The Blue Knight Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 Frozensprouts, your posts give me hope. I don't know if that's a good or bad thing! I thought he was trustworthy before this, and I never doubted him before, but now I just don't know. He's opened up to me since I found out, and I have access to so many of his personal accounts. Of course, if someone wants to lie, there is a way to do it, but it would take a lot more energy. In my opinion Sandie, that's his way of saying he wants to make it work. If he's a fairly sincere dude, keeping this affair from you probably was draining him and in some sense, he's relieved that that chapter in his life is over and now he wants to move forward with you.
Author SandieBeach Posted March 9, 2012 Author Posted March 9, 2012 In my opinion Sandie, that's his way of saying he wants to make it work. If he's a fairly sincere dude, keeping this affair from you probably was draining him and in some sense, he's relieved that that chapter in his life is over and now he wants to move forward with you. Well, he certainly could have refused to be open (though it would be over with us at that point), so it shows me that, for whatever reason, he is at least trying. At risk of sounding like a broken record, my trust in him has been shattered though, and at this point I cannot even imagine the possibility of regaining it. BTW, you are a very wise man, TBK.
The Blue Knight Posted March 10, 2012 Posted March 10, 2012 Well, he certainly could have refused to be open (though it would be over with us at that point), so it shows me that, for whatever reason, he is at least trying. At risk of sounding like a broken record, my trust in him has been shattered though, and at this point I cannot even imagine the possibility of regaining it. BTW, you are a very wise man, TBK. Sandie . . . . - You admit that you still love him - You admit that you brought on some of the problem that lead to this - You obviously still want to make this work Those are all positives that make another shot at your marriage very workable. If your husband is communicating the same sentiments, feels remorse, and admits the wrong he's done, I think you've got a valid attempt at making it work this time around. The deal is, trust is something that is built over time as you're well aware. You're going to need time to regain the trust you once had and nobody would fault you for that, least of all me. I didn't have a lot of trust when my ex-wife cheated on me. That's completely normal and it may take many months or even a couple of years for him to earn that trust back. In many respects my ex-wife seemed different enough to me after the affair that she never was fully the same girl I met and married. Looking back that was a sign that her head was never completely back "in the game" afterward. If you saw the posting by WFBack in the "infidelity" category the other day about his wife's three month affair it's entirely different than your own situation because I, and others don't read a lot of remorse or willingness for change in his wife. She strikes me as hesitant and weighing her options. I don't believe she's being completely forthcoming. Your husband strikes me as entirely different. Some people get into affairs and may enjoy some of the moments of excitement but find it very difficult to live with themselves and to continue to live that dual lifestyle. I know I would. It would take a toll on me big time because I can't lie and I can't be someone other than who I am. Others seem to thrive on the excitement of an affair and after having one develop a taste for it and will eventually slip back into another torrid relationship. My personal opinion is that your hubby is the former and WFBack's wife is the latter. But only time, working through the issues, and open and honest communication will overcome the baggage. Just hang in there and take it day by day. Work on the problems and if your husband is remorseful and showing you how much he wants to make it work, forgiveness and healing will come for you in time.
Ninja'sHusband Posted March 10, 2012 Posted March 10, 2012 I agree with snooping, maybe not to the extreme, but definitely keep your eyes open. My WW seemed completely remorseful, truthful, and transparent when she told me she was pregnant and didn't know who the father was (she miscarried a week later). Fact was, even though she seemed like she had learned her lesson and was working hard to earn back my trust, she was lying that it had been a one night affair. She kept her computer open to me, her email, etc....still took me 3 months to find the Facebook conversation that proved it had really been a 4 month A, and sent all of our R work during the last 3 months down the drain. I clamped down much harder after that, drove her nuts, now we are headed for D. Keep your eyes open, if you find something, approach very carefully and don't expect him to just open up. You'll have to make it extremely safe to do so, I dunno, trickle truth seems so prevalent. It must be really hard to own up to lies like that. 1
The Blue Knight Posted March 10, 2012 Posted March 10, 2012 I agree with snooping, maybe not to the extreme, but definitely keep your eyes open. My WW seemed completely remorseful, truthful, and transparent when she told me she was pregnant and didn't know who the father was (she miscarried a week later). Fact was, even though she seemed like she had learned her lesson and was working hard to earn back my trust, she was lying that it had been a one night affair. She kept her computer open to me, her email, etc....still took me 3 months to find the Facebook conversation that proved it had really been a 4 month A, and sent all of our R work during the last 3 months down the drain. I clamped down much harder after that, drove her nuts, now we are headed for D. Keep your eyes open, if you find something, approach very carefully and don't expect him to just open up. You'll have to make it extremely safe to do so, I dunno, trickle truth seems so prevalent. It must be really hard to own up to lies like that. Yeah, that's what I encountered as well and that's a good description, "trickle truth" is a good way to look at it.
Author SandieBeach Posted March 13, 2012 Author Posted March 13, 2012 I agree with snooping, maybe not to the extreme, but definitely keep your eyes open. My WW seemed completely remorseful, truthful, and transparent when she told me she was pregnant and didn't know who the father was (she miscarried a week later). Fact was, even though she seemed like she had learned her lesson and was working hard to earn back my trust, she was lying that it had been a one night affair. She kept her computer open to me, her email, etc....still took me 3 months to find the Facebook conversation that proved it had really been a 4 month A, and sent all of our R work during the last 3 months down the drain. I clamped down much harder after that, drove her nuts, now we are headed for D. Keep your eyes open, if you find something, approach very carefully and don't expect him to just open up. You'll have to make it extremely safe to do so, I dunno, trickle truth seems so prevalent. It must be really hard to own up to lies like that. Appreciate your post, NS. You are absolutely right: while it often feels like he is being very honest, he is likely disclosing only the most relevant details about the affair. It's difficult to be the rational person after someone you care about deeply acted so irrationally. My biggest fear now is that this may not have been his first affair. While I do not have any proof (like I did with this affair), out problems existed for years, and it almost seems natural that he would seek elsewhere what he was not getting from me.
Author SandieBeach Posted March 13, 2012 Author Posted March 13, 2012 Some people get into affairs and may enjoy some of the moments of excitement but find it very difficult to live with themselves and to continue to live that dual lifestyle. I know I would. It would take a toll on me big time because I can't lie and I can't be someone other than who I am. Others seem to thrive on the excitement of an affair and after having one develop a taste for it and will eventually slip back into another torrid relationship. My personal opinion is that your hubby is the former and WFBack's wife is the latter. But only time, working through the issues, and open and honest communication will overcome the baggage. Just hang in there and take it day by day. Work on the problems and if your husband is remorseful and showing you how much he wants to make it work, forgiveness and healing will come for you in time. I hope that you are right, TBK. I really do... the hardest thing to know right now (it's only been 4 weeks since I found out) if the affair was his regrettable choice, or if it's a character issue. The transparency is there right now, but it could be on the surface. I really don't want to sound like a broken record (and at times I feel like I am dwelling on this), but his lies to me came so easily....even about things unrelated to the affair (prior to the affair)...So, is this a character issue for him? God, I hope not, but there is a strong possibility...
frozensprouts Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 I hope that you are right, TBK. I really do... the hardest thing to know right now (it's only been 4 weeks since I found out) if the affair was his regrettable choice, or if it's a character issue. The transparency is there right now, but it could be on the surface. I really don't want to sound like a broken record (and at times I feel like I am dwelling on this), but his lies to me came so easily....even about things unrelated to the affair (prior to the affair)...So, is this a character issue for him? God, I hope not, but there is a strong possibility... as weird as it may sound, did you find him ( while the affair was going on) getting angry with you and blowing up over nothing? did he start picking fights with you and quibbling over things that never mattered before?Did you find him accusing you of being too controlling, keeping him from what he wanted to do, etc.? In other words, did the nice guy seem to disappear only to be replaced by someone who was kind of , well, a knob? he may have have been doing this because, way deep down, he knew cheating was wrong, and on some level it bothered him. So he tried to salve his guilt and justify his actions by making you, in his mind, to be some horrible person who somehow deserved what she was getting because you treated him so badly. he may have also been really short tempered because of guilt about what he was doing. As twisted as it sounds, that may actually not be the end of the world. It would mean that he really did have a problem with cheating on you, wanted to rationalize it to himself, and that's why he got so angry. the thing now is for him to learn to not make the choice again and to find better solutions to problems in your marriage.
Author SandieBeach Posted March 13, 2012 Author Posted March 13, 2012 as weird as it may sound, did you find him ( while the affair was going on) getting angry with you and blowing up over nothing? did he start picking fights with you and quibbling over things that never mattered before?Did you find him accusing you of being too controlling, keeping him from what he wanted to do, etc.? In other words, did the nice guy seem to disappear only to be replaced by someone who was kind of , well, a knob? he may have have been doing this because, way deep down, he knew cheating was wrong, and on some level it bothered him. So he tried to salve his guilt and justify his actions by making you, in his mind, to be some horrible person who somehow deserved what she was getting because you treated him so badly. he may have also been really short tempered because of guilt about what he was doing. As twisted as it sounds, that may actually not be the end of the world. It would mean that he really did have a problem with cheating on you, wanted to rationalize it to himself, and that's why he got so angry. the thing now is for him to learn to not make the choice again and to find better solutions to problems in your marriage. There were definitely moments like that. Overall, he was very supportive of me during the affair, but we did have a few huge fights and they were all pretty much made out to be my fault. Also, as I mentioned in another post, he got angry with me for being late to pick him up at the airport as he was coming home after seeing her. A lot of people are saying that we could have a stronger marriage if we keep being honest, but I wake up every day thinking that it may be better for me to move on with my life without him. We both learned a valuable lesson about the importance of honesty and communication in marriage, but I am not sure we can apply what we learned in our relationship. Ugh, I'm going crazy with this! 1
beenburned Posted March 14, 2012 Posted March 14, 2012 SB and Alice, I don't want to discourage you both, but reconciliation can take anywhere between 2 to 5 years. Depending on many things, such as, the WS's desire to understand why he cheated and be willing to do the hard work of changing, length/depth of the affair, state of the over all marriage before the affair, etc. There are no short cuts, especially when it comes to the BS's healing process. My holding on to my anger and resentments, for so long, almost cost me my marriage.(and I had a remorseful dedicated H) I clearly remember the day that my H got down on his knees crying, saying that he had done everything in his power to change, and if I couldn't forgive him to please let him go.(he was close to a nervous break down and it had been 4 whole years since d-day) I then realized that if I wanted a new and improved marriage, I had to forgive him and get on with our lives!(without the affairs intruding on our future) Each and everyday is what you choose to make it. 4
Spark1111 Posted March 14, 2012 Posted March 14, 2012 SB and Alice, I don't want to discourage you both, but reconciliation can take anywhere between 2 to 5 years. Depending on many things, such as, the WS's desire to understand why he cheated and be willing to do the hard work of changing, length/depth of the affair, state of the over all marriage before the affair, etc. There are no short cuts, especially when it comes to the BS's healing process. My holding on to my anger and resentments, for so long, almost cost me my marriage.(and I had a remorseful dedicated H) I clearly remember the day that my H got down on his knees crying, saying that he had done everything in his power to change, and if I couldn't forgive him to please let him go.(he was close to a nervous break down and it had been 4 whole years since d-day) I then realized that if I wanted a new and improved marriage, I had to forgive him and get on with our lives!(without the affairs intruding on our future) Each and everyday is what you choose to make it. Thanks for this! For me it was two years of roller coaster, before I could even start to come off of it. A little more than 4 years after Dday, true peace. Read everything you can get your hands on and talk, talk, talk, about it. Choose your MC very wisely. I learned more on the internet and in support forums than the few we went to. Educate yourself first!
frozensprouts Posted March 14, 2012 Posted March 14, 2012 SB and Alice, I don't want to discourage you both, but reconciliation can take anywhere between 2 to 5 years. Depending on many things, such as, the WS's desire to understand why he cheated and be willing to do the hard work of changing, length/depth of the affair, state of the over all marriage before the affair, etc. There are no short cuts, especially when it comes to the BS's healing process. My holding on to my anger and resentments, for so long, almost cost me my marriage.(and I had a remorseful dedicated H) I clearly remember the day that my H got down on his knees crying, saying that he had done everything in his power to change, and if I couldn't forgive him to please let him go.(he was close to a nervous break down and it had been 4 whole years since d-day) I then realized that if I wanted a new and improved marriage, I had to forgive him and get on with our lives!(without the affairs intruding on our future) Each and everyday is what you choose to make it. these are real words of wisdom. some can't reconcile, because they know they just can't for give the cheating, and if that is the situation, then there is no shame in ending things. As long as you did your best. There really are no short cuts...it takes a lot of time ( right now, we are at 2 1/2 years) 1
The Blue Knight Posted March 15, 2012 Posted March 15, 2012 Yes, either a magnificent liar and a cheat, or just a very weak and neglected husband who wanted sex that his wife was not giving him. The jury is still out... Sandie, while you'd be foolish to just accept everything your husband says at face value without allowing for time to heal and watching him closely, I see this woman as nothing more than an intimacy surrogate as you somewhat suggested above. Lots of people here will tell you your husband can never be trusted again. I find that preposterous. Some are serial cheaters and that's who they are. Others just walked into something that was there with no real deep-seated plot in mind. People make mistakes and affairs, while never permissible, are the result sometimes of marriages where needs weren't being met. Key component of what you just said, he's backing up his words with actions. If he's not sincere, you'll know in due time. I think the man is thrilled to have you back and in some odd way, he's probably thankful that the affair occurred if it placed the two of you back in each others arms. 1
2sunny Posted March 15, 2012 Posted March 15, 2012 That could be true BK... But she can only really know for sure if he does the work he needs to do to find out exactly why he cheated... And to be sure he does every bit of the work necessary to be sure he repairs the damage he caused. Any anger Sandie holds onto at that point (if they get to that point) is just trying to control by hanging onto negative energy... By punishing and shame. If a M can heal - then both people need to move toward healing the new marriage. Letting go of the OLD is key. Letting go of what was... Or what used to be - is completely useful to grow a new and improved marriage. But first this OP needs evidence that he IS being honest, rebuilding trust and has the actions that match his words.
PI777 Posted March 15, 2012 Posted March 15, 2012 Its understandable that you would now have doubtsas to whether he is going back or not. From my experience a cheater will not tell you they are doing anything untoward when questioned. I operate a private investigation firm and see this same scenario time after time. If you feel the relationship is worth it you could consider using a private investigator to get the facts before you start pointing the finger again and possibly build a case against yourself. At least then you know the truth without having to get involved and risk being caught out. Then you can make a decision based on facts and hopefully leave those doubts behind. I have attached a link if you would like to read. Why hire a private investigator | Private Investigators in Sydney, Private Detectives, Spouse Investigators
2sunny Posted March 15, 2012 Posted March 15, 2012 Sheez, advertise much? If she was gonna pay an investigator she could more easily just install some spyware or key logger.
Funsize Posted March 15, 2012 Posted March 15, 2012 Seriously? Its time to move on. You might love him but he clearly doesn't love you, He just doesn't want the financial reprucussions of a divorce. Put this behind you and get on with your life.
Author SandieBeach Posted March 15, 2012 Author Posted March 15, 2012 Sandie, while you'd be foolish to just accept everything your husband says at face value without allowing for time to heal and watching him closely, I see this woman as nothing more than an intimacy surrogate as you somewhat suggested above. Lots of people here will tell you your husband can never be trusted again. I find that preposterous. Some are serial cheaters and that's who they are. Others just walked into something that was there with no real deep-seated plot in mind. People make mistakes and affairs, while never permissible, are the result sometimes of marriages where needs weren't being met. Key component of what you just said, he's backing up his words with actions. If he's not sincere, you'll know in due time. I think the man is thrilled to have you back and in some odd way, he's probably thankful that the affair occurred if it placed the two of you back in each others arms. Um....are you sure you are not my husband?? Yes, our marriage was definitely free of deep intimacy and we barely had sex. There was a clear need by both of us, and while I thought about cheating on him in the past but didn't, he took steps to fulfill what he was missing. I think remembering that I almost cheated is why I am still here giving him a chance. I know I would have regretted cheating, so I am giving him the benefit of the doubt. I do agree that I will know in due time if he's being sincere. There is definitely more honesty and transparency now more then ever, and the sex part is out of the ball park. It's the trust part that would take me a looong time, and I am not typically a patient person... 1
Author SandieBeach Posted March 15, 2012 Author Posted March 15, 2012 That could be true BK... But she can only really know for sure if he does the work he needs to do to find out exactly why he cheated... And to be sure he does every bit of the work necessary to be sure he repairs the damage he caused. Any anger Sandie holds onto at that point (if they get to that point) is just trying to control by hanging onto negative energy... By punishing and shame. If a M can heal - then both people need to move toward healing the new marriage. Letting go of the OLD is key. Letting go of what was... Or what used to be - is completely useful to grow a new and improved marriage. But first this OP needs evidence that he IS being honest, rebuilding trust and has the actions that match his words. I agree 2sunny: if I am giving this marriage a chance, I will have to stop throwing this affair in his face every time I am angry. At this point, I have not yet decided what I want to do. I think it's still very early to know, and yes, I am now watching his actions like a hawk!
2sunny Posted March 15, 2012 Posted March 15, 2012 I agree 2sunny: if I am giving this marriage a chance, I will have to stop throwing this affair in his face every time I am angry. At this point, I have not yet decided what I want to do. I think it's still very early to know, and yes, I am now watching his actions like a hawk! Is HE in counseling? Is he doing everything to earn trust back? 1
Author SandieBeach Posted March 15, 2012 Author Posted March 15, 2012 Seriously? Its time to move on. You might love him but he clearly doesn't love you, He just doesn't want the financial reprucussions of a divorce. Put this behind you and get on with your life. Oh, hello little green man on my shoulder! I knew you were going to come by soon! Of course, no one wants financial repercussion of a divorce. Neither do I. Whether or not that is his reason for wanting to work things out in our marriage, we'll see...
The Blue Knight Posted March 15, 2012 Posted March 15, 2012 That could be true BK... But she can only really know for sure if he does the work he needs to do to find out exactly why he cheated... And to be sure he does every bit of the work necessary to be sure he repairs the damage he caused. Any anger Sandie holds onto at that point (if they get to that point) is just trying to control by hanging onto negative energy... By punishing and shame. If a M can heal - then both people need to move toward healing the new marriage. Letting go of the OLD is key. Letting go of what was... Or what used to be - is completely useful to grow a new and improved marriage. But first this OP needs evidence that he IS being honest, rebuilding trust and has the actions that match his words. From what Sandie posted, I'm under the impression she has some idea of why he cheated and it sounds like he's doing the things needed for her to accept him back again. The saying "time heals all things" is most true in a marriage where an affair takes place, assuming of course that both individuals are committed to working toward that goal. But I agree with everything you said sunny. I'm under no illusion that people don't go on to cheat a second and third time. They do. I've been a victim myself, forgave and moved on, only to be victimized again three years later. And I still hung around another couple of years because of kids. She wasn't a serial cheater as much as she was just a lost person who suffered from depression off and on and found happiness illusive. And we get along fine today because I moved on and I forgave. Had I taken the attitude that nobody can ever be trusted (as I see here from time to time) I wouldn't have moved on and married my current wife and been fairly happy. There are no guarantees with love. It's like anything else in life. But if one or both persons in the marriage become apathetic or neglectful about what they put into the marriage, at some point, the fallout is often an affair. People just never seem to realize it until they get stung with the reality of their spouses affair.
Author SandieBeach Posted March 15, 2012 Author Posted March 15, 2012 Is HE in counseling? Is he doing everything to earn trust back? He already started counseling, and suggested we also see someone together, like a marriage counselor. I think that would be smart, but I feel that I need to be a bit more sure if I want to give him a chance before going to an MC.
Author SandieBeach Posted March 15, 2012 Author Posted March 15, 2012 There are no guarantees with love. It's like anything else in life. But if one or both persons in the marriage become apathetic or neglectful about what they put into the marriage, at some point, the fallout is often an affair. People just never seem to realize it until they get stung with the reality of their spouses affair. That's so true TBK. As much as I am hurt right now, I have a little bit of empathy towards the situation because I know that my own apathy and complacence created a rift between us. I am angry with him, but am not bitter and do not hate him - and I am so glad about that because if we end our marriage, I will be able to move on... 1
2sunny Posted March 15, 2012 Posted March 15, 2012 I can understand your reluctance. What has HE changed? What are his words and actions? How much has he focused on you? How much has he let go of his cheating ways? How much is he being COMPLETELY forthcoming? And I know you have wondered since the start of this thread... So - now - what has your gut been telling you this week?
Recommended Posts