maylis Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 (edited) What are reasonable expectations from the liar? Do you even bother if you have been lied to? How do you regain trust? What helps you to feel reassured? My situation in particular - in Nov my bf (now ex as of today) told me in his last relationship he used to hide a friendship with a girl. The information he gave me is that they basically had an emotional cheating thing going on (no sex, but flirting and keeping it from their significant others). I was concerned but he told me they hadn't spoke since her bf saw a message he had written (Jan 2011). 30 Dec I was taking his phone off the charger to charge mine and it rings - text message from this girl. I asked him about it and he said that he lied and they still do talk. I tried this entire last month to deal with it, we argued every week since then and its because he started keeping his phone on vibrate (first time in the entire time I have known him), if I asked any question in regards to that he got super defensive and she was continuing to text message him. Two nights ago he said he was just going to ignore them. Yesterday he received another and I said it is best to deal with problems directly and not ignore her - tell her you aren't talking to her anymore. He said he wanted to do that in private, I was reluctant but eventually agreed if he did it by text message. He agreed. This morning I asked if I could see his phone, he gave it to me. He asked why I wanted to see it and I said I want to be reassured and he said we think we should break up. I said I agreed and that was it. I am 30 and he is 27. Edited January 27, 2012 by maylis
ditzchic Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 The only thing you can reasonably expect from a liar is more lies. I don't even deal with liars anymore. First lie and I am out the door. In my entire life, once someone has lost my trust they have never been able to gain it back. I would rather start over with someone fresh than try and repair the damage. You're ex sounds incredibly untrustworthy. I think you dodged a bullet here.
shayla Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 I've got to agree with this. If I had walked the first lie out of my ex's mouth, I could have avoided 3 years of suffering. The lies never stopped and they are still going on right now, one year after the break up. You will never have anything good with a liar. There will be no trust and you will drive yourself crazy wondering where the truth is, and trying to find the truth. With him, you never will.
FitChick Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 First lie and I am out the door. What if he told you that you had a better body than his ex, then you found her on the cover of Sports Illustrated's bathing suit issue? What if you bought a dress, told him you loved it and asked for his opinion? He hated it,thought you looked awful but lied and said you looked great. People need to prioritize. Cheating isn't the same as the above examples but they are both lies. The world isn't black and white.
ditzchic Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 What if he told you that you had a better body than his ex, then you found her on the cover of Sports Illustrated's bathing suit issue? What if you bought a dress, told him you loved it and asked for his opinion? He hated it,thought you looked awful but lied and said you looked great. People need to prioritize. Cheating isn't the same as the above examples but they are both lies. The world isn't black and white. No no. I didn't mean fudging or embellishing an inconsequential matter of opinion. I meant a straight up lie lie. Re-telling an event in a way it absolutely did not happen. I am a pretty forgiving person when someone makes a mistake. If you tell me the truth, there is a lot I can handle. If you lie to me I take that as you essentially telling me you don't trust me enough to handle the situation like a mature adult. You don't respect me enough to make my own decisions. I trust and respect my SOs enough to not badger them for information and become a nag. I really am one of the least prying girlfriends on the planet according to all of my ex-boyfriends. But if untrue words come flowing out your mouth freely, what choice do I have? Once that trust is broken there just is no going back with me. No one is worth the anxiety.
Oxy Moronovich Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 OP, why did your boyfriend tell you about his relationship with this girl in the first place? Is it something he said out of the blue? Or did you have a conversation with him about cheating and he mentioned it?
Author maylis Posted January 27, 2012 Author Posted January 27, 2012 (edited) OP, why did your boyfriend tell you about his relationship with this girl in the first place? Is it something he said out of the blue? Or did you have a conversation with him about cheating and he mentioned it? I was telling him how I hadn't seen a friend of mine in a long time who is a guy because his girlfriend doesn't like me (she's not a bitch, she has just had a really horrid past so I don't mind). Then he said that his ex wouldn't let him have friends who were girls and I thought it was weird if they were just friends. Then he explained the nature of their friendship and how it was more than just a normal friendship. He wouldn't admit that until after I found out he lied to me and when I said I wanted to break up the first time. Edited January 27, 2012 by maylis
salparadise Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 One of the most beautiful aspects of a great relationship is knowing you have someone you can trust completely, confide in, and having them feel the same way about you. Also, this thing we call integrity is either an integral part of a person's personality or not. This is expressed in many ways besides always being truthful. And I'm not talking about little white lies that are expected, such as complimenting some on cooking a nice dinner even if you're not crazy about it. It's about matters of substance, such as keeping one's word, repaying debts, not always taking the easy way out of tough situations, making the minimal effort and so forth. Once someone demonstrates a propensity for disingenuousness, you should assume you're only seeing the tip of the iceberg and it will be rough sailing if you stay with them. In an extreme form it's called antisocial personality disorder and severity is on a continuum. In terms of relationships, you really don't need to know anything else once you've figured out a person is this way.
Author maylis Posted January 27, 2012 Author Posted January 27, 2012 One of the most beautiful aspects of a great relationship is knowing you have someone you can trust completely, confide in, and having them feel the same way about you. Also, this thing we call integrity is either an integral part of a person's personality or not. This is expressed in many ways besides always being truthful. And I'm not talking about little white lies that are expected, such as complimenting some on cooking a nice dinner even if you're not crazy about it. It's about matters of substance, such as keeping one's word, repaying debts, not always taking the easy way out of tough situations, making the minimal effort and so forth. Once someone demonstrates a propensity for disingenuousness, you should assume you're only seeing the tip of the iceberg and it will be rough sailing if you stay with them. In an extreme form it's called antisocial personality disorder and severity is on a continuum. In terms of relationships, you really don't need to know anything else once you've figured out a person is this way. Good points made, thank you
phineas Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 The only thing you can reasonably expect from a liar is more lies. I don't even deal with liars anymore. First lie and I am out the door. In my entire life, once someone has lost my trust they have never been able to gain it back. I would rather start over with someone fresh than try and repair the damage. You're ex sounds incredibly untrustworthy. I think you dodged a bullet here. I agree with this. I don't do shady. What OP's BF did was shady.
Author maylis Posted January 28, 2012 Author Posted January 28, 2012 ..he just left my apartment. he asked to come over to talk so i said yes. he asked what i thought about us breaking up i said if he was interested in getting back together with me it wouldnt be like that, it would have to be different he said he doesnt want to risk being in a relationship with me. i asked why he came over and he said he felt like it was hte right thing to do..? he asked if we could be friends and i said no. that was it, he was here like 10 minutes. someone PLEASE explain that one to me?!?!??!
Oxy Moronovich Posted January 28, 2012 Posted January 28, 2012 maylis, your guy doesn't feel he did anything worth a breakup. Yes, he had an emotional affair. But his conscience is eased by the fact that he told you in the first place. True, he spoke to her when he said he wouldn't, but since he didn't get physical with her, he can't find himself feeling he did anything horrible here. That's why he wants to get back together.
Author maylis Posted January 28, 2012 Author Posted January 28, 2012 maylis, your guy doesn't feel he did anything worth a breakup. Yes, he had an emotional affair. But his conscience is eased by the fact that he told you in the first place. True, he spoke to her when he said he wouldn't, but since he didn't get physical with her, he can't find himself feeling he did anything horrible here. That's why he wants to get back together. He told me yes, he wouldn't admit that is what it was, an emotional affair. he said "they were just kidding around" (which I read people in emotional affairs say when they can't admit to it) and after he admitted it he saw I was uncomfortable so he lied to me and told me they quit talking January 2011. The only reason I found out he was lying is because I happened to have his phone in my hand as she was texting him, otherwise I am pretty sure I'd still be being lied to. I agree he doesn't think he did anything wrong and doesn't want to be held accountable for his actions at all.
phineas Posted January 28, 2012 Posted January 28, 2012 maylis, your guy doesn't feel he did anything worth a breakup. Yes, he had an emotional affair. But his conscience is eased by the fact that he told you in the first place. True, he spoke to her when he said he wouldn't, but since he didn't get physical with her, he can't find himself feeling he did anything horrible here. That's why he wants to get back together. This. also, just because he told you he didn't do anything physical with her doesn't mean he didn't and a booty-call is always just a txt away. when it comes to shady there is ALWAYS more in my experience. Maybe not sex but how would you really know? OP you most likely just scratched the surface.
Author maylis Posted January 28, 2012 Author Posted January 28, 2012 This. also, just because he told you he didn't do anything physical with her doesn't mean he didn't and a booty-call is always just a txt away. when it comes to shady there is ALWAYS more in my experience. Maybe not sex but how would you really know? OP you most likely just scratched the surface. I think you are right, but he has no reason to contact me again. I gave him all his stuff back while he was here.
Author maylis Posted January 29, 2012 Author Posted January 29, 2012 This. also, just because he told you he didn't do anything physical with her doesn't mean he didn't and a booty-call is always just a txt away. when it comes to shady there is ALWAYS more in my experience. Maybe not sex but how would you really know? OP you most likely just scratched the surface. What do people think of this - If he is willing to meet with me, this girl and her boyfriend and we all talk about this in the open. This seems fair, no? If theres really nothing to hide they should both be willing to do this, right? This is if my ex contacts me and wants to try again, I don't know that I should contact him first.
phineas Posted January 29, 2012 Posted January 29, 2012 What do people think of this - If he is willing to meet with me, this girl and her boyfriend and we all talk about this in the open. This seems fair, no? If theres really nothing to hide they should both be willing to do this, right? This is if my ex contacts me and wants to try again, I don't know that I should contact him first. My Ex-wife used the same tactic with her "friend" (the guy she was cheating on me with). It really just turned out to be a stall tactic & such a meetup never happened. Honestly, if you've hit the point where such a thing has to happen, why bother? The question to ask is would you have done this? Why not? Because you know better & arn't dishonest or disrespectful. Anyone you have to explain this too or who does this doesn't use the same model of moral compass as you do. Do you really want to try & have a relationship with someone like that? Can you without always suspecting he's being shady or looking for red flags in everything he says or does? Only you can decide that.
veggirl Posted January 29, 2012 Posted January 29, 2012 What do people think of this - If he is willing to meet with me, this girl and her boyfriend and we all talk about this in the open. This seems fair, no? If theres really nothing to hide they should both be willing to do this, right? This is if my ex contacts me and wants to try again, I don't know that I should contact him first. Why would you want to do this? He has already PROVEN to you that he is a LIAR and he will justify it til the cows come home. MAYBE he will appease you with something like this ridiculous scenario you have presented, but would you really be appeased long-term? You would trust him after that? Many CHEATERS will go to great lengths to deceive their partner, including having a 3rd party "vouch" for them. NO you shouldn't contact this jerk. And you shouldn't respond if he does contact you! Please!
Author maylis Posted January 29, 2012 Author Posted January 29, 2012 My Ex-wife used the same tactic with her "friend" (the guy she was cheating on me with). It really just turned out to be a stall tactic & such a meetup never happened. Honestly, if you've hit the point where such a thing has to happen, why bother? The question to ask is would you have done this? Why not? Because you know better & arn't dishonest or disrespectful. Anyone you have to explain this too or who does this doesn't use the same model of moral compass as you do. Do you really want to try & have a relationship with someone like that? Can you without always suspecting he's being shady or looking for red flags in everything he says or does? Only you can decide that. I am sorry to hear that about you and your wife. Did this other guy have a significant other as well? I have a lot to think about, I don't think he will contact me again anyway.
veggirl Posted January 29, 2012 Posted January 29, 2012 Honestly, if you've hit the point where such a thing has to happen, why bother? OP, phineas is 100% correct with this question. Please ask it of yourself, over and over if you must. Also, why do you want him to contact you? You CAN DO BETTER. You do not need to SETTLE FOR A LIAR.
ditzchic Posted January 29, 2012 Posted January 29, 2012 I am sorry to hear that about you and your wife. Did this other guy have a significant other as well? I have a lot to think about, I don't think he will contact me again anyway. I really hope he doesn't contact you again for a long time. You've really dodged a bullet here. I know you want it to work and you're probably willing to do a lot to get it working again. But why? He's proven to you that he's a liar, he doesn't respect you and that he doesn't even want to be with you. If he contacts you again, he'll throw you a couple of crumbs and you'll be ok with it. You'd basically be telling him that it doesn't matter if he treats you well. You'd be teaching him to treat you like crap basically. Please delete his numbers and contact info. You need to fully understand what happened here before you can talk to him again.
phineas Posted January 29, 2012 Posted January 29, 2012 I am sorry to hear that about you and your wife. Did this other guy have a significant other as well? I have a lot to think about, I don't think he will contact me again anyway. YEP! Both my now ex-wife & he were cheating on someone with each other. Their both living together now & he's been working out of town for days at a time so it's only a matter of time before one of them cheats on the other In my own opinion. Not my problem anymore but I am concerned about how the kids will react.
Author maylis Posted January 29, 2012 Author Posted January 29, 2012 Why would you want to do this? He has already PROVEN to you that he is a LIAR and he will justify it til the cows come home. MAYBE he will appease you with something like this ridiculous scenario you have presented, but would you really be appeased long-term? You would trust him after that? Many CHEATERS will go to great lengths to deceive their partner, including having a 3rd party "vouch" for them. NO you shouldn't contact this jerk. And you shouldn't respond if he does contact you! Please! You're right, I don't know if I could say it would make me feel better long term. I was thinking today - when he brought upthis scenario I was talking about how I think it is fine for my boyfriend to have women who are friends (normal friends like with their guy friends) and he chose to lie and say they haven't talked in a year. Why would he feel the need to lie?
veggirl Posted January 29, 2012 Posted January 29, 2012 You're right, I don't know if I could say it would make me feel better long term. I was thinking today - when he brought upthis scenario I was talking about how I think it is fine for my boyfriend to have women who are friends (normal friends like with their guy friends) and he chose to lie and say they haven't talked in a year. Why would he feel the need to lie? Girl he lied because there is either more to the story or he is waiting for the chance for there to be more to the story. Blech
dreamingoftigers Posted January 29, 2012 Posted January 29, 2012 Hun the point is that this guy is a liar that seeks his ago boost outside of his relationships. And you've only been dating. By addressing THAT LIE it won't make the problem go away. It may however, prolong your relationship to get hurt more, and more deeply down the road. Let this one go. You have no idea how many better options there are out there.
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