PlumPrincess Posted December 19, 2011 Posted December 19, 2011 Shouldn't that be good for people like you. I mean, more women for you to choose from? In order for there to be "have mores" there have to be some "have nots". The wallowing in self-pity here has really reached a new level. The reason why he looks so unappealingly pathetic to women is that he insists on his pathetic approach. We girls told him we think that it's a bad idea and smacks of loser, but whatever...
fortyninethousand322 Posted December 19, 2011 Posted December 19, 2011 The wallowing in self-pity here has really reached a new level. The reason why he looks so unappealingly pathetic to women is that he insists on his pathetic approach. We girls told him we think that it's a bad idea and smacks of loser, but whatever... How does this have anything to do with what I wrote? I was replying to a male poster asking him why he would care if a male was struggling, because basically it eliminates some competition for him. One would think he'd be fine with it. There's nothing wrong with what I wrote.
Author U1987 Posted December 19, 2011 Author Posted December 19, 2011 I don't care about ratings and don't pay attention to them. I care about finding someone that I am compatible with, so I look at the percentages and read what the guy has written. Some guy just wrote to me, "hey baby, how wuz your weekend?" I'm sure as hell not responding or giving him any stars! It's a lame message that he's probably sent to dozens of women. Huge turnoff. Well yeah of course; the majority of messages guys send on OLD are lame like that. The thing is, I don't write those kind of messages; I don't try to "holler" at these girls or everything. I actually put some effort into it. This is my standard first email. Hey ______, what's good? I'm _______. I have to say, you're profile really stood off the page. You come off as ______, ______ and just a little bit ______; I like that. I can also appreciate anyone who's into ________. I _______ as well. Anyway, I think we'll definitely enjoy learning more about each other, so get back to me if you want to chat some more. Have a good one! The first 2 blank spaces are her name and mine. The next 3 blank spaces are non-looks-based, non-sexual compliments that come to mind after reading her profile. The last 2 blank spaces are common/similar interests. A similar format was suggested to me by a veteran online dater on here who said it actually got him lots of correspondences and dates; I've since added some slight tweaks and modifications here and there. What's wrong though? Why isn't it working?
oaks Posted December 19, 2011 Posted December 19, 2011 What's wrong though? Why isn't it working? It sounds like a form letter. (Of course, I know it's a form letter, so perhaps that spoils my judgement.) Maybe you have bad photos. I wonder if you'll get any new answers this time - you've done this thread before.
ScienceGal Posted December 20, 2011 Posted December 20, 2011 What's wrong though? Why isn't it working? It seems very generic to me. My #1 critique is that you did not ask any questions ("what's good?" doesn't count). ALWAYS end with a specific question. What kinds of things do you have in common with these women? Example, "I really enjoy hiking too, my favorite place is ______. Whats are some of your favorite places to go?" And get good photos if you don't already. Look happy and like you're having fun. Travel photos are great. If you own a cat, guinea pig or bird, DO NOT post a picture with it. A photo with your dog would be ok, unless it's a chiuaua. I will not respond to: - a shirtless man that is not on the beach or in a situation that requires him to be shirtless. I don't care if you have an 6 or 8 pack if you're portraying yourself like a piece of meat (or male whore). - a guy who has taken a photo of himself in the mirror and you can see him holding the camera. You're not selling yourself on Craigslist for crying out loud. I am sure you know someone that will take one for you. If not, go to a nice place and ask a stranger. Tell them it's for your grandma that lives across the country. I am just one person, and these are my opinions. Just trying to help And here is a question for you. Do you think you're appealing to women? Why or why not?
Author U1987 Posted December 20, 2011 Author Posted December 20, 2011 It seems very generic to me. My #1 critique is that you did not ask any questions ("what's good?" doesn't count). ALWAYS end with a specific question. What kinds of things do you have in common with these women? Example, "I really enjoy hiking too, my favorite place is ______. Whats are some of your favorite places to go?" I've been told (like I said, by some successful veteran male online daters) that it's a bad idea to ask personal questions in the first email; that it comes off as invasive (since you don't know her at all and she's made no effort yet to reach out to you) and that it looks even more embarrassing if she doesn't respond (with your question just hanging in the air like that). And get good photos if you don't already. Look happy and like you're having fun. Travel photos are great. If you own a cat, guinea pig or bird, DO NOT post a picture with it. A photo with your dog would be ok, unless it's a chiuaua. I will not respond to: - a shirtless man that is not on the beach or in a situation that requires him to be shirtless. I don't care if you have an 6 or 8 pack if you're portraying yourself like a piece of meat (or male whore). - a guy who has taken a photo of himself in the mirror and you can see him holding the camera. You're not selling yourself on Craigslist for crying out loud. I am sure you know someone that will take one for you. If not, go to a nice place and ask a stranger. Tell them it's for your grandma that lives across the country. My photos are awesome; its me playing electric guitar on stage with a band and me walking a runway in a small fashion show. Believe me, nothing enrages me more than all the barely-literate jackasses on OLD who pose shirtless and send "Hey baby gurl, wuz happening" kind of messages. You don't need to mistake me for one of those guys. I am just one person, and these are my opinions. Just trying to help And here is a question for you. Do you think you're appealing to women? Why or why not? I consider myself a high-quality male; I'm a senior, about to graduate with a degree in biomedical science and going to grad school after. I play the guitar and piano. I've traveled to South America and Asia. I'm in shape (29 inch waist), I constantly dress well (upscale-casual, inspired by GQ) I'm drug/disease/debt free, have successfully quit smoking. I constantly like to go out instead of moping around the house just smoking pot, drinking beer and playing video games like most guys my age do in their free time. I only work part time at the moment. Some women on here have told me "Well, you just in college, so it's not like you're very successful..." But I've asked them what difference does that make? Why should it matter to a girl how much money I make? I'm not looking for gold diggers. I consider myself appealing to women who can see it, but I don't know how to express and convey my qualities without sounding like I'm bragging/full of myself. Like I said on another thread once, I also honestly believe that things like text messaging, smart phones and internet culture have destroyed most young women's abilities to notice a high quality guy when they see one and connect face to face with them.
Janesays Posted December 20, 2011 Posted December 20, 2011 You have an odd definition of high quality.
lululucy Posted December 20, 2011 Posted December 20, 2011 I've been told (like I said, by some successful veteran male online daters) that it's a bad idea to ask personal questions in the first email; that it comes off as invasive (since you don't know her at all and she's made no effort yet to reach out to you) and that it looks even more embarrassing if she doesn't respond (with your question just hanging in the air like that). My photos are awesome; its me playing electric guitar on stage with a band and me walking a runway in a small fashion show. I disagree completely with these "veteran male online daters". Your sample letter comes across as scripted, and if you didn't ask any personal questions I would assume you'd just skimmed my profile and picked out random details. Couple that with pictures of you in the centre of attention and I would assume you're a player or just more interested in yourself than the girl you were talking to. Which is true, really, since all you want is a piece of ass. I suppose you're showcasing yourself fairly well in that case. And Jane's right, that's a weird definition of high quality male.
oaks Posted December 20, 2011 Posted December 20, 2011 I've been told (like I said, by some successful veteran male online daters) that it's a bad idea to ask personal questions in the first email; When you've done this thread in the past you've also received the advice to ask a question. (You probably received contradictory advice around every aspect of what to do!) Anyway, what you're doing now isn't working, so change something. I think (but I'm a guy) that asking a relevant question invites a response and, if the woman is even slightly inclined to respond, makes it easier for some women to respond. Perhaps including those women who are new to online dating and have absolutely no clue what to write.
ScienceGal Posted December 20, 2011 Posted December 20, 2011 Maybe you should stop asking supposed online dating veteran gurus. If you already think you have the correct approach, why bother asking for more advice on here?! You need to stand out. Women get messages like yours all the time. Be more specific and show her you actually took the time to read her profile. Asking questions shows you're interested in the answers. And, makes it 100x easier for her to respond. So what if she doesn't answer... No big loss from where you are, right? Another thing is that you're going to med school. While this is great for you, it is not appealing to a woman who is looking for a LTR and to settle down. This would be my issue (not your income). Perhaps you will have more luck when you get to whatever school you're going to. I'm done writing in this thread. Good luck.
PlumPrincess Posted December 20, 2011 Posted December 20, 2011 I don't like stupid messages à la "you are hot", but I don't expect anything too fancy either as a first message. I see it as a statement of interest and an invitation to visit the other person's profile. If I like what I read and see a reason why you contacted me, you're in. If not, even the most considerate and well-crafted message is not going to achieve much.
EnigmaticClarity Posted December 20, 2011 Posted December 20, 2011 I've been told (like I said, by some successful veteran male online daters) that it's a bad idea to ask personal questions in the first email; that it comes off as invasive (since you don't know her at all and she's made no effort yet to reach out to you) and that it looks even more embarrassing if she doesn't respond (with your question just hanging in the air like that). There's truth in what you, ScienceGal, and the "veteran male online daters" you refer to are saying. I try to make all first emails short and not too personal as you suggest, but asking a question is ideal; it inspires a response more than not asking one. I also try to make it highly original; I've seen that bit about the "profile jumping off the page" out on the web before, it screamed "copied and pasted form letter" to me. I doubt most girls will recognize it, but some will. Original material customized to the girl is always better anyway and really doesn't take long. The more I like the girl, the longer I'll take on a witty opening, but I rarely take longer than 10 minutes even if it's someone I'm dying for a response from. My technique has always been to make a message subject line short, incomplete yet compelling, and part of a question that they have to click into the body of the message to be able to see. Humor customized to something from their profile almost GUARANTEES a profile view and if they like what they see sets up a high probability of response. Quick example--subject "I'm guessing the answer is yes", body "I see you're a big fan of Italian restaurants. Most people I see eating spaghetti in those cut it up--I bet you twirl yours like a real Italian would, don't you?" I only half-enjoy that one and would polish it for a girl I really wanted a response from, but it exhibits everything that I think evokes responses--humor, compelling subject line that begs a girl with 50 daily messages to click to see what the subject means, brief so that it doesn't take me much time yet inspires her to read my profile to learn more, and a simple question that sets up her response. I hate to say it and wish it weren't the case, but women have a lot of trouble coming up with what to say--I suppose men do as well--and asking them a question frames a response FOR them, making it easier for them to think of what to write in a follow-up. My profile is laced with humor as well and as you've done yourself have I worked on great pics of me in varying social situations or engaged sports or other activity pics with action (spiking a volleyball, throwing a frisbee to a dog, shooting and dunking a basketball) are great as well. I get about 80% profile views from my initial email using this general form, and somewhere from 50% to 70% responses to initial emails.
Casablanca Posted December 20, 2011 Posted December 20, 2011 Definitely weird. And if you asked me I would rate you a 1 based on creepiness alone. If a girl asked me, Id do the same as well
Mme. Chaucer Posted December 20, 2011 Posted December 20, 2011 You have an odd definition of high quality. So … a young woman who has not been corrupted by her iPhone and the world wide web would be able to notice your "high quality" and have casual sex with you because of it?
serial muse Posted December 20, 2011 Posted December 20, 2011 So … a young woman who has not been corrupted by her iPhone and the world wide web would be able to notice your "high quality" and have casual sex with you because of it? Gotta admit, I was thinking this too. It is a bit off, OP, that you're suggesting that women are having trouble somehow in recognizing your high quality, when you've also said (in other threads) that you want to pretend that you're interested in a relationship so you can have casual sex. So maybe the truth is that these women are actually quite good at recognizing what would be good for them?? (I have no opinion on whether the internet has helped with that or not.)
ScreamingTrees Posted December 20, 2011 Posted December 20, 2011 It'd probably be more acceptable to ask the ones that don't respond if they could take some time out to give constructive criticism.. It's STILL better than asking for an undeserved 5 star rating, no? At least they can be honest and possibly help you more than they ever could with some stupid stars.
serial muse Posted December 20, 2011 Posted December 20, 2011 It'd probably be more acceptable to ask the ones that don't respond if they could take some time out to give constructive criticism.. It's STILL better than asking for an undeserved 5 star rating, no? At least they can be honest and possibly help you more than they ever could with some stupid stars. I agree with this. There's still an excellent chance that someone who's not interested isn't going to bother, but you won't be likely to get blowback. And I think there will be people who will respond to something like this, because it doesn't sound whiny or angry, just thoughtful and respectful. Nobody likes to be guilted, OP. Nobody. It is NOT going to up your star rating if you try to guilt people. They will respond badly. This is basic human nature stuff.
snowflakes88 Posted December 20, 2011 Posted December 20, 2011 The first 2 blank spaces are her name and mine. The next 3 blank spaces are non-looks-based, non-sexual compliments that come to mind after reading her profile. The last 2 blank spaces are common/similar interests. A similar format was suggested to me by a veteran online dater on here who said it actually got him lots of correspondences and dates; I've since added some slight tweaks and modifications here and there. What's wrong though? Why isn't it working? It is waaaay too generic. It's obvious that it's a "form," even if you're filling in the blanks with information from her profile. I skip over anything that I can tell is a form or copy/paste message. Also: "I have to say, you're profile really stood off the page." That should be "your." This might not be a big deal for some women, but I'm also less likely to respond if there are obvious grammatical/spelling/punctuation errors. I'm curious as to how your profile reads. If it's anything like what you posted above (e.g., "I have a 29-inch waist and dress in a manner inspired by GQ"), I can see a lot of women being turned off by it.
Author U1987 Posted December 22, 2011 Author Posted December 22, 2011 I'm curious as to how your profile reads. If it's anything like what you posted above (e.g., "I have a 29-inch waist and dress in a manner inspired by GQ"), I can see a lot of women being turned off by it. Jesus! Of course not! Do you think I'm that dumb? I let my pictures speak for my physical shape and style of dress.
Mme. Chaucer Posted December 22, 2011 Posted December 22, 2011 Jesus! Of course not! Do you think I'm that dumb? I let my pictures speak for my physical shape and style of dress. I don't know about dumb, but some of your ideas (girls should be made to "feel guilty" for not responding to you; girls would have casual sex with you if they had the capacity to understand how "high quality" you are; trying with all your might to find the right wording in your dating profile to lure relationship seeking girls into having casual sex with you; it could conceivably be appropriate or useful to ask (or try to guilt trip) a non-repsonder to give you a 5 star rating) are communicating the idea that you are very disconnected with other people. And, yes, that it would be likely that your profile contains some odd information like the size of your waist or that you dress like a GQ model. I bet that your online dating presence is not that different from yours here on LS.
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