Men "lowering their standards".....

[Wolf18]

They don't "talk" to me about Batman, they ARGUE with me about Batman.

 

And therein lies the thing I've been trying to beat you over the head with.

 

That guys actually DON'T jump on everything they see, even desperate ones. That guys have their own screwed up senses of standards just like some women do. (I find it hilarious karma that you turned down a girl for having too wavy hair.) That girls can supposedly be attractive on paper (or forums) and still have difficulties that do not include fetus face accessories.

 

I've shown you pictures of guys I've dated. I've described my standards every time. I can say, honestly, hand to heart, that I have dated every single guy who stated out loud he is interested in me.

 

And yet you still misbelieve. What exactly is it going to take for you to accept that there are some women out there that DON'T HAVE IT EASY? Why are you so determined to prove this point?

 

I agree that I deserve my karma for being a shallow idiot, now that I am on the receiving end of such an attitude Times are so bad, that I'd probably do anything just to touch a woman at all and have her reciprocate, I feel like I'm in prison in this ****ty society. Don't even need a relationship or even full one night stand.

 

As for the rest, you must live in Bizarro land.

 

 

I guess I should have added that she doesn't want a ONS. She wants you to be her BF. You still going there? No, it's not an extreme caricature. I meet men like that. [/Quote]

 

 

I probably wouldn't want to be the boyfriend of such a woman, to be quite honest. And I know you wouldn't want to date her male equivalent.

 

Most people, aren't that extreme however, and every guy you've rejected hasn't been either.

 

I go to bars with my girlfriends, who are all educated professionals. In terms of looks, we range from average to beautiful, and men aren't falling over us, but according to you they're falling over crazy, unemployed alcoholics?! That just doesn't make sense. [/Quote]

 

Well didn't you say you lived in Oppositeville, USA? The place where ugly, unemployed alcoholic men have supermodels that financially support them?

 

 

I used to go to bars a lot , and I have never , in the probably hundreds of times I've gone out, seen a group of women , no matter what they look like, not get hit on atleast twice. And if there's attractive women in your group, multiplay that by 20.

 

I really would love to know where all of you women live where it's the polar opposite of where I live.

[verhrzn]

I really would love to know where all of you women live where it's the polar opposite of where I live.

 

I'm in the Midwest. When I go out with my female friends, one of my friends gets hit on A LOT. She's bubbly and exotic and extremely confident, so it makes sense. The rest of us, who are of varying degrees of attractiveness, are ignored.

[Wolf18]

I'm in the Midwest. When I go out with my female friends, one of my friends gets hit on A LOT. She's bubbly and exotic and extremely confident, so it makes sense. The rest of us, who are of varying degrees of attractiveness, are ignored.

 

 

I suppose we will have to agree to disagree.

 

I will stick by my point that 99% of women who are having dry spells, are in that predicament by choice.

[123321]

The few folks I know who claimed I "settled" are the ones still single and hoping for an impossible standard.

 

Interesting sentence there.

[counterman]

I suppose we will have to agree to disagree.

 

I will stick by my point that 99% of women who are having dry spells, are in that predicament by choice.

 

Most of my girl friends are in that situation because of their ridiculous standards. First, they complain that no guys show interest, but when decent guys show interest, they're labelled as a creep or loser simply because these guys aren't extremely good-looking (I know some of these guys and with all the douchebags around, these guys are pretty decent and have grounds to be really successful). They have not much going on for them, some are below-average looking but they expect Brad Pitt. It's funny because they've had NO dating experience whatsoever and yet they have this unrealistic expectations. Fine, everyone is entitled to their standards and preferences but when they're getting older, fear being alone and start getting desperate, don't complain that there are no 'good guys' left because those decent guys that they've turned down are now successful and in happy relationships with girls who didn't expect a Hollywood stud. I use the work 'friends' loosely here; I can't stand some of the things I heard come out of their mouths.

 

BUT I understand this isn't representative of all girls and is probably far from it. Whether it is or not, it doesn't affect me whatsoever. Some girls have it tough, and some girls don't. Same with guys.

[Wolf18]

That's been my experience as well Counterman. Some girl who I chased hard but ended up getting with some other dude, would write on her facebook lamenting about how no guys at her college want to get to know her (btw, she barely leaves her room and has many social problems). I remember becomming enraged whenever I would read such a thing, this girl had a boyfriend, and 2 other guys (and countless other admirers) that would take her in and be with her in an instant.

 

Objectively she was no better looking than me or better than me in any way other than having a vagina. But woe is me, "I tried to make conversation with the 6'4 soccer team star with long blonde hair and he ignored me to talk to an equally popular/attractive girl" was the big crime against her Women have it so tough

[mammamia1]

both counterman and wolf18 are right. I'm a woman and on dry spell by choice. Yes there's a number of guys whom I rudely ignore. The thing is, for women, we can't enjoy sex if we don't like the guy (versus a good number of guys who would enjoy sex with anything that walks).

To "like" someone, well, now it comes back to the criteria and all. Judging from the women's posts here, I guess most share the same situation.

[iris219]

Most women over a certain age don't care about landing the "hot" guy. Here's what I'm looking for in a SO:

1. Someone I find reasonably attractive. This does NOT mean traditionally handsome. I find a large range of men attractive. As long as a guy isn't really fat, I'll consider it. Attractive to me just means not repulsed by the thought of sex with the person.

2. That we have some sort of rapport/connection that makes me care about his life, want to get to know him more, and inspires me to share details about myself. This one is so rare that when I find it, a man pretty much automatically becomes attractive to me.

3. We are compatible, meaning: We can communicate about issues on which we disagree without trying to kill each other. We show our love for each other in ways the other respects and understands. We want similar things in life (i.e. marriage and children).

 

I don't care about your job, social status, money, education, or if you're "hot." I think the above is pretty realistic.

[mammamia1]

this totally sounds like me. Probably because I'm 20-something years old. I'm scared to think about when I get older (which is only few years away), I have no options any more and karma will bite me. Yes, many girls are that silly.

 

Some girl who I chased hard but ended up getting with some other dude, would write on her facebook lamenting about how no guys at her college want to get to know her (btw, she barely leaves her room and has many social problems). I remember becomming enraged whenever I would read such a thing, this girl had a boyfriend, and 2 other guys (and countless other admirers) that would take her in and be with her in an instant.

 

Objectively she was no better looking than me or better than me in any way other than having a vagina. But woe is me, "I tried to make conversation with the 6'4 soccer team star with long blonde hair and he ignored me to talk to an equally popular/attractive girl" was the big crime against her Women have it so tough

[ThaWholigan]

both counterman and wolf18 are right. I'm a woman and on dry spell by choice. Yes there's a number of guys whom I rudely ignore. The thing is, for women, we can't enjoy sex if we don't like the guy (versus a good number of guys who would enjoy sex with anything that walks).

To "like" someone, well, now it comes back to the criteria and all. Judging from the women's posts here, I guess most share the same situation.

 

As I suspected. Which is why Elysian Powder's posts, although inflammatory, make sense.

 

Women will generally find it difficult to be aroused and have sex with men they are not attracted to. It's that simple. I wish that they could "give us a chance" as some guys allude to, but it just doesn't work that way. I think if more women owned up to that then it would be easier for some guys, but personally, I'm not gonna call for them to do that because.......well, they won't .

 

My father is a philosophical and funny guy. He's an actor and has appeared on TV and stage (he' was in a Steven Seagal movie aswell). Last time I saw him, about a month ago or something, he said to me "Son.....Women are to be loved........not to be understood". I laughed my ass off. This is a guy who women flock to, so to hear him say that was pretty funny.

 

I feel that once we accept that there are slight differences that are there, it may be easier for us to meet halfway. Because I feel what my father says is vice versa. I think women don't really understand men all that well either to be honest. That's just my humble opinion on the matter.

 

 

Iris219's list is pretty much a standard list for most women. If women find you universally unattractive, you can actually change that. Mick Hucknall is an ugly mofo and he's slept with thousands of women . Albeit rich, but still......

 

This raises the question. We know what women find attractive (or we think we do). We have the info, the tools, the ability to become attractive/seductive/whatever. What the hell are we waiting for??

 

 

Edited December 17, 2011 by ThaWholigan

[mammamia1]

he said to me "Son.....Women are to be loved........not to be understood".

 

that's a good piece of wisdom.

I had a guy (whom I ignored) kept asking even months later "what did I do wrong? did I say something that upset u?" If I were to answer that question, I'd have to explain my mood swing, PMS, long list of criteria etc. Really, there's nothing to be understood. If u fall into that situation guys, just move on. I'm a woman and I can't understand myself, so how can u

 

On the other hand, u know the criteria and most of them are doable. Hit the gym, pay attention to your wardrobe, learn a little bit more so you can have more interesting conversation etc. It's quite easy to be attractive.

[ThaWholigan]

that's a good piece of wisdom.

I had a guy (whom I ignored) kept asking even months later "what did I do wrong? did I say something that upset u?" If I were to answer that question, I'd have to explain my mood swing, PMS, long list of criteria etc. Really, there's nothing to be understood. If u fall into that situation guys, just move on. I'm a woman and I can't understand myself, so how can u

 

On the other hand, u know the criteria and most of them are doable. Hit the gym, pay attention to your wardrobe, learn a little bit more so you can have more interesting conversation etc. It's quite easy to be attractive.

 

It is typical of masculine nature, we want to blitz our way to the heart of the problem in one way or another. When one adds an element of detached introspection as well as a healthy level of emotional control, he can have a greater chance of garnering positive responses socially and sexually.

 

I have sometimes asked probing questions like the one above and got vague answers that didn't help me at all. I learned never to ask those questions. I started asking questions of myself instead, and I knew what I had to do to become attractive. It's not terribly hard, but it does take a lot of work and time. And patience. And diligence.

 

But I strive towards that, because it will benefit me, and the more I believe it will benefit me, the more I will actually start to enjoy my journey towards my ambitions (socially, sexually, financially etc).

[Wolf18]

this totally sounds like me. Probably because I'm 20-something years old. I'm scared to think about when I get older (which is only few years away), I have no options any more and karma will bite me. Yes, many girls are that silly.

 

 

Yes , karma will indeed bite you. All the awesome experiences you are missing because you are so picky will forever loom over your head when it's too late.

[Dust]

Wolf18 I don't agree with most of your view... BUT I really enjoy reading your posts! Entertaining as Fck. You truely have joined my lists of favorites here.

 

First men have very lower standards and it is in our nature to be that way. It's actually kind of faggy in my opinion to get them to high!

 

Now an attractive man has it made in life. For the most part a well spoken sharp looking man can have any fricken thing he wants for the better part or his entire life.

 

A sexy woman is just part of the crowd. In fact sexy women look better when in a herd of other sexy women.

 

Let me stop rambling and get to the point... You can't actively lower your standards. You can't say I'm going to seriously date and waste my time with that sloppy, unkept, boring person. You have to actually get excited about that person. You have to find yourself going "wow I'm in Love with that sexy piece of hotness" even if you're talking about you're lowered expectations.

[ThaWholigan]

Wolf18 I don't agree with most of your view... BUT I really enjoy reading your posts! Entertaining as Fck. You truely have joined my lists of favorites here.

 

First men have very lower standards and it is in our nature to be that way. It's actually kind of faggy in my opinion to get them to high!

 

Now an attractive man has it made in life. For the most part a well spoken sharp looking man can have any fricken thing he wants for the better part or his entire life.

 

A sexy woman is just part of the crowd. In fact sexy women look better when in a herd of other sexy women.

 

Let me stop rambling and get to the point... You can't actively lower your standards. You can't say I'm going to seriously date and waste my time with that sloppy, unkept, boring person. You have to actually get excited about that person. You have to find yourself going "wow I'm in Love with that sexy piece of hotness" even if you're talking about you're lowered expectations.

 

Pretty much. "She's not my ideal, but I wouldn't kick her out of bed in the morning". If I am physically attracted to her moderately enough, it's a go from there of course. That has a chance to grow.

 

If I cannot even get an erection while thinking about her provocatively, it's not going to happen

[counterman]

There's two main groups amongst my girl friends and acquaintances: those who are in long-term relationship (and will most likely stick with these guys) and those who are single (with little dating experience). The ones in between have been in and out of relationships.

 

The ones who have been with their boyfriends for a while or are planning to stick it out with him have "settled" for Mr Good Enough; these guys are promising, have a career and are stable but may not be the best looking or fulfill any other higher expectations, however, it means that she is not alone and she's enjoying the relationship experience, it's not completely crazy love but it's good enough.

 

The other main group is what I described earlier, the girls who are extremely picky and have higher expectations and standards, but are not necessarily the good-looking girls. Many of these girls complain why guys aren't interested in them... when they do have their fair share of interest from guys, attractive guys too. "Yes, there is chemistry but not the heart-throbbing kind, you know" -- something along those lines. Some start to show resentment to girls who get more attention from the better looking guys or the overall "packaged" guy. Most of these girls have little to offer themselves and the ones that have gone too far in what they said about guys I knew, I have severed ties with. I can't stand self-entitled behaviour. For example, one girl said that she wants a 6ft good-looking guy, who will walk with in her on the beach and play guitar and a lot of other crap... I looked at her and was like "are you serious?". She was. How about you work on yourself and become a better person? She maliciously attacked one of my friends who liked her, calling him a creep and whatnot and implied "how can YOU think you can date ME?" and that was it for me.

 

I refuse to console these girls or offer any advice or support, it's their choice.

 

The girls in between are still dating here and there. Some get into seemingly promising relationships, only to realise the guy is a douchebag and some are chasing that elusive "one", some are searching for the GIGS guy. I would be in a similar situation, just dating here and there but nothing really happening.

 

Bare in mind, I'm in my early 20s and I'm dealing with girls in their early 20s. Most of the ones I have met are really immature. Wolf18, that's a similar story I hear all the time. It's such a crime that the guys that these girls want want other more attractive girls I understand that you would want to be attracted to someone you date and I'm the same, like most people and I'm not saying these girls should date guys they're not attracted to, but if you're not that good-looking yourself and have a pretty awful personality, and you're only "attracted" to the top bunch of great guys, well you're going to have it hard, aren't you? As grkBoy says, you have to be realistic here.

 

I have a bunch of girls over the past few years who have shown lots of interest in me but I wasn't attracted to them. If I'm still single in the next 10 years, I still won't date them. There is not "standard" or anything, just the simple fact is that I'm not attracted to them. If what people mean by lowering standards meaning dating someone you're not attracted to, then that's something I won't do. BUT I do know many people who are in that situation, in the hopes that they'll grow to be attracted to that person and grow to love him/her.

 

I think some would refer to "lowering your standards" as dating someone you're not ideally attracted to. A lot of my guys friends wanted hot girlfriends but many have settled for the "cute" girl or the first girl to show them interest. Most are in happy relationships, whereas some keep burning out in attempts to find this hot girlfriend. But I would say that this is just lowering your expectations, which would open more doors. I too have a range of girls I find attractive, some of which others may not find attractive but I don't care. If I am attracted to her, I'll ask her out. That's it. There is no lowering of anything.

[irc333]

But in fact, I began to think of all the things that some of these guys put up with from women

 

In agreement.

 

I heard tons and tons of whipped husbands say, in a nervous laugh, how they have to consult with "the boss" before making purchases, or even going somewhere with friends.

 

It's funny how they say it all in jest, but you can seriously tell the dude is miserable and whipped by a controlling wife.

[Dust]

Really this thread is starting to fill up with bitter guys.

 

Personaly I think getting a woman and one that can make you throbbing hard is easy enough.

 

First off don't lower your standards raise them. If nature lowers your standards you'll actually believe you found a higher level any ways!

 

First trick you need to find more Hott people. Thats the point of lowering yours standards right? More to chose from. So if you can find more sexy girls you've achieved the same thing right?

 

I can know a girl is sexy just from hearing her voice on the drive thru intercom before even seeing her. Heck I can know a girl is sexy sight unseen from a cough... heck if I here foot steps I can tell if she's sexy. I can smell a sexy girl.

 

My point is when I'm single and looking sexy girls are sudenly every where.

[RecordProducer]

Really this thread is starting to fill up with bitter guys.

 

Personaly I think getting a woman and one that can make you throbbing hard is easy enough.

 

First off don't lower your standards raise them. If nature lowers your standards you'll actually believe you found a higher level any ways!

 

First trick you need to find more Hott people. Thats the point of lowering yours standards right? More to chose from. So if you can find more sexy girls you've achieved the same thing right?

 

I can know a girl is sexy just from hearing her voice on the drive thru intercom before even seeing her. Heck I can know a girl is sexy sight unseen from a cough... heck if I here foot steps I can tell if she's sexy. I can smell a sexy girl.

 

My point is when I'm single and looking sexy girls are sudenly every where.

Okay, you officially ruined the word "sexy" for us!

[Dust]

Okay, you officially ruined the word "sexy" for us!

 

You're a women it has different meaning for you then me.

[Woggle]

In agreement.

 

I heard tons and tons of whipped husbands say, in a nervous laugh, how they have to consult with "the boss" before making purchases, or even going somewhere with friends.

 

It's funny how they say it all in jest, but you can seriously tell the dude is miserable and whipped by a controlling wife.

 

I see this all the time. I love my wife dearly but I will never call her the boss. She has no rule over me.

[DepressedinDenver]

I hope I am reincarnated as a woman in my next life so it can be far less lonelier than this one.

[Shaun-Dro]

People are lazy. I am lazily procrastinating filling out a form I need to send off right this minute while typing this. 99% of the problems men display here with initial dating stages are based on simple quantity deficiency IMO. If they approached dating and meeting women like any other skill, they would understand that you have to practice anything over and over to get good at it. Many guys grow up dedicating countless hours to sports and other hobby practice, then resent the fact that women don't just fall out of the sky into their laps. When you learn to hit a baseball or a golfball, you have to swing at the thing 1000s of times, you can't sit in the dugout or the cart watching and learn how to do it. IMO it has much less to do with lowering standards and more to do with approaching attraction and seduction like any other skill requiring significant practice to master.

 

This doesn't apply to becoming a lady-magnet. You can't practice that. It has to be inborn. Athletes become good because what they're practicing isn't fighting back against them. It's not on the receiving end or on an end where a ball can make decisions of whether it wants to be hit out of the park for a homerun. It's a lifeless object that you're working hard to make a connect with. This doesn't work with living specimens because there's a degree of resistance that will always be met.

 

Women have the power to make decisions to accept or reject. Working on how to change her mind cannot be undone. If women were blowup dolls, without a mind of their own, then yes, certain skills in obtaining them can be applied.

[dasein]

This doesn't apply to becoming a lady-magnet. You can't practice that. It has to be inborn. Athletes become good because what they're practicing isn't fighting back against them. It's not on the receiving end or on an end where a ball can make decisions of whether it wants to be hit out of the park for a homerun. It's a lifeless object that you're working hard to make a connect with. This doesn't work with living specimens because there's a degree of resistance that will always be met.

 

Women have the power to make decisions to accept or reject. Working on how to change her mind cannot be undone. If women were blowup dolls, without a mind of their own, then yes, certain skills in obtaining them can be applied.

 

You couldn't be more wrong.

[ThaWholigan]

Was on POF today, and I got a message!

 

I got excited like crazy, thinking "shieet, this is my lucky day!! Maybe I got a reply from that light-skinned chick.....". I logged in quick fast, went to my inbox, clicked the message:

 

"hey bbz"

 

Girl was not even average looking . Pale, short hair, masculine looking , and I think she weighed more than me (I weigh a little less than 200lbs, but in proportion with 6 foot 3 height). I sat there laughing my ass off thinking "Wow.....this is my level...." And then I remembered I made this thread.

 

----------------------------------------------------------

 

Looking at this thread reminded me of the time I liked that one girl. Hot like anything she was. Honey golden skin, long curly hair, piercing eyes, proportionately shapely legs and bum. She also had the most magnificent pair of (.)(.) I had ever seen, and had this little bit of puppy fat under her chin that just made her even more sexy to me. At first, it wasn't a big deal that I thought she was hot: We spoke on the net for a couple months before I met her in 05, I made beats and she sang, so we had mutual interests. Didn't meet up often but talked online a lot. We got on, even though I was more passive and she was blunt. I was so nervous the first time meeting her I was shaking. She was even hotter than in her pics. Everything I wanted in a girl physically, she embodied it. And as I got to know her more, I began to like her personality too. She's ambitious, creative, dry humor (love it).

 

Basically, in 08 I started to see her more and talk to her more, then on my birthday she asked me if I was a virgin as I had always been single. I said yeah. She was surprised. Later that night she called me talking about how hot I was and that she wanted to "tear my clothes off", but then retracted saying that I was rare, and I should save my first for my wife. I was like "STFU, you don't know if I will get married". Convo done.

 

This went on for a couple of weeks, back and forth convos about sex and what we would do to each other (there was talk about biting and pulling hair), before she would change her mind and say "but your a virgin, blah blah". Then one day, I was like "Yo, lets go hotel". She was like "You know I have a BF don't you?" Well no, I kinda didn't. Still, the sex talk carried on that night, as well as the excuses as to why it couldn't happen (BF, my virginity, my penis size [she said no bigger than 7"])

 

The worst part of the story:

 

I still went to see her the next night. I had a condom in my pocket. And I slept in her bed that night. And didn't do a damn thing :lmao:. I didn't even kiss her or put my hand over one of her extraordinarily large breasts, I just lay there, holding her round the waist while trying to hide my boner. The most sexual contact I got was her groping my ass (nearly every girl I meet says I have the greatest ass, not sure how much of an asset this is). I left feeling a weird sense of triumph, followed by an overwhelming sense of failure. She was upset that morning. She couldn't wait for me to leave, even saying "sorry I'm treating you like this". I was so naive lol. I felt like a dick. That was my opportunity. She had only been seeing this guy for a few weeks, I could have done it. She wanted me to make my move. All the protestations meant nothing, as I was pushing forward and ended up in her bed and fluffed it at the death. I did an Arsenal (soccer fans know). It was at that moment, that I had a turning point and realised I was doing everything wrong.

 

So it puts today in perspective. Bald, masculine looking girls don't have to be my level. I could have had the girl I really wanted if I was smart enough. I wasn't.......

 

------------------

some of the comments about the message were a little mean, I apologize...

Edited December 28, 2011 by ThaWholigan