darkmoon Posted January 14, 2012 Posted January 14, 2012 the book was about seeing who treated you well, flirting, not being wife-y til married, playing hard to get, not being exclusive til the man said, and not rushing in til men said/did certain things. it aslo had advice on dressing for men the book seemed good, helped with not getting hurt - but did the Rules go out of fashion?
thatone Posted January 14, 2012 Posted January 14, 2012 people who are content with themselves and what they want don't need an instruction manual. hence, all such books go out of fashion, because their audience isn't lacking instructions, they are lacking in everything else.
Oxy Moronovich Posted January 14, 2012 Posted January 14, 2012 people who are content with themselves and what they want don't need an instruction manual. hence, all such books go out of fashion, because their audience isn't lacking instructions, they are lacking in everything else. Exactly. It's 2012 and people still need to read books in order to meet people? Wow.
Author darkmoon Posted January 14, 2012 Author Posted January 14, 2012 it was guidance that i wished i'd followed - but men resented the way that sex was not forthcoming - wished i had not been such a giver - f*ucked and dumped
dasein Posted January 14, 2012 Posted January 14, 2012 The Rules was about playing games to manipulate weak men into marriage. Bad idea all around, and IIRC both the authors who touted the success of The Rules in their own lives ended up divorced. Don't sleep with someone until you are good and ready, but that is not the same thing as purposefully withholding sex for manipulation purposes. Former, good, latter, bad.
kaylan Posted January 14, 2012 Posted January 14, 2012 The Rules was about playing games to manipulate weak men into marriage. Bad idea all around, and IIRC both the authors who touted the success of The Rules in their own lives ended up divorced. Don't sleep with someone until you are good and ready, but that is not the same thing as purposefully withholding sex for manipulation purposes. Former, good, latter, bad. Agreed. No one likes games and manipulation. The Rules was just that. And it seemed like it was all about the womans wants in the relationship and not the mans as well. A healthy relationship has to focus on the happiness of both partners. Tbh, the Rules always seemed like Pick Up Artist stuff, but for women. Both mantras as full of crap imo.
ThaWholigan Posted January 14, 2012 Posted January 14, 2012 Agreed. No one likes games and manipulation. The Rules was just that. And it seemed like it was all about the womans wants in the relationship and not the mans as well. A healthy relationship has to focus on the happiness of both partners. Tbh, the Rules always seemed like Pick Up Artist stuff, but for women. Both mantras as full of crap imo. I dunno, a lot of the PUA stuff I have personally read were not about catering to man's needs at the expense of the woman's. But then I have an entire archive of PUA material on my computer that I haven't read yet, bar a few Carlos Xuma books and a Love Systems DVD.
dasein Posted January 14, 2012 Posted January 14, 2012 Makeup, hair dye, pushup bras, high heels, chicken cutlets, tanning beds, plastic surgery... are PUA for women. They don't see it that way of course, but the analogy is apt. A man walking up to a woman and reading her palm because he read on a PUA site that women get wet for fortune telling is exactly the same as a woman wearing breast enhancers in her bra because she thinks big tits get men hard.
Author darkmoon Posted January 14, 2012 Author Posted January 14, 2012 Makeup, hair dye, pushup bras, high heels, chicken cutlets, tanning beds, plastic surgery... are PUA for women. They don't see it that way of course, but the analogy is apt. A man walking up to a woman and reading her palm because he read on a PUA site that women get wet for fortune telling is exactly the same as a woman wearing breast enhancers in her bra because she thinks big tits get men hard. I like dressing up, because I enjoy it. I bought a lovely box of coloured eye-shadows, ready for summer. Not PUA directly, but believe me, u wouldn't want to jump me very much when I'm unadorned. No man smiles at me then, which is ok right now, too much work on. (this is my leisure time)
dasein Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 I like dressing up, because I enjoy it. I bought a lovely box of coloured eye-shadows, ready for summer. Not PUA directly, but believe me, u wouldn't want to jump me very much when I'm unadorned. No man smiles at me then, which is ok right now, too much work on. (this is my leisure time) I don't disagree. PUA techniques are the equivalent to adornment for men. No woman smiles at the shifty eyed hunched over dude who can barely carry a conversation just as you say no man smiles at you unadorned.
carhill Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 I remember it well, as it coincided with the loss of my virginity It also colored much of my dating experience in the late 90's and, retrospectively, the 'list' that my exW always talked about when we were dating. Why did it go out of style? IMO, men got wise to it, just like women are wise to PUA. Myself, not keeping up with such earth-shattering social trends, I was clueless, in the beginning anyway.
xxoo Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 I was already married when I first heard of "The Rules". But a friend used the book to help her in her on again/off again relationship with her bf. They did marry in the end. I think the rules helped her appear less.....desperate....which in turn made her more attractive to her then bf. In the beginning, she was more eager about the relationship than the guy was, and he wanted more challenge. When she started being less eager and available (more about phone calls and attention and dates than sex), he started to pine for her more. As much as I thought the book was bunk, I do think giving him that space to pursue her worked in her favor.
Wolf18 Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 Makeup, hair dye, pushup bras, high heels, chicken cutlets, tanning beds, plastic surgery... are PUA for women. They don't see it that way of course, but the analogy is apt. A man walking up to a woman and reading her palm because he read on a PUA site that women get wet for fortune telling is exactly the same as a woman wearing breast enhancers in her bra because she thinks big tits get men hard. No way. The equivalent to that is 150 dollar tshirts, 6 packs, too much hair gel, tans, rolex's, a German car, so on and so on. There is no female PUA. Not even "the rules". The only rule women have is be wooed. Unless of course you're a girl that is only attracted to men 3 leagues above you, then you have to do more.
El Brujo Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 Everyone knows that The Rules were written by promiscuous people (and to hell with everyone else). The Emperor has no clothes.
kaylan Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 (edited) I dunno, a lot of the PUA stuff I have personally read were not about catering to man's needs at the expense of the woman's. But then I have an entire archive of PUA material on my computer that I haven't read yet, bar a few Carlos Xuma books and a Love Systems DVD. You should check out PUA forums then. Its rife with negativity and is def about catering to guys who want to take advantage of women. PUA books on the other hand are more positive and about guys being more self confident. PUA forums preach that too, but some then get lost in a lot of selfish, pessimistic, misogynist crap while crying about how misandrist the world is. Makeup, hair dye, pushup bras, high heels, chicken cutlets, tanning beds, plastic surgery... are PUA for women. They don't see it that way of course, but the analogy is apt. A man walking up to a woman and reading her palm because he read on a PUA site that women get wet for fortune telling is exactly the same as a woman wearing breast enhancers in her bra because she thinks big tits get men hard.Um not quite. Maximizing your appearance works for both genders. I would say that appearance ties into the Rules, the same way it ties into PUA mantra. PUA mantra preaches to guys about looking their best. Thats no different than the list of things you gave regarding appearance. I was already married when I first heard of "The Rules". But a friend used the book to help her in her on again/off again relationship with her bf. They did marry in the end. I think the rules helped her appear less.....desperate....which in turn made her more attractive to her then bf. In the beginning, she was more eager about the relationship than the guy was, and he wanted more challenge. When she started being less eager and available (more about phone calls and attention and dates than sex), he started to pine for her more. As much as I thought the book was bunk, I do think giving him that space to pursue her worked in her favor.PUA stuff is about being less desperate as well. Its about being self confident and living life for yourself and not living it with the sole goal of attaining women. They try and teach guys that women are part of the journey, but not the goal of the journey. I think thats one of the positive aspects of PUA teachings...I just think the wooing techniques fail when it comes to logic. The teaching on confidence though are good for dudes without it. No way. The equivalent to that is 150 dollar tshirts, 6 packs, too much hair gel, tans, rolex's, a German car, so on and so on. There is no female PUA. Not even "the rules". The only rule women have is be wooed. Unless of course you're a girl that is only attracted to men 3 leagues above you, then you have to do more. I would say there are female PUA. Women know what they are doing when they try to attract the best of the best men. Just like how top tier guys will know how to draw in the best of the best women. Its more than simple wooing or receiving woo. There exists little tactics like style, flirting, fitness, how one speaks and walks, etc. I believe an attractive person, male or female, can spot someone they like and either chase or be chased if they know what they are doing. One of my good buddies, and a great wingman, is who we will call D. D is a good looking guy and literally does nothing when we go out to game women. He just lets himself be seen and then judges womans reactions. Sometimes women put themselves in his area to wait for him to make a move. Other times they will just come up and dance with him or make convo. Im not gonna lie, I do hate how easy he has it when we go out. Edited January 15, 2012 by kaylan
ThaWholigan Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 You should check out PUA forums then. Its rife with negativity and is def about catering to guys who want to take advantage of women. PUA books on the other hand are more positive and about guys being more self confident. PUA forums preach that too, but some then get lost in a lot of selfish, pessimistic, misogynist crap while crying about how misandrist the world is. -------------------------------------------------------- I believe an attractive person, male or female, can spot someone they like and either chase or be chased if they know what they are doing. One of my good buddies, and a great wingman, is who we will call D. D is a good looking guy and literally does nothing when we go out to game women. He just lets himself be seen and then judges womans reactions. Sometimes women put themselves in his area to wait for him to make a move. Other times they will just come up and dance with him or make convo. Im not gonna lie, I do hate how easy he has it when we go out. Used to be on Attraction Forums (love systems forums). Wasn't incredibly impressed, there was some good stuff, but the attitude was a little sour. Like I said, I was most impressed with some of the instructors ideas (Cajun & Vercetti, Future was OK aswell). Second part, would like to have more times like that. Few times it happened I didn't know what to do. This was before I knew what I know now.
Janesays Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 My theory has always been: if you have to manipulate someone into liking you, then they don't really like you.
dasein Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 No way. The equivalent to that is 150 dollar tshirts, 6 packs, too much hair gel, tans, rolex's, a German car, so on and so on. There is no female PUA. Makeup, etc. = PUA for women, identifying a corollary analogy doesn't invalidate mine. Women use artifice (makeup) to enhance their attractiveness to men in ways men respond to, men use artifice (PUA) to enhance their attractiveness to women in ways women respond to. One magician does the card trick using deck mechanics, the other magician accomplishes the same thing with misdirection. Neither is completely "honest" or completely "insincere," little of both. Um not quite. Maximizing your appearance works for both genders. No, not starting up with you. BTDT. If you can explain why the analogy I presented is inapt in clear terms, happy to respond. Otherwise see above.
dasein Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 My theory has always been: if you have to manipulate someone into liking you, then they don't really like you. Ah, so you don't wear makeup?
PlumPrincess Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 I guess, push-up bras or padded bras are some kind of fraud. Isn't it funny, that those are socially accepted, but imagine a woman wearing padded panties to have a nicer butt. Or a guy with padded underwear.
Titania22 Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 My theory has always been: if you have to manipulate someone into liking you, then they don't really like you. I agree. Ah, so you don't wear makeup? And I rarely wear makeup. Interestingly enough, when I do wear makeup, i tend to attract men who think i am easy and when I don't wear makeup, I attract no-one (obviously doesn't include men who never make there interest known)
Titania22 Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 I guess, push-up bras or padded bras are some kind of fraud. Isn't it funny, that those are socially accepted, but imagine a woman wearing padded panties to have a nicer butt. Or a guy with padded underwear. Interestingly I have never been able to tell what a guy has got down there by looking, a guy can look like he has nothing and be larger then the other guy who had nothing much but appeared to.
Janesays Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 Ah, so you don't wear makeup? Does chapstick count? Actually, no. Growing up, I didn't have a good relationship with my mom so no one ever taught me how to put it on. And before you ask, no, I don't dress up. I'm an animal behaviorist be profession, so most of my clothing tends to be covered in animal hair and sports little holes here and there!
dasein Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 OK my point is that lots of women compare PUA techniques, such as a guy learning palm reading, as insincere if not outright dishonest, while those same women engage in appearance enhancement that is at least as insincere. I have no problem with women enhancing their appearance to increase their attractiveness, why do men who enhance their charm and "interestingness" in an effort to increase their attractiveness receive such ire? True or False? Women have been asking men to be more romantic and charming for a long long time? Once men start to learn ways to be more romantic and charming, more seductive, women complain that they are fake, and using women. The men who don't learn to be more romantic and charming are boring though, and women complain about this, or rather simply ignore boring men in favor of more charming, seductive ones. Contrary to what many say, I believe women do know what they want... they want to complain about men.
thatone Posted January 15, 2012 Posted January 15, 2012 (edited) i agree, to an extent. a lot of them know what they want but on the same hand a lot of them can't ever attain it, and have conditioned themselves to hide what they really want, a sort of fear of honesty. so the end result of that is after being dishonest with men for so long, and how natural that becomes to them, they also become dishonest with themselves. the thread that comes to mind recently is a younger girl who typed out half a bible lamenting some guy who didn't call her, and they had this great connection and great first date and blah blah blah and the whole thing could be summarized by, as i think you or phineas quoted and pointed out, "he's in a band". well derp, she wanted to attract a guy who did something she was attracted to. but she didn't, so that's it. the whole thing could've been said in two sentences but she spent so much time lying to herself that she couldn't possibly be honest with anyone she had been asking advice from. Edited January 15, 2012 by thatone
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