What if men stopped pursuing?

[kaylan]

I'm not limited to only one woman, and I've slept with plenty of married women while having a handful or more, of sex offers at all times, from single women.

 

Monogamy only benefits the Alphas and women. It enables women to sex-up Men like me and then, to marry the omega males like you .

lol @ you banging low quality women. People need to quit with this alpha crap. The crap is subjective and what some women like others do not.

 

I know tight pants scene guys who arent big and dont have much cash, and pull girls like crazy. To their chicks they are alpha, but to your typical club going miniskirt blond they may be beta.

 

So meh to all this nonsense.

 

My grandpas are both married since their 20's and they've always cheated on my grandmas;my grandmas have always known of It and accepted this because Alpha males are too extremely rare and important to let them go or to punish them.

 

monogamy is only enforceable in low value males due to women's disdain for low value males.

dont think a woman may never pull this on you and you end up crying here and looking all "omega"

 

Remember in this day and age women dont have to worry about staying in a marriage for security like your grand mothers had to.

 

Monogamy isnt about being enforceable. Some men and women actually want it and honor their commitments. Just because you screw trashy low class broads doesnt change anything. Ive had my opportunities but I respect others relationships because I wouldnt want it done to me.

Edited December 14, 2011 by kaylan

[Emilia]

lol @ you banging low quality women. People need to quit with this alpha crap. The crap is subjective and what some women like others do not.

 

I know tight pants scene guys who arent big and dont have much cash, and pull girls like crazy. To their chicks they are alpha, but to your typical club going miniskirt blond they may be beta.

 

So meh to all this nonsense.

 

 

dont think a woman may never pull this on you and you end up crying here and looking all "omega"

 

Remember in this day and age women dont have to worry about staying in a marriage for security like your grand mothers had to.

 

Monogamy isnt about being enforceable. Some men and women actually want it and honor their commitments. Just because you screw trashy low class broads doesnt change anything. Ive had my opportunities but I respect others relationships because I wouldnt want it done to me.

 

Thanks for saving me the time to type a very similar response to Elysian's nonsense.

 

As to the original post: if a man is smart he doesn't need to chase women much. He will need to make the initial approach often but the key is to get enough quality women interested and build rapport with. Those don't need to be chased because they are not prey.

[Emilia]

My grandpas are both married since their 20's and they've always cheated on my grandmas;my grandmas have always known of It and accepted this because Alpha males are too extremely rare and important to let them go or to punish them.

 

 

Your grandmothers stayed because divorced women were ostracised in those days - especially if they caught STDs off their philandering husbands as your grandmothers undoubtedly did. Nice family

[Woggle]

I won't go as extreme as some others but from what I notice alphas get away with everything. They can do anything they want to a woman and she will keep coming back but a beta has to pretty much walk on eggshells around a woman or else he gets torn apart. They overlook the big things in alphas while looking for small things to criticize in betas.

 

Not saying this is all women but I have seen this scenario play out plenty of times.

 

Monogamy works when you find two people that want it but how often does that happen?

[LittleTiger]

I haven't read the whole thread but my opinion is that the population of the human race would shrink drastically. If it survived at all, it would eventually consist of a small number of highly sexualised dominant women with a few physically exceptional men to 'service' them when required.

 

In our current society, men are driven by sex. They may also want a loving relationship, but their primary motivation is sex. Not so for most women - most women want relationships. They want sex too of course, but it's not their driving force.

 

If men stopped pursuing, many women just wouldn't bother with men at all. I could really put the cat amongst the pigeons and say that the only reason women need men these days is for sperm donation but I'd probably start World War III.

 

Hopefully, the human need for love and affection would override all else and our species would somehow survive but, the only reason all men will stop pursuing is if their interest in sex is reduced. At an absolutely basic level, in reproductive terms, the male sex drive is far more important than the female's - so if men ceased to care so much about sex, the human race would probably be wiped out in no time.

[El Brujo]

In our current society, men are driven by sex.

 

Not me.

 

I'm the one-in-a-million freak who's looking for love and doesn't give a crap about sex... so I guess I'm one of God's mistakes.

 

If men stopped pursuing, many women just wouldn't bother with men at all.

 

Thank you.

[stillafool]

Would women A) just accept it and choose to be alone, or B) change their behavior and start pursuing men instead?

 

There's a site named HerWay dot com which operates on the premise that women are allofasudden going to change their behavior and start pursuing men. That would be bad news for a lot of PUAs, but good news for the guys like me who are more laid back.

 

When I went to that Meetup potluck for singles a couple of weeks ago, the organizer hit the bull's-eye when he told me that judging from the way he saw me hanging back in the crowd, I need a more assertive type of woman to hit on me. Guess what? He was right---I never was turned on by submissive women. There was one woman there who expressed her wish for a "mail-order husband", but all the other guests probably thought she was desperate. Not Me!

 

There's a lot of talk about women wanting to have the same rights as men, but it looks like that equality doesn't apply to dating and relationships as long as female behavior doesn't change. I'm not trying to be sexist, I'm just pointing out something we all accept even though it's sexist.

 

Unfortunately for singles who still want to play by the old rules, it looks like things are changing whether certain people like it or not... playing hard-to-get has pretty much died out, now I hear a lot of people saying that going on a date is becoming more like a job interview, with questions shot at them like bullets about what they want in a relationship. Not that that's a bad thing (at least to me, Mister Logical), but it gives us no room to be charmingly stoopid.

 

So... would you be willing to bite the bullet and go with the new rules, or try to push back and hold out as long as you can?

 

 

 

Haven't you heard? This morning on the news they were stating that more women than ever before are choosing to remain single and not marry, but they still want kids. I imagine they will become more assertive in asking out the men they truly want to date rather than settling as some did before. I don't know that this will be a good thing for men in the long run because women will become even more choosier about who they date.

[stillafool]

I could really put the cat amongst the pigeons and say that the only reason women need men these days is for sperm donation but I'd probably start World War III.

 

 

I imagine in the future the price of good sperm will go sky high.

[stillafool]

It would be much worse for the average man than it is now.

 

Women seem to have a very narrow view of what they consider attractive. So if women did the asking out, you'd have something like ten girls all asking out the same guy and of course he would say yes to all but the ugliest of them.

 

Average and below guys will be completely ignored by women. At least now, average guys can ask out a ton of women and maybe get lucky. But if women were the pursers, the guys would never get lucky.

 

There would be a lot of unsatisfied angry men and violence, especially towards women would go way up.

 

Exactly! You can bet most women will choose to go after the most masculine and goodlooking guys.

[dasein]

So, if a wide-spread social level, men weren't so insistant on a woman being monogamous (she could have multiple lovers), she actually might be more willing to sleep with/marry a "lesser" guy, because she isn't looking at him to satisfy all her needs.

 

Wrong, women will have sex only with the top % of men while expecting support in other ways from other men, and will sleep with those others only to the extent necessary to secure the support/benefits that the top % doesn't have to provide. This is exactly the system we are living under now within the "no fault" divorce regime which is highly biased in women's favor.

 

As far as the topic goes, women do in fact pursue men constantly and zealously now, only a tiny % of men though. Just because it's easiest to see groupies at a rock concert doesn't mean other top % men don't have groupies too. That's the untold story behind lots of the sexual harrassment claims, against Herman Cain for instance, the media neglects to cover how top men have hordes of women throwing themselves at them for some reason.

Edited December 14, 2011 by dasein

[Nexus One]

Come to think of it, the other sex valuing polyamory is actually beneficial to the "lesser" attractive mates. Once of the reason men and women are so picky about their partners is because of our monogamous system... once they're tied to this person, that's it. So the person better satisfy them emotionally, sexually, intellectually, etc.

 

If one man takes many wives/lovers, then he might not be so stringent that the girl is ugly, because he has 6 other beautiful women to also have sex with. She may be a great conversationalist, and that's all he needs. So, while she doesn't get an "equal partner," she at least gets to experience some joys of marriage.

 

So, if a wide-spread social level, men weren't so insistant on a woman being monogamous (she could have multiple lovers), she actually might be more willing to sleep with/marry a "lesser" guy, because she isn't looking at him to satisfy all her needs.

 

Not even Somedude would share a woman I think, that indicates you think even lower about yourself than he does.

 

To have to rely on cheating men to get your fix is a pathetic attitude verhrzn.

You are really selling yourself short. I don't think your looks are the problem, but rather your attitude. You have major self-confidence issues.

 

Life isn't only about dreams, life is also about action. Without action you're just slacking. It's time for you both to get frustrated enough that you just take what you want, rather than rely on the actions of others.

Edited December 14, 2011 by Nexus One

[grkBoy]

If men all 100% stopped pursuing, most guys still wouldn't get dates, or only get pursued by the women they don't want.

 

You'll see the tall/hot/wealthy/exciting guys have harems of women all trying to get them to commit.

[jobaba]

This thread is pretty depressing. It's basically saying:

 

1) Humankind is shallow and all about good looks.

 

2) The definition of good looks is universal and immutable.

[ThaWholigan]

^^^

Its not looks, it is an attitude, a personal outlook that permeates from your core. I personally think a lot of this Alpha stuff is not what it seems. Everyone makes it seem like you are born that way, but in fact most of those traits associated can in fact be cultivated within yourself if you are dedicated to becoming a top man. That's what I believe anyway.

 

I mean, there may not be a great deal one can do about looks/height, but I have seen many examples that show that these things will not matter if one has enough "Alpha" traits to keep a woman around.

 

People resign themselves to defeat so easily that I find it disturbing. Suggesting chemical castration even :laugh: That's funny as hell. I don't find this thread depressing. I just find it pitiful.

 

Looks are marginally important, but to some extent they are still pretty subjective. A woman can't f*** your looks, she can only f*** you. I've had many girls say I am good looking before, without prompt either. I am still a virgin. Go figure lol.......

 

Looks aren't the problem. It is something within.

Edited December 14, 2011 by ThaWholigan

[verhrzn]

Not even Somedude would share a woman I think, that indicates you think even lower about yourself than he does.

 

To have to rely on cheating men to get your fix is a pathetic attitude verhrzn.

You are really selling yourself short. I don't think your looks are the problem, but rather your attitude. You have major self-confidence issues.

 

Life isn't only about dreams, life is also about action. Without action you're just slacking. It's time for you both to get frustrated enough that you just take what you want, rather than rely on the actions of others.

 

Why is it pathetic? Beggars can't be choosers.

 

What do you mean by "take what you want, rather than rely on the actions of others"? How exactly am I supposed to "take" a romantic relationship?

[Quiet Storm]

Woman pursuers often don't make good long term partners.

 

Although they happily pursue men, it is not usually just one man. They seek external validation, which is what prompts them to become the pursuer. They thrive on male attention.

 

The pursuing woman is often a dream come true for the quiet guy with no game, as he doesn't have to put out any effort.

 

However, the outgoing, more aggressive woman's need for external validation is not going to disappear once she lands a man. Instead, it is likely that his value to her will drop. His attention and compliments will get old and boring, and she will be seeking other men to fill her validation needs.

 

Many men that end up cheated on, are the quiet types that waited for their woman to find him. They start out feeling happy and lucky, and years later wish they had been more choosey.

[Disillusioned]

This thread is pretty depressing. It's basically saying:

 

1) Humankind is shallow and all about good looks.

 

2) The definition of good looks is universal and immutable.

 

To me it screams that sex and good DNA are WAY too overrated, at least by some LSers.

 

After all... somebody has to compose symphonies, build bridges, and do other things besides living from one lay to the next. :lol:

[Quiet Storm]

Its not looks, it is an attitude, a personal outlook that permeates from your core. I personally think a lot of this Alpha stuff is not what it seems. Everyone makes it seem like you are born that way, but in fact most of those traits associated can in fact be cultivated within yourself if you are dedicated to becoming a top man.

 

I have two boys. I could tell as babies that one is an alpha and the other a beta.

 

My alpha kid is demanding, very aggressive and competive in sports, hates to lose, wants to be the smartest, the strongest and the best at everything he does. He always knows the right thing to say. Other kids listen to him and allow him to lead. He is popular and his peers flock to him. He doesn't take any crap from anyone.

 

My beta kid is laid back. He enjoys sports but doesn't have that competitive drive. He does his best but is not concerned about how others compare. He is thoughtful, helpful and empathetic. He blends into the group, and is more interested in working together than standing out. He has close friends but is not the life of the party.

 

As newborns, when the dog barked my alpha would curiously look to see what the noise was. My beta would startle and cry. As toddlers, my alpha hated to share and would fight for his toys. My beta would let the alpha have it and find something else to play with.

 

Both kids were raised in the same house by the same parents. Both are good looking, athletic and tall.

 

IMO, people can emulate alpha behavior and learn what works with others. (like PUA). However, an alpha is nauturally like that. No one has to tell him how to be alpha, he just is.

 

I think that people are born with a core nature. Your environment, upbringing, exposure to trauma can affect your personality, but I believe your true nature stays constant.

[verhrzn]

I have two boys. I could tell as babies that one is an alpha and the other a beta.

 

My alpha kid is demanding, very aggressive and competive in sports, hates to lose, wants to be the smartest, the strongest and the best at everything he does. He always knows the right thing to say. Other kids listen to him and allow him to lead. He is popular and his peers flock to him. He doesn't take any crap from anyone.

 

My beta kid is laid back. He enjoys sports but doesn't have that competitive drive. He does his best but is not concerned about how others compare. He is thoughtful, helpful and empathetic. He blends into the group, and is more interested in working together than standing out. He has close friends but is not the life of the party.

 

As newborns, when the dog barked my alpha would curiously look to see what the noise was. My beta would startle and cry. As toddlers, my alpha hated to share and would fight for his toys. My beta would let the alpha have it and find something else to play with.

 

Both kids were raised in the same house by the same parents. Both are good looking, athletic and tall.

 

IMO, people can emulate alpha behavior and learn what works with others. (like PUA). However, an alpha is nauturally like that. No one has to tell him how to be alpha, he just is.

 

I think that people are born with a core nature. Your environment, upbringing, exposure to trauma can affect your personality, but I believe your true nature stays constant.

 

You may be right about Alphas/Betas having certain personalities and being that way from birth (though frankly, it's been stated again and again that personality is both nature AND nurture, not one or the other) but I think there's a leap of logic going on when automatically Alphas are the most attractive type.

 

Me personally, a guy who has a personality like your Beta boy sounds way more desirable. To me, the Beta is the Alpha, if that makes sense.

 

The key factor here is that men who complain about not being Alphas, are trying to attract Alpha females (so females who display the most characteristics of "femininity" as defined by society, like Alphas display the characteristics of "masculinity.") The guys I see complaining about how they can't get a girl, are the ones who have very narrow idea about how a "woman" should be... but the types of women who fit that definition have themselves an idea of how a "man" should be, and so don't want guys who don't fit that description.

[dasein]

I could really put the cat amongst the pigeons and say that the only reason women need men these days is for sperm donation but I'd probably start World War III.

 

Well, truth be told, no one really needs anyone today to the extent our grandparents did. Desires are another matter, and for men who can elevate themselves into the top %, they don't need women either. They can get sex when they want and maids are cheap.

 

IMO, the birthrate among low income families who can't afford children will continue to rise while the birthrate among higher income families who have a better chance of providing for children will continue to drop. Same for the marriage rate and the single parent household rate. No one wins out in this climate, we all end up being cultural losers.

[MrNate 2.0]

Well, truth be told, no one really needs anyone today to the extent our grandparents did. Desires are another matter, and for men who can elevate themselves into the top %, they don't need women either. They can get sex when they want and maids are cheap.

 

IMO, the birthrate among low income families who can't afford children will continue to rise while the birthrate among higher income families who have a better chance of providing for children will continue to drop. Same for the marriage rate and the single parent household rate. No one wins out in this climate, we all end up being cultural losers.

 

Yep. By the same logic, we can throw the cat into the pigeons and say men don't really need women for..well..anything really. Especially if we don't want children.

[Woggle]

Nobody really needs anybody for anything other than reproductive purposes but things have gotten so bad as far as gender relations go that many people don't even want each other anymore.

[Quiet Storm]

Me personally, a guy who has a personality like your Beta boy sounds way more desirable.

 

He is definitely easier to get along with.

 

I think many women are attracted to the alpha traits of confidence, the way they stand up for themselves & what they believe in, what appears to be dominance over other men and their social skills. Also, the way alphas carry themselves, can be very sexually attractive.

 

HOWEVER, once they get the alpha, their other alpha traits become difficult for a peaceful existence. Women don't want to feel dominated in conversations, they don't like that he thinks he's "the boss", they are annoyed that he enjoys outside interests besides her, they worry about other women and they can be very selfcentered.

 

Most women aren't as physically attracted to betas. I think it's because betas seem too "easy". The way they are nice, caring, thoughtful and empathetic can make them lose value in some womens eyes. They can be too eager to please. Some women think that seems desperate.

 

I don't think women like to feel like a man's only option. They want to feel like she was chosen out of many options.

 

For many women, the perfect man would be an alpha that morphs into a beta when she hooks up with him. After that, he must remain beta until she gets bored, and then he should turn back to alpha for a day every now and then to keep her interested.

 

I see how men are confused about women, because I think that many women don't even know what they truly want. The positive qualities that they want on paper (caring, thoughtful, sweet, fair, honest) don't always get their panties wet, so to speak.

 

JMO.

[ThaWholigan]

He is definitely easier to get along with.

 

I think many women are attracted to the alpha traits of confidence, the way they stand up for themselves & what they believe in, what appears to be dominance over other men and their social skills. Also, the way alphas carry themselves, can be very sexually attractive.

 

HOWEVER, once they get the alpha, their other alpha traits become difficult for a peaceful existence. Women don't want to feel dominated in conversations, they don't like that he thinks he's "the boss", they are annoyed that he enjoys outside interests besides her, they worry about other women and they can be very selfcentered.

 

Most women aren't as physically attracted to betas. I think it's because betas seem too "easy". The way they are nice, caring, thoughtful and empathetic can make them lose value in some womens eyes. They can be too eager to please. Some women think that seems desperate.

 

I don't think women like to feel like a man's only option. They want to feel like she was chosen out of many options.

 

For many women, the perfect man would be an alpha that morphs into a beta when she hooks up with him. After that, he must remain beta until she gets bored, and then he should turn back to alpha for a day every now and then to keep her interested.

 

I see how men are confused about women, because I think that many women don't even know what they truly want. The positive qualities that they want on paper (caring, thoughtful, sweet, fair, honest) don't always get their panties wet, so to speak.

 

JMO.

 

I understand you completely. I feel out of me and my younger brother who lives with me, I am the beta and he is the alpha. He is shorter than me though (5"6), but much more aggressive and forthright, and things do seem to happen for him, and he gets a lot of girls too.

 

I have always been laidback, had confidence issues in the past, and am generally more amiable by nature. Perhaps the most imposing thing about me is my physical presence, I am quite tall (6"3) and have the physique to be very muscular should I choose to be. I do have a quietly competitive and aggressive nature, but I repress that often in favor of my more naturally easy approach to things.

 

I think it can be difficult to try and attract women if you are naturally this way. Often I do get interest, but I admit that most of the time I am not attracted to those who are interested, and even when I am, I lacked the basic skills necessary to reciprocate (autism). I personally believe that I can cultivate the skills necessary, but that's just me.

 

It might be wrong of me to think this way but I would actually rather be alone than be with someone I'm not attracted to or do not want to be with. And I think that nobody should. So if I am rejected, it doesn't make me too unhappy for long, because I have rejected girls for the very same reason.

 

 

As for women being confusing, you're not wrong. I have been pleasantly surprised by the amount of women who say they respond to certain things, but frankly in my experience, girls will say they want one thing and generally tend to go for something else. Even the ones you wouldn't expect to do so! It can leave you feeling quite jaded, but I have never been one to stay jaded. The best thing I can do is ignore all of that and work on the traits I want to cultivate and the person I want to be and do my thing. Whoever wants to be part of my reality is welcome.

Edited December 14, 2011 by ThaWholigan
continued

[SteveC80]

I haven't read the whole thread but my opinion is that the population of the human race would shrink drastically. If it survived at all, it would eventually consist of a small number of highly sexualised dominant women with a few physically exceptional men to 'service' them when required.

 

In our current society, men are driven by sex. They may also want a loving relationship, but their primary motivation is sex. Not so for most women - most women want relationships. They want sex too of course, but it's not their driving force.

 

If men stopped pursuing, many women just wouldn't bother with men at all. I could really put the cat amongst the pigeons and say that the only reason women need men these days is for sperm donation but I'd probably start World War III.

 

Hopefully, the human need for love and affection would override all else and our species would somehow survive but, the only reason all men will stop pursuing is if their interest in sex is reduced. At an absolutely basic level, in reproductive terms, the male sex drive is far more important than the female's - so if men ceased to care so much about sex, the human race would probably be wiped out in no time.

 

Men dont need women either,nobody NEEDS someone

 

As a whole id say if anything women need Men more because of their need for Men to lead them and make decisions