisses me off . . . .
Kate Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 you are right -- he does know what i want, and by contacting him it's only letting him know i'm still waiting in the wings. they have to feel as though 1) you respect their space, 2) the may have made the biggest mistake of their lives cause you are gone -- by choice now! they didn't will you away, you WENT away!! i'm hoping my ex realizes both of these things, and since he knows what i want, either he is worth it and wants to be with me and fix himself, or he is lazy and i don't want him anyway!! either way, it should be a win-win, n'est pas?? Thanks, guys.
Kate Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 his name is not jorge by chance, is it? and screw his arrongant statement...that is REDICULOUS. like you don't deserve food or water or something!!! it's amazing how we can lower ourselves to get what we "want"!!! who wants that animalistic treatment!!?
ntovrhm Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 No problem! Hang in there, and if you don't mind me saying, it sounds like you can definitely do better . . . .
dreamguy Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 Kate, "FUN, witty, outgoing, confident, smart, ambitious and dead sexy hot!! it's not like he's the only guy in the tri-state area pining over me...but unfortunately he's the only one i wanted!! and i don't know why!" He's the only one you want because right now you're under the impression he doesn't want you. We all want what we cannot have. And even though all the men in the world would want you, you would only desire him (because you know he doesn't want you now, or he is faking it to fool you). Simple human logic. And as long as you show him you want him then you are not making this logic work for you ! Let him believe (and I mean really believe) you don't want him anymore and check out the results ! You already sent him a message saying you won't wait around. Stop contacting him and stick to your last message. Even if he's going out with another girl he would go head over heals to get back your attention. I'm a guy. And that's what I would do if my girl did that to me !! Check my signature... it says it all. People who know they are attractive usually cannot accept being dumped. And you know you're attractive (you said it). And he knows how the game works. He's playing it every second. Show him you know how the game works as well and strike back with confidence. Had you been the one who dumped him, I would tell you to try and call him. But he did it to you. Raise your shields and defend yourself !!
ntovrhm Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 Kate: LOL, no, not Jorge. I let things be about him for too long now, so I guess I shouldn't be surprised when he came off with that statement. Basically, he had trust issues, which I knew he had when he was here, and he still had when he went away, but I thought we were doing better. I NEVER cheated, and I bent over backwards (too much), to give him the reassurance that he needed, even when it went against my better judgment. I thought that once he saw me for who I was, that he not be scared about me being unfaithful. I was very open and honest with him, and it was those things against me as a way to justify his own insecurities. I know you can't change someone, but I thought this was a situational problem (because of a cheating ex who he really cared about), not a deeply ingrained problem.
Kate Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 i do like your quote at the end that you have, but i must say that i have never relied on good looks for anything...when i was younger, i was awkward and extremely shy...then i broke out of my shell and had to rely on my personality -- i felt it was all i had -- my looks came later and fortunately i have never ever ever relied upon them. my ex used to compliment me all the time, but i complimented him as well and i know he appreciated it. i ALWAYS made him feel like an eqaul as far as aesthetics are concerned!! maybe too much, though, cause he probably thinks he's God's gift now...but that's ok, looks are SO trivial...my confidence has always come from within (life experiences, etc.) but my LACK of confidence comes from being an oversensitive individual in general....but i suppose that what you said about being attractive is right, cause maybe my ex figures that every guy in the past pined over me so he wasn't going to -- but that's a load of crap cause you SHOULD pine and dote on someone if you love them for HOW THEY TREAT YOU -- NOT WHAT YOU LOOK LIKE!! that should just be the icing on the cake!! like all of the other colorful icings!! i am in no way shallow as a result of a good interior and so it is because of this i know that he little "plan" that you referred to will only come back to haunt him -- because i proved that i was nothing but nice, sweet, human and willing....all things of which he probably assumed i wasn't before we were dating... never judge a book by its cover! i think that my ex learned that and is probably trying to deal with having a girl who on the SURFACE appears to have everythng...but is also sweet and honest and willing beneath it all. he is going to seriously lose out, i can't even believe i was going to call him earlier. he is going to freak when he wakes up and realizes he wants me!
Kate Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 you guys are both so right. dreamguy, i love hearing a man's perspective. i guess i couldn't admit the fact that he IS playing a game!! it's insane, I NEVER suspected, and i'm not trying to sound sarcastic or naive. here's one thing i was thinking about: he is overwhelmed...he can't believe what he got when he got together with me...things were so amazing between us, not at all like he had before. he would let little comments slip like, "when we get married..." then he would realize how non-chalantly he said them...and one time i was saying how when i get pregnant later on (not with him, in general...) and i was saying something about my boobs and he was like "i can't wait" -- for what? for my husband to be with me or for him to? so just little things like that he would say. ANYWAY, my point is he was overwhelmed with his desire for things to work out for us. so he saw it coming and tried to pull back...and the more he did, the more i pushed...and it scared him, and it just became a rediculous cycle. cause if he really did see himself with me like he SAID, AND he just got out of a 4 year relationshp, that IS a lot to handle on the psyche. that would expalin him staying with me even when he wasn't ready -- he said last week after our first "time out" that he wished he had broken up with his ex much sooner in order to have that grace period that he needed in order to be ready for me. i know he wants to be with me, only now i'm so scared and unsure. every time he left me, didn't call me, etc., i thought it was the end end end...but i now realize that each time he DID come back (i shouldn't have made it so easy). why would he stop now? it's not like i did anything horrible to him etc. but you are right -- he is playing a game, maybe his own deck of cards because secretly i think that what he wants is to WANT me -- he wants to feel that burn. and to explain, HE broke up with his ex in december...a hard decision, it was his first love...but he had been out of love with her forever...so he had been really used to NOT WANTING SOMEONE, or A RELATIONSHIP. he knew the way he felt about me in the past, and knew he wanted me, but wasn't ready...but he wasn't ready / willing to gamble the risk of not having me at all if we didn't act on something. i would have much rather him have been honest in the beginning, but i thinnk that it does show how he wanted me all along but couldn't handle it. i will go one more week...i have an ex bf visiting in town (not staying w/me) this weekend. i know i will run into my recent ex...and the last thing i want to do is hurt him, but it can't totally hurt for him to SEE me with someone else...and this guy is totally into me....but he knows my situation, and in no way will i be flirting with him for my recent ex to see...that could damage things for good....i will know how to play it....but i do think that it will help clarify his feelings for me...i mean, if you broke up with your girl and saw her with another guy, it would totally clear things up about the way you feel!!! PLUS, my recent ex KNOWS i don't jump from one thing to the next...he would definitely know i am not sleeping with him or anything crazy. (i hope). but that doesn't matter...he needed time away from me....i can NOT feel guilty about hanging out with other guys...right????? i bet you can't wait for an update next monday!! cause i'll sure as hell have one.
Kate Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 ok so dreamguy is right about keeping my last contact just that -- or it will lose it's power and push. the last time i ever contacted him was one week ago, saying that i didn't want him to contact me until he knew what he wanted, and even though i hoped it was me, that i was moving on and maybe or maybe not we'd be in the same place when/if he returned. i gave him no guarentees, nothing. so let me really see what the results are....really let him believe i want nothing to do w/ him...that's kind of a sad way to drive results, though, isn't it?? he has to hurt bad enough to go for what he wants, though. i was really pissed off one time -- he did something ****ed up, and i didn't call him for 2 days...he called me twice only...and after we finally reconciled, i checked his phone...and at the end of the 2nd day, he was on the phone with a girl he dated in highschool for 20 minutes -- in a way this was really good...because it showed me how weak he was that he needed to call a girl to give him attention in order to feel better about things. is this normal? whenever i felt bad or that he was leaving me i'd call my guy friends just to "talk". i guarentee that if i leave him alone long enough that all of the "talking" in the world won't replace what he doesn't have -- ME.
Kate Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 this is the last part of a long email i sent him a week ago: "if you ever ever become clear and, as you put it, "feel rejuvenated", i hope you do find what it is you are looking for. if it is in fact me, may the force be with us. but i can't promise you i will be in that place as i am clearly removing myself from you after too much effort and too many failed attempts. you are a wonderful human being and i hope i was at least able to make a positive impact on your life one way or another. " is that vague yet strong enough??
ntovrhm Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 and convinces me more that you are doing the right thing by not contacting him . . .
Kate Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 how does it convince you i am doing the right thing by not contacting him? he said he felt drained...well what about ME!? the one who put in all of the effort? men can be so weak...and they NEVER know what they have till they lose it. SO STUPID. maybe the grass just looks greener right now cause i am all alone. i have no basis on which to judge him other than his actions with me -- which made no attempt to show me i was his girlfriend. what was he thinking, anyway? that i would just sit around and wait for him to be "ready"? this guy has some serious thinking to do. i can't WAIT to snap out of this and get something I REALLY deserve...then again, at the same stupid time, i can see how if i wasn't ready for something and someone else always beat me to the punch that i would pull away too...i can't crucify him for being honest...i just hope that this time apart helps. i sound shizophrenic right now i am so confused.
ntovrhm Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 the jumping around of emotions. And I think you should leave it be, because its sounds like you still left open the possibility for him to come back, but warned him that you weren't going to sit around and wait. What ever reasons he gave, whether they are true or not, it is something that he has to deal with . . .something that you cannot help him through. Once again, that your emotions are all over the place is just another reason not to try and contact him first. You sent him a logical, heartfelt e-mail. There is no reason to let him know how much you are hurting or confused right now. I don't believe in playing games, but I also don't believe (and maybe this is from just my situation, and not yours), that someone who hurt you is any longer entitled to have any more insight into your personal thoughts and emotions. You can be honest with someone, but until he contacts you and you are ready to keep your guard up, do not talk with him.
sid3 Posted June 21, 2004 Posted June 21, 2004 I've been reading your posts, you give some really good advice. You need to take your own advice. I know very well how hard it is, all too well. But one thing that is helping me more than anything else is the idea that time is not always a bad thing. It has seemed like the longer it goes on the less likely a reconciliation would be possible. But, I have only gone 8 days now with N/C, so I have put my hope in time. We live in a world that wants instant gratification. Uncertainty is a hard thing to deal with. I had a rough day too, your not alone. Sometimes in your posts you question whether you want him back for sure. Take some time to think about it, be true to yourself. I have thought about my situation, and I know exactly what I want and why. I have read it alot; letting go, giving space, time to heal, realizing what you had when it's gone. They're all true. I am focusing on letting go, and the only thing I have to let go of now is making contact. I am holding on to hope and love.
dreamguy Posted June 22, 2004 Posted June 22, 2004 Kate, "and in no way will i be flirting with him for my recent ex to see...that could damage things for good....i will know how to play it....but i do think that it will help clarify his feelings for me...i mean, if you broke up with your girl and saw her with another guy, it would totally clear things up about the way you feel!!!" I agree, I'd say he should see you with another guy but DO NOT flirt with the other guy in front of him. It will only ruin your chances and push him to take a final decision of leaving you. The simple fact that he sees you with another guy will be enough to make him jealous. Take my word on that and don't overdo it. "that would expalin him staying with me even when he wasn't ready." "i would have much rather him have been honest in the beginning, but i think that it does show how he wanted me all along but couldn't handle it." Those are exactly my thoughts. Every time I got together with my ex and said "things are not working out. Do you want to stop this relationship or continue with it", she answered "I want to continue" !! About 4 months ago, she said "I need some time alone". I refused and I told her I didn't believe in breaks. I told her that asking for a break meant it was over for good. Was I stupid or was I stupid ?? I think I was both Why ? Because whenever someone says they need time (and they know how you feel about them) then YOU SHOULD GIVE IT TO THEM. Give it to them until they decide if they're coming back to you or not !! If they take too long (exactly how long they should take varies a lot from case to case) then I'd suggest you start living your own life and going out with other persons. "that's kind of a sad way to drive results, though, isn't it?? he has to hurt bad enough to go for what he wants, though." Yep it's sad but so true. The more you pamper them the longer they remain in an indecisive and uncertain state. You don't want that because as long as they are in the uncertainty state they are vulnerable to external influences !! They could respond to someone new in their life more easily (knowing they still have you waiting). Again, you don't want that. What you want is for them to be hurt bad enough to know that no matter who comes along, they will always compare them to you and think of you because you were the one they couldn't have. When you pamper them it's like telling them "All right go see what's out there... it's ok with me". Dangerous advice. When you hurt them it's like telling them "Move an inch to go see what's out there and you will lose me". Makes them think twice before doing it (And even if they end up doing it, they'll be thinking about you and worrying). ntovrhm , "What ever reasons he gave, whether they are true or not, it is something that he has to deal with . . .something that you cannot help him through. Once again, that your emotions are all over the place is just another reason not to try and contact him first." Absolutely true ! You cannot talk to your ex until you have complete control of your feelings because they will know if you don't and it'll make the meaning of your words sound fragile. If you keep on doing that, they'll be so accustomed to it that you would have reached the point of no return. so STOP while it's still possible. Sid "I've been reading your posts, you give some really good advice. You need to take your own advice. But one thing that is helping me more than anything else is the idea that time is not always a bad thing. [...] We live in a world that wants instant gratification." Sid now you're talking ! You took the words out of my mouth, I've been meaning to tell Kate the same thing: "Kate, you give some really good advice. You need to take your own advice."
Kate Posted June 22, 2004 Posted June 22, 2004 i know you guys are right. the pain is just so intense and i keep questioning things. should i have not given him the ultimatum-type thing? i don't think it was an ultimatum, but i did say not to contact me until he knows what he wants and that i'm moving on. that's fair, right? i think so. i need to stick to my guns here and stop wavering. i had dreams about him all night. when you wake up in the middle of the night and can't sleep it's like the emotion of anything is so intense. i only pray he feels that, too. i'm also on 8 days of NC and hope i can go another week, at least. oh i hope he calls me...and i hope i can figure out what i REALLY want and if it includes him. one minute i HATE him, the other i LOVE him. is that normal? obviously i can't talk to him until i reach a middle ground!
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