sex = commitment?

[2sunny]

Or be honest and tell her you want sex but aren't ready yet to commit. She can either say yes or no!

[J322Y]

Are you sure? You've already stated the attraction and compatibility that you have with the two women you're seeing. I'd say you're already in something of a rebound relationship(s). Even without sex, there's still potential for emotional entanglement and hurt feelings. Even without sleeping with you, one or both of these women might be willing to hang around and hope that one day you will be ready for a committed relationship with them. Starting out with with someone new with an understanding of no commitment isn't a guarantee, either, because feelings, needs and desires change over time.

 

I'm not looking for guarantees or complete insulation from risk. I'm looking for a logical boundary so that I can date without too much worry of hurting myself or others.

 

By the way, just saying "I'm not ready" is not enough. Actions speak much louder than words, so if you act like you want everything that comes with a committed relationship but say "no" to commitment, that's a huge mixed message. If you're going effectively be in uncommitted relationships, you have to set boundaries on behavior and maybe give up things you would otherwise want: sex is OK but no sleeping over, no favors for each other, weekend getaways by car are OK but no vacations or plane trips -- whatever you and your partner(s) agree on that would show a meaningful difference between being committed versus not. It's rarely as simple as just saying "we're (not) committed" or just not having sex with anyone else. Set and keep clear boundaries, or you're sure to have misunderstandings and misery on your hands -- but to do that you have to know what you want and what you are willing to accept.

 

The way you describe setting boundaries might work for some, but I think I need something more simple and straightforward. I don't think I'll be sending mixed messages if I'm clear and consistent about not being ready for a LTR. A woman that dates me will need to be mature and intelligent enough to understand what I mean and to deal with it accordingly. This might sound like BS unless you understand that I'm brutally honest. Women who invest time with me will know my concerns and what and why I'm doing to deal with it. I make sure people know what they're getting with me.

 

That in mind, "no sex before a committed, monogamous relationship" is apparently one of the boundaries that these ladies have. They know what they want (a committed relationship) and they don't want to settle for less (sex without commitment). It's pointless to ask why -- it's what they want. You want something different, and it would be just as pointless for them to ask why you don't want what they want. You need to stop seeing them and move on to others whose wants are more in line with your own.

 

Not exactly. The women haven't said "first a commitment, and then sex", they've simply stated that they are only sexually active with one person (relationship) at a time. That's the point of this thread; the commitment begins with the act of sex. I'm questioning why the first time I have sex with someone also has to be the act that equals/begins commitment. The truth is that I want basically the same thing as the women I've described, I just want to go about it slowly and thoughtfully. If they can understand and deal with that then I think I'll have a good chance of finding a good partner.

 

I'm among those who agree that you should not be dating. You are emotionally and mentally ripe for a rebound relationship, sexual or not. In fact, it seems like you are searching for exactly that, and are under the impression that it's technically not a rebound relationship if it's not committed or monogamous. Rebounds take a variety of forms, and you aren't doing yourself any favors by jumping into the sack, comittment or not, instead of taking time to process the old relationship and getting readjusted to being single.

 

You can have a life while not dating. Spend more time with your friends, cultivate new ones, take up a new hobby or activity or go back to one you used to do. Don't buy into the idea that you need to have a sexual partner(s) to qualify as a human being. Don't be afraid of spending some time alone and figuring out what you really want in this next stage of your life.

 

I understand why you think I shouldn't be dating but I believe you're wrong. Dating has been a lot of fun so far and I don't think I'll become wiser or stronger in a vacuum, at least that's not how I deal with things. I feel the desire to see women, and I'll find a way to make it work for all parties involved.

 

Thanks for taking the time to consider this issue.

[J322Y]

You've illustrated the difference between "sex is special" and "sex with you is special." It's nice to find a man who thinks sex is special, but what I really want is a man who thinks I'm special.

 

My point in this thread is that we give sex too much importance in terms of overall feelings about each other. You can have sexual chemistry with someone but not connect in other important ways. You can also love a person who isn't your ideal sexual partner but you can still enjoy them on that level. Point; I don't think allowing sex to be the defining factor of commitment is a good idea.

[J322Y]

You're in your 50's, wtf are you waiting for? Just pick the one you like the best, and be honest with the other one.

 

You seem like you've been pretty open with them already. You could just tell them that sexual chemistry is very important in a relationship to you, so it's difficult to commit to someone you haven't slept with.

 

You could try waiting them out. Just continue doing everything as you are. Show them the same amount of attention and affection, and don't pressure for sex. Just keep making out with them or whatever you're doing and pushing the passion and intensity, and just don't mention sex. Pretty soon they'll either leave you alone, or sleep with you. The key here is suppressing your frustration, and making them become more and more attached to your personality. I had a similar situation where a girl I was seeing only wanted to have sex with condoms, even though we weren't seeing others. I got annoyed with it, so I didn't buy anymore and when she asked why I hadn't bought more a few days later, I told her I wasn't using them anymore but I liked her enough that I'd wait until she felt comfortable to have sex without them. She lasted a week and a half, before she cracked.

 

I'm waiting because I would like to allow myself the time to meet more than just these two. I deserve the best possible partner so I want to take my time.

[J322Y]

I agree with you. I think it's silly that sex equates to commitment. That's the silliest thing i've ever heard.

 

But you're lucky these women were honest about it, so at least now you know how to handle things. Did you tell them you thought otherwise?

 

I made it clear that I was dating others, and they let me know that was fine, but that if the relationship became sexual they would expect me to stop dating others.

 

So far I've told my favorite date that I'm very attracted to her sexually but that I'm not ready to commit now. She said she still wants to see me but that she won't have sex with me under those circumstances.

[J322Y]

If I'm dating a new guy and I'm liking him and it's new... It would upset me IF he said he committed to the R and to me when he actually wasn't POSITIVELY and TOTALLY into ONLY ME!

 

I think you're trying to say you'll commit to get the sex.

 

IF you have ANY reason to wonder - then WAIT - and wait until you know for sure she's the only one you want to see.

 

In the meantime - IF you just need sex - sheez, you can get that anywhere on any night... Go get it while you're still a free man. Use a condom!

 

Pretty much the opposite...

 

I don't NEED a woman for sex even though I want it. My point is that I don't want sex to be the motivating nor the defining aspect of my relationships with women.

[J322Y]

Or be honest and tell her you want sex but aren't ready yet to commit. She can either say yes or no!

 

I'm always honest and this is pretty much what I'm doing now. In fact I told her that last night. I'm still willing to see her even if she doesn't want to have sex under these circumstances.

[2sunny]

That's good to hear!

[maybealone]

I made it clear that I was dating others, and they let me know that was fine, but that if the relationship became sexual they would expect me to stop dating others.

 

Maybe I'm weird, but I think of that as being different from commitment. To me, there is dating exclusively (which some people want, as they don't want to sleep with someone who is sleeping around) and there is commitment. To me, commitment means you aren't going to even look for someone else. Dating exclusively means you stop dating other people, but you can still do what you want when you want and pursue friendships, but if you find someone else you want to sleep with, you stop sleeping with the person you are exclusive with. If not and the relationship progresses, it might at some point become a full commitment.

 

Maybe to others these are the same thing, but I have always felt they were different.

Edited February 27, 2012 by maybealone

[J322Y]

Maybe I'm weird, but I think of that as being different from commitment. To me, there is dating exclusively (which some people want, as they don't want to sleep with someone who is sleeping around) and there is commitment.

 

Yeah, she pretty much said the same thing, but I'm very literal and specific with my language. If the understanding is that I'm not to date or sleep with anyone else then I have made a commitment.

 

To me, commitment means you aren't going to even look for someone else. Dating exclusively means you stop dating other people, but you can still do what you want when you want and pursue friendships, but if you find someone else you want to sleep with, you stop sleeping with the person you are exclusive with. If not and the relationship progresses, it might at some point become a full commitment.

 

My type of commitment in a LTR might be a little different than most people's. I only promise one thing; not to have sex with others. I don't promise anything else. That means I might socialize with other women, but I would never cheat.

[2sunny]

Yeah, she pretty much said the same thing, but I'm very literal and specific with my language. If the understanding is that I'm not to date or sleep with anyone else then I have made a commitment.

 

 

 

My type of commitment in a LTR might be a little different than most people's. I only promise one thing; not to have sex with others. I don't promise anything else. That means I might socialize with other women, but I would never cheat.

 

Does she understand that YOU view it this way?

 

Since everyone has differing ideas about what commitment means to THEM - you may want to be CLEAR about IF your idea of commitment matches HER idea of EXACTLY what that entails.

 

IF you just recently got out of a long term relationship - what's the rush to get tied down again? It may be useful to explore your options for a long while... Especially since you stated that you're not in it for the sex.

 

Why limit yourself to one gal so soon? That seems confining.

[J322Y]

Does she understand that YOU view it this way?

 

Since everyone has differing ideas about what commitment means to THEM - you may want to be CLEAR about IF your idea of commitment matches HER idea of EXACTLY what that entails.

 

I don't leave much room for misunderstandings when it comes to relationship. I told my last LRT exactly what I was committing to and I would do the same with the next. I think most people kind of fall into a LTR without really thinking about what they're promising. As you point out, everyone's idea is different and that often results in wrong assumptions on both sides. That's why I only promise to be faithful. I don't think it's fair to ask more, especially at my age.

 

IF you just recently got out of a long term relationship - what's the rush to get tied down again? It may be useful to explore your options for a long while... Especially since you stated that you're not in it for the sex.

 

Why limit yourself to one gal so soon? That seems confining.

 

Even though I only left my GF recently I began disconnecting emotionally from her a few years ago. It was a long and difficult process, but I felt there was a chance that we could work it out so I invested the time. It didn't work out in terms of the relationship but I managed to stay friends with her.

 

Why limit myself so soon? That's why I started this thread; I want to meet several women but I'm already running into this issue involving sex and commitment. Of course I want to have sex with people I'm attracted to, but as you say, I don't want to rush into anything. I also don't want to push away women who may possibly be a great LTR for me. Like some have said, I can't have everything so I'm trying to figure out how to deal with it.

[2sunny]

I don't leave much room for misunderstandings when it comes to relationship. I told my last LRT exactly what I was committing to and I would do the same with the next. I think most people kind of fall into a LTR without really thinking about what they're promising. As you point out, everyone's idea is different and that often results in wrong assumptions on both sides. That's why I only promise to be faithful. I don't think it's fair to ask more, especially at my age.

 

 

 

Even though I only left my GF recently I began disconnecting emotionally from her a few years ago. It was a long and difficult process, but I felt there was a chance that we could work it out so I invested the time. It didn't work out in terms of the relationship but I managed to stay friends with her.

 

Why limit myself so soon? That's why I started this thread; I want to meet several women but I'm already running into this issue involving sex and commitment. Of course I want to have sex with people I'm attracted to, but as you say, I don't want to rush into anything. I also don't want to push away women who may possibly be a great LTR for me. Like some have said, I can't have everything so I'm trying to figure out how to deal with it.

 

I will say - I am the same age range as you - but I just don't get it when a woman uses sex as bargaining tool.

 

Either she wants to or she doesn't!

 

Let's pretend...

 

You date her and others for six months - you get no sex from her while you test the waters... See what other women show you - maybe someone else is MORE compatible?

 

Or - you focus in on her... Don't explore other women that may be more aligned with your needs... THEN you are committed - and what IF sex with her isn't great?

 

I don't think sex should be bartered. It kind of sets the tone for HER to use it as a weapon to manipulate and control.

 

I'm not digging it!

[J322Y]

I will say - I am the same age range as you - but I just don't get it when a woman uses sex as bargaining tool.

 

Either she wants to or she doesn't!

 

Let's pretend...

 

You date her and others for six months - you get no sex from her while you test the waters... See what other women show you - maybe someone else is MORE compatible?

 

Or - you focus in on her... Don't explore other women that may be more aligned with your needs... THEN you are committed - and what IF sex with her isn't great?

 

I don't think sex should be bartered. It kind of sets the tone for HER to use it as a weapon to manipulate and control.

 

I'm not digging it!

 

Do you live near me?

[Cypress25]

The truth is that I want basically the same thing as the women I've described, I just want to go about it slowly and thoughtfully.

 

Then wait for sex. Continue to date as many women as you want, take your time and carefully consider all your options, and hold off on sex until you decide which woman you want to commit to.

 

Don't like the sound of that, do you? The truth is, you want to rush sex, but you want to take your time with everything else. Sounds good for you, but doesn't sound fair to the women you're stringing along.

 

My point in this thread is that we give sex too much importance in terms of overall feelings about each other. You can have sexual chemistry with someone but not connect in other important ways. You can also love a person who isn't your ideal sexual partner but you can still enjoy them on that level. Point; I don't think allowing sex to be the defining factor of commitment is a good idea.

 

I understand your point, but I don't think you understand mine. Women didn't just arbitrarily decide to give sex so much importance for the hell of it. For many women, sex has an enormous emotional impact on them. They can't help it. Because sex stirs up such strong emotions for them, they must take it seriously. They can't take it lightly because that would mean repressing their own feelings, which is damn near impossible and really bad for your mental health.

 

You don't think it's a good idea to put so much importance on sex because that interferes with your selfish pursuit of getting easy sex from multiple women. I understand. But try looking at it from the woman's point of view. It's not her goal to aid you in your pursuit of casual sex. It's her goal to protect her own feelings. She does that by reserving sex for committed relationships because it's the best way to avoid the devastating situation of being dumped right after sex. Many women become more attached after sex. They can't help it, it's not a choice. That's just how they feel. It's not your place to tell women how they should feel about sex. That's like telling someone not to be sad when a loved one dies.

 

Clearly, you cannot comprehend how much it hurts to be intimate with a partner and get attached to them, only to have them walk away immediately afterwards because they found someone better. You think women shouldn't care about that? Well, they do. You think it's a bad idea, but it's a great idea for them. It protects them from future heartbreak. These women know what they want and how they feel, and they're acting in their own best interests. Can you blame them? Do you really expect them to ignore their own feelings and act in your best interest, thereby making themselves vulnerable to severe emotional pain? Why the hell should they do that? Just because it would make your life easier?

[Cypress25]

I don't think sex should be bartered. It kind of sets the tone for HER to use it as a weapon to manipulate and control.

 

No one is bartering for sex. Everyone has the right to decide who they want to have sex with, and when they want to have sex, and under what circumstances they want to have sex. These women are not saying "If you do this for me, I'll give you sex." They're simply stating a fact: "I don't have sex outside of committed relationships." With that knowledge, the OP can make a choice: he can wait it out with her or he can walk away.

 

Instead, he's bitching about the fact that these women have too much self-respect to have sex with him before they're ready. "Why do they put so much importance on sex and feelings, why can't they just give me what I want, waaaaaaaaa!" Get over it, OP. Those women don't owe you anything. If sex is important to them, they are well within their rights to decide when and with whom they will have it. They're not bargaining, they're not bartering, they're not manipulating. They're saying they don't want to have sex with a man who is currently dating other women. It's perfectly reasonable, so stop complaining about it.

[J322Y]

Then wait for sex. Continue to date as many women as you want, take your time and carefully consider all your options, and hold off on sex until you decide which woman you want to commit to.

 

I may do just that, but isn't that just me controlling/manipulating women? If a woman understands that I'm not ready to commit but wants to have sex with me why is it better for me to say no to her? Who benefits from that? I'm interested to hear your specific thoughts about this.

 

 

Then wait for sex. Continue to date as many women as you want, take your time and carefully consider all your options, and hold off on sex until you decide which woman you want to commit to.

 

Don't like the sound of that, do you? The truth is, you want to rush sex, but you want to take your time with everything else. Sounds good for you, but doesn't sound fair to the women you're stringing along.

 

It's not a horrible idea, but it's more complicated and artificial than just honestly telling women that I'm not ready to commit and letting them decide what exactly they want with me.

 

How am I "stringing them along" if I'm being honest? If I'm not ready to commit and they understand that then they can make up their own minds. How is it unfair to an adult who understands exactly who I am?

 

 

I understand your point, but I don't think you understand mine. Women didn't just arbitrarily decide to give sex so much importance for the hell of it. For many women, sex has an enormous emotional impact on them. They can't help it. Because sex stirs up such strong emotions for them, they must take it seriously. They can't take it lightly because that would mean repressing their own feelings, which is damn near impossible and really bad for your mental health

 

Not all women are the same as you. A women who is enormously impacted by sex will not date me when she learns that I'm not ready to make a commitment.

 

 

You don't think it's a good idea to put so much importance on sex because that interferes with your selfish pursuit of getting easy sex from multiple women. I understand. But try looking at it from the woman's point of view. It's not her goal to aid you in your pursuit of casual sex. It's her goal to protect her own feelings. She does that by reserving sex for committed relationships because it's the best way to avoid the devastating situation of being dumped right after sex. Many women become more attached after sex. They can't help it, it's not a choice. That's just how they feel. It's not your place to tell women how they should feel about sex. That's like telling someone not to be sad when a loved one dies.

 

If I was after easy sex I would lie like most people, or just go to bars. I'm decent looking and could pick up women if I wanted to, it's just not my thing. You seem to think you speak for all women but I'm pretty sure that you don't. Most women are very happy to meet a man who will not lie to them, at all, and who will discuss these issues as much as they care to. I am extremely respectful to the women in my life, but I don't treat them like children. Emotionally mature women are very capable of hearing the truth and making a good decision. It seems like I hold women in higher regard that you do, at least in some ways.

 

Clearly, you cannot comprehend how much it hurts to be intimate with a partner and get attached to them, only to have them walk away immediately afterwards because they found someone better. You think women shouldn't care about that? Well, they do. You think it's a bad idea, but it's a great idea for them. It protects them from future heartbreak. These women know what they want and how they feel, and they're acting in their own best interests. Can you blame them? Do you really expect them to ignore their own feelings and act in your best interest, thereby making themselves vulnerable to severe emotional pain? Why the hell should they do that? Just because it would make your life easier?

 

I associate with women who are strong and smart enough to make grown up decisions. I don't trick or force anyone into anything. I don't expect anyone to ignore their feelings, I expect them to take care of themselves as all adults should. I tell prospective dates that I'm dating others and not ready to commit even before I meet them. I put it right there in the email. Many of them choose not to respond, so I think we can assume that your fears are unfounded in my case.

 

I don't mind having this discussion with you, but please try to control your attitude.

[J322Y]

No one is bartering for sex. Everyone has the right to decide who they want to have sex with, and when they want to have sex, and under what circumstances they want to have sex. These women are not saying "If you do this for me, I'll give you sex." They're simply stating a fact: "I don't have sex outside of committed relationships." With that knowledge, the OP can make a choice: he can wait it out with her or he can walk away.

 

Instead, he's bitching about the fact that these women have too much self-respect to have sex with him before they're ready. "Why do they put so much importance on sex and feelings, why can't they just give me what I want, waaaaaaaaa!" Get over it, OP. Those women don't owe you anything. If sex is important to them, they are well within their rights to decide when and with whom they will have it. They're not bargaining, they're not bartering, they're not manipulating. They're saying they don't want to have sex with a man who is currently dating other women. It's perfectly reasonable, so stop complaining about it.

 

Now you're just being silly.

[Alexanda]

Sex certainly does not mean commitment. Its just sex. I dont think you should have sex with a woman until you know you want to exclusively date her. Sex complicates and can even confuse things. Sex isnt something to be taken lightly.

[J322Y]

Sex certainly does not mean commitment. Its just sex. I dont think you should have sex with a woman until you know you want to exclusively date her. Sex complicates and can even confuse things. Sex isnt something to be taken lightly.

 

I'm not understanding your post. It seems contradictory to me.

[maybealone]

I will say - I am the same age range as you - but I just don't get it when a woman uses sex as bargaining tool.

 

Either she wants to or she doesn't!

 

I don't think it's a bargaining tool to not want to sleep with someone who is sleeping around. Some people just don't want to do that.

 

Or - you focus in on her... Don't explore other women that may be more aligned with your needs... THEN you are committed - and what IF sex with her isn't great?

 

He's not marrying these women. If the sex wasn't great and he didn't think it could get great, he would have no reason not to just walk away and find someone more sexually compatible.

 

My type of commitment in a LTR might be a little different than most people's. I only promise one thing; not to have sex with others. I don't promise anything else. That means I might socialize with other women, but I would never cheat.

 

Yeah, that's what I would call exclusively dating. I've been in many committed relationships including a marriage, and I have never asked a man to not socialize with other women. But it sounds more like you are talking about some sort of pseudo-dating, where you are socializing with the intent of possibly finding someone better than the person you are committed to. With my definition of commitment, that would be cheating.

 

OP, I think being honest with these women (as you have been) is really your only option, though I think it would be better for you to move on and find women who aren't looking for a relationship. They will be much less likely to want an exclusive dating situation before sex.

[J322Y]

My type of commitment in a LTR might be a little different than most people's. I only promise one thing; not to have sex with others. I don't promise anything else. That means I might socialize with other women, but I would never cheat.

Yeah, that's what I would call exclusively dating. I've been in many committed relationships including a marriage, and I have never asked a man to not socialize with other women. But it sounds more like you are talking about some sort of pseudo-dating, where you are socializing with the intent of possibly finding someone better than the person you are committed to. With my definition of commitment, that would be cheating.

 

I'm a little confused. I'm not saying that I want a commitment now. I don't think I'm talking about pseudo-dating. I'm talking about dating multiple women and making sure that they understand that I'm not ready for a LTR yet. It's as simple as that. I'm single so my responsibility is to take care of myself while respecting others. When I eventually get into a LTR I will focus less on myself and more on my partner. I'm very nurturing in a LTR.

 

OP, I think being honest with these women (as you have been) is really your only option, though I think it would be better for you to move on and find women who aren't looking for a relationship. They will be much less likely to want an exclusive dating situation before sex.

 

If I'm honest doesn't that take care of everything? Once a woman understands what's in my heart and in my mind she can decide how she wants to deal with it. Isn't it better for the women to decide for themselves if they want to move on?

 

I understand that there will probably be difficult situations for both me and the women I date. I think it's more important that I be true to myself than to make it easy on them and myself. I really want to jump into a relationship with one of the women I'm seeing, but I think it's too soon so I'm making a hard decision. I risk losing someone I'm very attracted to. I don't like it but it seems like the responsible way to handle it. I wouldn't be doing anyone a favor by jumping into a LTR too soon.

[2sunny]

Do you live near me?

 

I don't live near you - if you are in Florida.

 

From my experience - it seems the courting of a gal is a lost art for most men.

 

Since you're not looking to get married right away - just take it slow and have fun with whoever you meet and tend to enjoy. It could be one - it could be four gals...

 

Over time - most people will show you their true nature... And seeing how they act/react in different situations tends to tell me whether or not they are my style.

 

Many times - it takes a crisis situation for me to determine how much I may or may not admire their character. I am more attracted to men who stay calm and don't over react to dramatic situations. I don't do well if people around me aren't mellow and clear minded and completely focused.

 

As direct as I am with words - my general aura is calm and soothing... I find that gentle demeanor in a man attractive to me - although I also like him to be strong minded and centered.honesty wins BIG points but is rare.

 

If and when I realize a lie - he's history - of course after pointing out his lie... Grrr

[maybealone]

I'm a little confused. I'm not saying that I want a commitment now. I don't think I'm talking about pseudo-dating. I'm talking about dating multiple women and making sure that they understand that I'm not ready for a LTR yet. It's as simple as that. I'm single so my responsibility is to take care of myself while respecting others. When I eventually get into a LTR I will focus less on myself and more on my partner. I'm very nurturing in a LTR.

 

Sorry I was confusing. I know what you are doing now, and I actually think it's great that you know you are not ready for a LTR and that you aren't leading anyone on. But earlier you said that to you, a LTR is promising not to have sex with other people and that seemed to be your definition of "not cheating." To me, a LTR is more than that -- it's also not actively looking.

 

When the only agreement is to not have sex with other people, that's exclusive dating to me. That would mean you are free to focus on yourself, do whatever you want to do, and even meet women with the intent of possibly finding someone you would rather date, you just won't sleep with anyone else until you are not longer in an exclusive arrangement.

 

If I'm honest doesn't that take care of everything? Once a woman understands what's in my heart and in my mind she can decide how she wants to deal with it. Isn't it better for the women to decide for themselves if they want to move on?

 

Absolutely! Like I said, I think you are doing the best anyone could under these circumstances. I'm just suggesting that it might be better to look for women who want to date around too, because they probably aren't looking for any sort of exclusive arrangement before sex.

 

Even with complete and total honesty, some woman are going to hope they are going to change your mind. Just as you might be hoping they change theirs and decide to not wait for any sort of exclusive agreement. Starting out by choosing women who aren't looking for any kind of relationship from the beginning might be better for everyone.

Edited February 28, 2012 by maybealone

[J322Y]

Sorry I was confusing. I know what you are doing now, and I actually think it's great that you know you are not ready for a LTR and that you aren't leading anyone on. But earlier you said that to you, a LTR is promising not to have sex with other people and that seemed to be your definition of "not cheating." To me, a LTR is more than that -- it's also not actively looking.

 

When the only agreement is to not have sex with other people, that's exclusive dating to me. That would mean you are free to focus on yourself, do whatever you want to do, and even meet women with the intent of possibly finding someone you would rather date, you just won't sleep with anyone else until you are not longer in an exclusive arrangement.

 

You almost understand me. I would never make a commitment to a woman with the intent of finding someone I would rather date. I probably should have left my 13 year LTR four years before I did, but I'm very hesitant to give up on a relationship. The same is true of my 10 year marriage; I probably should have left much sooner. I put a lot of effort into salvaging those relationships and at least I managed to keep both my exwife and ex GF as close friends. My reluctance to exit LTR's is why I think I'm nervous about starting another one so soon.

 

 

Absolutely! Like I said, I think you are doing the best anyone could under these circumstances. I'm just suggesting that it might be better to look for women who want to date around too, because they probably aren't looking for any sort of exclusive arrangement before sex.

 

Even with complete and total honesty, some woman are going to hope they are going to change your mind. Just as you might be hoping they change theirs and decide to not wait for any sort of exclusive agreement. Starting out by choosing women who aren't looking for any kind of relationship from the beginning might be better for everyone.

 

I do avoid OLD profiles that specify they are looking for a LTR. I've explained to my dates that I'm dating others before meeting them. Also, I do want to meet women that are potential LTR's, I just don't want to rush into anything.

 

It's kind of funny; many women criticize men because they want to rush into sex (I don't), but women often want to rush into a LTR. I really just want to slow the process down a little. Yes, that means a women who really likes me might "lose" me, but isn't that a risk we all need to accept? I don't like the idea of me losing a cool women either, but objectively it's better for that woman if she finds someone she likes more, just as it's better for me if I find a better match.