Back up plan

[beenburned]

As a BW/BH, how exactly do you know if you were just their back up plan?

 

Former cheaters lie about most everything. Maybe the OP was the dumper, the one that ended the affair.

 

How would you ever know if the WS only stopped cheating because he/she was dumped? Or maybe they do prefer the OP over you, and are only staying married because it is easier on them.(and cheaper)

 

It really bugs me sometimes to know we, as BW/BH, may never know the whole truth, or what secret thoughts are going through their brain.

 

How can we be happy in our marriage knowing that the WS might feel like they have just settled for less than what they wanted all along?(the OP)

[Owl]

Interesting question. To a degree, I might have been her backup plan...at that time.

 

But, we both know full well had she gone to be with him, she wouldn't have ended up happy. And she's damned glad that she DIDN'T leave and end up with him now.

 

So, I don't really care if I was her backup plan THEN...I know how good things are NOW. And that's all that matters when you get down to it.

[Black Jack]

As a BW/BH, how exactly do you know if you were just their back up plan?

 

Former cheaters lie about most everything. Maybe the OP was the dumper, the one that ended the affair.

 

How would you ever know if the WS only stopped cheating because he/she was dumped? Or maybe they do prefer the OP over you, and are only staying married because it is easier on them.(and cheaper)

 

It really bugs me sometimes to know we, as BW/BH, may never know the whole truth, or what secret thoughts are going through their brain.

 

How can we be happy in our marriage knowing that the WS might feel like they have just settled for less than what they wanted all along?(the OP)

 

I never stuck around for long to listen to those lies. Once I found out she was getting sticked from someone else I kicked her out and divorced her.

[Spark1111]

Maybe I'm one of the lucky ones; or maybe I have a healthy sense of self.

 

I immediately practiced the 180 before I even knew what it was!

 

I threw him out and told him to go get her. I wished them well. If he came to get clothes, I made sure I was gone. If he came to the door, I did not let him in unless he had been invited by one of our children.

 

I refused to speak of "us." I was angry, but stayed very calm when I absolutely had to speak with him.

 

I invited him to our children's events and stayed respectful, but after it was over I was busy and had "someplace" else to be...buh-bye.

 

I got busy with friends and family and put the focus on me; the gym, the beach, the park, art class, music venues, even took a few weekends away .....whatever it took to make me feel better.

 

I decided not to decide anything until I felt whole and sane again.

 

I also became a super sleuth. He was discussing his reconciliation efforts with her via text, and sigh...., she told him how unfair it was that he was meeting with such "unwavering hostility." HAHAHAHA! What reconciliation?????

 

He moved in with her for three weeks. It ended once I gave him carte blanche to be with her and a few trusted friends and family members spoke with him.

 

I think she let him go easily, fearful of exposure (they worked together) and of course, I had been portrayed as the uncaring cold-hearted spouse.

 

My DDAy reactions were NOT the response of an uncaring spouse, but rather someone who was heartbroken. I think it burst her belief that I didn't love him, so getting caught was no big deal right? It was a huge deal.

 

And no, I do not live in fear of having been the default choice as he had to beg me back for a long time and fight for the marriage every step of the way.

 

I have told him repeatedly that I choose to be here, but don't have to be.

 

I have also told him that if he believes someone out there could love him more than I, the door is always open to leave. Just be honest.

[beenburned]

Owl,

That's so true. I LOL when I read your answer!

 

Sometimes hindsight is good for everybody.

[Lauriebell82]

As a BW/BH, how exactly do you know if you were just their back up plan?

 

Former cheaters lie about most everything. Maybe the OP was the dumper, the one that ended the affair.

 

How would you ever know if the WS only stopped cheating because he/she was dumped? Or maybe they do prefer the OP over you, and are only staying married because it is easier on them.(and cheaper)

 

It really bugs me sometimes to know we, as BW/BH, may never know the whole truth, or what secret thoughts are going through their brain.

 

How can we be happy in our marriage knowing that the WS might feel like they have just settled for less than what they wanted all along?(the OP)

 

All these questions are why I could NEVER agree to take my spouse back if he ever cheated on me. I'd be way to paranoid and suspicious.

[beenburned]

Spark,

I left him for about a month after d-day.

 

I didn't call or see him at all during that time.

 

He came to me begging and crying for a second chance.

 

I, like you, practiced the 180 before I even knew what it was.

 

But, like Owl said, maybe we were just their back up plan, at that point in time. But now, with time and hindsight, maybe they(WS), see it totally different.(they lost the rose colored glasses)

[drifter777]

I know I was totally my wife's back-up plan, and she has admitted this to me. More than anything this fact helped me understand that having me in her hip pocket made the cheating easy. She had nothing to lose and could whore around just for the fun of it and, if she found someone she really liked, try a relationship with that person. She did both and, when she was "ready", came back to me swearing that her catting around was just a phase and now she knew how much she really loved me, blah, blah, blah. Like a stupid, young fool, I believed it and have been trying to reconcile ever since.

 

All that matters is that the cheater always sees their BS as a back-up plan whether their affair(s) is simply a fling or what they feel is a genuine romance. They believe that no matter what happens, they can always return to the old man or the little woman and pick up life where they left off.

 

Yeah, it makes me sick to face this fact but I believe it is generally the truth for all of us.

[Spark1111]

Spark,

I left him for about a month after d-day.

 

I didn't call or see him at all during that time.

 

He came to me begging and crying for a second chance.

 

I, like you, practiced the 180 before I even knew what it was.

 

But, like Owl said, maybe we were just their back up plan, at that point in time. But now, with time and hindsight, maybe they(WS), see it totally different.(they lost the rose colored glasses)

 

It an interesting insight.

 

I'm sure I was the back up plan prior to discovery, but I doubt I was after dday.

 

I super sleuthed their texting; and he was playing the pity card with her I truly believe, in the event I never took him back. He was trying to make her his plan B. Very sad. Very cowardly on his part and I eventually told him so.

 

One day he is crying at her kitchen table about how much he wants to come home, and she....very nobly, tells him she understands completely.

 

My heart broke for her.

 

In retrospect, she should have been hurling plates around his head; similiar to some of my reactions at my finer moments. I think he would have respected her more.

 

She seemed much more devastated when he told her to stop calling as they could not longer "be friends."

 

Go figure.

[Ninja'sHusband]

These are great stories Thanks for sharing.

[frozensprouts]

i don't know about being a "back up plan"...

 

all i know is that during the time that i was trying so hard to convince him to stay, he wanted nothing more than to leave. Then, pretty much as soon as i told him that, if he loved her they should be together and i wouldn't stand in the way, their affair ended.

 

go figure.

 

she tried many times over the next few days to convince him to come back ( even saying they could be together, just not as much and i'd never know- he showed me the email)

[beenburned]

I think the difference might be in just how much info the BW/BH had on the cheating spouse's activities.(such as texts, phone records, keyloggers, etc)

You can get a clearer picture of the level/depth of the affair involvement.

 

In the event, a BW/BH does not have these resources, then they have to rely mostly on what the cheating spouse says.(Especially if the OW were just ONS.)

 

Drifter had a good point: Why do cheaters always take the BW/BH for granted?

Is it because they know we are loyal and true?

[beenburned]

FS,

I think it has to do with them viewing us as the parent that is telling them they can not do something. They are rebelling against authority.(They act like a spoiled brat child)

 

So when we let them have their way, saying it is O.K. to go, they finally stop to think, if what they thought they wanted was such a good idea after all .And they finally realize that all the fun and games have very serious consequences.

 

I find it amazing how WS's don't think much at all, until d-day hits.

[frozensprouts]

FS,

I think it has to do with them viewing us as the parent that is telling them they can not do something. They are rebelling against authority.(They act like a spoiled brat child)

 

So when we let them have their way, saying it is O.K. to go, they finally stop to think, if what they thought they wanted was such a good idea after all .And they finally realize that all the fun and games have very serious consequences.

 

I find it amazing how WS's don't think much at all, until d-day hits.

 

makes sense...

 

it also puts me in mind of the way teenagers are with "puppy love"...they'll run off into the sunset, everything will be flowers and sunshine everyday...and then reality hits

[SoMovinOn]

How can we be happy in our marriage knowing that the WS might feel like they have just settled for less than what they wanted all along?(the OP)

 

Why wonder? Get divorced.

[pureinheart]

Why wonder? Get divorced.

 

I agree with this simply by the fact that all we can do in most cases is go by what the OP says. We can choose to believe them or not. Taking this a bit further, let's say the OP does deceive again- if you (the believing spouse) did all you could do to make your part right, which is all any of us are responsible for, then hold your head high and walk with the knowledge that YOU did YOUR best. In the end of any circumstance our best is all that is required.

[flutterbykiss]

As a BW/BH, how exactly do you know if you were just their back up plan?

 

Former cheaters lie about most everything. Maybe the OP was the dumper, the one that ended the affair.

 

How would you ever know if the WS only stopped cheating because he/she was dumped? Or maybe they do prefer the OP over you, and are only staying married because it is easier on them.(and cheaper)

 

It really bugs me sometimes to know we, as BW/BH, may never know the whole truth, or what secret thoughts are going through their brain.

 

How can we be happy in our marriage knowing that the WS might feel like they have just settled for less than what they wanted all along?(the OP)

 

This really is the killer question, isn't it? I admit to doing a bit of obsessing in this department myself. I'm sorry that you are haunted by these doubts, BB, so I will try to share with you some of the conclusions I have come to about my WS. I warn you they might seem a bit controversial but there is a certain sick logic that applies to a sick situation

 

1) If WS truly loved and respected the OW then he would have offered her more than scraps and given me up long before it ended with her. There was a reason deep in his heart why he risked everything he had with her to hang on to me.

 

2) (And this one is sick) WS was hoping I would never know about the OW and it would never threaten our relationship. OW, however, knew full well about me and WS willingly took the risk that she would one-day object to being the bit-on-the-side and leave. Many people think this means that WS didn't want to get caught and have to stop the A. That's that may be true but, if it is, the inference there is that, at crunch time the A goes - not the marriage - and I think that speaks volumes for the WS's priorities.

 

3) A lot of people who have affairs are chasing a childish need for approval - the whole affair fog is pretty much based on how good it feels to be accepted and wanted - so even if the OW did call it off, that means she rejected him and blew the only hold she had over him (the illusion of total, unconditional adoration). Now she's just the b***h that cut him off.

 

4) I don't need to know everything that happened between OW and WS. Clearly he was game playing in fantasy land - which probably means a lot of things were said and done that look like love, on the surface. But it's pretty obvious that those things were a fake since he never followed through with anything concrete.

 

It's a really messed up thing but, I think most cheaters cheat because they want to stay in their M or primary relationship. People who don't truly want their partner leave and they leave long before they get to the point of cheating. After all, why would you bother getting to that point of desperation with someone you don't truly, deep-down want to have in your life? An A is an 'as well as' not an 'instead of'. WS's clearly want more than they get from their M but they still want to stay. Why else would they lie rather than just say ' I'm off for a bit-on-the-side, p**s off if you don't like it?' - which incidentally is pretty much the message they give the OW/OM everytime they get up and go home.

 

As for WS's attachment to the OW/OM... OW/OM really is just a tool WS uses to achieve whatever it is they think they are missing out on in their 'real' relationship. Sure, that tool may seem very valuable while it's providing a valued service but (I know from experience) that the very same tool is looses it appeal once it's outlived it's usefulness.

 

Again, please excuse the diatribe It is just my opinion but I have played all three sides of the infidelity triangle before I got my co-dependent s**t together and it's funny how the view changes but the lay of the land stays the same no matter which position you stand in.

 

For me the concern is, not that WS doesn't love me or thinks I'm second best or the back-up plan, it's that cheating is how he copes with his issues and yes, it could and probably will happen again until he deals with that. I try to keep his actions in perspective, though, and that seems to make it feel a little less like a personal reflection on me or his feelings for me. Chin up, BB.

[beenburned]

flutterbykiss,

 

OMG, your post was amazing!!

 

You brought up different angles that I had never thought of.

 

Your learning experience has really brought you much wisdom.

 

Almost all of your post resembled my H's thought process. He has admitted he was the classic cake eater.(never wanting a divorce)

 

Like Owl stated above, it really doesn't matter now what their thoughts were in the past, as long as they did the introspection to learn and correct their behavior!

 

Thanks for making my day much better!!

[SandieBeach]

 

1) If WS truly loved and respected the OW then he would have offered her more than scraps and given me up long before it ended with her. There was a reason deep in his heart why he risked everything he had with her to hang on to me.

 

2) (And this one is sick) WS was hoping I would never know about the OW and it would never threaten our relationship. OW, however, knew full well about me and WS willingly took the risk that she would one-day object to being the bit-on-the-side and leave. Many people think this means that WS didn't want to get caught and have to stop the A. That's that may be true but, if it is, the inference there is that, at crunch time the A goes - not the marriage - and I think that speaks volumes for the WS's priorities.

 

3) A lot of people who have affairs are chasing a childish need for approval - the whole affair fog is pretty much based on how good it feels to be accepted and wanted - so even if the OW did call it off, that means she rejected him and blew the only hold she had over him (the illusion of total, unconditional adoration). Now she's just the b***h that cut him off.

 

4) I don't need to know everything that happened between OW and WS. Clearly he was game playing in fantasy land - which probably means a lot of things were said and done that look like love, on the surface. But it's pretty obvious that those things were a fake since he never followed through with anything concrete.

 

It's a really messed up thing but, I think most cheaters cheat because they want to stay in their M or primary relationship. People who don't truly want their partner leave and they leave long before they get to the point of cheating. After all, why would you bother getting to that point of desperation with someone you don't truly, deep-down want to have in your life? An A is an 'as well as' not an 'instead of'. WS's clearly want more than they get from their M but they still want to stay. Why else would they lie rather than just say ' I'm off for a bit-on-the-side, p**s off if you don't like it?' - which incidentally is pretty much the message they give the OW/OM everytime they get up and go home.

 

As for WS's attachment to the OW/OM... OW/OM really is just a tool WS uses to achieve whatever it is they think they are missing out on in their 'real' relationship. Sure, that tool may seem very valuable while it's providing a valued service but (I know from experience) that the very same tool is looses it appeal once it's outlived it's usefulness.

 

Again, please excuse the diatribe It is just my opinion but I have played all three sides of the infidelity triangle before I got my co-dependent s**t together and it's funny how the view changes but the lay of the land stays the same no matter which position you stand in.

 

For me the concern is, not that WS doesn't love me or thinks I'm second best or the back-up plan, it's that cheating is how he copes with his issues and yes, it could and probably will happen again until he deals with that. I try to keep his actions in perspective, though, and that seems to make it feel a little less like a personal reflection on me or his feelings for me. Chin up, BB.

 

An excellent post, FBK, and an interesting perspective to consider. I don't disagree with you, but some of your comments do make me wonder... My husband claims that he was clear with the OW that he never intended to leave me. She had asked him that a few times, and even got upset when he told her he "loved me and wanted to stay with me." Of course, I have no way of knowing if that was what he said to her at the time, and I don't want to contact the OW to ask her. Just not my thing...

 

In any event, what bothers me about that whole thing is that even if he did say to her had no intention of leaving me, I could imagine a scenario where her being so "understanding" of the situation would make him feel closer to her, and he would even more neglect his relationship with me. That, in turn, would create a wider gap between us, and the OW may at that point become a rational choice for him.

 

One other thing that I am having difficulties coming to terms with it this "fantasy" thing he had with her, and how, instead of telling me what bothered him in our marriage, he coped by finding someone else to take care of his needs. He and I had pretty big issues ourselves, so I can understand his unhappiness, but the fact that an affair was his solution scares me to no end.

[Black Jack]

It's a really messed up thing but, I think most cheaters cheat because they want to stay in their M or primary relationship.

 

They don't cheat because they want to stay in their marriage, especially when they already left when they decided to push their pants down for someone else. They keep it secret so they can have their cake and eat it. If they wanted to literally stay married, they would not cheat. Plain and simple.

[Ninja'sHusband]

flutterbykiss's post is a good one

 

But I think it doesn't account for the exit A which seems to be common among women. Women who can't communicate their complaints to their spouse clearly or have just completely checked out of the relationship but are too afraid to D. They setup a huge crisis and then when the BH reacts badly with anger, jealousy, and suspicion, they leave citing they can't take it anymore and that the BH is taking it too far. They shift the blame making themselves feel better. There's actually a whole section on this that I'm paraphrasing from the book "Good Divorce".

 

It's an unfair tragedy because if they'd just bring up their issues in a direct way(threaten to D!, better than an A at least) they could be dealt with...and the marriage repaired. But with the A, now there's a massive injury that just wreaks even more havok and creates more problems for them to have to face, including guilt every time they see their BH. So much for working on the issues that existed before hand, better to D =(

 

I'm guessing that most WHs are cheating for reasons like what flutter called out. If I had cheated, God, yeah I'd do ANYTHING to make up for it and would feel awful. My WW feels guilty yes but also so justified it scares me...over the course of time she's rationalized a lot of stuff. She's gone from "it's nothing to do with you, there's obviously something wrong with me" to "It's a build up of everything you've done over 14 years!". F that, now I think it has more to do with her MLC and lack of self esteem. She's been a stay at home mother with no career for 11 years, only one long term relationship in her life, she's 37. Yeah...that's what it's really about. She wants to start over and do everything right this time. Get a masters, a brand new husband, new car, be a MA champion. Screw the old family =( Let's plant a bomb and make sure it can never be repaired, watch it burn down in flames while pissing on it, pretending that the liquid will do some good to quench the flames. Not everyone wants to save the marriage, a lot of people like to pretend they do.

[flutterbykiss]

In any event, what bothers me about that whole thing is that even if he did say to her had no intention of leaving me, I could imagine a scenario where her being so "understanding" of the situation would make him feel closer to her, and he would even more neglect his relationship with me. That, in turn, would create a wider gap between us, and the OW may at that point become a rational choice for him.

 

Yes, that scares me silly, too. It's what I fear most about the possibility of him having another A. I try to remind myself that:

 

1) It had already got to that point for the A to begin and WH didn't leave, he had an affair.

 

2) I don't care what games OW thought she was playing, no-one (NO-ONE) can stay perfect up close. The more time WH spent with her, the more she started to have little wants or needs of her own and since he was in it entirely for himself, those reasonable (under other circumstances) requests really did her no favors in his eyes. WH might put up with a lot of inconveince for me and for our relationship but was with OW because he thought she was going to fulfill the totally selfish, impossible, unrealistic fantasy he had in his head. When she didn't turn out to be an absolute doormat then she was more trouble than she was worth. I'd feel sorry for her if only I had the satisfaction of knowing that she understood that

 

BB, I'm so glad I could help a little. I certainly wouldn't have got to that perspective without a LOT of input from many awesome and wise posters on LS. Hang in there.

[flutterbykiss]

Ninja's H,

 

That's true, I don't generally aim my comments at exit-affairs where the WS truly and irrevocably wants out of the relationship. I think they have a different pathology.

 

Although, the blame shifting seems to be quite common across the board. I think cheaters are basically game-players - within their own heads as well. They must be to handle their problems so indirectly. I think it's basically a weak person, uncomfortable in their own skin, that resorts to blaming their situation, their spouse, their life, etc, because they can't just face up to not being totally satisfied with their existence. And I think it's a weak, selfish person who then cheats at the rules of life to 'band-aid' that dissatisfaction rather than questioning what choices they made to get them to this point.

 

I understand your anger and frustration. It isn't fair but unfortunately you just can't make another person face facts, or be truthful, if they are not emotionally equipped to deal with the harsh realities. Their mind will shy away and hide behind all sorts of games and excuses. I think that's the hardest part to accept. Keep posting here. You are not alone.

[beenburned]

Sandie,

Most WS do many things in order to try and distance themselves from their spouse.(trying to justify bad behavior)

 

It is very common to read of many OW claiming that the MM is their best friend or soul mate. He talks bad about the wife and marriage, she then comforts him by agreeing with anything he says. She constantly tries to make him think that she is the opposite of the big bad wife.(so perfect for him)

 

Even more disturbing than the neglect you spoke of, is the WS's feelings toward the spouse turning to anger and rage. I also experienced gaslighting and verbal abuse.

[frozensprouts]

Sandie,

Most WS do many things in order to try and distance themselves from their spouse.(trying to justify bad behavior)

 

It is very common to read of many OW claiming that the MM is their best friend or soul mate. He talks bad about the wife and marriage, she then comforts him by agreeing with anything he says. She constantly tries to make him think that she is the opposite of the big bad wife.(so perfect for him)

 

Even more disturbing than the neglect you spoke of, is the WS's feelings toward the spouse turning to anger and rage. I also experienced gaslighting and verbal abuse.

 

i remember this...

my husband went from being a really nice guy to a jerk, ready to quibble over every insignificant little point ( even to the point of freaking out at me one time when I asked him where he was going. He told me "most husband's and wives don't tell each other where they are going when they go out".

Piffle!

He was just looking for an excuse to be angry with me and feel that i was "controlling" him ( salve to his conscience for cheating, I guess)

 

He'd then gripe about it to "the other woman" and she'd affirm it and exacerbate the issue as much as she could ( he showed me some emails from her to him where she told him that she "didn't understand how he could live with being controlled like that and how it must be terribly hard for him, she'd never be that way, etc.)