fortyninethousand322 Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 I... really don't see your point. That people only care about the opinions of people who are attractive to them? No kidding. Let me ask you this, do you stress out about the opinion of a fat girl? If a fat girl was like," Oh my gosh, I'd never date a guy in a turtleneck," would you think "Women are so superficial and demanding!" or would you think," Pfft, like you should have standards." Depends. You act as if men have never found any fat women to be attractive. There actually have been some overweight women I've met in my life that were in fact very attractive. And I would care about their opinion. In my experience, women aren't necessarily completely superficial about things that you would normally think they would be. I've known women who would date a very strange looking guy who had a decent job but nothing special but who didn't know how to take care of himself (couldn't wash clothes or dishes for example) but would shudder at the thought of some other guy who looked better and had a better job (and was a fairly pleasant guy) because he wore odd looking shoes or something. It's just nonsense. Furthermore, average women (ya know, the ones dating average men) STILL get stressed out being perfect. All you need to do is compare the dating advice of men compared to women. For men, dating advice nearly stops after the relationship starts. Once a guy attracts a woman, it's pretty much just coasting. For women, not only does she need to attract a guy, but she needs to MAINTAIN the attraction. Thus, the constant pressure to be perfect. That's like complaining that men's health magazines focus on prostate exams while women's magazine focus on breast cancer screenings. I mean that's just gender differences. Most men have problems just getting dates most women have problems getting quality men to have a relationship with.
ThaWholigan Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 Don't be surprised if no female wants to participate in your "Desperation learning curve" experiment. It's selfish and manipulative that you would date someone just to give yourself "experience" or out of some desperation for a relationship. Agree. If I want to date someone, it's because I truly want to date them, not because I need to date someone, anyone as long as they have lady parts . I want to meet a girl obviously, but I'm not unhappy being single.
fortyninethousand322 Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 Don't be surprised if no female wants to participate in your "Desperation learning curve" experiment. It's selfish and manipulative that you would date someone just to give yourself "experience" or out of some desperation for a relationship. Well, I think I might be still young enough to not have to worry about some things. But if you're SD who is 30 years old and has never had a relationship that has to be more of a turnoff to more women than desperation. It's like telling someone in the desert that they should stop acting so thirsty because no one is going to want to give them water. Look, it's a toss up. At some point no one is going to want to date SD because his resume is full of holes. What's he supposed to do then, double down on his high standards?
Author jobaba Posted February 28, 2012 Author Posted February 28, 2012 The 'they are superficial' point of view is complete BS, it's a cop out. It lets the person who got rejected blame it on the person who rejected them, and avoid addressing any issues they might have. I'm not talking about a first approach rejection either, as they are almost always physical because it's the easiest criteria to reject someone by. If you have been out on a few dates with someone and then been rejected it was for a reason other than physical attraction. SD has a problem, he is still f'ed up buy a woman he was never in a relationship with, and hasn't talked to in months. That is a big damn issue, he missed or completely ignored many signs that she didn't want a romantic relationship with him. IMO he needs to re-evaluate how he views comparability, because it obviously doesn't jive with the women he wants. Completely disagree Ronin. I have had women friends tell me straight up the reason they were not interested in me romantically is because they had no physical attraction to me. And I have been rejected by women who have said to me they'll date Bob, Jim, or Joe when they've gotten to know him all of a week. As emotional as some women are, do you really think they would let something like 'compatibility and common interests' deter them if they were really HOT for a guy?
NXS Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 You're kidding right? There are THOUSANDS of studies that show that women are constantly stressed out by all the things THEY have to be to attract a man. The women's magazines you're citing are pretty much nothing but articles on how to please your man, how to look good for your man, how to act correctly for your man, how to not be a dried-up-career-lady so you can GET a man, etc. To get a man, you have to be attractive, but not any type of attractive, you have to sexy and stylish and mysterious and confident, and you need to wear the right lingerie, and the right type of shoes. You also need to be smart, but not TOO smart or you'll intimidate him. You also need to be independent but not TOO independent, or you'll intimidate him. Don't call him, because then you're needy, unless he's giving signals that he wants you to call him, cause then if you don't, you're playing games. The list goes on, and on, and on. Women are under constant pressure to be perfect. Sexy girlfriends, supportive wife, maternal mothers, constantly balancing home (where women still do the majority of chores and child care) and work (where the majority work just as many hours as men.) Who writes all these articles? Yes that's right... women and gay men. They never ask men what men want they just come up with this constant rubbish and women buy it. Don't take my word for it look at the threads here on LS, have you ever seen men writing lists of what they want from women? Just even look at this thread and the only lists are coming from women, you won't see any big list of what men want because there is none, men are very basic in what we want from women. Btw women do not work the same hours as men and men's activities in the home are never included in any of these surveys but that's getting off on a tangent here. We could just as easily turn your argument back on you. "Don't you know how demanding MEN are? You don't know, you've never dated men!" There are just as many men with ridiculous standards.... Can you give an example of men's ridiculous standards? For example, in a recent Guysource article on Jezebel, men were discussing their preference of boobs. The summary? Men require large boobs (not small, and not "comically" big, whatever that is) that are also perky. Except that rarely happens in nature. Physics, y'know? Oh, and you better not just any kind of plastic surgery, or else you have self-esteem/Daddy issues. Except.... how the heck else are you supposed to get big perky boobs EXCEPT through plastic surgery?! And this wasn't one guy who expressed this opinion, but all but one of the guys referenced! So let's see which standard is more unrealistic: guys shouldn't wear turtle necks, or girls should have large perky boobs, but only naturally. Hmmm. Jezebel is a feminist site which has no credibility for me. Men may discuss their preference for boobs but that's just fantasy stuff, it has no basis in real life. It's like asking women what their ideal man would be and then writing an article about how absurd women's demands are. I'm not basing my opinions on some survey/article I'm basing it on real life, with real women who have absurd demands.
ThaWholigan Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 Who writes all these articles? Yes that's right... women and gay men. They never ask men what men want they just come up with this constant rubbish and women buy it. There is a large dollop of truth in this statement, something I have always believed. It's like Chris Rock used to say - "Men desire 3 things - food, sex & silence"
somedude81 Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 For example, in a recent Guysource article on Jezebel, men were discussing their preference of boobs. The summary? Men require large boobs (not small, and not "comically" big, whatever that is) that are also perky. Except that rarely happens in nature. Physics, y'know? Oh, and you better not just any kind of plastic surgery, or else you have self-esteem/Daddy issues. Except.... how the heck else are you supposed to get big perky boobs EXCEPT through plastic surgery?! And this wasn't one guy who expressed this opinion, but all but one of the guys referenced! So let's see which standard is more unrealistic: guys shouldn't wear turtle necks, or girls should have large perky boobs, but only naturally. Hmmm. This just in; verhrzn has great boobs. More at 11.
verhrzn Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 Who writes all these articles? Yes that's right... women and gay men. They never ask men what men want they just come up with this constant rubbish and women buy it. Don't take my word for it look at the threads here on LS, have you ever seen men writing lists of what they want from women? Just even look at this thread and the only lists are coming from women, you won't see any big list of what men want because there is none, men are very basic in what we want from women. Jezebel is a feminist site which has no credibility for me. Men may discuss their preference for boobs but that's just fantasy stuff, it has no basis in real life. It's like asking women what their ideal man would be and then writing an article about how absurd women's demands are. I'm not basing my opinions on some survey/article I'm basing it on real life, with real women who have absurd demands. So let me get this straight... the reasons those women's articles are ridiculous is because they were written by women. But when women DO go and ask men what they want, then we shouldn't listen to what the men actually SAY because it's "fantasy." Men don't give lists because men don't think about it, or they aren't honest about it. It doesn't mean they don't have them. A lot of guys grow up with an entitled idea of what they should get in a woman, but they don't think of it as a "list of requirements"... they just see it as "the way things are." Men have plenty of ridiculous standards about women's bodies. It's EVERYWHERE. Women are constantly indited with information about what's wrong with us; we have too much hair, we're too fat, we're too skinny, we're too tall (yes, guys have height requirements as well), we're too "frumpy," we're too prudish, we're too slutty, on and on. Tell me, how often do you shave/wax all of your hair from waist down? Men take it for granted that women do it all the time. And yet somehow a woman's standard that she doesn't like turtlenecks on a guy is awful and SOOOO strenuous? Gimme a break.
AD1980 Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 Many men underestimate how much of their true self they are projecting to people - in fact I would go as far as to say that most don't even know what they truly think. I think it's telling that Somedude thinks that people who are positive despite all their hardships are delusional, when I don't think that it's completely farfetched that he himself could possibly be deluded. It's amazing how people act with regards to the experiences in their lives and how they react to them. I really dont buy that womens intution garbage and how they can see through people more then Men considering how many use bad judgement in Men and didnt sniff these guys out right away If somedude was 6'2 muscular and handsome he woludnt be having these exact problems and hed have some experience an confidence underneath him
NXS Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 So let me get this straight... the reasons those women's articles are ridiculous is because they were written by women. But when women DO go and ask men what they want, then we shouldn't listen to what the men actually SAY because it's "fantasy." They don't ask men what men want unless it's framed in a way to make men look like monsters or idiots, that's my point. Asking men about boobs is a typical example of this and the fact that this was on a site like Jezebel and presumably had numerous feminists pointing and screeching is standard fare. Do they ever ask men real questions about what men really want? No they don't because they couldn't care less what men really want. Men don't give lists because men don't think about it, or they aren't honest about it. It doesn't mean they don't have them. A lot of guys grow up with an entitled idea of what they should get in a woman, but they don't think of it as a "list of requirements"... they just see it as "the way things are." The "lists" of what men want are very basic, they want their basic needs met. Now you may see that as entitlement but for me it's just basic human needs. Being treated like a human being and not a disposable item. Men have plenty of ridiculous standards about women's bodies. It's EVERYWHERE. Women are constantly indited with information about what's wrong with us; we have too much hair, we're too fat, we're too skinny, we're too tall (yes, guys have height requirements as well), we're too "frumpy," we're too prudish, we're too slutty, on and on. Tell me, how often do you shave/wax all of your hair from waist down? Men take it for granted that women do it all the time. And yet somehow a woman's standard that she doesn't like turtlenecks on a guy is awful and SOOOO strenuous? Gimme a break. Again, most of this stuff is women projecting what men want instead of asking them. Furthermore I'm convinced that a lot of women dress for themselves and their friends and not for men, except to try and get attention from men. I don't believe women do this for men in general.
ThaWholigan Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 I really dont buy that womens intution garbage and how they can see through people more then Men considering how many use bad judgement in Men and didnt sniff these guys out right away If somedude was 6'2 muscular and handsome he woludnt be having these exact problems and hed have some experience an confidence underneath him It's people's intuition, not women's. Women are just more attuned at certain details of social science than men are, in general anyway. Not that men don't have that ability at all, but generally it is more developed in girls. Hypothetically, I think that if Somedude was 6 foot 2, muscular and handsome, he may have a little more success than he has now, but he wouldn't be better off in my opinion. He would probably find something else to complain about or be depressed about.
zengirl Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 Many men underestimate how much of their true self they are projecting to people - in fact I would go as far as to say that most don't even know what they truly think. I think it's telling that Somedude thinks that people who are positive despite all their hardships are delusional, when I don't think that it's completely farfetched that he himself could possibly be deluded. It's amazing how people act with regards to the experiences in their lives and how they react to them. Yes. I don't know why SD and people like him (not just men, I think plenty of women do this too) think that people need to be TOLD something in order to pick up on it. We all have the power of inference, and you're not hiding it that well!
ThaWholigan Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 Yes. I don't know why SD and people like him (not just men, I think plenty of women do this too) think that people need to be TOLD something in order to pick up on it. We all have the power of inference, and you're not hiding it that well! Completely agree with you, women do this also. I don't know why some people think that people cannot pick up people's undertones at all. Some people are acutely able to read people's body language (a la Mentalist), some are able to pick up on a vibe or a feeling around them etc. Either way, it's difficult to hide from a lot of people. It's an unconscious thing IMO.
binny Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 have you ever seen men writing lists of what they want from women? Actually, I have some male friends who have lists about what they want from woman. In their lists things like hair colour, height etc are included. Perhaps not all men write lists but some do and they are no worse than many womens lists! In fact, I don't know any woman's list about what she wants from a man to include hair colour, height etc...
Lonely Ronin Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 The biggest issue I see on this forum from both men and women, is that they don't understand dating at all. Many seem to think if they make it past date 3 or 4 or some other arbitrary number then they are golden. as a man I see it as follows: 1. I ask a woman out and she says yes. (she has passed my physical requirements, and I hers) 2. After some number of dates we reach a level of trust and romantic intimacy develops. (we have both concluded that the other is normal and worth getting to know better) 3. Conversations become deeper, sleep overs take place, we reach a level of physical intimacy we are both comfortable with. 4. Conversations become deeper life goals and significant past life experiences are discussed. Things like do you want children are discussed. 5. Friends and family become aware that we are seeing someone 6. We start interacting as a couple in front of friends and family. Labels are openly used. (dating is over you're now in a relationship) 7. Deep emotional feelings for the other are expressed, terms like love joy happiness are usually are usually used when referring to the other person. 8. Talks of a life together happen 9. Marriage is proposed & accepted 10. A marriage occurs 11. The never ending process of growing and changing with the other begins 13. Children can potentially happen 12. The relationship eventually ends because of old age. So many people here seem to think they are golden if they make it past step 3. They also seem to think being rejected after this point means something is wrong with the other person. You can be rejected at any point and it can be no ones fault. However i do believe the further you get the more likely it is that someone is at fault. I made it through #9 in my last LTR and we where both equally at fault. She wasn't honest with me or herself about some of my personality traits that she didn't like, and I let stuff slide and took her at her word, even though some times stuff didn't feel right to me. Depending on the individuals in question, the order of some steps can be moved around, and the speed at with steps are checked of can vary greatly.
Teknoe Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 We had a lot of things in common because we had a lot of things in common. What is so hard to understand? Sure, maybe you and her had some things in common, like enjoying video games, having the same class together, and such. But she meant her comment on other things "We really don't have much in common" (i.e. sense of values, perhaps goals, age gap... she was 21 you were 30, etc.) What is so hard to understand about that? She was always nice and very understanding. Then she suddenly snapped and cut me off without any explanation. Um, don't you remember you yourself posting "I feel the end is coming. She is contacting me less and less. In fact, I was surprised when she said she could hang out ____. But I'll take it. I'll take whatever she gives me." YOU SAW THE END COMING! YOU ADMITTED SO Now you claim you didn't see it coming. Wow. I think that says it all, don't you? She was somebody I strongly cared about and felt very close to, and after a minor fight she decided to disappear. To this day I'm still confused. And I'm mad because she took away what I enjoyed most in this world. Minor fight? Again, you're being delusional. Just calling it like it is. Nothing is minor when a girl tells you to basically butt out of her life. And D is SUPER NICE. She put up with you for a couple years, she didn't know how to tell you nicely to back off. You pushed her to the limits and she was looking to get out of the "friendship" first chance she could take. While the breast joke was the straw that broke the camel's back, don't think it was isolated. Her wanting out was an accumulation of your act growing thin on her. An older, more mature girl would have exited the friendship a lot earlier. Because D was a 21 year old super nice puppy, she had to be pushed to the extreme to finally tell you off. It wasn't a minor fight that separated you from her. She simply didn't like you as a friend very much, especially the more demanding and clingy you became in the 2nd half of the friendship.
AD1980 Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 The biggest issue I see on this forum from both men and women, is that they don't understand dating at all. Many seem to think if they make it past date 3 or 4 or some other arbitrary number then they are golden. as a man I see it as follows: 1. I ask a woman out and she says yes. (she has passed my physical requirements, and I hers) 2. After some number of dates we reach a level of trust and romantic intimacy develops. (we have both concluded that the other is normal and worth getting to know better) 3. Conversations become deeper, sleep overs take place, we reach a level of physical intimacy we are both comfortable with. 4. Conversations become deeper life goals and significant past life experiences are discussed. Things like do you want children are discussed. 5. Friends and family become aware that we are seeing someone 6. We start interacting as a couple in front of friends and family. Labels are openly used. (dating is over you're now in a relationship) 7. Deep emotional feelings for the other are expressed, terms like love joy happiness are usually are usually used when referring to the other person. 8. Talks of a life together happen 9. Marriage is proposed & accepted 10. A marriage occurs 11. The never ending process of growing and changing with the other begins 13. Children can potentially happen 12. The relationship eventually ends because of old age. So many people here seem to think they are golden if they make it past step 3. They also seem to think being rejected after this point means something is wrong with the other person. You can be rejected at any point and it can be no ones fault. However i do believe the further you get the more likely it is that someone is at fault. I made it through #9 in my last LTR and we where both equally at fault. She wasn't honest with me or herself about some of my personality traits that she didn't like, and I let stuff slide and took her at her word, even though some times stuff didn't feel right to me. Depending on the individuals in question, the order of some steps can be moved around, and the speed at with steps are checked of can vary greatly. I cant even get past step 1
somedude81 Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 Hell, if somedude81 was 5'10 he'd be a total player. Women wouldn't be able to resist him.
zengirl Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 My colleague with the V-neck rule was at an office night out a couple of months ago to a karaoki bar. The guy hosting the karaoki was a very good looking guy, good personality, good singer etc but she didn't want anything to do with him because he broke her golden rule. It was absurd. I would bet, based on what I know of human nature (and it's not just women who do this, but men do it a bit differently perhaps) that she was looking for excuses not to be interested in him. Plenty of people do that, yes, and it sometimes signals either some internal unavailability of the person who's being nitpicky or sometimes is just following your feelings. I'm sure there are a few rare women who really do follow their checklists, but I think you'll find many women threw them out for the right guy. And men do this too, though they don't exactly do it with checklists---they'll back away from a perfectly good (on paper) prospect with seemingly stupid excuses, too. Except really the only reason you ever need not to date someone is that you don't want to date them. This socialization of women is the problem; books/magazines/movies/ads/talk shows etc all telling women what they should be demanding from men. There's nothing whatsoever about what women should give in return, it's all me me me me. This has not been my experience, being socialized as a woman. In fact, women's magazines consistently tell women how to PLEASE men. They (all different kinds, from Homemaker type magazines to Cosmo Sexcapades) give women sex, beauty, behavior, recipe, etc, tips to attempt to make women more pleasing to men. Whether or not the tips are actually valid varies, of course; some are just stupid, but women are much more likely to be brought up as people-pleasers in general than men, so that's pretty silly. And ads! Geez, all the ads geared towards making women prettified and such for men. . . I think you're seeing a very skewed version of socialization. (Though, yes, women nowadays are told to demand their worth more frequently than women of the past, but they are also taught to be pleasers, so it's more ambivalence and dissonance than anything.) The result is a large number of what I can only describe as pampered, selfish, childlike women with ever more absurd demands and no sense of give and take. I'm beginning to think that some of these absurd rules, like my above example, are nothing more than some kind of status symbol that women use to compete with each other. It's like how much more absurd can I be and still get a man. No, they're about control. Women, generally, make lists because it makes us feel more in control (not just in dating). We fixate on standards. Women are socialized to believe that women are, by nature, 'emotional' (whether they are or not) and the tick marks of making a list and checking it off helps a woman feel grounded in logic where she might otherwise feel out of control. And, yes, some use excuses to remain either emotionally unavailable or just to justify not liking someone they sincerely don't like but don't want to just SAY that. Too many (not all) women are taught not to assert themselves too clearly, which is a real problem. I wish more women were taught that it was okay to assert yourself and want whatever it is you truly want. I'm sure many of the female posters here think that I and some of the other guys here are exaggerating about all of this but the fact is you've never dated women and you don't know what it's like. And you've never been a woman and you don't truly know why anyone else does what they do. (Neither do I, but I think I have a better grasp because I'm more objective since I don't date them or care why they're doing it, particularly.)
verhrzn Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 I No, they're about control. Women, generally, make lists because it makes us feel more in control (not just in dating). We fixate on standards. Women are socialized to believe that women are, by nature, 'emotional' (whether they are or not) and the tick marks of making a list and checking it off helps a woman feel grounded in logic where she might otherwise feel out of control. And, yes, some use excuses to remain either emotionally unavailable or just to justify not liking someone they sincerely don't like but don't want to just SAY that. Too many (not all) women are taught not to assert themselves too clearly, which is a real problem. I wish more women were taught that it was okay to assert yourself and want whatever it is you truly want. Ooo this is actually a really good insight. I've never thought about it like this before, but I fully endorse it. To build on that observation, it seems like women need excuses (thus the list) in order to reject someone. Guys can get very aggressive and angry about rejection, so a list may be a form of protection. "Nothing personal, it's because you have a turtleneck on!"
Teknoe Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 About 4 of us tried, for several pages of one of your threads. It culminated in you getting very angry and accusing all of us for 'attacking you' and 'getting defensive', so I decided not to bother in this thread. Your life, your loss. Yeah, pretty much. SD, I'm out of this discussion. I can only try to help so much before it's hitting a brick wall over and over. +1000000000000!!!!!!!! Hell, if somedude81 was 5'10 he'd be a total player. Women wouldn't be able to resist him. I can only try to help so much before it's hitting a brick wall over and over. He really doesn't want help. He likes the anonymous venting since he doesn't have real life friends to share this with. He likes the fact that he can log on Loveshack, rant away, and basically have zero accountability. (Face to face he can't ignore you but on the net he can and will). He needs to quit worrying about 'defending himself' on Loveshack and he needs to quit worrying about how to get a girl. If he would just focus his energies on living out healthy habits physically, emotionally and spiritually, he would actually be... attractive. I think deep down he's too scared though to make the efforts that would bring him the results he desires. It's kind of ironic when you think about it. It's easier with the hurt that is familiar, tried-and-true, than to try new things and still be hurt. But he'll never know until he applies himself. Sadly, rather than applying himself, he relegates himself to the tried and true: complaining on LS, trying to 'defend himself' in just about every thread he "takes over" with his junk time in, time out.
Author jobaba Posted February 28, 2012 Author Posted February 28, 2012 The biggest issue I see on this forum from both men and women, is that they don't understand dating at all. Many seem to think if they make it past date 3 or 4 or some other arbitrary number then they are golden. as a man I see it as follows: 1. I ask a woman out and she says yes. (she has passed my physical requirements, and I hers) 2. After some number of dates we reach a level of trust and romantic intimacy develops. (we have both concluded that the other is normal and worth getting to know better) 3. Conversations become deeper, sleep overs take place, we reach a level of physical intimacy we are both comfortable with. 4. Conversations become deeper life goals and significant past life experiences are discussed. Things like do you want children are discussed. 5. Friends and family become aware that we are seeing someone 6. We start interacting as a couple in front of friends and family. Labels are openly used. (dating is over you're now in a relationship) 7. Deep emotional feelings for the other are expressed, terms like love joy happiness are usually are usually used when referring to the other person. 8. Talks of a life together happen 9. Marriage is proposed & accepted 10. A marriage occurs 11. The never ending process of growing and changing with the other begins 13. Children can potentially happen 12. The relationship eventually ends because of old age. So many people here seem to think they are golden if they make it past step 3. They also seem to think being rejected after this point means something is wrong with the other person. You can be rejected at any point and it can be no ones fault. However i do believe the further you get the more likely it is that someone is at fault. I made it through #9 in my last LTR and we where both equally at fault. She wasn't honest with me or herself about some of my personality traits that she didn't like, and I let stuff slide and took her at her word, even though some times stuff didn't feel right to me. Depending on the individuals in question, the order of some steps can be moved around, and the speed at with steps are checked of can vary greatly. 'Dating' as I defined it to suck, is the vast chasm for me between #1 and #2, getting a woman to like you and facing heart wrenching rejection. I understand not everybody has this problem. Anything past #3 and even really #2 is more a 'relationship' if not boyfriend/girlfriend. Relationships do not suck...
Anela Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 My colleague with the V-neck rule was at an office night out a couple of months ago to a karaoki bar. The guy hosting the karaoki was a very good looking guy, good personality, good singer etc but she didn't want anything to do with him because he broke her golden rule. It was absurd. This socialization of women is the problem; books/magazines/movies/ads/talk shows etc all telling women what they should be demanding from men. There's nothing whatsoever about what women should give in return, it's all me me me me. The result is a large number of what I can only describe as pampered, selfish, childlike women with ever more absurd demands and no sense of give and take. I'm beginning to think that some of these absurd rules, like my above example, are nothing more than some kind of status symbol that women use to compete with each other. It's like how much more absurd can I be and still get a man. I'm sure many of the female posters here think that I and some of the other guys here are exaggerating about all of this but the fact is you've never dated women and you don't know what it's like. There are those of us who have been overlooked in favour of the "me, me, me" girls, after men had said they didn't want that type of person. Try to be fair, kind, etc, and that's what I get in return. I should have avoided them like the "me, me, me" girls before these guys regained some confidence thanks to my liking them and giving them the time of day; those "me, me, me" girls saw that these guys (one in particular) had anger issues and insecurities, whereas I was, again, trying to be fair, since I had my own issues. Bah. I'm still recovering from a fricking cold. I shouldn't be in here. this is making me feel more sick. damn it.
Anela Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 You're kidding right? There are THOUSANDS of studies that show that women are constantly stressed out by all the things THEY have to be to attract a man. The women's magazines you're citing are pretty much nothing but articles on how to please your man, how to look good for your man, how to act correctly for your man, how to not be a dried-up-career-lady so you can GET a man, etc. To get a man, you have to be attractive, but not any type of attractive, you have to sexy and stylish and mysterious and confident, and you need to wear the right lingerie, and the right type of shoes. You also need to be smart, but not TOO smart or you'll intimidate him. You also need to be independent but not TOO independent, or you'll intimidate him. Don't call him, because then you're needy, unless he's giving signals that he wants you to call him, cause then if you don't, you're playing games. The list goes on, and on, and on. Women are under constant pressure to be perfect. Sexy girlfriends, supportive wife, maternal mothers, constantly balancing home (where women still do the majority of chores and child care) and work (where the majority work just as many hours as men.) We could just as easily turn your argument back on you. "Don't you know how demanding MEN are? You don't know, you've never dated men!" There are just as many men with ridiculous standards.... For example, in a recent Guysource article on Jezebel, men were discussing their preference of boobs. The summary? Men require large boobs (not small, and not "comically" big, whatever that is) that are also perky. Except that rarely happens in nature. Physics, y'know? Oh, and you better not just any kind of plastic surgery, or else you have self-esteem/Daddy issues. Except.... how the heck else are you supposed to get big perky boobs EXCEPT through plastic surgery?! And this wasn't one guy who expressed this opinion, but all but one of the guys referenced! So let's see which standard is more unrealistic: guys shouldn't wear turtle necks, or girls should have large perky boobs, but only naturally. Hmmm. Yep. It seems like we're constantly told from a young age, thanks to magazines and what-not, how we can be more attractive to men and keep them around. The advice is rarely, "Like yourself, be kind to yourself and others, take care of yourself because it's good for YOU, study whatever you're interested in, etc" - it's how to keep him satisfied, how to lose 20lbs in no time, that hair dye, full of pictures that have been photoshopped. adverts with girls in school advertising a cream or mask that makes you look years younger.
Teknoe Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 Yep. It seems like we're constantly told from a young age, thanks to magazines and what-not, how we can be more attractive to men and keep them around. The advice is rarely, "Like yourself, be kind to yourself and others, take care of yourself because it's good for YOU, study whatever you're interested in, etc" - it's how to keep him satisfied, how to lose 20lbs in no time, that hair dye, full of pictures that have been photoshopped. adverts with girls in school advertising a cream or mask that makes you look years younger. exactly. that's why we have to make a concerted effort to DAILY renew our minds and the way we have been programmed to think and view life (and dating). If you want to be healthier, start doing more healthy habits (i.e. eating right, sleeping right, thinking positively, thinking of others' needs first, helping out others, etc.) It isn't rocket science..
Recommended Posts