carhill Posted January 9, 2012 Posted January 9, 2012 Yeah, enough experience with cleaning up the mess such young bucks left in their wake a couple generations ago causes me to give such advice, for the health of everyone, including the next guy she dates
Author spinaroonie Posted January 9, 2012 Author Posted January 9, 2012 IMO any woman that suddenly refuses sex and won't communicate the issue is not worth having around. The lack of communication at her end is about as irritating as her withholding sex - and "I don't know" is a BS response. I'll give it one more shot - do the old freeze-out and try something different (comedy club?) in a couple of weeks to spice things up. Maybe this will hit the rest button on our relationship. IF she pulls the same stunt again it's time to next. It's too bad as up to this point I thought I'd struck gold - that rare cute, pleasant, easygoing girl who was fun, didn't play games, and always DTF. It's unfortunate that she's starting to play power games like this.
Feelsgoodman Posted January 9, 2012 Posted January 9, 2012 I tend to agree with the above post. Refusal to have sex coupled with a refusal to provide an explanation is unacceptable behavior in my book. If she was on a period, she would have told you. Clearly, there is some underlying problem that she doesn't wishy to discuss.
xpaperxcutx Posted January 9, 2012 Posted January 9, 2012 IMO any woman that suddenly refuses sex and won't communicate the issue is not worth having around. The lack of communication at her end is about as irritating as her withholding sex - and "I don't know" is a BS response. I'll give it one more shot - do the old freeze-out and try something different (comedy club?) in a couple of weeks to spice things up. Maybe this will hit the rest button on our relationship. IF she pulls the same stunt again it's time to next. It's too bad as up to this point I thought I'd struck gold - that rare cute, pleasant, easygoing girl who was fun, didn't play games, and always DTF. It's unfortunate that she's starting to play power games like this. Refusing sex is not the same as withholding sex. Whatever her reasons are, you cannot say she's doing it on purpose unless she deliberately teased you, then left you hanging with blue balls ( that in itself is withholding sex). Okay I will have to agree that her behaviour is odd especially her inability to communicate. However I will have to agree with the other posters that you might need to switch up your routine to get a different reaction out of her. If the same actions tend to lead to the same results, would different actions lead to different results?
xxoo Posted January 9, 2012 Posted January 9, 2012 "Withholding sex"? You had sex with her a few times. This is not an established relationship. She doesn't owe you sex each time you see her! If it isn't meeting your needs anymore (or hers), then move along. I don't see the need to accuse her of power games and withholding. What power? What is she getting from you?
snug.bunny Posted January 9, 2012 Posted January 9, 2012 "Withholding sex"? You had sex with her a few times. This is not an established relationship. She doesn't owe you sex each time you see her! If it isn't meeting your needs anymore (or hers), then move along. I don't see the need to accuse her of power games and withholding. What power? What is she getting from you? I agree with this. If you're dating/sleeping with others then she doesn't owe you jack. And if she's dating/sleeping with others then you don't owe her jack either. You never answered my question if she's the same girl as the girl from your sex thread, so I have to assume they are two different women. But if it is the same girl, and she went from hot to cold that quickly, then obviously something is up. I don't think "changing the routine" up in terms of your dates will solve whatever is at the heart of the matter... You haven't been dating that long, so I can't possibly see how things would get monotonous at this stage, unless all you're doing is getting together once every two weeks and boinking...
Mme. Chaucer Posted January 9, 2012 Posted January 9, 2012 I thought that she didn't have any orgasms with you, and she limped away in pain. She is not your girlfriend - it does not sound like there is any fun, emotional or intellectual connection involved - If this is the case - why ON EARTH would she continue to be "DTF" (loathsome expression ) with YOU? I've said it before, and I will say it again. If you want a girl's body to be a repeat "source" for your sexual release, the you better figure out how to make having sex with you worthwhile as an end in itself. Sex seems to be what you have to offer - but, does anybody want it?
ditzchic Posted January 9, 2012 Posted January 9, 2012 Seems to me she lost interest or is in the process of losing it fast. It doesn't seem there is much of an emotional connection there between you guys. She obviously doesn't feel comfortable talking to you about things. Those two things play a HUGE part in if a woman wants to have sex with you. Just because you gave her enough to pique her sexual interest doesn't mean you have enough to keep it. Unless you want something long term out of her and are willing to "work on the relationship" leave her go and move on. Don't play games with her to try and con her to give it up to you if you don't have serious intentions. There are lots of girls out there who are DTF for awhile. Go find one of them and leave this one live her life to go find someone she is on the same page with.
Taramere Posted January 9, 2012 Posted January 9, 2012 (edited) Last night we go out for dinner and dessert. Come back to my place to watch TV. After the show's done she pulls the classic "I'm not having sex tonight, I'm not in the mood". When I ask her why she says "I don't know." This throws me for a loop as in the past she's always been DTF with no LMR. No idea what the acronyms mean (down to ****? LMR...I have no clue what that is). If you're dating somebody then sooner or later there is going to come a point when they're just not in the mood for sex. If you are, then you can try to seduce them of course...but if they're really not in the mood, they're just not. It's like offering food to somebody who just isn't hungry. Maybe they're feeling generally unhappy about something and have gone off their food as a result? Unfortunately people don't always know why they're in a flat humour...so asking questions about it doesn't necessarily get you much further. Not if they don't have the answers. The way you talk about her, it doesn't sound as though you're all that into her. She's easy to be around, falls in with your plans generally, pays her own way on dates...on paper, it sounds like she's almost exactly what your PUA site compatriots would probably say that a woman should be. But do you admire her? That's a question your PUA friends are not likely to ask you, because in that world men are not supposed to admire women beyond having a shallow appreciation for their physical attributes. But you know, and women also know, that the truth is that when a man falls hard for a woman, admiration plays a big part in it. If I were that girl, reading your post and knowing it was about me, I'd dump you straight away. And it's not that you've said anything harsh or unkind about her. It's just that although she's pleasant and easy to be around, and has generally gone along with whatever you want sexually, there's a distinct lack of admiration and "wow" in the way you're talking about her. "Socially awkward, introverted, but easy to be around and pays her own way..." It doesn't sound like a relationship with any real prospects. It actually sounds a little depressing. I agree with people who are saying the focus on PUA might not be helping you. If you talk too enthusiastically to those guys about a woman, they're going to be all "mangina....oneitis...afc" etc etc. If you absorb a lot of that thinking, I think you'll find most women quickly becoming flat and uncommunicative in their dealings with you. It's a natural response when you feel somebody is lukewarm about you...and you honestly do sound very lukewarm about, and lacking in any genuine admiration for or excitement about this girl. Even if you find it pleasant to be around her and enjoy having sex with her. Edited January 9, 2012 by Taramere
kaylan Posted January 10, 2012 Posted January 10, 2012 "Withholding sex"? You had sex with her a few times. This is not an established relationship. She doesn't owe you sex each time you see her! If it isn't meeting your needs anymore (or hers), then move along. I don't see the need to accuse her of power games and withholding. What power? What is she getting from you? This. Grow up some OP. Show her that shes valued for more than whats between her legs and things will be fine with you two.
NoMagicBullet Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 What part of calling her once a week, chatting on the phone for a half hour and taking a genuine interest in her, setting up a date, picking her up from her home, taking her out to eat at places she's never sampled and asking about her life, splitting the bill (because we believe in equality and she's cool with it), introducing her to my friends at a party, splitting a bottle of wine back at my place and watching shows we both enjoy, making love, and dropping her off back at her home would make her feel like a booty call? 1) It's the same old thing. It's boring. For a long-term married couple, sure, it's date night, but not when you've gone on a handful of dates with someone and still don't know each other well. 2) Once a week on the phone is low interest when the relationship has gone sexual. 3) None of it is different from a booty call; only in your head do you think it's different. Get out of your point of view and try to see it from someone else's. Or she could just call/text me. Let's flip the script. When a girl never calls you, that indicates a fairly low level of interest. You said she's an introvert and that both of you are in your early 20s -- she is likely very uncomfortable calling a guy and expressing interest in him. She's likely very uncertain of your real interest in her as a person, and is probably afraid you will abandon her as soon as she expresses genuine interest in you now that you've had sex. (Or maybe she's waiting to see if you're going to stop acting like a player and start being real? Eh, just another thought.) If you want to keep things going with her, don't do a freeze-out now! It will only confirm her worst fears that you were using her for sex, and when you contact her again, it will seem like even more of a booty call. And please, please, please, for your own long-term happiness (if not to stop hurting and driving away women who may be genuinely interested in you), give up being a PUA! All those techniques are for getting women into bed, not building relationships. It's already showing in your paranoid mindset that what she's doing is about power -- it's not. She's not secure in this relationship yet because it's still very new; for that matter, you aren't secure in it either, otherwise you wouldn't be asking advice here or playing these games with her and trying to control the situation. This is never an easy stage for any relationship, but you have got to drop the PUA stuff -- it will only mess up your head, this relationship and any future relationships if you keep buying into such a manipulative, self-absorbed mentality.
bean1 Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 You think calling her once a week is taking a "genuine interest"? I blame her right now. She is uncomfortable and feels she is being used for sex but is too chicken/shy/inexperienced to actually tell you this or stop seeing you. Hopefully she will learn soon enough and grow some balls next time. If you want to just sleep with a girl then fine, do what you are doing (until she starts saying no again) but if you are looking for a relationship then observe the following: - You have less sex/dates/outings/talking in one week while young, single, and dating then I do in my marriage with kids - Calling someone once a week does NOT make genuine interest - The description of sex that others described sounds one-sided and just plain awful (from our female point of view).
AlexDP Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 I thought that she didn't have any orgasms with you, and she limped away in pain. She is not your girlfriend - it does not sound like there is any fun, emotional or intellectual connection involved - If this is the case - why ON EARTH would she continue to be "DTF" (loathsome expression ) with YOU? I've said it before, and I will say it again. If you want a girl's body to be a repeat "source" for your sexual release, the you better figure out how to make having sex with you worthwhile as an end in itself. Sex seems to be what you have to offer - but, does anybody want it? I have to agree here. If you don't offer anything else, the sex had better be good. But apparently it isn't. Now I'll admit I only have sex in relationships and I hate the entire FWB thing, because I think it's gross (not because of some moral objection), but I always make the girl orgasm. And hey, maybe I was lucky, I don't know, but with a certain amount of patience, skill and the ability to understand what she likes, you should be able to make it pleasurable.
Lucky_One Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 http://www.loveshack.org/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=3795256 http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=141199831 http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=190862 My bet? It's because you're a creep. A man who initiates identical threads on multiple forums (and even responds to posts with identical c/p answers) is a man who lacks such self-confidence that he would surely be a turn-off to any sensible woman. If a guy has to resort to asking other guys the best way to "hit and quit it", then he has no game anyway. So what we have is a guy who desperately wants a GF, but he believes he is too cool to act in a way that shows any sort of respect. There are a whole host of ways in which you have shown disrespect, but I want to touch on one that no one else has mentioned. When a "nice, young, fairly introverted, possibly somewhat inexperienced with dating" girl to ask a man to come into her house while she is getting ready, but he says he would rather wait in the car than meet her parents, then he has shown a great deal of disrespect to both her and to her parents. I have a son of dating age (fairly close to your age, OP), and it is a common occurrence for him to go up to the door to pick up his date. If he is such a pu$$y that he can't manage to shake the hand of a father of a girl that he is banging, then I have to think that he was either raised in a barn, has zero social skills, or really doesn't give a flying f*ck about the girl. I suspect her folks were giving her hell about her dating a guy who is so classless. And they don't even know the half of it.
Disenchantedly Yours Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 Spinaroonie, you haven't given the girl anything worth a darn. Do you really think your company alone should be enough to keep her interested in you? That's not how it works. Why should she give you anything to you when you've given next to nothing to her? You expect to get sex (lame) yet you can't even be bothered do really court her or treat her like how a woman wants to be treated. Further, when she outright communicated that she didn't want to have sex, you ignored it and continued to kiss her and took her to the bedroom. That's not exactly not forcing yourself on someone. You clearly don't have much respect for her feelings because you ignored her upfront communication and are now having a tiny bit of a tantrum trying to insinuate something is wrong with *her* without considering how your own actions lead you to the road you find yourself. Here you say that she is an easy going girl, pleasant, generally down for anything *you* want to do. You brag abought how you split the bill, which means you don't have to be bothered paying for anything while you still get to take sex from her. And you complain because she denied you. What have you really given her of any worth? All you do is take from her. You don't give anything. And that's the problem. And she might not be able to verbally define it. But she certainly feels it and is responding accordingly. I think it's time to think less about yourself and what you want and more about the girl you are in a relationship with. When a man begins thinking about what he can offer, what he can give, then he is growing and become mature. When a man whines about his toys being taken way while at the same time bragging about how little he actually has to give to get his toys, he is a sad case that isn't going to get much respect from any woman.
Lucky_One Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 From his other thread. "A girl I'm banging now admits to rarely cumming/orgasming from sex. Ever - not just with me. Last time we had sex I wrapped it up and we tried missionary, cowgirl, reverse cowgirl and back to missionary. She likes it rough so there was some hair pulling and mild choking. I banged away for a half hour before cumming into her. I orgasmed but she didn't. She said her vag was sore and limped home." Really? Really?!?! REALLY?!?!?!?!?!?!? You really have to ASK why she didn't want to have sex with you? Because you are both disrespectful AND a bad lover. If you were good enough in the sack, then she might stay with you even though you treat her shabbily. And if you treat her wonderfully, she might stay with you even though you suck in bed. But both? No way, Jack.
bean1 Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 I don't disagree with you girls above ^ but this girl is not blameless either. I know this is a skill that is learned generally as we get older (this girl sounds very inexperienced/timid) but she should be clear that this is not acceptable or at least stop going out with the guy. If she has been on what, 6 dates, with him calling only once a week and kept going back for more, well, I guess she is telling him that's fine with this too right??? I have been in her position before. I think, looking back, I should not have allowed it to happen either. But being young and shy, kept going with it thinking it would improve. That is her fault too.
Mme. Chaucer Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 Considering the pretty unlikely description of his sexcapade, the use of language along with the constant reposting among various sites, I sometimes think we might be … the butt of a joke. Since we are not allowed to suggest that someone might be a troll.
Disenchantedly Yours Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 From his other thread. "A girl I'm banging now admits to rarely cumming/orgasming from sex. Ever - not just with me. Last time we had sex I wrapped it up and we tried missionary, cowgirl, reverse cowgirl and back to missionary. She likes it rough so there was some hair pulling and mild choking. I banged away for a half hour before cumming into her. I orgasmed but she didn't. She said her vag was sore and limped home." Really? Really?!?! REALLY?!?!?!?!?!?!? Wow. That is disturbing beyond belief. Sounds like the OP neither knows how to have good sex or really even cares how his partner feels. I think this poster is just getting off to be disrespectful to this girl and talking about her on this board for whatever messed up reason. I have a son of dating age (fairly close to your age, OP), and it is a common occurrence for him to go up to the door to pick up his date. If he is such a pu$$y that he can't manage to shake the hand of a father of a girl that he is banging, then I have to think that he was either raised in a barn, has zero social skills, or really doesn't give a flying f*ck about the girl. Lucky, that shows that you and your husband raised him really well. And not only that, but he apparently is a good guy that he follows through with that.
Woggle Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 It sounds like she doesn't want the same things you do. Nothing wrong with that but maybe you should find somebody that does.
ditzchic Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 Considering the pretty unlikely description of his sexcapade, the use of language along with the constant reposting among various sites, I sometimes think we might be … the butt of a joke. Since we are not allowed to suggest that someone might be a troll. I'm not sure if you can say he's a troll... but I do agree that he seems to be sensationalizing the sex a bit. But we've all met the guy that thought he was a dynamo in bed when really he wasn't anything close. I try not to make blanket statements about guys being bad in bed, I always write off bad sex as just having a faulty sexual connection between the two of us. I think sex is instinctual so there is no such thing as someone being bad at it. That's like saying someone is a bad breather. lol. But I think this may simply be a case of a guy that thinks he's doing all the right things sexually when she is just on a different page and he hasn't caught her interests in other ways so she's mentally checked out.
soserious1 Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 I'd think that never having an orgasm & limping away in pain after hours of sex with you might well be a reason why she wasn't in the mood. Why would you need to look further for a reason?
Author spinaroonie Posted January 11, 2012 Author Posted January 11, 2012 I think some of you have it right - she feels "slutty" for banging a guy on the regular without a "title". It could be that she wants a relationship, but is afraid of articulating her desires for fear of scaring me away. And she's withholding sex as a test to see if I stick around. (ie. if he's still dating me, he likes ME and not just the sex.) The fact that she invited me in to meet her parents on the 4th date implies this (though I declined). She's probably had guys in her past scram at the first mention of the R word, so she's probably being very tentative because she's maybe afraid to lose me, and she's withdrawing physically out of fear of getting too emotionally attached and hurt in the process. Problem is I always wait for the girl to pop the "what are we?" question. When it's the guy pushing for the relationship it never seems to work out well as the girl doesn't feel like she's earned or "won over" the guy. So we may have arrived at a detente. Another problem is I tease her mercilessly, yet I'm very sparse about giving her compliments so she may even think I don't really value her very much as a person. On the other hand, if she showed more softness/femininity/physical affection I'd be much more liberal in this respect. I tend to mirror the energy of the girl I'm dating. If she's a little cold and aloof, I respond in kind. If she's warm and affectionate I respond the same way. In my experience, in a feminist smothering girls with affection only chases them away. On the other hand, I get the sense that this is a girl that responds to brute displays of masculinity (ie. being picked up and thrown on the bed, the desire for rough sex) and her ex-bf looked like a bit of a white trash sleazebag - and she stuck with this guy for 2 years. I'm wondering if this is symptomatic of latent daddy issues. So getting too "soft" or "romantic" may even drive ber away. Like most girls in their early 20s she probably doesn't even know what she wants. Not really sure how to play this one...
Lucky_One Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 Give me a break. You posted THAT identical reply on your "BodyBuilding" forum on the 9th. You can't even reply with something original? Why don't you just agree with all the "SoSuave" nutbags that she must be having a herpes outreak??
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