dasein Posted January 4, 2012 Posted January 4, 2012 The truth is what it is. It's not little magic fairies doing the macarena in your tummy--it's adrenaline doing a number on your central nervous system. I would like to think there is something more than just brain chemicals when two people fall in love. If you break it down like that, you just won't go far in dating or in love or whatever else you want. Sorry, no fairy dust. FF nailed it. To add, google "limerence wiki" for more on the uncertainty part. It really is just uncertainty of the return of lusty feelings. And it's always better to understand how things work than attributing them to "magic."
The Outlaw Posted January 4, 2012 Posted January 4, 2012 It's that nervous feeling you get whenever you're around someone you're attracted to. Big time nervous feeling.
silvermercy Posted January 4, 2012 Posted January 4, 2012 Sorry, no fairy dust. FF nailed it. To add, google "limerence wiki" for more on the uncertainty part. It really is just uncertainty of the return of lusty feelings. And it's always better to understand how things work than attributing them to "magic." Where did I mention anything about magic and fairy dust? I find people without spirituality dry. But that's a totally different topic altogether.
chryssy83 Posted January 5, 2012 Posted January 5, 2012 Ummm....I don't think that the butterflies are anything like fear. It's more like a bubbly, tingly, excited feeling I get when I meet a guy who really attracts me on all levels (to the extent one can without knowing him well). It's certainly not a result of extreme social anxiety, of which I have almost none.
Feelin Frisky Posted January 5, 2012 Posted January 5, 2012 I would like to think there is something more than just brain chemicals when two people fall in love. If you break it down like that, you just won't go far in dating or in love or whatever else you want. I'm sorry but I really don't see where the term "butterflies" means falling in love and I said that twice. As I also said some people may use that term in the context of having "sparks of attraction", but generally "butterflies" is mostly used to mean nervousness about anything where you are going to be "on the spot" to perform socially or professionally in front of other people. I stuck to that context and if you look again it should be pretty clear. Perhaps you have not heard people say that have "butterflies" in their stomach before an interview, before public speaking, before a blind date, speaking to someone who has power over them which can go from say someone higher up the food chain at work or in the family as well as talking to someone you've had a crush on for a while for the first time because they have had an implicit "power" over you which puts you nervousness mode about performance. None of this has anything to do with two people "falling in love" but in either case, physical chemistry is absolutely always involved. The nervous "butterfly" scenario is adrenaline effecting the central nervous system which manifests in stomach tension, bowel tension, blushing, shaky voice and even shaky hand. Falling in love is a whole different story chemically because it's not a short-term fear response.
Untouchable_Fire Posted January 5, 2012 Posted January 5, 2012 I would like to think there is something more than just brain chemicals when two people fall in love. If you break it down like that, you just won't go far in dating or in love or whatever else you want. Frisky has it right. I used to get butterflies when I was 15 and talked to a girl I liked. That happened because I was nervous and had ZERO self confidence with women. I actually have not had that butterflies feeling since then, because I have confidence in myself... and I'm not worried if this doesn't work out. Anyone who puts stock in this feeling is an idiot.
carhill Posted January 5, 2012 Posted January 5, 2012 Perhaps this underscores the differences in genetic and socialized 'wiring' between men and women. I personally, not being a woman, have no clue about what they feel when they say they have 'butterflies' even if they describe it, as done in this thread. It is informative to read the descriptions but the elemental nature of the feelings are outside of my experience as a man. Alien
Quiet Storm Posted January 5, 2012 Posted January 5, 2012 I agree that "butterflies" are the result of chemical reactions. It would make a nice fairy tale to say that the "butterflies" I got when I met my husband were some kind of sign that we are soul mates, but I am logical enough to know that our phermomes were meshing (20 years later they still mesh). I think because women are more emotional and romantic, we view these basic, human, biological chemcial reactions in a romantic and emotional way. Men have the natural physical drive to have sex, and many don't need any emotional connection whatsover to be physically attracted to someone. Most are not naturally monogamous, and would have sex with many different women if they were willing and it didn't have any negative consequences. Physical attraction is all that is needed to prompt most men to have sex. During sex and the build up, the man's lust will create passionate and loving feelings in him, often resulting in words that the woman takes way too seriously. But his emotional feelings are fleeting, and related to the chemicals of lust, which is why many men lose interest or feel "suffocated" after they get the goodies. Most women on the other hand, need some kind of emotional connection to prompt them to have sex. Men know this, which is why many really lay on the romance at the beginning of a relationship. They need her to be emotionally invested, so that she is more willing to have sex (or keep the sex coming). With pick up artists, the emotion they create in the women is uncertainty. They have figured out that this uncertainty and mystery creates the "butterflies" of attraction in women. Not always being available, planting seeds of doubt, throwing out a compliment followed by a criticism...all of that builds mystery. The fact that they are busy and have many options (not acting too eager or desperate), makes his attention seem more valuable. When the PUA is with the woman and giving her attention, the previous uncertainty, combined with relief (he wants me), creates butterflies, which makes the woman feel a "connection". Once he starts having sex with her, the oxytocin kicks in and she feels bonded to him. This connection sparks the woman to feel a need to please him...and he has successfully gotten her under his thumb. The butterflies get many women in trouble. It attracts them to men that aren't good for them and often keeps them there. He could have a list of terrible qualities, she will say to herself "but I have butterflies, I haven't felt like this for anyone before, that must mean something". He will treat her badly, but she will say "but I love him". In my case, I was lucky and felt butterflies for a man that wanted to commit to me. However, many women feel butterflies for the wrong man. It would serve women well to be more logical and less emotional, but that's just not how most of us are. Logically, many of the qualities we want in a man are kindness, stability, honorable, integrity....however, many of us feel attraction and interest for men that don't meet those standards. When we enter a relationship with them, we'll expect them to be more kind & stable, when those are not the qualities that attracted us in the first place. So I very much feel that butterflies are simply chemical reactions, but most women don't. We want to believe in soul mates and connections and "the one". We want romance and happily ever after. We want this love to MEAN SOMETHING. We don't want to think we are interchangable. We want to feel special. To label these feelings as chemical reactions and biological drives just make it too impersonal for most of us. I think the bottom line for many men, its less about the individual woman and more about the role a woman plays in his life. They want a woman to fill their need for sex and companionship. They are not so much interested in feelings and connection and personalities, IMO. They don't need her to know all his thoughts and dreams. They don't care much about her education or her career or her hobbies or favorite movies. I believe most men just want their "woman role" to be filled with an attractive, good natured woman that doesn't cheat on him. For women, it's less about the role and more about the individual man. If she feels a connection, that often trumps all logic. And it all comes down to the butterflies.
Forever Learning Posted January 5, 2012 Posted January 5, 2012 I agree that "butterflies" are the result of chemical reactions. It would make a nice fairy tale to say that the "butterflies" I got when I met my husband were some kind of sign that we are soul mates, but I am logical enough to know that our phermomes were meshing (20 years later they still mesh). I think because women are more emotional and romantic, we view these basic, human, biological chemcial reactions in a romantic and emotional way. Men have the natural physical drive to have sex, and many don't need any emotional connection whatsover to be physically attracted to someone. Most are not naturally monogamous, and would have sex with many different women if they were willing and it didn't have any negative consequences. Physical attraction is all that is needed to prompt most men to have sex. During sex and the build up, the man's lust will create passionate and loving feelings in him, often resulting in words that the woman takes way too seriously. But his emotional feelings are fleeting, and related to the chemicals of lust, which is why many men lose interest or feel "suffocated" after they get the goodies. Most women on the other hand, need some kind of emotional connection to prompt them to have sex. Men know this, which is why many really lay on the romance at the beginning of a relationship. They need her to be emotionally invested, so that she is more willing to have sex (or keep the sex coming). With pick up artists, the emotion they create in the women is uncertainty. They have figured out that this uncertainty and mystery creates the "butterflies" of attraction in women. Not always being available, planting seeds of doubt, throwing out a compliment followed by a criticism...all of that builds mystery. The fact that they are busy and have many options (not acting too eager or desperate), makes his attention seem more valuable. When the PUA is with the woman and giving her attention, the previous uncertainty, combined with relief (he wants me), creates butterflies, which makes the woman feel a "connection". Once he starts having sex with her, the oxytocin kicks in and she feels bonded to him. This connection sparks the woman to feel a need to please him...and he has successfully gotten her under his thumb. The butterflies get many women in trouble. It attracts them to men that aren't good for them and often keeps them there. He could have a list of terrible qualities, she will say to herself "but I have butterflies, I haven't felt like this for anyone before, that must mean something". He will treat her badly, but she will say "but I love him". In my case, I was lucky and felt butterflies for a man that wanted to commit to me. However, many women feel butterflies for the wrong man. It would serve women well to be more logical and less emotional, but that's just not how most of us are. Logically, many of the qualities we want in a man are kindness, stability, honorable, integrity....however, many of us feel attraction and interest for men that don't meet those standards. When we enter a relationship with them, we'll expect them to be more kind & stable, when those are not the qualities that attracted us in the first place. So I very much feel that butterflies are simply chemical reactions, but most women don't. We want to believe in soul mates and connections and "the one". We want romance and happily ever after. We want this love to MEAN SOMETHING. We don't want to think we are interchangable. We want to feel special. To label these feelings as chemical reactions and biological drives just make it too impersonal for most of us. I think the bottom line for many men, its less about the individual woman and more about the role a woman plays in his life. They want a woman to fill their need for sex and companionship. They are not so much interested in feelings and connection and personalities, IMO. They don't need her to know all his thoughts and dreams. They don't care much about her education or her career or her hobbies or favorite movies. I believe most men just want their "woman role" to be filled with an attractive, good natured woman that doesn't cheat on him. For women, it's less about the role and more about the individual man. If she feels a connection, that often trumps all logic. And it all comes down to the butterflies. What an AMAZINGLY ACCURATE post. You are 100% right of course. I am going to print this out and tape it on my fridge, along with keep extras on hand to give to my friends. Awesome! So well written and easy to understand. I learned alot from this. Thank you so much!
silvermercy Posted January 5, 2012 Posted January 5, 2012 So most men only want is sex and companionship? That's it? And they don't care about anything else like her education, her dreams etc? How come there are so many couples where the men take a very genuine and loving interest to what their other half does? (In fact, one example of how some men "care" TOO much about their partner's education can be found in extreme sociopathic situations: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2075435/Husband-chops-wifes-fingers-stop-studying-degree.html) Are men and women 2 different species? How on Earth they managed to populate the earth without one species exterminating each other is fascinating... Obviously they are very incompatible. No? I think it's more social conditioning and less biology (I speak as a biologist btw).
Author jobaba Posted January 5, 2012 Author Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) I agree that "butterflies" are the result of chemical reactions. It would make a nice fairy tale to say that the "butterflies" I got when I met my husband were some kind of sign that we are soul mates, but I am logical enough to know that our phermomes were meshing (20 years later they still mesh). I think because women are more emotional and romantic, we view these basic, human, biological chemcial reactions in a romantic and emotional way. Men have the natural physical drive to have sex, and many don't need any emotional connection whatsover to be physically attracted to someone. Most are not naturally monogamous, and would have sex with many different women if they were willing and it didn't have any negative consequences. Physical attraction is all that is needed to prompt most men to have sex. During sex and the build up, the man's lust will create passionate and loving feelings in him, often resulting in words that the woman takes way too seriously. But his emotional feelings are fleeting, and related to the chemicals of lust, which is why many men lose interest or feel "suffocated" after they get the goodies. Most women on the other hand, need some kind of emotional connection to prompt them to have sex. Men know this, which is why many really lay on the romance at the beginning of a relationship. They need her to be emotionally invested, so that she is more willing to have sex (or keep the sex coming). With pick up artists, the emotion they create in the women is uncertainty. They have figured out that this uncertainty and mystery creates the "butterflies" of attraction in women. Not always being available, planting seeds of doubt, throwing out a compliment followed by a criticism...all of that builds mystery. The fact that they are busy and have many options (not acting too eager or desperate), makes his attention seem more valuable. When the PUA is with the woman and giving her attention, the previous uncertainty, combined with relief (he wants me), creates butterflies, which makes the woman feel a "connection". Once he starts having sex with her, the oxytocin kicks in and she feels bonded to him. This connection sparks the woman to feel a need to please him...and he has successfully gotten her under his thumb. The butterflies get many women in trouble. It attracts them to men that aren't good for them and often keeps them there. He could have a list of terrible qualities, she will say to herself "but I have butterflies, I haven't felt like this for anyone before, that must mean something". He will treat her badly, but she will say "but I love him". In my case, I was lucky and felt butterflies for a man that wanted to commit to me. However, many women feel butterflies for the wrong man. It would serve women well to be more logical and less emotional, but that's just not how most of us are. Logically, many of the qualities we want in a man are kindness, stability, honorable, integrity....however, many of us feel attraction and interest for men that don't meet those standards. When we enter a relationship with them, we'll expect them to be more kind & stable, when those are not the qualities that attracted us in the first place. So I very much feel that butterflies are simply chemical reactions, but most women don't. We want to believe in soul mates and connections and "the one". We want romance and happily ever after. We want this love to MEAN SOMETHING. We don't want to think we are interchangable. We want to feel special. To label these feelings as chemical reactions and biological drives just make it too impersonal for most of us. I think the bottom line for many men, its less about the individual woman and more about the role a woman plays in his life. They want a woman to fill their need for sex and companionship. They are not so much interested in feelings and connection and personalities, IMO. They don't need her to know all his thoughts and dreams. They don't care much about her education or her career or her hobbies or favorite movies. I believe most men just want their "woman role" to be filled with an attractive, good natured woman that doesn't cheat on him. For women, it's less about the role and more about the individual man. If she feels a connection, that often trumps all logic. And it all comes down to the butterflies. Wow. That is a profound post. Good stuff. The only thing I disagree with is the bolded. I think many women would date a man based on looks alone. I have heard women talk about men they have just met and say, "I'd date him!" Still, EVERYBODY should read this post. Edited January 5, 2012 by jobaba
Imajerk17 Posted January 5, 2012 Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) So most men only want is sex and companionship? That's it? And they don't care about anything else like her education, her dreams etc? C'mon silvermercy, you know better. We're just pretending to be interested in that stuff, just get into you pants. No. (I do wonder what the look on your face was reading that though.) Quiet Storm nailed it from our end too. We want sex AND we want companionship. We're interested in your dreams in the sense in that you share with us. But we can feel like we want to sleep with you without connecting on this level. And we want you to be interested in ours. BUT we don't feel the need to share our inner workings too often. Edited January 5, 2012 by Imajerk17
Untouchable_Fire Posted January 5, 2012 Posted January 5, 2012 So most men only want is sex and companionship? That's it? And they don't care about anything else like her education, her dreams etc? How come there are so many couples where the men take a very genuine and loving interest to what their other half does? (In fact, one example of how some men "care" TOO much about their partner's education can be found in extreme sociopathic situations: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2075435/Husband-chops-wifes-fingers-stop-studying-degree.html) Who the hell was paying for her college? If I didn't want my wife in college I would just cut off the money... not her fingers. So who was paying for it?
silvermercy Posted January 5, 2012 Posted January 5, 2012 C'mon silvermercy, you know better. We're just pretending to be interested in that stuff, just get into you pants. No. (I do wonder what the look on your face was reading that though.) Quiet Storm nailed it from our end too. We want sex AND we want companionship. We're interested in your dreams in the sense in that you share with us. But we can feel like we want to sleep with you without connecting on this level. And we want you to be interested in ours. BUT we don't feel the need to share our inner workings too often. I had a poker face! As I said before, I think everything you also mentioned is mostly social conditioning.
Imajerk17 Posted January 5, 2012 Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) I had a poker face! As I said before, I think everything you also mentioned is mostly social conditioning. OK, Lady GaGa! That said, I do think social conditioning plays a role, but I think that the underlying biology between men and women is what does it. Edited January 5, 2012 by Imajerk17
silvermercy Posted January 5, 2012 Posted January 5, 2012 OK, Lady GaGa! That said, I do think social conditioning plays a role, but I think that the underlying biology between men and women is what does it. Well, I think it's the exact reverse! The rest is... Bad Romance... lol
Imajerk17 Posted January 5, 2012 Posted January 5, 2012 Well, I think it's the exact reverse! The rest is... Bad Romance... lol Are you on the right track baby or were you born this way?
Buttercup84 Posted January 6, 2012 Posted January 6, 2012 I love them , had them for my ex and still do sometimes . I miss them
skippercollector Posted January 6, 2012 Posted January 6, 2012 I don't think I've ever heard anyone use the term "butterflies in one's stomach" in regards to physical attraction. I've only ever heard the term in regards to nervousness. For example, some of the times I've experienced it are: 1. Just before I give a speech or public talk. 2. Getting on a plane. 3. Right before a test at school started. 4. Going into surgery. I think this is the way most people will define "butterflies."
Jynxx Posted January 7, 2012 Posted January 7, 2012 (edited) A bit late to the party, but here's my .02$ I never experienced something like that, but it seems to be some form of blood pressure change. When I'm extremely stressed or had too much of something I hear my heartbeat in my ears and feel somewhat dizzy in my brain. It's just a temporary overdose of stresshormones/adrenaline/chemicals in general that my body can't handle. I figure "butterflies" are that same form of stress with people who are lucky enough to have it manifest in their stomach area rather than in their head. Edit: Just read through the thread and saw some people describe it as the stomach feeling of a freefall. Doesn't sound fun at all to have for more than a few seconds, I'd rather have the nauseating feeling described above then. Edited January 7, 2012 by Jynxx .
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