Author vsmini Posted January 6, 2012 Author Posted January 6, 2012 The guy DOES have a stable financial situation. He has 30k in savings and no debt. Choosing not to work at Starbucks while looking for a job in your career path when you have 30k in savings and nothing else to support (student loan, children, etc) is not financial irresponsibility IMO. Perhaps the two of them disagree on how they define financial stability - but the way you are stating it is as if the OP's way of looking at things is certainly the right one, and if he won't come to HERS, she should dump him. Errr...no. Personally, I could make 30k last 2 years comfortably with no loans to pay off. If I stretch it, I could make it last 3. I've lived off $1000/month before with $150/week going out to rent - it wasn't a big deal. I could have saved even more by taking a cheaper place at $100/week. I disagree that she is a gold digger or any such thing, but neither do I feel we should impose our own personal financial principles on our partners if they aren't mooching of us or in debt themselves. Regardless, all I have seen in this thread is the OP thanking people who agree with her, for the most part. Each to their own - if all the OP wishes to hear is people supporting her concerns, all I can do is wish her the best of luck. I appreciate all feedback - The thing is...is that he had 30K last year and he is nearly at the end of that. With only a months worth of savings to live on at this point it is no longer a stable situation. I'm sorry if I appear to only appreciate the comments that agree with me but that is simply not the case. I have actually thanked a few people who had a bit harsher perspective so I'm not so one-sided.
FitChick Posted January 6, 2012 Posted January 6, 2012 He spends most of his day on his own project he has been doing for the last 7 years. He is an editor/screenplay writer. And before everyone starts rolling their eyes. This is a legit project that has funding (funding for the film only - not living expences) and has won him quite a few legit film festivals based on his short of this feature film. If that is the case, get used to supporting him. I have two friends who are lawyers and both support their filmmaker husbands who are in their 40s. If he is an editor, he can find work editing or working at a post production house. Barring that, he should do what most showbiz folks do waiting for their Big Break - work as a waiter. If you work at a nice restaurant, you can make quite a bit of money.
musemaj11 Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 A man with no job is like a woman with an ugly scar on her face. The opposite sex hates him and he hates himself. Im pretty sure this guy is depressed. The fact that he has kept trying in the past year means that he is not lazy. He does want to work. I have been in his shoes before. He was choosy about jobs because he still had money. But he will take any job once its all already spent.
Ninjainpajamas Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 (edited) Perhaps, but you learn a lot more about someone's REAL strength of character during adversity, not when times are good. And he's not showing much here. That's a joke, and I feel sorry for people who think this world is a competition and about showing real "strength"..that's like me beating you to a pulp and judging you by how many times you can get up. The higher you are the harder they fall when things don't work out for you, and this is a typical case. In fact likely only experiencing this due to the economical state of the country, otherwise he'd probably fine a job right away just like many untalented jokesters I've had the privilege of working with in my lifetime who get where they are due to "senority" not performance anyway. Of course he is depressed and down, I love how people talk how they have never been there, or fortunate not to have, or even feel like they think they can run their mouth now "because they overcame it". Imo how you are acting is what defines you in this moment...how supportive can you be? do you only tolerate one year of a setback before you decide whether to jump ship or not? If anything this is defining the relationship not him, in one year he could have this completely turned around, making far more money than you are...then what are you going to say? glad I stayed? wish I wouldn't have left him? Beyond ridiculousness in this entire post, it's a catastrophe really. I would dump vsmini like a rock If I was him and reading this post, then go live with family or in some other situation. Get my life together, and get a real supportive woman who really would be there for me in my lows not only when my wallet is fat. Edited January 7, 2012 by Ninjainpajamas
Els Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 I would dump vsmini like a rock If I was him and reading this post, then go live with family or in some other situation. Get my life together, and get a real supportive woman who really would be there for me in my lows not only when my wallet is fat. Just curious, have you ever supported a jobless gf before? For how long?
Els Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 I appreciate all feedback - The thing is...is that he had 30K last year and he is nearly at the end of that. With only a months worth of savings to live on at this point it is no longer a stable situation. I'm sorry if I appear to only appreciate the comments that agree with me but that is simply not the case. I have actually thanked a few people who had a bit harsher perspective so I'm not so one-sided. Oh, ick. Sorry if I missed that. I still do think, though, that rather than preempting, you should just observe what happens when his reserves dry out. Does he then step up and do whatever he needs to support himself, or does he insist upon you supporting him? Therein will your answer lie. If he just waits until the last minute before taking a menial job, I personally don't think there is anything wrong with that. Your opinion may differ, and in that case, perhaps it is indeed worth rethinking your R. But I don't think you should be giving him 72-hour ultimatums or such, as some posters are suggesting, as a preemptive measure while he is still living on his reserves - because you don't even know for SURE that he is going to just wait around and expect you to support him. Give him the benefit of the doubt.
FitChick Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 Just curious, have you ever supported a jobless gf before? For how long? I was wondering what the responses from men would have been had the sexes in this case been reversed and it was the girlfriend who was an unemployed actress. It wouldn't change my advice, though.
dasein Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 He spends part of his day looking for jobs online... OK here's a suggestion you can use as a test. Every large company and professional practice in the world has a publications function. Many of these regularly hire freelancers to write and edit copy of white papers and puff pieces ("Here's our most recent 'learned research' on XYZ issue Prospective Client, ain't we smart enough to charge you lots of $$ per hour?"). These are sometimes in the marketing department and sometimes in their own corporate publications department. It is very easy to find their names and email addresses as they are often included on the white paper or the receptionist can tell you who they are and their email. If not, call or email the ostensible author, complement the piece, and ask who oversees stuff like that at the firm. The name they give you has a list of freelancers they hire regularly. Your BF's goal is to get on lots of those lists and drip on the prospects via email periodically. Almost no one sucks up to and networks with the people in these corporate publication depts in large professional practices despite that most of them have a budget for hiring out writing work. Negotitating a flat fee for a piece could net a couple thousand dollars for a single day's work. The test is, is he willing to do a little legwork to get some bread and butter rolling in related to his field that he can do from home without having a "jobjob" he has to go to (via the method I describe or others) while he works on and waits for the big projects, or is he "too good" for that? If the former, good bet for a continued relationship, if not, probably a bad bet.
Shaun-Dro Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 I've been dating someone for just over a year and it's going really well. We're both 30, on the same page with things that are important to us, live together and are on the way to being engaged (at least within the next year). My only issue is his employment status. He graduated from a top university and has held some really good jobs in his field but since he's moved here (I've known him for years and years but we just started dating a year ago) he hasn't held a steady job. He moved to the city last year with quite a large sum of savings almost at 30K (from working at his last job) but after city rent and living expences it's now dwindled to near nothing. He's gone on many interviews but hasn't nailed anything down. In the last 2 months he's pretty much stopped trying. I've suggested doing something basic, entry-level just so he can get a paycheck coming in but he just can't wrap his head around working at a drugstore or a starbucks after his good employment in the past. I think he feels he's too old for that. But what choice does he have? I've tried my hardest to be supportive and not nag him or discuss it too much with him and emasculate him in the process but today I brought up that I was concerned and he got really down. I told him it's been a year and though I know he's capable of working, the time we've been together he has not had a job and that I'm concerned. I also never brought it up in the past because we split things 50/50 and he pays his share of the rent - financially I do not carry any of his weight...so really, how much can i complain? I can't - I just want to see him get a job - I guess it's his lack of motivation for finding a job is what worries me...because he says he is really stressed out about his nearing-zero savings balance. We're usually such great communicators but he really shut down after I talked to him. advice? I got great advice for you: get rid of the useless chump. I'm kidding, dont get twisted over my remarks. What was your boyfriend's main specialty when he graduated college? I'm talking about his field of major. Maybe you guys should pack up and go to where he used to live. There might be a better chance of steadier work. Are you working, Vsmini? I haven't seen you around the boards until now so I'm curious as to how you're doing overall. Would you consider leaving NYC with your man or has the Big Apple polluted you into staying?
NYC-BigKat Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 Well I've never financially supported him or needed to. He pays for his own way on everything so that's a reason why I've been hesitant to bring it up because it hasn't affected me, financially at all... He has no debt - and his student loans are paid for. I have a good job and could financially support the both of us but I am not ok supporting a guy that is fully able to work but chooses not to. We don't have kids or some insane mortgage - he's able to work and claims he really does want to (as long as it's a job he wants...) so I think it's a bad idea to start supporting him financially. It could lead to much trouble later on. Hey u wanna come & support me? I need to get out of my mom's apt lol.
carhill Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 I found a re-read of a recent thread by the OP to be instructive. It underscores that change is an ever-present part of life. There was a lot of good advice in that thread which can pertain to this thread as well. I hope it works out in a positive way for their partnership.
Mrlonelyone Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 Not finding a job in this economy is not a surprise. Don't let the political operatives fundged numbers lie to you. http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2012/01/06/unemployment-rate-drop-is-for-real/ The U.S. unemployment rate dropped to 8.5% in December, while a broader measure dropped even further to 15.2% from 15.6% the prior month, both at their lowest levels since February 2009. 15.2% of able bodied americans either can't find work or have given up looking. Add the underemployed (i.e. working poor just getting by) that's more like 30%. If he's working on a movie, stick with him. If the project makes money then all will be well. The only hitch is the situations where a man will have one woman when he's struggling....then "upgrade" when he hits it big. A so called "starter" wife, the a "trophy" wife. I'm not saying he'll do this. That's something that really happens. On the other hand. There are people who build lives and wealth with that one partner. People who like carhill treat a marriage as a team. I'm afraid that is a rare thing now adays. Just ask yourself. If I end up supporting this man will he be there for me? _________ One more thing. In reading this I could not help but think of the following. spends most of his day on his own project he has been doing for the last 7 years. He is an editor/screenplay writer. http://www.spike.com/video-clips/8th6j8/that-novel-youve-been-working-on
FitChick Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 Wait a minute, what kind of editor is he? Since he makes films, I assumed film editor but now I see where he could be a wordsmith. Definitely more jobs in publishing than film.
zengirl Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 Personally, I'd have a big issue with the attitude he's taken in several ways: 1.) He won't consider a job that's 'beneath' him, even though he's already given UE sufficient time to try and get something he considers suitable and is running out of funds. 2.) He doesn't volunteer or seem overly interested in networking or doing legwork to do the "little bit extra" you need to do to get a job in a bad economy. 3.) He gets defensive and ego-bruised when the OP, his significant other who he LIVES with and shares his stresses with, attempts to ask him his plans, or even help him with suggestions. I know these are tough times, but if he's gotten several interviews, which he's blown -- as someone said above: if he's getting interviews, his resume and experience were sufficient, but he needs to work on some other aspect, namely his interview technique, networking, and so forth -- then he needs to adjust, and it sounds like not only is he not able to do so but he's actively AVOIDING it. That's a scary temperament in a partner, IMO. It's admirable he had such savings when he moved and has ambitions and a project to keep him busy, but it seems he's lost sight of the basics. Unless you're interested in supporting him, OP (and it sounds like, with his ego, that'd be a nightmare too!), I'd say don't get any more entangled until something with his attitude or circumstances change. And, frankly, even if he lucks into a job tomorrow, watch out! The next time the chips are down for him, he'll have the same problems waiting to come out.
Imajerk17 Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 Thank you - I asked him to pretend that next week his bank account would hit zero "what would you do?" I asked, he stated that he "didn't know." and that he couldn't give me an answer. He also said that when that time comes he will "make it work." but that time is almost NOW and he's been trying to make it work. I don't understand how he can magically make it work at crunch time when he hasn't been able to for months. I've said all of this to him and he pretty much shut down, got really sad and kept saying "I don't know" over and over again. I've never seen him like this. I realize that I am late for the discussion but I will give my 2 cents anyway. vsmini, I like you and all, but this post gave away more to me than probably you would like to hear. You sound like you have a cattle prod up his azz. You're overstepping your boundaries. Until he stops contributing financially to the relationship (which of course includes coming to you for financial help), this isn't really your business. I have been in your boyfriend's situation. He is under an awful lot of stress, and I can assure you that your boyfriend is thinking of the exact scenarios that you brought up to him. I can also assure you that if I were in his shoes I would shut down towards you too. I don't need a taskmaker! I am harsh, but I am also rooting for him to get a job, and for this to work for both of you.
darkmoon Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 i've known three females whose men were financially stuck one put her hubby thru college, he left her anyway three kids later (she went off sex so I don't wholly blame him) - - one is still married and her hubby is a musician (poor) but a great dad and good guy peacenik - - one was me, rich from working in the middle east, who got ripped off and dumped you've known this guy a year - not that long - his "i don't know" response is tbh bad - i used to ask mine about who will pay for what and he'd say "something will happen" - yeah me paying, channelling my inner feminist both responses are evasive it's a balancing act for you, if u want to stick with him, don't pay for dates and spoil him - sooner or later you'll look at him, lying in bed while you're playing parent and feel like you have a girl to support
carhill Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 One small clarification that underscored some of my responses....the OP has known the man for 'years' (her words) and they just got together as a couple in the past year and apparently IIRC moved in together in August.
Imajerk17 Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 (edited) i've known three females whose men were financially stuck one put her hubby thru college, he left her anyway three kids later (she went off sex so I don't wholly blame him) - - one is still married and her hubby is a musician (poor) but a great dad and good guy peacenik - - one was me, rich from working in the middle east, who got ripped off and dumped you've known this guy a year - not that long - his "i don't know" response is tbh bad - i used to ask mine about who will pay for what and he'd say "something will happen" - yeah me paying, channelling my inner feminist both responses are evasive it's a balancing act for you, if u want to stick with him, don't pay for dates and spoil him - sooner or later you'll look at him, lying in bed while you're playing parent and feel like you have a girl to support I'm sorry to hear, darkmoon. Reconciling your advice with mine though, I agree that OP should not be supporting her boyfriend. Regardless of how long OP knew the guy. That said, I do think the time to "draw the line" comes if he can't pay his fair share anymore. No later but really, no sooner either. Edited January 7, 2012 by Imajerk17
darkmoon Posted January 8, 2012 Posted January 8, 2012 he remained fairly dominant too - shouting to win arguments - which was awful, as i expected men to like feminism and embrace its then new-ness more fool me i used to slip him the cash under table for paying for ouor meals out so that he would not look emasculated - he'd expect money to go and play pool with me left at home lonesome do not take up with a man with an increasingly badly concealed lazy streak
musemaj11 Posted January 8, 2012 Posted January 8, 2012 I was wondering what the responses from men would have been had the sexes in this case been reversed and it was the girlfriend who was an unemployed actress. It wouldn't change my advice, though. Oh please, its a freaking fact that men are a lot more willing to be financially supportive of their partners. Personally I wouldnt do it because Im smart enough to realize that women wouldnt do it themselves if they had to support their man financially. However, I know that unlike me, most men out there would be happy to provide for their women because thats what they have been taught to do as a man just like all men in the past thousands of years.
Author vsmini Posted February 15, 2012 Author Posted February 15, 2012 I realize that I am late for the discussion but I will give my 2 cents anyway. vsmini, I like you and all, but this post gave away more to me than probably you would like to hear. You sound like you have a cattle prod up his azz. You're overstepping your boundaries. Until he stops contributing financially to the relationship (which of course includes coming to you for financial help), this isn't really your business. I have been in your boyfriend's situation. He is under an awful lot of stress, and I can assure you that your boyfriend is thinking of the exact scenarios that you brought up to him. I can also assure you that if I were in his shoes I would shut down towards you too. I don't need a taskmaker! I am harsh, but I am also rooting for him to get a job, and for this to work for both of you. I do appreciate the feedback from you and EVERYONE. It's now over a month later and still no job. I've taken everyone's advice in stride and really haven't mentioned much to him. I still stand firm that I was never nagging him or had a cattle prod up his "azzz" - I asked him honest questions because I wanted to start up a conversation about it. I was sensitive but he still shut down. To an extent - I disagree that him finding a job is "none of my business" I don't buy that one bit. We live together, have both talked about marriage and agree we want it....It's my business and you won't convince me differently. Still - I don't abuse that and act as if it's a passport into making him feel bad about the situation, I am allowed to ask him about it - that I'm not going to budge on. He has one more rent payment and then he is officially going to his credit cards. I'm not breaking up with him. He is still landing interviews but not getting the jobs. Hopefully something will turn up. Thanks again for EVERYONE'S feedback!
Author vsmini Posted February 15, 2012 Author Posted February 15, 2012 I got great advice for you: get rid of the useless chump. I'm kidding, dont get twisted over my remarks. What was your boyfriend's main specialty when he graduated college? I'm talking about his field of major. Maybe you guys should pack up and go to where he used to live. There might be a better chance of steadier work. Are you working, Vsmini? I haven't seen you around the boards until now so I'm curious as to how you're doing overall. Would you consider leaving NYC with your man or has the Big Apple polluted you into staying? I'm working - I have been working with the same company for six and a half years and I love it. I love my job but don't love the city. When I/we're ready I want to settle down in the country. I'm thinking one of the square states! Michigan is where we are both originally from - the job market is more bleek over there. He is now applying out of state.
Author vsmini Posted February 15, 2012 Author Posted February 15, 2012 That's a joke, and I feel sorry for people who think this world is a competition and about showing real "strength"..that's like me beating you to a pulp and judging you by how many times you can get up. The higher you are the harder they fall when things don't work out for you, and this is a typical case. In fact likely only experiencing this due to the economical state of the country, otherwise he'd probably fine a job right away just like many untalented jokesters I've had the privilege of working with in my lifetime who get where they are due to "senority" not performance anyway. Of course he is depressed and down, I love how people talk how they have never been there, or fortunate not to have, or even feel like they think they can run their mouth now "because they overcame it". Imo how you are acting is what defines you in this moment...how supportive can you be? do you only tolerate one year of a setback before you decide whether to jump ship or not? If anything this is defining the relationship not him, in one year he could have this completely turned around, making far more money than you are...then what are you going to say? glad I stayed? wish I wouldn't have left him? Beyond ridiculousness in this entire post, it's a catastrophe really. I would dump vsmini like a rock If I was him and reading this post, then go live with family or in some other situation. Get my life together, and get a real supportive woman who really would be there for me in my lows not only when my wallet is fat. This really makes me feel that some readers are A - not reading what I'm saying at all and that goes for my OP B - take any questioning of job status or any signal of honest worry as a sign that the girlfriend is an unsupportive, nagging witch. I have my own job, never asked him for money when his wallet was "fat" and never gave him any ultimatums or called him a deadbeat. This is hardly grounds for thinking I deserve to be dumped. The guy I'm with isn't an idiot and has integrity - if I was just some b*tch that nagged him about getting a job for no good reason (or any reason at all) and put him down he would be long gone. Some people on here are having stronger reactions to this than he is.
Sanman Posted February 15, 2012 Posted February 15, 2012 If you really are up for marriage, this is the time to prove it. Support him and be prepared to make some sacrifices. You said that he is getting interviews, thus he is doing what he is supposed to be doing. You mentioned that he is applying out of state and that may be the key. I had contemplated moving to where my gf lives, but all my good job offers came in the NYC area and that is where I decided to stay. Our is for both of us to stay employed at stable positions and, when we are both ready, we will both start job hunting. Wherever we get the best combination of job offers is where we will move. If she gets promoted (I am on fellowship with a job offer when I am done) and it is harder for her to make the same money she does at her company I will have to move to her. If I get a crazy good offer that I cannot find near her then she moves to me. Either way, we are not moving in together until both of us have stable jobs in the same area. I have several friends (couples) doing the same. You guys may need to do this and weather the storm of time apart.
2sunny Posted February 16, 2012 Posted February 16, 2012 I'd like to ask you - what DOES he do all day long everyday? How many hours EACH day is he FOCUSED on obtaining a job? Any job? Remind him - some money is better than NO money. I'd be concerned what his plan is when his savings runs out. Ask him what the plan is. IF he doesn't have an idea - you may want to rethink being with him... Unless you don't mind a guy who has no plan and no energy to get a plan - and doesn't make the effort to even come up with the energy to focus about carrying any plan out. What's attractive about a man with no direction?
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