Star Gazer Posted January 10, 2012 Posted January 10, 2012 Very interesting. I do CrossFit too. Even just getting to Regionals is an accomplishment, so much respect. Anyway, I'm assuming you're talking about "mirror" athletes--those who workout for vanity, versus those who train because they are passionate in their sport, such as you and your friends winning these CrossFit competitions. The average person, such as the girls the OP is meeting, might not see the difference. Most of the serious CrossFitters I know are strict with their diet--e.g., Paleo vs Zone and so on. And we can really get on a roll talking about our WODs and PRs and our box's programming and "doing it Rx" and so on. [i have a tendency too, but I temper myself.] The hour in the box is often the highlight of our day. There is a decent amount of time, money, and energy on our part that is being tied up here in our pursuit of CrossFit (and eating clean and getting the extra hour of sleep a night, and so on) too. This probably doesn't come across as self-absorbed to you or me, but to the average person, it probably does. Right. The same goes for runners, and pro skiers, both of whom I spend a good deal of time with. And the same goes for any other sport. The difference is...there is sport involved. I'm not speaking of someone who is absorbed with their sport. That type of absorption doesn't rub me the wrong way in the dating context at all. I don't see those folks as vain, or self-absorbed. Rather, I see them as obsessed with their sport, and their performance. What they look like is a consequence of their dedication to their sport (as well as other things, like genetics). What I'm saying is, knowing the above, there is still a "type" of "fit" person that IS self-absorbed... that is, the "mirror athlete." (I hesitate to even use the word "athlete" or "fit" because for a "mirror athlete" the focus is on muscle growth and fat loss, and not on real fitness/athleticism as it is for a true "athlete." Yes, there are big dudes who are fit/athletic, but for the most part, the meatheads I speak of are not really athletic or fit. I seem them almost die on their first day of CF or on a 10k run all the time.)
Star Gazer Posted January 10, 2012 Posted January 10, 2012 What I've found is that it's best to treat the subject of fitness/dietary views/philosophies/lifestyles to your self. I've basically started treating (at least in most cases) the subject sort of like religious or political views. For the vast majority of people, they will either a) not care at all and see you as self absorbed or vain or b) have a view on the subject that differs from yours and be close minded or even militant about defending their views and/or debunking yours. Either way, the minute the subject is discussed, people will judge you for it in some form or another. Rarely is this judgement positive. I think that the best approach is to stick to what you love to do and what works for you in terms of fitness/diet and enjoy the benefits produced by your choices. Don't make it a point to openly discuss your views on the subject unless you're CERTAIN that you're in the type of company that is in an equal position to carry on an open minded, equally informed conversation. This is a very good perspective, and one I only recently learned when I took up serious long distance running/training. Most people don't understand why I want to run at all, or why I love it so much, nevermind why I'm training for a marathon. So, I just keep it to myself. I don't want to explain to anyone why I eat so many bananas...
kaylan Posted January 10, 2012 Posted January 10, 2012 OP, haters gon hate. Stay fit and sexy bro. People who wish they could look like you will call you vain without cause. Theres nothing wrong with wanting to look good and feel good. Sex appeal and health go up...so keep working out. Working out only helped my dating life.
tman666 Posted January 10, 2012 Posted January 10, 2012 This is a very good perspective, and one I only recently learned when I took up serious long distance running/training. Most people don't understand why I want to run at all, or why I love it so much, nevermind why I'm training for a marathon. So, I just keep it to myself. I don't want to explain to anyone why I eat so many bananas... Exactly. I've even taken to giving vague answers to direct questions regarding fitness/diet ("uhh yeah, I like lifting weights and I try to eat enough protein..." ) because the vast majority of the time, people aren't actually interested in hearing what you have to say with an open mind and the intent of having an intelligent discussion. Instead, they're using your response as a "measuring stick" of sorts to place you in a hierarchy of where you stand compared to them. There's so much oneupsmanship that goes on in life, and the fitness world tend to be no different. Everyone's got an opinion on what the best training method is, which goals are the best, what diet is the best, etc. While there are definitely wrong answers, there are so many combinations of training methods/diet strategies that work to achieve the same goals that it's almost completely pointless debating them. Hence, do something you love, do what works to achieve your goals, and tune the rest out. This strategy requires consistency, time, and a willingness to be open minded yet discerning. Engaging the haters only detracts from your personal goals.
kaylan Posted January 10, 2012 Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) Right. The same goes for runners, and pro skiers, both of whom I spend a good deal of time with. And the same goes for any other sport. The difference is...there is sport involved. I'm not speaking of someone who is absorbed with their sport. That type of absorption doesn't rub me the wrong way in the dating context at all. I don't see those folks as vain, or self-absorbed. Rather, I see them as obsessed with their sport, and their performance. What they look like is a consequence of their dedication to their sport (as well as other things, like genetics). What I'm saying is, knowing the above, there is still a "type" of "fit" person that IS self-absorbed... that is, the "mirror athlete." (I hesitate to even use the word "athlete" or "fit" because for a "mirror athlete" the focus is on muscle growth and fat loss, and not on real fitness/athleticism as it is for a true "athlete." Yes, there are big dudes who are fit/athletic, but for the most part, the meatheads I speak of are not really athletic or fit. I seem them almost die on their first day of CF or on a 10k run all the time.) Muscle growth and fat loss is part of being fit. Just because someone doesnt do cross fit or run a 10k doesnt mean they arent fit. Different fitness levels are suited to different things. Id never call a sprinter not fit because he cant run long distances. I would never call a power lifter not fit because hes slower than the average guy. Quit sipping the haterade. If people want to workout for aesthetics, let them. A side affect of working out for aesthetics, cutting all that fat, building all that muscle, ....that IS fitness. They reap SO many health benefits from eating right and working on their physique. Some of the hardest working guys in the gym, and the dudes who are most strict with their diets are guys I know who do it mostly for aesthetics. But you also get the strength and health perks. Ken griffey jr is one of the most famous athletes of ALL time and will be in baseballs hall of fame and he BARELY worked out and didnt watch what he ate. He was naturally gifted and put up great numbers. But he played ball and did his thing. Wanna tell me isnt an athlete? I doubt he would be able to run 10 k or do cross fit, but thats not a measure of any athlete as I previously said. How is he any different from the guy who busts his azs in the gym to look good, and plays sports with his bros in his free time? Edited January 10, 2012 by kaylan
Star Gazer Posted January 10, 2012 Posted January 10, 2012 Don't worry, Kaylan. I'm not interested in dating you, or anyone else who exercises for the sole purpose of trying to look good and show off. That's not my thing. Being with someone who's interested in being fit and healthy is.
Imajerk17 Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 (edited) What I've found is that it's best to treat the subject of fitness/dietary views/philosophies/lifestyles to your self. I've basically started treating (at least in most cases) the subject sort of like religious or political views. For the vast majority of people, they will either a) not care at all and see you as self absorbed or vain or b) have a view on the subject that differs from yours and be close minded or even militant about defending their views and/or debunking yours. Either way, the minute the subject is discussed, people will judge you for it in some form or another. Rarely is this judgement positive. I think that the best approach is to stick to what you love to do and what works for you in terms of fitness/diet and enjoy the benefits produced by your choices. Don't make it a point to openly discuss your views on the subject unless you're CERTAIN that you're in the type of company that is in an equal position to carry on an open minded, equally informed conversation. Good point. I think this concept can be extended: whenever it comes to anything impressive about us, it's best to let her ask us about it first, and then for us to be modest about it. The worst thing we could do is volunteer it with the hopes that she will be impressed. If I were to approach a woman in the grocery store and it is clear that we both came from our workouts for example, I would tell her enough so that we have a fun conversation about working out. The point of the interaction is to VIBE. She doesn't need to know my back squat max, however impressive or unimpressive it might be, right now. She doesn't need to know how much time I spend a week in the gym because frankly not much good can come from it. And there's nothing good that can come from me proving to her (if it is even true) that I'm more "hard-core" than she is. There is plenty of time to share this stuff later on. Edited January 11, 2012 by Imajerk17
kaylan Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 Don't worry, Kaylan. I'm not interested in dating you, or anyone else who exercises for the sole purpose of trying to look good and show off. That's not my thing. Being with someone who's interested in being fit and healthy is. I see reading comprehension is not your friend. I have said in this thread and other threads that health and looking good are both great reasons to work out. And they are both reasons why I work out. Trust me, it bothers me none that you wouldnt date me, especially with your crappy attitude. Why shame people for living a healthy lifestyle? More people need to work out, for whatever reasons they choose. Get off the high horse girl.
Emilia Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 (3) Women in their 20's are flakier than older women. Many younger women have some guy in the picture, be it an ex, a friend, so on and so forth. A woman in her 30's--not so much. So you have more of their attention and investment. So you think we in our 30s are less flaky because we have fewer options? Character development, growing up, maturing, etc wouldn't have anything to do with it by any chance?
kaylan Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 (edited) ^Lol. I was going to stay away from that one myself. But since you adressed it, I have to agree with you. I dont buy it. I find that reasoning about age to be a crappy "cry moar" attitude from bitter guys who reached their 30s without much success with women. If a gal isnt into you, shes gonna flake no matter what her age. Tbh, I have no idea why I dont get flaked on more, since its supposed to be the norm with women my age. They could surely get a hotter guy if they wanted to, but for some reason still talk to me. Whats funny is that the couple of times girls have been flakey with me, they were girls who I could have done better than. Its not like anyones options increase in their 30s. Most people start settling down so obviously the dating pool shrinks for everyone. Not just women. And tbh, with what I hear from older cats, older women arent hard up to find guys themselves. If a girl is attractive and has her act together, plenty of men will want her in her 30s. Edited January 11, 2012 by kaylan
Imajerk17 Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 (edited) Consider the context of my response please. The OP asked why women weren't flaking on him a few years ago but they are now. The two things that changed is that the women he are meeting are much younger and he is much better-looking. I stand by my response, although yes Emilia, there certainly is a maturity component too. The truth is though, that single *people* (both genders) in their 30's *as a group* have less full social calender, and a harder time meeting people. I'm in my 30's so I'm not insulting anyone. Not saying that it is like that for anyone or that it should be that way or that someone who is older has to resign him/herself to that, but that is the reality for many 30-somethings. People in their 30's tend to be more realistic than people in their 20's. They tend to put more of an emphasis on character versus chemistry. With that in mind, this is how I think it goes down for the OP now. He meets a girl in her 20s who is eager to talk to him because he is so good-looking. The conversation they have is probably only "nice" though. Anyway, the time before they are supposed to meet up again, she processes the interaction and whether she really wants to see him again, and decides meh.... He's good-looking, but as they didn't make much of a connection, there's no butterflies. And what would they have to talk about? Is it worth clearing her busy schedule? Besides as OP is in his 30s (Iif I remember correctly), he is 10 years older too. When the OP used to meet a woman in her 30s and had a "nice" interaction with her, that was enough to get her to meet up with him again. Not that her standards are lower per se, but she IS realistic, and gets that someone who might be great for her might not make such a big first impression. And yes, she also knows that she made plans with the guy, and as she is more mature, she keeps her word. So she will follow through, and give this guy a chance. Besides, what the hell else is she supposed to do? More and more people in her circle are married off. And yes kaylan, if a guy had to choose between getting a number because he is an average-looking guy who made a powerful connection with the girl (any age), versus being a really hot guy who had only a "nice" interaction with the girl, he should hope to be the average guy who made the connection. If the OP really connected with these women, they wouldn't flake on him. Even if he was only average-looking. Maybe even especially if... Edited January 11, 2012 by Imajerk17
Star Gazer Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 I am 33 and my social calendar is busier now than it ever was in my 20s. I don't think I was ever really a flaky person, but on occasions where I was flaky, it was in my 20s and not because of my social calendar but because I was flightier, less mature, and not as interested in keeping commitments or following through on plans.
Imajerk17 Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 I am 33 and my social calendar is busier now than it ever was in my 20s. I don't think I was ever really a flaky person, but on occasions where I was flaky, it was in my 20s and not because of my social calendar but because I was flightier, less mature, and not as interested in keeping commitments or following through on plans. Good for you! I'm not sure that would be true though, for most people in their 30's (the busy social calender part), especially people who are 36, 37, 38...
Star Gazer Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 I see reading comprehension is not your friend. I have said in this thread and other threads that health and looking good are both great reasons to work out. And they are both reasons why I work out. Trust me, it bothers me none that you wouldnt date me, especially with your crappy attitude. Why shame people for living a healthy lifestyle? More people need to work out, for whatever reasons they choose. Get off the high horse girl. I have a crappy attitude? Compare our responses and the level of disrespect you've shown. I can read just fine. But apparently you can't, and also like to put words in my mouth that I never said. I would never shame anyone for living a healthy lifestyle. That's an asinine thing to say. All I said was there is a difference between people who exercise as a part of living a healthy lifestyle, and those who exercise SOLELY to look good (and thus are vain and self-absorbed). I am not interested in dating the latter. Why shame me for my preferences?
ditzchic Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 Don't worry, Kaylan. I'm not interested in dating you, or anyone else who exercises for the sole purpose of trying to look good and show off. That's not my thing. Being with someone who's interested in being fit and healthy is. What exactly is wrong with wanting to look good? Looking good was what got my ass in the gym. Feeling good about myself because of the results (both physically and mentally) is what keeps me going there. In today's society where overweight and chowing down on fast food is the norm, healthy is highly subjective. I've actually heard people defend their bad habits by saying something along the lines of "I'm perfectly fine, I don't have diabetes." That's become today's definition of healthy. As long as you are looking good genuinely for yourself and not just to prove how awesome you are to the rest of the world, I say do whatever floats your boat. What gets you in the door isn't usually what keeps you there. And as an aside, I quit smoking for vanity reasons. I didn't want to get wrinkly leather face. Are you saying that reason isn't as valid as someone else's decision to quit based solely on the cancer risks?
Star Gazer Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 Good for you! I'm not sure that would be true though, for most people in their 30's (the busy social calender part), especially people who are 36, 37, 38... Well, the same is true of all of my SINGLE friends in their 30s AND 40s. I don't really think age has anything to do with how busy or free ones social calendar when single (once you get married and have kids, the social calendar necessarily changes, and I'm not referring to that).
Imajerk17 Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 Well, the same is true of all of my SINGLE friends in their 30s AND 40s. I don't really think age has anything to do with how busy or free ones social calendar when single (once you get married and have kids, the social calendar necessarily changes, and I'm not referring to that). Yeah but you and your friends are all kicking azz in all these races and crushing the WODS in CrossFit. I say Results Not Typical.
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